Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

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floofychan333
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Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by floofychan333 » Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:18 pm

I've watched about 5 episodes of Super and I must say the music isn't as terrible as I thought it would be. Many BGMs are good and the synths would be good if they had different instrumentations. However, I often wish there were more moments of silence. Additionally, Sumitomo isn't trying to be Kikuchi's successor at all, which I strongly disapprove of because it just doesn't feel like Dragon Ball without music that is Kikuchi-composed or at least is trying to sound like Kikuchi. In fact, he seems to be attempting to emulate Bruce Faulconer more, which is rather unfortunate because the Faulconer score was commissioned solely to save money and make Dragon Ball sound "cool." Sumitomo's score also sounds fairly generic at times and is one of many factors contributing to the modernization of Dragon Ball which I'm somewhat opposed to.
The "Cha-la Head cha-la" variation that plays at the beginning of every episode is by far the best track, with the Oriental-sounding theme that plays on King Kai's planet coming in second. If Sumitomo built on the successes of these two BGMs, the score would be vastly improved in my opinion.

What do you think? Do you agree or disagree with me? Or do you have any additional input?
"All of you. All of you must have KILL all the SEASONS!" -Dough (Tenshinhan), Speedy Dub of Movie 9.

"My opinion of Norihito's Sumitomo's new score is... well, very mixed. The stuff that's good is pretty darn good, but the stuff that's bad makes elevator music sound like Jerry freaking Goldsmith." -Kenisu

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Jinzoningen MULE » Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:40 pm

He hasn't impressed me yet. He has good and bad tracks, I probably enjoy more of them than I dislike, but he hasn't done anything that I'd give him a blue ribbon for.

Wish I could say more, but I don't have much of an opinion of him. I don't actively want him replaced or anything, but I wouldn't miss him.
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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Lord Beerus » Sat Feb 18, 2017 6:53 pm

Someone in Toei really needs to have word in Sumitomo's ear and tell him to focus solely on full orchestral pieces, where he seems to truly shines in a major way as seen in Battle Of Gods and some parts of Super, as supposed to instead of wasting energy on all the synthesized shit he puts together. I was reminded one too many times of Crash Bandicoot listening to some of his tracks in Majin Boo Kai and Super. And while I love Crash Bandicoot, I don't want its type of music anywhere near Dragon Ball in any remote sense. When Sumitomo is good, he's really good, but when he's bad, he's awful. But at the same time, they're just a lot of mediocre and unmemorable tracks he produces.

Sumitomo is a very frustrating composer to listen to.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Saikyo no Senshi » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:59 am

He is not good. It's frustrating cause music was Dragon Ball's strong points in the original run and now it's not. In fact it's been like that since Kai. Yes,Yamamoto's score was trash. The light hearted stuff Sumitomo has composed so far is poor and not at all memorable. I would also blame poor selection and placement.

There were one or two tracks in the Black story arc which was okay, but it's not impressive overall. 2 movies and 80 episodes of a new TV series is enough to have a fair opinion on him and I feel his music is just meh and he should be replaced. But, that's not happening sadly.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by floofychan333 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 12:37 am

Saikyo no Senshi wrote:He is not good. It's frustrating cause music was Dragon Ball's strong points in the original run and now it's not. In fact it's been like that since Kai. Yes,Yamamoto's score was trash. The light hearted stuff Sumitomo has composed so far is poor and not at all memorable. I would also blame poor selection and placement.

There were one or two tracks in the Black story arc which was okay, but it's not impressive overall. 2 movies and 80 episodes of a new TV series is enough to have a fair opinion on him and I feel his music is just meh and he should be replaced. But, that's not happening sadly.
Ideally I'd want Kikuchi-sensei to come back. If Masako Nozawa is still voicing Goku at 79, why can't Shunsuke Kikuchi-sensei keep composing at age 85? Or at least have somebody with actual experience composing that would create BGMs inspired by Kikuchi-sensei replace Sumitomo (who I think is OK personally but I'm sure there are way better anime composers out there.)
"All of you. All of you must have KILL all the SEASONS!" -Dough (Tenshinhan), Speedy Dub of Movie 9.

"My opinion of Norihito's Sumitomo's new score is... well, very mixed. The stuff that's good is pretty darn good, but the stuff that's bad makes elevator music sound like Jerry freaking Goldsmith." -Kenisu

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Saikyo no Senshi » Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:34 am

Oh, absolutely. Kikuchi coming back would be a dream come true. But, that's highly unlikely. I'd say Takaki Hiroshi would do a fine job. He has composed some fine tracks in his career and I think he would take DBS more towards the Kikuchi-esque world and the Dragon Ball world you, I and many of us like.

