A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

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A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:12 pm

Sean Schemmel once talked about "A horribly edited and scored version of Kai with silly sounds and music" that was coming somewhere. Earlier on people assumed it was the Nicktoons dub (Dont quote me on this though) then the Ocean Kai dub and it seems its lost forever. I however think Sean was talking about an English pilot they may or may not have done for Kids TV networks. Thank god both Nicktoons and 4kids/Saban just went with an edited but true version of Kai.

What do you think may have happened to that dub? And what may have been its purpose?
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Robo4900 » Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:02 pm

Here's what I think might have happened: He heard Ocean were doing a Kai dub based on the Nicktoons masters, which Ocean were behind the editing for anyway. So, Schemmel got salty about it, and started spreading misinformation about it based on his knowledge of the Saban and Westwood dubs.

He talked about this in 2010. By that time, the Ocean Kai dub wouldn't have even been cast yet, and they probably would have only composed a handful of tracks for the score, at most. So at best, he's spreading misinformation based on audition footage or demo tapes sent to the producers of the dub which were shown to Sean.

For the record, here's what he said:
Here is why the Ocean group dub will suck. And it has nothing to do with the actors as I have enormous respect for all of them. As far as I know, the Ocean group dub is going to have this really shitty music (some of which I have heard) and a whole host of added sound effects such as "doinks" and "boinks" and even in one scene, where Bulma simply turns her head in a conversation you hear a "whoosh" sound ala a bad martial arts movie. We are giving you the purest DBZ experience possible, and if you don't like that, then you don't like DBZ.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by NitroEX » Tue Jul 04, 2017 1:47 am

I hadn't considered that Ocean and Funimation might've collaborated on a pilot episode or test clip intended to be pitched to Nicktoons (which would potentially also include Ocean's music and sound effects). I believe something similar happened with One Piece in fact. As the story goes, I believe both companies were pitching versions of the show to Toei before 4kids eventually acquired the license to dub the series in the US. Here are some test clips I found:

Funimation Clip
Ocean Clip #1
Ocean Clip #2

As for the Ocean Kai dub, it definitely exists and is more than just a pilot. Numerous actors have confirmed it's been finished for a number of years now. It was supposedly pitched to a Canadian TV channel but was turned down (this was just a rumour, however). There's a small chance it may eventually pop up on television in Canada or some other country that has yet to air Kai.

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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:45 am

I'm pretty sure it was Ocean Kai Schemmel referred to and not a pilot Funimation worked on because he specifically said the Ocean dub would suck because of the music.
NitroEX wrote:I hadn't considered that Ocean and Funimation might've collaborated on a pilot episode or test clip intended to be pitched to Nicktoons (which would potentially also include Ocean's music and sound effects).
Same here, it could have been interesting if Ocean originally offered to let Funimation use their Kai replacement score on the Nicktoons dub. If that was a plan I'm sure Funimation would have rejected the idea, but it may have helped with Ocean Kai knowing the score made for that dub was also available on another TV dub (and kill a lot of curiosity from people like me that want to hear the score) and especially if it was received well.
NitroEX wrote: I believe something similar happened with One Piece in fact. As the story goes, I believe both companies were pitching versions of the show to Toei before 4kids eventually acquired the license to dub the series in the US. Here are some test clips I found:

Funimation Clip
Ocean Clip #1
Ocean Clip #2
Wow, there was a test One Piece Ocean dub (albeit only a few clips, but still)? I honestly never would have thought of that being a possibility. Makes you wonder what other unaired dubs or pilots are out there.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Tue Jul 04, 2017 6:13 pm

NitroEX wrote:I hadn't considered that Ocean and Funimation might've collaborated on a pilot episode or test clip intended to be pitched to Nicktoons (which would potentially also include Ocean's music and sound effects). I believe something similar happened with One Piece in fact. As the story goes, I believe both companies were pitching versions of the show to Toei before 4kids eventually acquired the license to dub the series in the US. Here are some test clips I found:

Funimation Clip
Ocean Clip #1
Ocean Clip #2

As for the Ocean Kai dub, it definitely exists and is more than just a pilot. Numerous actors have confirmed it's been finished for a number of years now. It was supposedly pitched to a Canadian TV channel but was turned down (this was just a rumour, however). There's a small chance it may eventually pop up on television in Canada or some other country that has yet to air Kai.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by NitroEX » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:03 pm

8000 Saiyan wrote:and that little girl sounds like Brenna O'Brien.
Sounds more like Andrea Libman to me but the quality isn't very clear.

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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Tue Jul 04, 2017 7:55 pm

NitroEX wrote: I believe something similar happened with One Piece in fact. As the story goes, I believe both companies were pitching versions of the show to Toei before 4kids eventually acquired the license to dub the series in the US. Here are some test clips I found:

Funimation Clip
Ocean Clip #1
Ocean Clip #2
Wow, there was a test One Piece Ocean dub (albeit only a few clips, but still)? I honestly never would have thought of that being a possibility. Makes you wonder what other unaired dubs or pilots are out there.[/quote]
There are so many unaired dubs.

http://lostmediaarchive.wikia.com/wiki/ ... :Lost_Dubs
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by VejituhTheWarriorGuy » Tue Jul 04, 2017 8:18 pm

NitroEX wrote:I hadn't considered that Ocean and Funimation might've collaborated on a pilot episode or test clip intended to be pitched to Nicktoons (which would potentially also include Ocean's music and sound effects). I believe something similar happened with One Piece in fact. As the story goes, I believe both companies were pitching versions of the show to Toei before 4kids eventually acquired the license to dub the series in the US. Here are some test clips I found:

Funimation Clip
Ocean Clip #1
Ocean Clip #2
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Robo4900 » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:37 pm

Dragon Ball Ireland wrote:I'm pretty sure it was Ocean Kai Schemmel referred to and not a pilot Funimation worked on because he specifically said the Ocean dub would suck because of the music.
It's possible they did work on a few pilot clips with just a few key Ocean cast members(Or possibly stock voice clips from previous Ocean dubs, since it's just a test), and that's what Schemmel saw, and on the basis of this pilot, someone with the rights(Probably someone in Europe or Canada) saw it and decided to commission a full Ocean dub of Kai.

