"(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

[S3 Hendrix]

Yamoshi has only been mentioned in an interview when Toriyama said he was the first SS and he is the spirit that allows the SSG ritual to be a thing because he died facing evil saiyans. You can check Herms98 twitter to see it.

It never had anything to do with the SSG mentioned in the BoG film but for whatever reason fans confuse them.

That interview also has him say the saiyan god and the super saiyan were the same person, we still dont know enough to deconfirm

It's literally said that Yamoshi just turned Super Saiyan. It's never said that the first Super Saiyan was also the first SS God, but that he is the saiyan god in the way that he is the spirit used on the ritual.

So saying Yamoshi turned SSG is pure headcanon so far that directly contradicts what Toriyama said. Yamoshi turned Super Saiyan after seeing his friends dying yet he was still underwhelmed and died. No SSG is mentioned in that part at all and there is no evidence that he turned SSG, in fact again it's the opposite. He could not have turned SSG because he is the dead spirit needed to use the ritual and turn SSG in the first place. It would be impossible for him to do it.

I don't see what more "evidence" you need. Until Toriyama retcons it (assuming its even going to be actually mentioned on the series), Yamoshi was just the first Super Saiyan. You can headcanon the opposite all you want (this fandom loves to headcanon stuff to try to make sense of things) but it will just be that, headcanon. You can't simply say Yamoshi was the first SSGod because he is pointed out to be the first SS. It's misinformation that only ends up confusing people, like the infamous Saiyan Beyond God thing.

To sum it up, and literally quoting parts of the interview:

"In a certain sense, they are the same person […] Afterwards, Yamoshi's spirit wandered in continuous search […] of a new savior, the Super Saiyan God."

Key words here are "In a certain sense" and "NEW". They were not literally the same person, and SSGod did not exist before Yamoshi died, hence the "new" part. The namekian who wrote about it also just seemed to somehow conect with Yamoshi's spirit, they never actually saw a SSG.

That same interview never says he went ssj because his comrades died, that is also your own head canon

[mahakaishin1991]

Yamoshi has only been mentioned in an interview when Toriyama said he was the first SS and he is the spirit that allows the SSG ritual to be a thing because he died facing evil saiyans. You can check Herms98 twitter to see it.

It never had anything to do with the SSG mentioned in the BoG film but for whatever reason fans confuse them.

That interview also has him say the saiyan god and the super saiyan were the same person, we still dont know enough to deconfirm

It's literally said that Yamoshi just turned Super Saiyan. It's never said that the first Super Saiyan was also the first SS God, but that he is the saiyan god in the way that he is the spirit used on the ritual.

So saying Yamoshi turned SSG is pure headcanon so far that directly contradicts what Toriyama said. Yamoshi turned Super Saiyan after seeing his friends dying yet he was still underwhelmed and died. No SSG is mentioned in that part at all and there is no evidence that he turned SSG, in fact again it's the opposite. He could not have turned SSG because he is the dead spirit needed to use the ritual and turn SSG in the first place. It would be impossible for him to do it.

I don't see what more "evidence" you need. Until Toriyama retcons it (assuming its even going to be actually mentioned on the series), Yamoshi was just the first Super Saiyan. You can headcanon the opposite all you want (this fandom loves to headcanon stuff to try to make sense of things) but it will just be that, headcanon. You can't simply say Yamoshi was the first SSGod because he is pointed out to be the first SS. It's misinformation that only ends up confusing people, like the infamous Saiyan Beyond God thing.

To sum it up, and literally quoting parts of the interview:

"In a certain sense, they are the same person […] Afterwards, Yamoshi's spirit wandered in continuous search […] of a new savior, the Super Saiyan God."

Key words here are "In a certain sense" and "NEW". They were not literally the same person, and SSGod did not exist before Yamoshi died, hence the "new" part. The namekian who wrote about it also just seemed to somehow conect with Yamoshi's spirit, they never actually saw a SSG.

Complaining about headcanon while spewing your own? K

[ankokudaishogun]

I wish to remember people that interview contentss aren't canon until they get in-media

[Sandubadear]

if what Toriyama says isn't canon, then I don't know what is. It can be disconsidered only if it contradicts something in the series like him saying that Kaioshins only live 75000 years even though Shin is several millions years old, and Elder Kai is much more older than that

[Jol]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aV3mgVEhAo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7ck4nvzrXw

Woohoo! The story's out! Can anyone please translate this?

