DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Discussion specifically regarding the "refreshed" TV version of DBZ created in Japan for its 20th anniversary, including individual threads for each episode.

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DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby GamerSkull » Mon Mar 26, 2018 5:32 pm

I hope nobody has made this topic before but I contemplating whether the Kai blu-rays are worth it.

How do the blu-ray collections for Dragon Ball Z Kai stack up to the regular DBZ blu-rays from FUNi (which I own despite the numerous flaws in them) ?
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KBABZ » Mon Mar 26, 2018 6:51 pm

From what I can find, pretty favourably! Ignoring the widescreen thing, the image appears to be cleaner and more defined, and there's no over-exposed lemon-lime filter over the footage, which results in much better flesh tones at the expense of the white balance. And from personal experience with Kai, looking at even the Blu-Ray footage looks worse and more Orange Brick than Dragon Box.

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby SuperCyan2 » Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:32 pm

Q-TEC put a lot of effort into the Dragon Ball Kai remaster and it looks great on Blu-ray as well as on DVD but the FUNimation Orange Bricks (DVD/BD) are quite ass-y. Blurry, crushed blacks, waterpaint-like, "artistic" and "modern". If the FUNi Orange Bricks DVDs/BDs all looked as good as Season 9 DVD but in fullscreen the English community wouldn't be too fussed with the Dragon Box Z being out of print.

The 9th Season looks terrific, imo!
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KBABZ » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:40 pm

Oh, as well, there's a section of Kai from the Ginyu encounter up until about second form Frieza where in the original production they used movie-quality film, and those episodes in the Kai transfer look fantastic:


---

SuperCyan2 wrote:crushed blacks

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby TheQuazz » Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:25 pm

Oh, is that the reason why that section of Kai looks so great? I simply adore the look those episodes have, I wish the whole of DBZ could have been remastered this way.

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KBABZ » Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:57 pm

TheQuazz wrote:Oh, is that the reason why that section of Kai looks so great? I simply adore the look those episodes have, I wish the whole of DBZ could have been remastered this way.

Agreed, it looks amazing!

The reason why those episodes look so good is because they're using movie film, where the panels for each frame on the film is much larger than the film used elsewhere in the series. By being physically larger, this allows for more detail to be printed on the panels, and that's what makes it pop when shown on modern displays compared to when it first aired in 1991. It's also why what we see in Kai/the Level sets is probably as good as we'll ever see Classic-era Dragon Ball anime, with the exception of the movie-quality film reel content that will benefit from a 4K master.

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KinguKurimuzon » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:09 am

SuperCyan2 wrote:The 9th Season looks terrific, imo!

Really? What'd they do different from the other 8?

Why'd they call them Season Sets anyway? DBZ was just one continuous season, wasn't it?
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KBABZ » Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:25 am

KinguKurimuzon wrote:
SuperCyan2 wrote:The 9th Season looks terrific, imo!

Why'd they call them Season Sets anyway? DBZ was just one continuous season, wasn't it?

It's an American thing mostly, plus Seasons feels more "complete" from a marketing standpoint than "Part X". The arcs themselves also don't really divide evenly so Seasons is a much more convenient way to say "5 episodes x 5 discs = 1 Season!"

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby Luso Saiyan » Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:09 am

I'd say that in terms of quality, and aside from the Level sets (which have sadly been cancelled), the Kai Blu-rays are the best releases of the series on home video.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby SuperCyan2 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:25 am

KinguKurimuzon wrote:Really? What'd they do different from the other 8?


The quality of the Orange Bricks is so inconsistent that it's hard to say what they did different but we at least know they used an automated machine to 'remaster' it so that explains it why some look better and some (or a lot) look worse.

I tried to watch Season 9 on FUNimation Now but that's for paid members only although you can watch the first episodes.

KinguKurimuzon wrote:Why'd they call them Season Sets anyway?[/size ]


It's a US thing where 'seasons' are used just for about anything these days, it's an easy way to identify when a show reaches a new chapter in its story and so on and so forth.

KinguKurimuzon wrote:[size=50]DBZ was just one continuous season, wasn't it?


It was. It officially lasted 291 episodes overall but it did have its arcs/sagas of Saiyan arc, Namek arc, Freeza arc, Artificial Human arc, Cell arc and Majin Boo arc.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby KBABZ » Tue Mar 27, 2018 3:22 pm

SuperCyan2 wrote:
KinguKurimuzon wrote:Really? What'd they do different from the other 8?


The quality of the Orange Bricks is so inconsistent that it's hard to say what they did different but we at least know they used an automated machine to 'remaster' it so that explains it why some look better and some (or a lot) look worse.

Correct, the same automated remastering program was used for Dragon Ball and then GT. In Dragon Ball it looks pretty good, outside of a loss of colours like green. However by the time it got to GT the process was basically perfected and the footage looks comparable to Dragon Box GT with the noise removed. It's just unfortunate that Funimation didn't decide to re-run the automation for the Blu-Ray release of Z, otherwise it'd be much more presentable and forgivable for the widescreen thing.

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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby Danfun64 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 5:51 pm

The reason the Blue Bricks (DB) and Green Bricks (GT) appear the way they do is because they were originally sourced from SD Digibetas. Also, the reason the Green Bricks look like the Dragon Box footage is because Funi's original video source of GT is the Dragon Box footage without any cleanup. Outside of the OP and ED, the colors are pretty much identical, and had Funi's old DVDs not had their infamous compression/macroblocking issues then there would have been no need for a US GT Dragon Box, as the singles didn't go through the DVNR process. As for original DB, the footage is a different source...inferior in some ways, superior in others.

