"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Kanassa]

Now that I've seen all the pages... Yep, just as boring as the last one. Merge Zamasu looks cool though, despite his neck pains.

[SansrivaaL]

Goku playing mind games on Zamasu and Vegeta besides getting SSJG, and not knowing what the hell was going on with the potara fusion were the only ones that caught me off guard.

[Pantheon]

Why didn't Vegeta catch on about the Potara? He should know.

Since the Super manga has never had Potara before he had to introduce it through clunky build up. If Toyotaro was a smarter writer it would have been Trunks who was confused.

But there wasn't even any exposition, nobody explained anything.

Never mind, he edited his post.

I have exposition on the mind today because of my essay . I meant build up in the way that if one character knows about something but another one doesn't it's strongly suggesting that the audience should know what is happening based on information given prior. Leaving them to realize that they are missing information from earlier in the series if they don't know what the story is hinting or building to.

[OLKv3]

S-S-Shut your mouth NINGEN!
This part was great

[TheMikado]

Why didn't Vegeta catch on about the Potara? He should know.

Since the Super manga has never had Potara before he had to introduce it through clunky build up. If Toyotaro was a smarter writer it would have been Trunks who was confused.

But there wasn't even any exposition, nobody explained anything.

Never mind, he edited his post.

Unless Goku had a sit down with Vegeta pay Buu. Doubt Vegeta even knows where those earrings came from or even remembers what they look like. It's not like he had a bunch of time to sit and check them out or ask questions. Plus it makes Goku look halfway intelligent and proactive for once. Something very rare in Super. If it was the anime Goku would have stopped Vegeta from trying to stop them because he wanted someone stronger to fight.

[Noah]

This chapter ends with Merged Zamasu? So it seems Vegetto is more likely to appear then

[TheUltimateNinja]

This chapter ends with Merged Zamasu? So it seems Vegetto is more likely to appear then

On the other hand this version is much weaker so Goku and Vegeta may have to downgrade to Gogeta to compensate.

[OLKv3]

This chapter ends with Merged Zamasu? So it seems Vegetto is more likely to appear then

On the other hand this version is much weaker so Goku and Vegeta may have to downgrade to Gogeta to compensate.

How is this version weaker? They seem to be the same power as the anime, except Black doesn't have Naruto clones to nullify Vegeta overpowering him. Zamasu was weaker than SSJ2 Trunks in the anime as well.

[sailorspazz]

S-S-Shut your mouth NINGEN!
This part was great

"Y-you don't understand, we're in love!"

I did find this chapter quite enjoyable (not only because of the hand-holding and "brother" comment though "kindred spirits" from the anime was still better. And them having an argument in the first place felt off to me...my boys would never fight!). Gokuu's attempt at Talk no Jutsu to try to convince Zamasu to give up on the plan was pretty interesting. I mean, I guess it's in his character to try that "give up and go home" tactic with villains. But overall that sort of demonstrates the level of emotional detachment going on here. In the anime, after Black and Zamasu gloated about murdering his family with his own body, there was no chance in hell he'd ever consider letting them go. In the manga, though, it feels very impersonal; even though his body was stolen by the guy, there's hardly any connection between Gokuu and Black. Others have pointed out that they've barely talked to each other, and not traded blows even once. That's one of the reasons that, though there are many things I like about this manga version, the development and character of Black is just so inferior in comparison to the anime that I can't get into it nearly as much.

[Grimlock]

If we are not on the path to meet Gogeta in the manga and considering Final Kamehameha was a Toei's thing and won't appear in the manga too, the only reason I would want to see Vegetto once again is if he appears as a Super Saiyan God. Otherwise, bring Gogeta already or don't fuse them. Let Trunks shine throughout the fight against Merged Zamasu.

[Herms]

Text translation for ch.22:
[spoiler]Page 1
DBS ch.22: Zamasu’s Last Resort
Vertical text: “Now, even the gods are…”
Kaioshin: “Lord Gowasu” [repeat three times]

Page 2
1
Black: “Hmph!”
3
Kaioshin: “[r] Gods are supposed to guide the universe towards peace, yet you do this…! [l] I’ll make you pay for this…!”
5
Zamasu: “Uh-oh!”

Page 3
3
Zamasu: “That’s rich, coming from a god too weak to govern the universe.”
5
Trunks: “[r] Lord Gowasu! You can’t die! [l] Open your eyes…!!”

Page 4
1
Gowasu: “Huh”
2
Gowasu: “[r] Cough [l[ cough”
3
Mai: “He…He’s alive…!”
Gowasu: more coughing
4
Mai: “[r] Kaioshin!!! [l] Lord Gowasu is still alive!!”
6
Black: “What?”
7
Black: “Did I miss his vitals…?”