Fu is so cool!

[S3 Hendrix]

Mechikabura is back

[Jol]

Mechikabura is back

Whoa, he is? Where?

[Goresh]

Another set comes with another set review! Along with UM4, comes 9 new Ultimate Rare cards that were the result of the voting campaign. These 9 new cards represent places 9-10 of the vote and the card that came out at #1 (Ultra Instinct Goku) will be released as an SEC during this set. I will not be covering the other 9 cards simply due to them being pretty much fodder level in terms of power, even though their art is pretty awesome. Just quickly something to note about the 10 cards that are being released as a result of the vote -- they each will hold a special ability called "Top Warrior," which triggers at the beginning of the 3rd round and allows the card with the ability to restore their ki. The effect of the ability is also strengthened the more allies there are with this ability, which implies that they want you to use these cards together on the same team.

On top of that, there is a new CAA being released with this set called "dokabaki" that allows you to break the enemy's Guard as well as bestow additional power upon the unit activating the CAA by a different teammate.

UM4-032 Gohanks: Xeno (SSJ3)
EL Type
HP: 3300
Power: 4400
Guard: 2700

CAA: Counter Rush CAA that activates while Gohanks: Xeno is in the attack position, HP is below 50%, and is being attacked by a single enemy. Upon activation of Perfect Rush, permanently halve the Power of the attacking enemy.

Passive: Move of Resuscitation - At the start of the round, if your team has 50% or less HP remaining, restore the ki of all allies and permanently double the rate at which Battle Power increases from ki consumption.

Super Attack: Super Exploding Fire Slash, costs 7 energy.

UUE: If Goten: Xeno and Vegeta: Xeno are present on the same team as Gohanks: Xeno, UUE activates. Halve the amount of damage sustained by all allies for 1 turn, costs 4 energy.

I think this unit is actually very well designed. This is the first time that we are seeing a passive skill that allows you to amplify your BP at a proportion to the amount of ki consumed. Not only that, Gohanks even restores your ki to help in that regard. I also do not think that being at 50% or less HP is that strict of a condition since that is easily obtainable from round 3 forward. In addition, Counter Rush is one of the best CAAs in the entire game and this guy has the additional effect of essentially permanently crippling any powerhouse the enemy team has by halving their attack. This is an extremely valuable ability to have against cards like Full Power SSJ4 Broly, Masked Saiyan, and Cumber since they all are unable to participate in coordinated attacks therefore forcing them to attack alone. I can see this guy being a major player in certain teams that are designed to last until the later rounds.

8.5/10

UM4-033 Elder Kai
SP Type
HP: 2100
Power: 1000
Guard: 1000

Before I mention what this card does I need to explain that this card is a very unique SP type in that he sort of has his own "stat." This stat is called "Ritual Level" and it is seen nowhere else in the game except for on this card. This is the first time that Elder Kai has been playable as a battle card in DBH and it is possible that we may see extensions of this stat be used later on in the game.

Attack Effect: When Elder Kai is linked with an ally, that ally's Power and Guard is increased depending on their Ritual Level.

Support Effect: Change the Support Area, which restores HP by (amount of ally characters in the support area x 500). Also, increase Ritual Level by 1.

I love the design aspect of this card because it's something that we have never seen before. A card having its own kind of stat is something that is pretty cool and I think it really fits the character well in this case. Just as Gohanks: Xeno was above, I think this guy is really designed to try and drag out the game as long as possible in order to make the most use out of the Ritual Level effect, since he is pretty much useless in the early rounds besides being able to heal. Due to that, it's pretty hard to tell how good this card will be since he is pretty dependent on how fast the meta is but in a slow meta I can see this card being very good.

8/10

UM4-043 Goku (SSJB Kaioken x20)
BS Type
HP: 2200
Power: 7500
Guard: 1000

CAA: Dokabaki CAA that activates when in the attack position and when all allies are finished attacking, Hero Energy is at 7 or more, and there is an ally with 25% ki or more. Upon big success, permanently reduce the damage mitigation effects of the attacked enemy by 50%.

Passive: Double-edged Kaioken - At the start of battle, receive no damage from ki effects and permanently increase Power and Guard by 1.5x. But, at the end of the second round reduce own ki by a super amount and decrease Hero Energy by 3.