Naruto after some masterful compositions by Masuda Toshio was able to find it's successor in Takanashi Yasuharu whose score in Naruto Shippuuden was just as memorable and felt like the same series. I hope someday Dragon Ball will also find that successor which Sumitomo clearly isn't. Tokunaga kind of, sort of was but his name was associated with GT, so I guess he was dropped for that reason.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by DHM211 » Mon Feb 20, 2017 2:57 am

His music ranges from horrible to phenomenal.

And when I mean horrible, I really mean horrible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vZD06f767g , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdoiE-rWiKk

But when I mean phenomenal, I really mean phenomenal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIoqcIio1Es , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IF_Lx4q1kM&t=3s , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKwFja23P4Q

Battle Of Gods is his most consistently amazing soundtrack. Its the most "mature" and epic that Dragon Ball has ever sounded.

Resurrection 'F, while not quite as epic, was for the most part, consistently good (iirc there was one synthy track in the whole ost).

DBZ Kai TFC is a mixed bag. For every great soundtrack theres one thats just ok and one thats downright horrible.

Dragon Ball Super up until the Goku Black arc, minus a few tracks, was just average(much like the show it self). However, I love every single track that Sumitomo composed for the Goku Black arc, and his most recent composition for the universal survival arc was really good also.

So yeah, Sumitomo is not the the most consistent composer, but I still think he's my favorite Dragon Ball composer.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 1:41 pm

As Super's progress his tracks have gotten better, I think he's a decent composer. In my opinion, he captures what Dragon Ball represents better than Kikuchi , I think the reason why so many people give him flack is because his tracks are similar to Bruce Falcouner. Or resembles rock music, which in their opinion doesn't fit Dragon Ball; I've seen that a lot within the Sub fanbase regarding Falcouner or Sumitomo. The reason why some people are indifferent to their music, is not its because bad, but that it doesn't fit Dragon Ball. Not to say they don't have any bad tracks, it's just one of the many reason why there disliked.

His work in the Future Trunks arc is actually really good, even though it's synonymous to temp music. He's been reusing a lot of tracks from Kai lately, so I'm thinking he must be killer soundtrack for this arc or it's an editorial decision.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Metalwario64 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 4:29 pm

SaiyanGod117 wrote:In my opinion, he captures what Dragon Ball represents better than Kikuchi
I don't see how, because it has no martial arts feeling to it whatsoever. Kikuchi never had such lows like Sumitomo's disco track as well.

His score as a whole is incredibly generic, and could fit in just about anything you put it to. That's its biggest problem, aside from his terrible use of synthesizers. Even if it's very well composed, it's still not "Dragon Ball". Yamamoto, despite all of his plagiarism, was more fitting to the series.
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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:03 pm

Metalwario64 wrote:
SaiyanGod117 wrote:In my opinion, he captures what Dragon Ball represents better than Kikuchi
I don't see how, because it has no martial arts feeling to it whatsoever. Kikuchi never had such lows like Sumitomo's disco track as well.

His score as a whole is incredibly generic, and could fit in just about anything you put it to. That's its biggest problem, aside from his terrible use of synthesizers. Even if it's very well composed, it's still not "Dragon Ball". Yamamoto, despite all of his plagiarism, was more fitting to the series.
I have to disagree, Dragon Ball stop being a purely martial arts show a while ago. It seems now it's all about that fastpaced and seamless action, my problem with Kikuchi is that his tracks are too soft and calm for a show like Dragon Ball. His tracks also sound very similar to one another, there's nothing that really stands out, like he was trying to play it safe. He never really pushed my expectations and tried to get wild with his music or try something new.

I recommend you give Sumitomo's disco tracks another listen, what really hampered them was bad music placement. I agree some of his tracks are generic and about Yamamoto his tracks were great.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Terez » Tue Feb 21, 2017 7:23 pm

DHM211 wrote:His music ranges from horrible to phenomenal.

And when I mean horrible, I really mean horrible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vZD06f767g , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdoiE-rWiKk

But when I mean phenomenal, I really mean phenomenal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIoqcIio1Es , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8IF_Lx4q1kM&t=3s , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sKwFja23P4Q

Battle Of Gods is his most consistently amazing soundtrack. Its the most "mature" and epic that Dragon Ball has ever sounded.

Resurrection 'F, while not quite as epic, was for the most part, consistently good (iirc there was one synthy track in the whole ost).

DBZ Kai TFC is a mixed bag. For every great soundtrack theres one thats just ok and one thats downright horrible.

Dragon Ball Super up until the Goku Black arc, minus a few tracks, was just average (much like the show it self). However, I love every single track that Sumitomo composed for the Goku Black arc, and his most recent composition for the universal survival arc was really good also.