Page 5
1
Black: “[r] If I leave you guys alive, you’ll just teleport away again. [l] So I’ll kill all of you, starting with the Kaioshins.”
2
Trunks: “Mai! Take Lord Gowasu and use this bike to get as far away from here as you can.”
Mai: “What about you, Trunks…?!”
3
Trunks: “I’ll hold him off until father and Goku get here.”
Mai: “That’s crazy…!!”
4
Trunks: “Go!!!”
5
Trunks: “Dah!!!!”

Page 6
4
Goku: “It’s OK, Trunks and Mai are still alive.”
5
Vegeta: “Darn, they’re pretty far away.”
6
Goku: “Oh no! Trunks’ ki is falling.”
Vegeta: “Is he fighting?”
7
Goku: “Hurry, Vegeta!”

Page 7
3
Trunks: “Fa…Father…”
4
Vegeta: “Hmph”
Goku: “So Kaioshin came here too…!”
5
Black: “Back again, huh?”
7
Vegeta: “[t] I’ll beat him. You feed those two Senzu.”

Page 8
1
Goku: “Can you manage on your own?”
2
Vegeta: “Of course.”
3
Vegeta: “Weren’t you going to seal away the immortal Zamasu?”
Goku: “OK, I’ll do that.”
5
Black: “Hmph”
7
Goku: “Trunks!!!”
8
Goku: “Sorry I’m late Trunks. You held out well. [l] Here’s a Senzu.”

Page 9
1
Zamasu: “I won’t allow this!”
4
Zamasu: “Keh!”
7
Zamasu: “So he got away?...”

Page 10
4
Mai: “Goku…!”
5
Goku: “[r] Hey! [l] Sorry for the wait!”
6
Mai: “[r] Um…[l] If you’ve got Senzu, you should give one to Lord Gowasu first.”
7
Goku: “Huh? Who?”

Page 11
2
Black: “[r] You look the same to me. [l] So what’s changed, Vegeta?”
3
Vegeta: “[r] Hmph…[l] You look as repellent as ever.”
4
Black: “[r] Pretty spunky. [l] Did you get a new transformation or something?”
5
Vegeta: “Did I?”

Page 12
1
Black: “[r] No matter the transformation [l] You’ll never beat me!”
3
Vegeta: “Hah!!!!”
5
Black: “What?”

Page 13
2
Black: “[r] Red hair…?! [l] Super Saiyan God?”
3
Black: “What are you up to?”
Vegeta: “I think you know...”
4
Vegeta: “That I need this form to beat you.”
5
Black: “[r] Hahaha…Vegeta, have you gone mad from despair? [l] What could you do as an inferior Super Saiyan?”
7
Black: “[r] …[l] What’s that look for?”

Page 14
1
Black: “Don’t smirk at me, Saiyan!!!”

Page 15
2
Black: “I thought I told you to lose…”
3
Black: “That expression!!!”

Page 16
3
Black: “Guh!!!”
5
Black: “[r] Nuh…Mumuh…[l] You suddenly got a lot faster…”
6
Black: “What did you do?...
7
Vegeta: “[r] What did I do? [l] Let me show you.”

Page 17
2
Black: “Where is your body getting such power…?!”
6
Vegeta: “Hah!!!”

Page 18
2
Black: “Kuh!!!”

Page 19
3
Black: “Gah!!!!”

Page 20
1
Black: “[r] Don’t toy with me… [l] You’re using some sort of incomprehensible technique…
2
Vegeta: “[r] Oh, don’t you like losing to God? [l] Mr. Rosé.”
3
Black: “[r] I’ve lost? [l] That’s a good one!”
4
Vegeta: “[r] Hmph [l] Then let’s settle this once and for all.”

Page 21
2
Goku: “Phew…Glad I made it in time.”
3
Trunks: “We owe you one, Goku.”
4
Goku: “Gowasu was in a tight spot too!”
5
Gowasu: “I never imagined there was anything like this on Earth…”
6
Kaioshin: “My apologies for using your precious Senzu.”
Goku: “[t] Don’t mention it. You saved Trunks, after all.”
7
Goku: “Still…This means there’s only one Senzu left.”
8
Goku: “[r] Well, no biggie. [l] Vegeta’ll just have to beat Black, and I’ll seal up Zamasu.”

Page 22
1
Trunks: “Huh? Does that mean you’ve learned the Mafuba, Goku…?!
2
Goku: “Yep, I’ve got it down pat!”
3
Goku: Oh, this one’s the time machine?”
4
Goku: “You can have it then.”
5
Goku: “This is it.”
8
Goku: “I’ll seal him in this jar.”
Mai: “…Plums?” [the jar is marked “plums”]
9
Goku: “See, gramps was using it to store pickled plums.”