Putting aside the fact this is only the very start of a working hypothesis, it would explain why Schemmel got to see it way back in 2010.
Of course, the theory about Ocean putting together a replacement score and offering it to Funimation is also valid. I wonder if Schemmel would be willing to explain what context he heard the music in. That would clear a lot of things up.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:32 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Dragon Ball Ireland wrote:I'm pretty sure it was Ocean Kai Schemmel referred to and not a pilot Funimation worked on because he specifically said the Ocean dub would suck because of the music.
It's possible they did work on a few pilot clips with just a few key Ocean cast members(Or possibly stock voice clips from previous Ocean dubs, since it's just a test), and that's what Schemmel saw, and on the basis of this pilot, someone with the rights(Probably someone in Europe or Canada) saw it and decided to commission a full Ocean dub of Kai.

Putting aside the fact this is only the very start of a working hypothesis, it would explain why Schemmel got to see it way back in 2010.
Of course, the theory about Ocean putting together a replacement score and offering it to Funimation is also valid. I wonder if Schemmel would be willing to explain what context he heard the music in. That would clear a lot of things up.
It has been a long time since then so it would be rather moot to ask him anything regarding this I feel.

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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by sintzu » Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:56 pm

I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Fri Jul 07, 2017 2:18 pm

sintzu wrote:I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
I heard this too, although I'm sceptical as I've never seen any concrete evidence Funimation considered doing this. Someone definitely mentioned it on these forums though. It wouldn't have been that hypothetical recycled dub because Schemmel was specifically referring to a Kai dub with "shitty Canadian music".
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Robo4900 » Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:45 pm

sintzu wrote:I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
That's very clearly not true.

If it was just their old Z dub over Kai's footage, it would be a hell of a lot of effort to cut it to work out, none of the actors would know anything about it(And they wouldn't be talking about recording for it), there would be no recasts, and they would be missing half of the Freeza arc.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by OmegaRockman » Fri Jul 07, 2017 6:55 pm

sintzu wrote:I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
I'm pretty sure those rumors were referring to Funimation's supposed original plans for their dub of Kai, but Justin Cook and Chris Sabat supposedly fought in favor of a proper redub. Of course, I don't remember if any official source confirmed or denied that rumor, either, so take it with a grain of salt.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Fri Jul 07, 2017 7:19 pm

OmegaRockman wrote:
sintzu wrote:I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
I'm pretty sure those rumors were referring to Funimation's supposed original plans for their dub of Kai, but Justin Cook and Chris Sabat supposedly fought in favor of a proper redub. Of course, I don't remember if any official source confirmed or denied that rumor, either, so take it with a grain of salt.
Yeah I don't think there is any confirmed source for that either the same with the Sabat wanted Mcneil to be Piccolo.

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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Sat Jul 08, 2017 4:13 am

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:
OmegaRockman wrote:
sintzu wrote:I read somewhere here (it could've been just speculation) that they were going to just stick their Z dub on the Kai footage so maybe that's what it is.
I'm pretty sure those rumors were referring to Funimation's supposed original plans for their dub of Kai, but Justin Cook and Chris Sabat supposedly fought in favor of a proper redub. Of course, I don't remember if any official source confirmed or denied that rumor, either, so take it with a grain of salt.
Yeah I don't think there is any confirmed source for that either the same with the Sabat wanted Mcneil to be Piccolo.
Widespread and unproven, sometimes disproven rumours are common to the Dragon Ball fandom. The same can be said about the notion Toriyama wanted to make Gohan the main character after the Cell games but changed it back to Goku after getting threats, which a lot of people believe. It's a shame because there wouldn't be so much argument if those who spread the rumours took a minute to retrieve the source and used it to back up what they're saying rather than leaving the rest of us to question where the rumours started.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by Robo4900 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:18 pm

Baggie_Saiyan wrote:Yeah I don't think there is any confirmed source for that either the same with the Sabat wanted Mcneil to be Piccolo.
That one doesn't even make sense. The way I understand it, Funimation's talent pool is American non-union actors, while McNeil is a Canadian union actor.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by MR.Mark » Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:23 pm

Either way it would of been interesting to hear Scott in the kai dub with proper direction from Sabat.

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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:24 pm

Robo4900 wrote:
Baggie_Saiyan wrote:Yeah I don't think there is any confirmed source for that either the same with the Sabat wanted Mcneil to be Piccolo.
That one doesn't even make sense. The way I understand it, Funimation's talent pool is American non-union actors, while McNeil is a Canadian union actor.
Although Scott's a union voice actor, Funimation managed to get him for Fullmetal Alchemist and One Piece.
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Re: A "Silly and Lame" English version of Kai.

Post by ButtfaceKalinski » Sun Jul 09, 2017 2:12 pm

I can't speak for Scott but you can be a full member of ACTRA but work ficore under AFTRA and thus work on non-union projects. On paper ACTRA and AFTRA have reciprocal agreements, but in practice there's been a few skirmishes over AFTRA's "global rule one" so the relationship between the unions is sometimes tense.

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