Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

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GreatSaiyaJeff
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Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby GreatSaiyaJeff » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:15 pm

So I personally didn't care much for Kai since it's just a DBZ without the filler. (I can skip episodes or fast forward through scenes on my DVDs) However I do appreciate that it brought in a new generation of fans. The one thing I think is a missed opportunity is reanimating it, now don't get me wrong, I like the original animation of the series but do you think they should have gone the crystal route and reanimate Z or they did the right thing and just trimmed down the series?
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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby precita » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:20 pm

Considering the animation likely would have looked as crappy as the first year of Super did, it's probably a good thing they spared us from that.

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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby Jinzoningen MULE » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:35 pm

Wouldn't this be better placed in the Kai section?

As for the actual question, I'm not much concerned with what they should have done, but rather, what they shouldn't have. They shouldn't have cut and paste episodes of Z into a shorter format and pretend that constitutes a new series. They shouldn't have replaced seemingly random bits old footage with poorly traced and poorly colored imitations, and they shouldn't have been so careless with the last arc that the whole product morphed into the greenest shit ever.
precita wrote:Considering the animation likely would have looked as crappy as the first year of Super did, it's probably a good thing they spared us from that.

That's not necessarily true. The reason Super had such a terrible run, and even still suffers from schedule issues is due to the hasty pre-production. No one had any time to get anything done because they were in such a race to have the series go on air immediately after Kai ended, which is why we only got 4 episodes in without a massive collapse.

However, Kai was created under entirely different circumstances. While it probably wouldn't have been the best looking series if it had been reanimated due to the general stagnation that's latched onto the franchise, it wouldn't have undergone Super's problems. More than likely, it would be more animated than Super is even now.
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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby veggiechan » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:41 pm

Absolutely. As it stands right now it's more or less useless to Japanese fans as it's inferior in almost every way to the original. Sucks seeing the nicely animated opening credits then settling for the same animation as Z. At least English-speaking fans have a much better dub. But if we had that plus reanimation it would've been significantly better to me. Case in point: the cutscenes from Ultimate Tenkaichi with the Kai dubbing.

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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby JacobYBM » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:45 pm

I would have much preferred Dragon Ball Kai being animated entirely from scratch. All 519 chapters could easily fit into 160 episodes.
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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby TheRed259 » Fri Apr 28, 2017 10:57 pm

After watching DragonBall Super, my answer is no.

But if we have been told that we will get something so close to the manga like this, then maybe I would change my mind.

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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby DHM211 » Fri Apr 28, 2017 11:31 pm

If it followed the character designs of the late cell arc/buu arc instead of the current character designs, had a better production schedule then super, and used the animation filter thats being applied to the Universal Survival Arc, then yeah.

Seeing as those requirements wouldn't have been met, then I'm happy they didn't reanimate it.

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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Saikyo no Senshi » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:40 am

Yep. I wouldn't despise Kai as much as I do had it been reanimated. I hate the strategy and mindset behind the product. The producers wanted to modernize the old series, but couldn't be bothered to produce new animation for it. Fuck that.

As much as I have problems with Super's visuals and production values, they aren't getting the basics wrong at least.

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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby Robo4900 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:51 am

DHM211 wrote:And used the animation filter thats being applied to the Universal Survival Arc, then yeah.

I vehemently disagree with this particular point. The filter looks awful, and is clearly an attempt to pander to the "'90s remaster like the orange bricks because that's what dbz looks like lololol" crowd(AKA: The Enigmo brigade).

TheRed259 wrote:After watching DragonBall Super, my answer is no.

But if we have been told that we will get something so close to the manga like this, then maybe I would change my mind.

Yeah, basically this.
Having said that, I do prefer Dragon Ball Z's animation to even the better stuff from Super; the slight roughness, the grit, it all looks great, and gives the show a real texture that can't really be met(Of course, Funimation's been trying to destroy this since the Orange Bricks, but never mind them...). Add to this the fact the animation itself is really nice(Except when it wasn't, of course), and you have something that really kicks ass. A reanimated Kai wouldn't have this, but if the animation was nice enough, I'd still think it was really cool.

Of course, given the nature of Kai, this would have never happened, as the budget required would be far too high, and if it had happened like this, the difference between Kai and Final Chapters would be even larger, making it even more jarring.
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Re: Should have been Kai been reanimated?

Postby Jinzoningen MULE » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:56 am

Robo4900 wrote:
DHM211 wrote:And used the animation filter thats being applied to the Universal Survival Arc, then yeah.

I vehemently disagree with this particular point. The filter looks awful, and is clearly an attempt to pander to the "'90s remaster like the orange bricks because that's what dbz looks like lololol" crowd

At first, perhaps, but the negative contrast effects have been fixed for quite a while now, and it works wonders on the lines.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Arian » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:58 am

I don't even know if Kai should have been made, because I was happy with Dragon Ball Z.