Ever since the Orange Bricks, Funi received a bunch of film reels which they scanned to HD. I wouldn't be surprised if the Digibetas of Z Funi used before the Orange Bricks (again using a master made before the Dragon Boxes) were less grainy than the film Funi got, if the Level Sets were any indication.
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I don't think making Dragon Ball a greek tragedy would sit well with young readers.


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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby SuperCyan2 » Tue Mar 27, 2018 6:25 pm

It's a shame on the Green Bricks they got rid of the original GT logo and the NEPs, FUNi could have offered the GT original logo for the Japanese version and at least keep the NEPs as extras. FUNimation did dub the GT NEPs in English but with Mark Menza's music, unfortunately.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby GamerSkull » Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:30 pm

I'll have to buy the Kai blu-rays at some point. I have the blu-rays for regular DBZ but I want to be able to watch the series' dub (but actually done well).

It's good to here the quality is better.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby Forte224 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:41 am

GamerSkull wrote:I'll have to buy the Kai blu-rays at some point. I have the blu-rays for regular DBZ but I want to be able to watch the series' dub (but actually done well).

It's good to here the quality is better.

Go for it. In my opinion it's one of the best English dubs I've heard.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby SuperCyan2 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 10:10 am

Forte224 wrote:Go for it. In my opinion it's one of the best English dubs I've heard.

Besides the Ocean Dub (the Westwood Dub was shit), yeah, the FUNimation Kai dub is really good too. I can't wait for the Ocean Dub Kai to premier.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby Forte224 » Wed Mar 28, 2018 11:16 am

SuperCyan2 wrote:
Forte224 wrote:Go for it. In my opinion it's one of the best English dubs I've heard.

Besides the Ocean Dub (the Westwood Dub was shit), yeah, the FUNimation Kai dub is really good too. I can't wait for the Ocean Dub Kai to premier.

I can't either, because (no disrespect) I don't get the love for the Ocean dub and I want to figure it out, haha. I can understand Piccolo, but otherwise Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, etc. just don't make sense to me why they're so loved. And they were the original Dragon Ball voices I ever heard!

I particularly can't see any of the Goku VAs bringing the childish tone to Goku, except maybe Kelamis. Whereas I feel Schemmel has done a decent job of bringing that across recently, though he does rely on the word "dude" too much to do so. Anyway, I can definitely agree the Ocean dub we heard in the uncut movies is far and away better than Funi, up until Kai.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby GamerSkull » Thu Mar 29, 2018 5:47 pm

Forte224 wrote:
SuperCyan2 wrote:
Forte224 wrote:Go for it. In my opinion it's one of the best English dubs I've heard.

Besides the Ocean Dub (the Westwood Dub was shit), yeah, the FUNimation Kai dub is really good too. I can't wait for the Ocean Dub Kai to premier.

I can't either, because (no disrespect) I don't get the love for the Ocean dub and I want to figure it out, haha. I can understand Piccolo, but otherwise Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, etc. just don't make sense to me why they're so loved. And they were the original Dragon Ball voices I ever heard!

I particularly can't see any of the Goku VAs bringing the childish tone to Goku, except maybe Kelamis. Whereas I feel Schemmel has done a decent job of bringing that across recently, though he does rely on the word "dude" too much to do so. Anyway, I can definitely agree the Ocean dub we heard in the uncut movies is far and away better than Funi, up until Kai.


I haven't actually heard the Ocean Dub. Perhaps I should check it out.
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby SuperCyan2 » Thu Mar 29, 2018 7:53 pm

GamerSkull wrote:I haven't actually heard the Ocean Dub. Perhaps I should check it out.

Check out the Pioneer DVDs of Movies 1-3 and then the 1-53 episodes if you have time. Ocean Dub did an amazing job on the first three movies and it's a shame they weren't given the rest to dub.

How I'd love to watch 4-13 movies by Ocean Dub. Especially the 13th which is easily the best of all, imo. :cry:
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Re: DBZ Kai Blu-Ray vs. DBZ Blu-Ray (FUNi)

Postby Danfun64 » Thu Mar 29, 2018 9:37 pm

Just a reminder that the dub of Tree of Might is completely different on the Pioneer DVD compared to the Rock the Dragon DVD set. Both are done by Ocean, but the former is uncut and is a lot closer to the original Japanese. While the latter has the same level of accuracy as the other Saban Ocean episodes (meaning a lot lower than the Pioneer dub), the acting is arguably slightly more enthusiastic due to being done before the Pioneer dub. (Dead Zone and World's Strongest have the same faithful dub on both, with the main difference being that the RTD DVD set uses censored masters)

Edit: Also a note that, while the Funi/Ocean/Saban dub of Tree of Might is less faithful to the original Japanese than Funi/Ocean/Pioneer is, the "Ultimate Uncut" dub of Tree of Might is even less faithful than Saban's dub is.
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Noah wrote:The best end for Dragon Ball would be the Freeza arc, but with everyone in King Kai's Planet staying dead, Piccolo and Vegeta too, Goku killed by the explosion of Namek (Freeza was ultimately defeated), Gohan and Bulma the only ones who have succeeded in surving this climatic battle with the two sets of Dragon Balls permanently erased from existence.

I don't think making Dragon Ball a greek tragedy would sit well with young readers.


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