So yeah, Sumitomo is not the the most consistent composer, but I still think he's my favorite Dragon Ball composer.
I agree. As someone who likes both the Kikuchi and Faulconer scores in a general sense, I think Sumitomo is a better composer than either (keeping in mind that the Faulconer score is a mishmash of several composers, of course). His "horrible" tracks don't bother me much in isolation but whoever is doing track placement is not very good at their job.
Metalwario64 wrote:Kikuchi never had such lows like Sumitomo's disco track as well.
Drunken organ improv. Fortunately for us, it wasn't spammed quite as much, but it was truly awful. Even Kikuchi's best tracks were weak IMO, whereas Sumitomo's best tracks are just gorgeous. He's extremely talented.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Zephyr » Tue Feb 21, 2017 10:47 pm

SaiyanGod117 wrote:Dragon Ball stop being a purely martial arts show a while ago. It seems now it's all about that fastpaced and seamless action
When did it stop being about martial arts?

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Tue Feb 21, 2017 11:01 pm

Zephyr wrote:
SaiyanGod117 wrote:Dragon Ball stop being a purely martial arts show a while ago. It seems now it's all about that fastpaced and seamless action
When did it stop being about martial arts?
I said purely as opposed to a show like the orginal Dragon Ball.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by lunaticthegame » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:25 am

He's pretty good, just if he were to make a lot of REALLy good music, he'd need a better budget.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Jinzoningen MULE » Wed Feb 22, 2017 12:39 am

lunaticthegame wrote:He's pretty good, just if he were to make a lot of REALLy good music, he'd need a better budget.
He's worked on various shows and produced mediocre scores for all of them that I'm aware of. Budget has little to do with it.
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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Terez » Wed Feb 22, 2017 3:56 am

lunaticthegame wrote:He's pretty good, just if he were to make a lot of REALLy good music, he'd need a better budget.
The best composers of history never produced masterpieces consistently on the kind of time frame you get for anime soundtracks. The only one who was able to put out regular masterpieces was Bach, and there's a reason he's widely considered to be the greatest composer of all time. (Whoever your favorite composer might be, their favorite was probably Bach.) Mozart for example had a prolific output but he was extremely repetitive and often dull. Beethoven was less prolific but he still had a number of duds. Most composers put out maybe 3-4 masterpieces a year, depending on how you define the word, and less the longer the works.

In other words, much like animation, it has nothing to do with budget and everything to do with time. Maybe a better budget could get him better assistants to handle things like track placement but I don't think we know enough about his process and his staff to say.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Zephyr » Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:00 am

SaiyanGod117 wrote:
Zephyr wrote:
SaiyanGod117 wrote:Dragon Ball stop being a purely martial arts show a while ago. It seems now it's all about that fastpaced and seamless action
When did it stop being about martial arts?
I said purely as opposed to a show like the orginal Dragon Ball.
How was Dragon Ball purely a martial arts show in a way that Dragon Ball Z wasn't?

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by SaiyamanMS » Wed Feb 22, 2017 5:45 am

He's better than Mark Menza's work on the GT dub. Which, uh... isn't saying much. I don't actively dislike his work, but it doesn't really impress me. Kikuchi, Tokunaga, Yamamoto and Faulconer all had their fair share of memorable tracks that I adore, while the most memorable tracks I can think of in the Sumitomo score are his rendition of Hero ~Kibou no Uta~ in Battle of Gods and Cha-La Head-Cha-La in Super. Why can't the guy who did the music for Dragon Ball Fusions do the anime too? The music in that game feels very Kikuchi-esque.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by SaiyanGod117 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 6:25 pm

Zephyr wrote:
SaiyanGod117 wrote:
Zephyr wrote: When did it stop being about martial arts?
I said purely as opposed to a show like the orginal Dragon Ball.
How was Dragon Ball purely a martial arts show in a way that Dragon Ball Z wasn't?
It's more disconnected from the fundamentals of martial arts in fighting and theme. In the OG Dragon Ball, it was centered on more honing your skills and attributes and that's what primarily the narrative revolved around. If you wanted to get stronger, train your mind and body, if you wanted to defeat a strong enemy, same thing. Similarly, most of the adventures of the OG Dragon Ball revolved around traveling the world fighting and learning from martial art masters. Albeit, it did have some fanstay, but at it's core it was primarily martial arts.

In Dragon Ball Z-Super there's still some martial arts, but it's focus is more on transformation and power ups. Plus things like magical beings, gods, and aliens and you could say that for DB, it's just that DBZ- Super makes it far more prominent in the story.

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Re: Your opinion of Norihito Sumitomo

Post by Metalwario64 » Wed Feb 22, 2017 8:54 pm

Terez wrote:
Metalwario64 wrote:Kikuchi never had such lows like Sumitomo's disco track as well.
Drunken organ improv. Fortunately for us, it wasn't spammed quite as much, but it was truly awful.
Uh... What? You mean this fantastic dark and ominous track? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4G3yVXU80Y
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