But when it comes to reanimating it or using the same animation, I advocate a reanimation. The animation in Ultimate Tenkaichi was decent, and it was just lazy and cheap of them not to do it.

Although using the classic animation does make it more recognizable...
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Metalwario64 » Sat Apr 29, 2017 2:25 am

If Kai had been reanimated, I would have preferred for them to do what Jojo did and try to match the art with how it evolved in the manga, but I'm certain that if Toei had reanimated Kai, they would have forced in Yamamuro's current character designs.

Of course, between what happened to Sailor Moon Crystal (well, the first 2 arcs anyway) and much of Dragon Ball Super, I imagine they would have rushed it and not put much money and effort toward it, so it would probably have the same schedule and planning problems that Super has faced, and in that case, I prefer what we got with Kai. At least, they probably could have put in money to tracing the whole series (which would have probably still been more cost and time effective and would cut out the need for storyboarding whatnot) and correcting some egregious Ebisawa art and some of Uchiyama's later, poor quality artwork.

That could also have lead them to being able to chop out more filler by animating new effects for Gohan being on the ship and being teleported to Earth, chopping out all of the filler with him returning to fight Freeza (which they could have done anyway by just redrawing a Gohan shot, and then tracing the teleport effect from another scene, and it would have taken very little effort).
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby SaiyanGod117 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 2:04 pm

Super is a special case, Kai wouldn't have looked like Super. The character designs at time of Kai's production, it would have looked like how it did in the promo art. So, it would look the equivalent to modernized 1990s Z-art; similar to Yo! Son-Goku and Friends. Even if it did have Yamamuro's current characters designs, I pretty much sure most of you wouldn't have even cared at time.

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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby ekrolo2 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 3:28 pm

Not with the current art style, no. There's also the question of just how directly you want to translate things because there's some things later on that'd covered in no time like Goku vs Vegeta round 2 which lasts a grand total of 10 pages and would get animated in the span of 2 minutes if you just directly translated it with no additional stuff.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby sintzu » Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:32 pm

No unless it was to be a seaosnal anime and even then it wouldn't be able to recreat the look that the original was known for simply because of the new technology that's used today.

JacobYBM wrote:All 519 chapters could easily fit into 160 episodes.


It took more than that for Z alone so there's no way they could do that and the original's 194 chapters as well.

ekrolo2 wrote:There's also the question of just how directly you want to translate things because there's some things later on that'd covered in no time like Goku vs Vegeta round 2 which lasts a grand total of 10 pages and would get animated in the span of 2 minutes if you just directly translated it with no additional stuff.


Exactly, there are things that need some changes when translating them from one format to another. trying to follow the manga page by page would be a mess. The reason that fights and other things were rushed in the manga is because of Toriyama's health at the time so there's no reaosn to make the same mistake he did.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Jinzoningen MULE » Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:35 pm

sintzu wrote:
JacobYBM wrote:All 519 chapters could easily fit into 160 episodes.


It took more than that for Z alone so there's no way they could do that and the original's 194 chapters as well.

Kai kept in a ton of filler when you look at it closely. If it were adapted panel for panel, the entirety of Dragon Ball could definitely fit in under 200 episodes.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Apr 30, 2017 6:44 pm

If Kai were to be like how Resurrection "F" The Future Trunks Special Edition reanimated bits were than 100% yes. I think largely why Kai failed was because I think people in Japan just saw it as basically a re-run which explains why did well ratings wise but not where it counted the merchandising sales.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby FoolsGil » Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:07 pm

Well, I remember when Kai was originally talked about and how excited myself and everyone were about it, and watched as interest waned when it was learned Kai was just a glorified trace job. Of course Kai should have been reanimated, the Dragonball franchise is a juggernaut the money put into remaking the series would bring at least triple Toei's money back.. And of course, hindsight being 20/20, Super would have greatly benefited with the flashbacks with reanimated footage.
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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby TheRed259 » Sun Apr 30, 2017 7:15 pm

Jinzoningen MULE wrote:Kai kept in a ton of filler when you look at it closely.

This basically happened with Kai: The Final Chapters so that Toei can sell more episodes internationally.

Kai 1.0= 98 episodes (199 episodes in DBZ)= they removed 101 episodes.
Kai 2.0= 69 episodes (092 episodes in DBZ)= they removed 023 episodes.

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Re: Should Kai Have Been Reanimated?

Postby Lord Beerus » Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:08 pm

Hell yeah. I honestly wouldn't have minded a modern animated remake of Dragon Ball, even with the current Yamamuro character designs. It could have definitely fit under 200 episodes, if it strictly adhered to the lighting pace of manga and adapted the story strictly from panel to panel. My only worry is that would have been censored even more than the original anime(s) was.


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