Super Attack: Super Spirit Bomb, costs 7 energy.

UUE: If Vegeta and Trunks: Future are on Goku's team, UUE activates. Permanently nullify all enemy damage multiplying effects. But, do not nullify amplification effects related to Burst CAAs. Costs 3 energy.

While the first 2 cards covered in this review are almost exclusively designed for long, drawn out games this guy is the polar opposite. He wants to end the game as soon as possible, which is pretty bizarre considering his passive ability focuses more on defense than offense. Although being completely immune to ki damage is clearly an amazing ability, having only a 1.5x multiplier to the Power stat is nothing special and really leaves Goku in an awkward spot with his monstrously high Power stat pretty much being the only thing going for him. On the other hand, Dokabaki definitely seems like one of the better CAAs in the game and his UUE is extremely useful. So while not the worst card ever, you definitely would need to build a team around this guy to expect him to really do anything spectacular.

7/10

UM4-046 Trunks: Future (SSJ3)
HR Type
HP: 3500
Power: 3500
Guard: 3100

CAA: Super Energy CAA that activates on or after the 2nd round when Trunks is in the attack position. Upon big success, permanently increase the attacked enemy's CI speed by a super amount and reduce Power by 5,000.

Passive: Super Saiyan 3 of Hope - While in the attack position alone, reduce damage taken by 80% and increase Hero Energy by 1 (once only).

Super Attack: Full Charge Burning Attack, costs 4 energy.

UUE: If SSJ Goku and SSJ Vegeta are on Trunks's team, Super Unit Effect activates, costs 10 energy.

I think this card, while there are many better options, is extremely powerful. Being able to nullify damage by 80% is invaluable and allows your team to inch closer and closer to being able to launch that Super Unit Effect, which is designed to end the game. Not only is he able to tank well, he also debuffs an enemy with his CAA, allowing you to buy more and more time as you rack up Hero Energy as fast as you can. Not the best unit of all time but great at what he's designed to do.

8/10

UM4-065 Hatchiyack
BS Type
HP: 2800
Power: 5400
Guard: 1000

CAA: Sparking CAA that activates on or after the 2nd round while Hatchiyack is in the attack position. Upon Super Sparking activation, permanently reduce the Guard of the attacked enemy by 5,000.

Passive: Super Hatred Amplification Device - The more damage Hatchiyack's team sustains, increase the amount of damage dealt by his Super Attack by a super amount (1 time only).

Super Attack: Full Power Revenge Cannon, costs 9 energy.

One of the worst CAAs, bland passive, and a 9 energy requirement on his Super Attack. Not impressed. Although his passive has the potential to be pretty powerful, it is only able to activate once per battle, and you don't really want to be taking that much damage at once anyway.

6.5/10

UM4-066 Majin Ozotto
HR Type
HP: 3600
Power: 3100
Guard: 2000

CAA: Draw CAA that activates on or after the 2nd round while Majin Ozotto is in the attack position. Upon success, permanently nullify the ability of the attacked enemy to increase Battle Power through ki consumption.

Passive: The Majin Engulfed in Mystery - At the beginning of every round, decrease the amount of Battle Power increased through ki consumption by both teams. Also, if the enemy team activated an Ultimate Unit Effect, nullify any UUEs that may otherwise activate on or after the next turn.

Super Attack: Ignite Vision, costs 6 energy.

The ultimate niche card. This card is insanely hard to judge since his effects are so wild that I have no idea what kind of team you would put him on. The most I know that is this guy would fit on a team that does not make use of UUEs at all and doesn't rely on ki to boost their Battle Power. I am sure that there are some extremely powerful things you can do with this card that I just can't think of right now since he has some effects that we have never seen before. Hard to call but ultimately this card gets outshined by someone coming later on in the review.

7.5/10

UM4-067 Ozaru Cumber (or Kamba)
SP Type
HP: 2100
Power: 5000
Guard: 2000

(Able to participate in coordinated attacks with other giant characters)

Attack Effect: Upon winning CI, launch Super Attack.

Support Effect: Reduce the ki of the 3 enemy attackers that have the most ki.

