Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

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Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby VegettoEX » Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:29 am

Heyo! Similar to some of the previous guest appearances and interviews, I'm creating a dedicated thread here on the forum just in case anyone doesn't follow us on social media, might be interested in checking this out, and otherwise would not see it pop up.

Fresh Geek Context is about two years old and about 50 episodes into its run. The two hosts, Jace and Josh, have been fans of the website and podcast, asked me to come on the show to chat, and I was happy to do so! They had a bunch of prepared questions for me about working on the website, meeting the other dudes, goals and plans and worth ethic stuff, and then we also took a slew of listener questions, as well.

I hope you enjoy the chat! You can grab the MP3 directly, or if you're already subscribed to Kanzenshuu's podcast feed, it's already there waiting for you.
:: [| Michael "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu |] - [| VegettoEX.com |] ::

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby TrunksTrevelyan0064 » Mon Jul 30, 2018 4:36 pm

This was a delightful thing to listen to. At risk of sounding like a brainless follower, I agreed with most if not all the things you said.

I very much feel you on the whole "I am a massive fan of [thing] and I want to somehow contribute something to its fandom" (I'm still trying to figure out what that specific "something" could be for me personally in regards to Dragon Ball, but that's a different topic entirely).

Seeing as Legendary Super Warriors was brought up, I can't not mention that that game holds a special place in my heart. It's not the most amazing game out there (though fun enough), but it definitely had an impact on my life, as without it I wouldn't have met a great friend who I am still in regular contact with to this day.

During the video game talk, I was also hoping that the lovely little gem Advanced Adventure would be mentioned. I've said this plenty of times before, but little Son Goku exploring a world he is adorably clueless about yet utterly invulnerable to, is the purest of pure gold, and Advanced Adventure evokes in me that same carefree, wholesome feeling that I get from the source material.

Overall, interviews like this always remind me - though I remain pretty much permanently conscious of it anyway - of how indescribably grateful I am for the professionalism and authenticity behind Kanzenshuu and everyone who contributes to it. So thank you once more for everything y'all do!

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby nato25 » Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:04 pm

TrunksTrevelyan0064 wrote:This was a delightful thing to listen to. At risk of sounding like a brainless follower, I agreed with most if not all the things you said.

I very much feel you on the whole "I am a massive fan of [thing] and I want to somehow contribute something to its fandom" (I'm still trying to figure out what that specific "something" could be for me personally in regards to Dragon Ball, but that's a different topic entirely).

Seeing as Legendary Super Warriors was brought up, I can't not mention that that game holds a special place in my heart. It's not the most amazing game out there (though fun enough), but it definitely had an impact on my life, as without it I wouldn't have met a great friend who I am still in regular contact with to this day.

During the video game talk, I was also hoping that the lovely little gem Advanced Adventure would be mentioned. I've said this plenty of times before, but little Son Goku exploring a world he is adorably clueless about yet utterly invulnerable to, is the purest of pure gold, and Advanced Adventure evokes in me that same carefree, wholesome feeling that I get from the source material.

Overall, interviews like this always remind me - though I remain pretty much permanently conscious of it anyway - of how indescribably grateful I am for the professionalism and authenticity behind Kanzenshuu and everyone who contributes to it. So thank you once more for everything y'all do!


Seconded, I visit this website almost daily and continue to get awesome info from it, have great, unique and sometimes combative discussions with the community and thoroughly enjoy the podcast. Thank you greatly for all the work you and everyone that contributes to this great site does.

Loved this bonus episode as well, felt like it was a Toriyama interview just with Mike. Fresh Geek Context asked some intriguing and pressing questions. Really refreshing to hear you speak candidly about the dub as it's something I feel is always tiptoed around in discussion. I loved your stance on how you don't need to hear some guy in Texas' (although honestly, I feel this is a bit condescending and dismissive when you talk this way as you obviously know the names!) interpretation on it.