Page 23
4
Trunks: “That’s…Black!!!”
7
Trunks: “What form…is father in?!”
Goku: “That’s Super Saiyan God.”
8
Goku: “It’s the form before Blue.”
Trunks: “The one before?!”
9
Trunks: “But…He’s holding his own against Rosé Black.”

Page 24
1
Goku: “Vegeta’s thought this through.”
2
Goku: “Super Saiyan Blue’s got amazing power, but can’t be held for long. God’s more balanced on that point, and uses up less stamina.”
Trunks: “But then…How’s he fighting Black with this ‘God’ form…?”
3
Goku: “He ain’t doing it as God! Watch close.”
Trunks: “Huh?!”
4
Goku: “[r] Just at the instant he attacks [l] Vegeta turns into Blue.”

Page 25
1
Trunks: “He can do that? Amazing…”
Goku: “He’s saving up Blue’s power, then letting it rip for just a moment.”
2
Kaioshin: “Isn’t that the same strategy you used against Hit?”
Goku: “Yeah, but back then I could only go Blue once and that was it.”
3
Goku: “[r] Vegeta’s doing that again and again. [l] And his power doesn’t drop either! He’s trained a bunch.”
5
Black: “[t] I get it…[l] You’ve been transforming in secret….”
6
Vegeta: “[r] Finally noticed, huh? [l] But noticing won’t help you.”

Page 26
3
Zamasu: “[r] Let’s take him out together. [l] That way, we’ll have the upper hand.”
4
Goku: “There he is!”
5
Goku: “[r] You guys hide here. [l] I’ll go seal him up!”

Page 27
1
Goku: “Hey, Zamasu!”
2
Goku: “You’re supposed to be a Kaioshin, right? Proud warriors should fight one-on-one. Don’t butt in!”
4
Zamasu: “…Will you fight me?”
5
Goku: “Yep, I’ll take you on!”
8
Black: “[r] …[l] What’s with that jar?”

Page 28
4
Vegeta: “Shouldn’t you stay focused?”
5
Vegeta: “Hmph”

Page 29
1
Zamasu: “[r] Don’t you get it? I’m immortal. [l] I can’t lose.”
2
Goku: “You may be immortal Zamasu, but this technique’ll finish you!”
5
Goku: “Take this! Mafuba!!!!”

Page 30
2
Zamasu: “[t] Oh…! Ooooooh…!!!!”

Page 31
1
Zamasu: “Wha…What is this…?!!!”
4
Goku: “Tsuah!!!!”
5
Goku: “I did it!!!”
6
Kaioshin: “Oh!”
Trunks: “It worked?!”

Page 32
1
Goku: “Trunks! Give me a hand!”
2
Trunks: “[r] Ah…[l] Yes sir!”
4
Trunks: “Is this OK?”
Goku: “Yep! Now we just gotta stick the charm on!”
7
Goku: “Huh?!!”
Trunks: “What’s this?...”
9
Roshi: “[r] He didn’t take the charm…[l] He took my hostess bar discount coupon by mistake…”

Page 33
2
Goku: “Damn!!!”
3
Mai: “Huh?!”
5
Zamasu: “[r] Huh [l] Huh”
6
Goku: “[r] This…[l] might be a problem…”

Page 34
2
Vegeta: “[r] That bastard [l] He blew it!”
3
Zamasu: “[r] Wh…What was that technique?...[l] That was a close call…”
4
Zamasu: “In that case, I’ll just keep on fighting until you’re all dead…!!!”
5
Goku: “[r] …Oh well…[l] Guess that kinda technique just ain’t my thing.”
6
Goku: “Hah!!!!”

Page 35
1
Trunks: “Huh?! Goku, you’ve got red hair now too…?”
Goku: “The Mafuba used up a lot of my stamina, so I wouldn’t be able to hold Blue for long now.”
2
Goku: “[r] Still [l] This should be enough to handle you.”
4
Zamasu: “Hah!!!”
5
Goku: “Whoops!”
6
Goku: “I gotta watch out for that paralysis thing!”

Page 36
6
Zamasu: “[r] Are you deaf or something? [l] I told you, I can’t take any damage...”

Page 37
1
Zamasu: “Uguh!!!”
4
Zamasu: “Kah…”
5
Zamasu: “Phew”
6
Zamasu: “How many times do I have to tell you? It’s no use!”
8
Goku: “[r] I don’t care if it’s no use…[l] All I can do now is keep fighting until you say ‘uncle’.”