Super Attack: Disaster Compress

A pretty interesting card since this is one of the only cards in the game that can actually participate in coordinated attacks with other giant characters such as Great Apes, Cell X, Lord Slug, etc. I think he is quite good since, although he seems rather vanilla at first, his ability to lower the ki of up to 3 enemy attackers essentially makes your opponent weary of who they move out to the attack position. Also giant characters tend to have slower CI speeds, which will allow Cumber to launch his Super Attack quite easily.

7.5/10

UM4-SEC Goku (Ultra Instinct)
BS Type
HP: 2600
Power: 8000
Guard: 1000

Has the special "Top Warrior" effect that I mentioned in the first paragraph of this post.

CAA: Counter Rush CAA that activates while Goku is in the attack position, HP is below 50%, and is being attacked by a single enemy. Upon activation of Perfect Rush, increase the CI speed of the attacked enemy by a super amount and reduce the enemy Hero Energy by 2.

Passive: Work of The Gods - When in the attack position and being attacked, reduce the damage of any attack that would do over 1,000 damage to 0 (one time only).

Super Attack: Ultra Instinct, costs 8 energy.

Remember Cell: Xeno from SDBH set 2? Well, he is one of the most utilized tanks in the game and he has pretty much the exact same passive as this goku except he can only utilize it during turn 1. This Goku, on the other hand, can make use of his passive whenever he feels like it. The insane part is you can use both of these units on the same team and pretty much stall the game out completely by throwing out Cell: Xeno during round 1, and then this guy during round 2. That will all but guarantee that you will enter round 3 with full health and the rest of your team will have full ki. Not to mention, this guy also has an 8,000 Power stat, which is absolutely insane. I foresee this guy being used in most teams that are trying to draw out the game to the later rounds because he all but guarantees that it will. (Oh and by the way he has the best CAA in the game).

9.25/10

UM4-SEC2 Omega Shenron: Xeno
HR Type
HP: 3200
Power: 5500
Guard: 2000

CAA: Change CAA that activates on or after the 2nd round while Omega Shenron: Xeno is in the attack position. Upon success, lose the ability to participate in coordinated attacks but perform a Super Attack without being restricted by Hero Energy and permanently increase Power by 10,000.

Passive: Shadow Dragon of Darkness - If Omega Shenron: Xeno's Change CAA is successful, at the end of the Battle Power calculation phase, reduce the ki of all enemies and ignore Guard and damage mitigating abilities while attacking, (Every time)

Super Attack: Ultimate Minus Energy Power Ball, costs 6 energy.

While this guy's passive might look fairly generic and his stats might seem underwhelming for an SEC, let me be the first to assure you that this guy is far from weak. The buffs that he receives from his Change CAA are actually insane and pretty much place him in a club with very few other cards who can completely ignore the Hero Energy mechanic of the game. Also, since his CAA increases his Power by a set amount and not by some multiplier, it allows him to continue being extremely powerful even if the enemy team consists of units that debuff Power. I think this guy can pretty much fit on any team you want and he is an extremely well balanced card. He can be used in early, mid, or late game teams and even lowers enemy ki.

9/10

UM4-SEC3 Super Fu
EL Type
HP: 3600
Power: 4600
Guard: 1500

CAA: Super Slash CAA that activates on or after the 2nd round when Fu is in the attack position. Upon activation of Perfect Slash, increase the CI speed of the attacked enemy by a super amount and reduce enemy Hero Energy by 3.

Passive: The Angry Researcher - At the beginning of every round, decrease the amount of Battle Power increased through ki consumption by the enemy team. Also, if there is a giant character on the enemy team, this effect increases.

Super Attack: Surprise Blade, costs 4 energy.

Well, looks like Majin Ozotto was powercrept even before he had a chance to show us what he could do. This guy is essentially the same card as Majin Ozotto except there are no negative effects toward your own team, which makes this guy insanely powerful. Literally just having this guy on the field even in the support area merits an inclusion on a lot of different teams. Most aggro teams depend on getting an early lead in Battle Power to end the game during rounds 1 or 2. But with this guy around, its possible that an enemy aggro team won't even be able to launch their Super Attacks because they didn't have enough Hero Energy due to their Battle Power being so low. There are a lot of crazy things you can do with this guy, especially considering he decreases Hero Energy by 3 when performing his CAA, which is, again, insane.