My big 2 follow up questions to that would be:

Would you watch a faithful dub (maybe akin to Attack on Titan's dub which is almost word for word with synonyms) of Dragon Ball that was highly regarded by critics or would you still stick to the original no matter what?

and

You obviously are very critical of Funimations changes to the script and rightfully so, but of course Toei and the anime staff are adding to the original script of the manga and there's heaps of Toei only productions. How do you feel about changes like that relative to changes made by the dub?

Bring back fan emails!

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby VegettoEX » Wed Aug 01, 2018 10:34 am

Thanks for checking it out! A lot of the history stuff may be too much of a retread for longtime visitors/listeners, but some of the other material is stuff you generally don't hear on our regular show for reasons as explained therein.

TrunksTrevelyan0064 wrote:During the video game talk, I was also hoping that the lovely little gem Advanced Adventure would be mentioned. I've said this plenty of times before, but little Son Goku exploring a world he is adorably clueless about yet utterly invulnerable to, is the purest of pure gold, and Advanced Adventure evokes in me that same carefree, wholesome feeling that I get from the source material.

I was super-close to mentioning it, but I didn't necessarily want to get into yet another total aside about things :).

nato25 wrote:I loved your stance on how you don't need to hear some guy in Texas' (although honestly, I feel this is a bit condescending and dismissive when you talk this way as you obviously know the names!) interpretation on it.

I mean... I don't, really. I have no idea who the script writers are these days, and especially when it comes to some of the artistic license being tossed around on a per-character or per-actor basis, and what overall authority the director may or may not hold over that... yeah, I have no idea these days. It was always easy in the past to just blame things on Barry Watson (since he truly was the production overlord), but today it's nebulous enough at times to just pin it on "random folks down in Texas".

And yes, it is intended to be a bit condescending and dismissive. :)

nato25 wrote:Would you watch a faithful dub (maybe akin to Attack on Titan's dub which is almost word for word with synonyms) of Dragon Ball that was highly regarded by critics or would you still stick to the original no matter what?

I don't mean this as a personal attack back at you ('cuz it's certainly an honest question), but I don't really understand the (what sometimes seems like a) fascination with asking or wanting to know this. You all already know our stance on things. There is literally nothing an English dub has to offer us. They didn't make the show and there is nothing these people can teach us about the show.

To me, it always seems like a dub-only watcher's way of validating their choice. Like, they want to watch dubs, so if they know someone who really loves the franchise with all their heart would also watch it dubbed — were it to actually be good — they could rest easy at night knowing they are OK in their choice.

You are OK in your choice. You don't need my approval. I don't need to, or rather CAN'T, validate what you do. You do you.

What I'm going to do in the meantime is explain what I love, why I love it, the how and why behind my loving it, and I hope that I explain and express my love in such a way that you want to check it out the same way I do!

At best an English dub is just always going to be a curiosity; at its worst, it's something that actively works against me doing my job.

nato25 wrote:You obviously are very critical of Funimations changes to the script and rightfully so, but of course Toei and the anime staff are adding to the original script of the manga and there's heaps of Toei only productions. How do you feel about changes like that relative to changes made by the dub?

Again, I don't mean this as an attack back at you or putting words in your mouth, but I say this all because I hear/see it so much:

I see this all the time as a distraction. Whataboutism. The dub did bad things, BUT SO DID TOEI SO YOU'RE A HYPOCRITE!

And this is total nonsense. We talk all the time about the changes Toei made. Things that are simply inconsistencies, things that affect the originally-intended tone of a scene, and things that are outright social problems to the fucking core like holy shit how did this ever get made this way.