Page 38
2
Black: “Shit…You little nobody….”
3
Vegeta: “[r] You stole the wrong body! [l] Time to finish this.”
4
Black: “Kuh!”
Goku: “Sounds like he’s wrapping things up.”
5
Goku: “Are you gonna keep doing bad stuff even on your own?”
7
Goku: “You can’t do nothing alone! You should know that better than anyone, right? Doesn’t it suck to be bossed around by your other self?”
8
Zamasu: “[r] …! [l] Silence! Be silent, mortal!”

Page 39
1
Goku: “[r] Frankly, as-is you’re weaker than even Trunks by yourself. [l] Just being immortal won’t allow you to kill everyone in the universe.”
2
Zamasu: “…Our plan is perfect…I won’t allow it to fail”
3
Trunks: “It looks like he’s taken some psychological damage…!”
4
Zamasu: “Hah!!!!”
7
Goku: “Give up and go back to your own universe, Zamasu!”

Page 40
4
Zamasu: “Shit…This…This can’t be happening…”
5
Zamasu: “Damn it all…”
7
Black: “Get up! What did you even become immortal for?!”

Page 41
3
Zamasu: “You never said things would turn out like this!!!”
4
Zamasu: “If we teamed up, the universe would be our oyster! Isn’t that what you said?!”
5
Zamasu: “If you’re not stronger than anyone else, then what’s the point?!”
6
Goku: “Are they having a spat?”
Vegeta: “…It’s over.”

Page 42
1
Vegeta: “[r] Will you be killed by me? [l] Or kill each other? Choose!”
4
Black: “Calm down, brother.”
5
Black: “We still have that last resort, right?”
6
Zamasu: “That…That’s right.”
7
Vegeta: “If you don’t choose, then I’ll just kill you.”
Goku: “…? ‘Last resort’?”

Page 43
3
Goku: “Oh no! Vegeta, attack now!!!
Vegeta: “What?!”
5
Goku: “Cheh!!!!”

Page 44
3
Vegeta: “What’s the idea, Kakarot?!”
5
Kaioshin: “Don’t…”
6
Kaioshin: “Don’t tell me…”

Page 45
2
Zzaammaassuu: “Rejoice mortals, that you may see this form.”
4
Zzaammaassuu: “[t] This is the birth of the one god of all the universes… Zamasu.”
Vertical text: “The wickedest god is born…!!”[/spoiler]

[TheSaiyanGod]

This chapter ends with Merged Zamasu? So it seems Vegetto is more likely to appear then

On the other hand this version is much weaker so Goku and Vegeta may have to downgrade to Gogeta to compensate.

How is this version weaker? They seem to be the same power as the anime, except Black doesn't have Naruto clones to nullify Vegeta overpowering him. Zamasu was weaker than SSJ2 Trunks in the anime as well.

I believe these clones and the sickle were things created by Toei.
It's bizarre and it does not make sense.

In fact, what makes the most sense is Goku and vegeta after training force them to merge, not Zamasu merge because he was afraid of Mafuba. Black should not even have this sickle in the anime, it was something very strange

[FortuneSSJ]

Toyotaro's panel composition is such a mess in this chapter. When he's bad, he's really bad:
[spoiler]





[/spoiler]
Feels like he rushed this one. I will wait for the full translation before giving my final thoughts, but seems to be the most disappointing chapter of this arc by far.

[OLKv3]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

[TheUltimateNinja]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Pretty blatant, damn.

[OLKv3]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Pretty blatant, damn.

Meanwhile Toei has been enjoying Dragon Ball Multiverse
[spoiler][/spoiler]

[TheMikado]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Pretty blatant, damn.

Meanwhile Toei has been enjoying Dragon Ball Multiverse
[spoiler][/spoiler]

All this tells me is that no one really cares too much about the artistic integrity of this series..

[Lord Beerus]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Pretty blatant, damn.

Meanwhile Toei has been enjoying Dragon Ball Multiverse
[spoiler][/spoiler]

I highly doubt anyone in Toei knows of the existence of Dragon Ball Multiverse.

[FortuneSSJ]

He really is remaking AF with this arc
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

I guess this arc in a official product is nothing more than a fanboy's wet dream coming back to life for him.
Never cared about AF. How was his Evil Goku compared to his Black?

[Bullza]

I like how the anime and manga have their differences because it makes reading the manga worthwhile.

At the same time though I don't like these big changes because it makes you wonder how lacking Toriyama's plot outline could be.

Unless this is all just a matter of Toriyama bringing Super Saiyan God back for the manga but the anime already wrote it out of the equation by having him absorb it instead.