9/10

That will do it for this review. Overall I really like a lot of the design choices the developers made, especially with the Elder Kai SP card and this new ability to reduce the amount of BP obtained through ki consumption. Shaking things up in a game like this is always healthy and I also liked that they didn't make just 1 SEC obscenely powerful and the other ones just moderately strong. All of the SECs in this set are definitely worthy of a team being built around each one and I'm excited to see what will come in the next set.

[Rinsankajugin]

Seems like Cumber becomes Super Saiyan 3 at the end of UM4's story mission. Since he has long hair like Raditz, I wonder if his SS3 hair will be ridiculously long like his.

[ricky84]

Cumber already seems to be Jiren level in just his base. If Cumber were to unlock Mastered UI then he would surpass Zeno lmao.

[mahakaishin1991]

I can see the writers revealing that Yamoshi, Shallot and Cumber are the ancient counterparts, ancestors and/or reincarnations of Goku, Vegeta and Broly respectively in the future. It would explain allot.

Yamoshi = the lone ancient U7 saiyan that was pure of heart.
Shallot = the mysterious arrogant saiyan with special blood/heritage
Cumber = the overpowered evil saiyan with unique ki and abilities.

What is this, Avatar?

Seems like Cumber becomes Super Saiyan 3 at the end of UM4's story mission. Since he has long hair like Raditz, I wonder if his SS3 hair will be ridiculously long like his.

The length doesnt seem to change but if you slow it to 0.25 speed his eyebrows are gone. It's 3

[Grimlock]

Can someone translate all these dialogues please? (question mark is a separate hyperlink too).

UM5 is going to be fun with tons of content from both Prison Planet saga and Demigra saga. I haven't been paying too much attention to the latter, but now that Mechikabura and Kaioshin of Time are back, it is going to be interesting. In the meanwhile, Cumber goes Super Saiyan 3 and we will have Xeno Vegetto going Super Saiyan 4, and Dende knows what else is more to come. One hell of a way to end 2018! Please wake me up when September and October end!

[mahakaishin1991]

https://youtu.be/ojCJgqZb3CE?t=7m57s Playable Mechikabura when?

How long till I see my boi King Vegeta Xeno again?

[mahakaishin1991]

Cumber already seems to be Jiren level in just his base. If Cumber were to unlock Mastered UI then he would surpass Zeno lmao.

Probs stronger than the Jiren we initially saw before he powered up. Dont know how he'll fair against ultra instinct, but apparently hes stronger than we've already seen given his SSJ3 form got Goku to absolutely soil his pants, and it seems stronger than his golden great ape form.

How long till he pulls SSJ3legendaryGodBlueKaiokenx10Ape4: arcade edition out of his backside?

[Majin Demigra]

where's Alakazam when you need him?

[Draconic]

Dark Omega Shenron looks great. The only truly great design out of the Xeno Shadow Dragons.

Mechikabula being back is the best possible thing to happen. I really thought he was done for the time, but his young form got basically no screen time so I can only look forward to that. Throw in a corrupted(?) Time Kaioshin and this should be tons of fun.

Prison Planet is still a massive dissapointment, but at least we're getting Super Saiyan 4 Vegetto out of it.

[Gt91]

Can someone translate all these dialogues please? (question mark is a separate hyperlink too).

UM5 is going to be fun with tons of content from both Prison Planet saga and Demigra saga. I haven't been paying too much attention to the latter, but now that Mechikabura and Kaioshin of Time are back, it is going to be interesting. In the meanwhile, Cumber goes Super Saiyan 3 and we will have Xeno Vegetto going Super Saiyan 4, and Dende knows what else is more to come. One hell of a way to end 2018! Please wake me up when September and October end!

Cumber ss3? Where? :0

[Mnich]

Just imagine Omega Shenron with these Dark Dragon Balls. He would look like a freakin devil (even if this title is already taken by Broly ).

My post from 25 October 2016. Not only Omega Shenron has Dark Dragon Balls, but now he also has a new form and he looks like a freakin devil! I love it.
Thanks DB Heroes for fulfilling my dream

[ankokudaishogun]

if what Toriyama says isn't canon, then I don't know what is.

What gets a media.

Because until then, anything can change, like the 6-10-15 ratio between Goku, Beerus and Whis.

he looks like a freakin devil!

He looks more like Dark Shenron

[Majin Demigra]

I think Mechi is into S&M by the look of that cutscene