There are a bunch of ways to follow up on this, and I've taken some time to think about how to get it across... but I think a quick list is really the best way:

- Being critical/dismissive of dub changes and being critical/dismissive of Toei's own changes are not mutually exclusive
- That being said, doing one without doing the other in certain cases is not inherently hypocritical
- When your mission is the original Japanese version, wasting time and resources and mental real estate on some foreign localization eventually just works against your original mission
- The original anime is already made, WAS already made by the time I even got to it, and we can't change that
- FUNimation's English dub, however, is something that I have seen from its effective beginning FROM that very beginning; I have seen it change and morph and improve and then continuously regress over time
- The original version is the original version is the original version
- People are unique, complicated, nuanced creatures that have varying feelings and reactions to different types of media that may or may not be in line with similar viewpoints they've already expressed for all sorts of reasons

I'm probably not getting some of that across as well as I would like, but I continue to value everyone's time listening, everyone's questions, and everyone continuing to entertain my bullshit for so many years on end.
:: [| Michael "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu |] - [| VegettoEX.com |] ::

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby nato25 » Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:30 am

Thanks for taking the time to reply Mike, really awesome and I greatly appreciate it.


"VegettoEX wrote:I loved your stance on how you don't need to hear some guy in Texas' (although honestly, I feel this is a bit condescending and dismissive when you talk this way as you obviously know the names!) interpretation on it.
I mean... I don't, really. I have no idea who the script writers are these days, and especially when it comes to some of the artistic license being tossed around on a per-character or per-actor basis, and what overall authority the director may or may not hold over that... yeah, I have no idea these days. It was always easy in the past to just blame things on Barry Watson (since he truly was the production overlord), but today it's nebulous enough at times to just pin it on "random folks down in Texas".

And yes, it is intended to be a bit condescending and dismissive. :)


You know what, I'm kind of glad you said this. I guess in my head I was always just thinking it was largely Sabat responsible for how the dub runs (the promotion work they do certainly pegs it that way), but you're right that is probably not the case.

VegettoEX wrote:Would you watch a faithful dub (maybe akin to Attack on Titan's dub which is almost word for word with synonyms) of Dragon Ball that was highly regarded by critics or would you still stick to the original no matter what?
I don't mean this as a personal attack back at you ('cuz it's certainly an honest question), but I don't really understand the (what sometimes seems like a) fascination with asking or wanting to know this. You all already know our stance on things. There is literally nothing an English dub has to offer us. They didn't make the show and there is nothing these people can teach us about the show.

To me, it always seems like a dub-only watcher's way of validating their choice. Like, they want to watch dubs, so if they know someone who really loves the franchise with all their heart would also watch it dubbed — were it to actually be good — they could rest easy at night knowing they are OK in their choice.

You are OK in your choice. You don't need my approval. I don't need to, or rather CAN'T, validate what you do. You do you.


You've got me pegged all wrong on this one! I will admit I grew up on the dub and still love it to this day but I enjoy both thoroughly on there own merits and I'm not a person that would seek validation on something like entertainment. You obviously have a low opinion of the Funi dub so I wondered as to if that was your main reason for shying away from the dub all this time in addition to your love and respect to the original Japanese work. I mean this is a show you love so one would think you would love hearing it in your native language and seeing that spin on it. I totally see your point about them having nothing to offer and you wanting to focus purely on the original Japanese though, and it's good to see that you do show some respect to the dub where you think it's earned such as the casting of Chirs Ayers and his performance.


VegettoEX wrote:I see this all the time as a distraction. Whataboutism. The dub did bad things, BUT SO DID TOEI SO YOU'RE A HYPOCRITE!

And this is total nonsense. We talk all the time about the changes Toei made. Things that are simply inconsistencies, things that affect the originally-intended tone of a scene, and things that are outright social problems to the fucking core like holy shit how did this ever get made this way.

There are a bunch of ways to follow up on this, and I've taken some time to think about how to get it across... but I think a quick list is really the best way:

- Being critical/dismissive of dub changes and being critical/dismissive of Toei's own changes are not mutually exclusive
- That being said, doing one without doing the other in certain cases is not inherently hypocritical
- When your mission is the original Japanese version, wasting time and resources and mental real estate on some foreign localization eventually just works against your original mission
- The original anime is already made, WAS already made by the time I even got to it, and we can't change that
- FUNimation's English dub, however, is something that I have seen from its effective beginning FROM that very beginning; I have seen it change and morph and improve and then continuously regress over time
- The original version is the original version is the original version
- People are unique, complicated, nuanced creatures that have varying feelings and reactions to different types of media that may or may not be in line with similar viewpoints they've already expressed for all sorts of reasons


I can see how I came across as 'TOEI is just as bad as the dub!!! the dubs still good! haha. That wasn't my intention though so sorry for wording my question poorly. I really just wanted to know how you felt about any changes being made on top of Toriyama's original work which you answered in your first question so thank you. I feel like long time listeners mostly knew your stance on these things but seeing this reaffirmation is great for learning more about you.

VegettoEX wrote:I'm probably not getting some of that across as well as I would like, but I continue to value everyone's time listening, everyone's questions, and everyone continuing to entertain my bullshit for so many years on end.


I think you indeed came across well and I'll continue to listen promptly until you guys stop decide to stop being both enlightening and entertaining.

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby VegettoEX » Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:54 am

Like I said, I was really trying not to necessarily put words in your mouth and extrapolate out more than you intended, but I also wanted to build on those questions and explain what I often do see when those questions are asked. I'm more than confident that any regular listener/visitor of ours means well and is asking questions in good faith! Thanks, again.
:: [| Michael "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby jpranevich » Sun Aug 05, 2018 3:15 pm

Which anime was it that you said you enjoyed going back to rewatch? I was in my car so didn't write it down and now I'm too lazy to scan in the podcast to determine what you said. Was it "Fist of the North Star"?

I remember that it was a series that I had not seen and that I should probably see based on your recommendation, but beyond that I do not remember. It was a busy day...

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby VegettoEX » Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:32 pm

jpranevich wrote:Which anime was it that you said you enjoyed going back to rewatch? I was in my car so didn't write it down and now I'm too lazy to scan in the podcast to determine what you said. Was it "Fist of the North Star"?

I remember that it was a series that I had not seen and that I should probably see based on your recommendation, but beyond that I do not remember. It was a busy day...

There's not much I rewatch, but as for Fist of the North Star, that's what I'm sadly only just now (very slowly) watching my way through for the first time. Been doing so in chunks for a long while, and trying to really keep up with it lately. I'm about 60 episodes in right now.

Would recommend A++++
:: [| Michael "VegettoEX" LaBrie |] ::
:: [| Kanzenshuu |] - [| VegettoEX.com |] ::

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Re: Fresh Geek Context: VegettoEX Interview (July 2018)

Postby dualist » Sun Aug 12, 2018 1:48 pm

This was a very insightful interview. I heard references here and there to dragon ball during my teen years in the 90s (I think I'm just a couple years older than you, so dating myself as well...LOL), but didn't REALLY get into the show until around 2003. The part of the interview where you discussed the English dub was really interesting. I was introduced to DB through the Funi dub and remember thinking the Japanese voices sounded strange I came across Kanzenshuu in 2013 and used to roll my eyes at your pronunciations and think it came off as condescending. Yet even before I heard you speak so eloquently about it in this interview, I had changed my stance as I realized that I was pretty ignorant to the entire issue. Your pronunciations are obviously the correct ones, but what was so insightful ruing the interview was learning that the correct ones were all that was around back then. So you don't say it correctly as a wag your finger type of thing, but because you absorbed the content in it's original form.

I could totally relate to the Fresh Geek guys because it seems like we have a shared experience with our introduction to DB. Watching Super was so interesting because I developed a loved for the Japanese voice acting to the point where I'm not even watching the dub. I NEVER thought I would feel that way, but as a result, I'm going back and doing a Z re-watch in Japanese.

With all that being said, just want to thank you and the rest of the fellas for providing so content and education on the series. This site is a true treasure and I appreciate coming here for the news and discussions with the community. Keep up the good work, bro!

P.S.: Kinda sad you don't like the Xenoverse series...lol. :(


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