What's the benefit of adding choreography if it actually ends up hurting the pacing of the action more than helping it?Miracles wrote:Toyotaro demonstrating Hit following up with a kick after his punch being blocked is called choreography. It's not to focus so much on high speed fighting. Toriyama has done this as well in his panels.Exline wrote:I may have been overexaggerting for this chapter in particular. I gave it a 3rd read and notice he didn't really disappoint with the panels as much this time for me. But I have felt this way constantly with other chapters. Moreso the beginning of this series.
I'm referring to scenes like this:
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This panel doesn't feel it adds anything at all to the fight. It actually feels like it slows the pace of the fight.
If we remove that panel, I think we can get a better sense of pace in the battle. We're more used to much faster battles like in the anime and original manga.
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The kick looks much faster now without a panel of it slowly winding up. Especially when the kick doesn't have much impact on it. If it doesn't amount to anything, what is the need for a panel such as this? It works better in the later half of the chapter in scenarios such as where Jiren clenches his fist and prepares to uppercut Hit. But here, it doesn't really add anything imo. It's useless and unnecessary. I only refer to it that way because it would've been fine without it. I see it as a waste of time on Toyotaro's part as well. It's not the only panel I have a problem with it, but it's one of a few found in multiple chapters.
Toriyama captures the pace of the battle better with storyboarding like this:
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He makes the attack look fierce, powerful and fast.
We did not need to see Goku pull his fist back to give more force behind his punch. It is implied immediately once we see the panel.
In the following page, Toriyama also slows down the pace to demonstrate the emotion the antagonist is feeling after the attack. Something Toyotaro has trouble conveying sometimes. Most of the time he excels at it, but sometimes he doesn't.
Also pages like these:
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Where it's just a page of nothing but dialogue with multiple panels I have a problem with as well. I do enjoy the dialogue and I understand that if it were all clumped into fewer panels, than it would not be as great. The panels themselves are what bore me. There is nothing to them. It just changes to someone else's face nearly each sentence and it's annoying. I feel Toyotaro could have definitely done much better with these scenes. It sometimes seems that he is trying to make these monthly chapters seem exactly like an anime episode which I personally don't think works too well. Why make a comic feel less of a comic?
Whilst discussing about how to beat Jiren, the panel could be focused just on him walking towards them whilst they discuss what they plan to do with him. But that's not what happen's here. To me, it's honestly too many expressions for one page. And the large quantity of panels on this page just for dialogue also makes it feel bloated because it seems unnecessary and be done with shorter. The dialogue would have to be dialed back, but I think it'd be for the better in cases like these.
( Apologies for my ranting, I only want Toyotaro to get better ); )
Also, those speech panels are necessary as they progress the story through characters dialogue-ing between each other. Giving us development on Hit's powers and Goku's mindset for the battle is vital.The extra dramatic panels would have brought nothing new to the audience as we already saw Jiren just lol pwn Goku and Hit at the same time before.Bergamo wrote:I think he refers to fights like Semiperfect Cell vs Vegeta where Vegeta turns his head for like 4 panels after being hit by an attack. He could have built a bit more tension after Goku fired his Blue Power at Jiren. Having an extra panel or two of smoke clearing would have made the show where Jiren emerges unscathed much more dramatic.
The Kamehameha doing nothing to Jiren and appearing quickly out of the smoke is fitting in a non competitive fight displaying Jiren's dominance.
Though I don't I agree with all his points, I think the general idea's of the fights being more concise in terms of panelling, with instead of needlessly using panel space to convey unnecessary levels of motion, especially when done poorly like in the above example, and just getting to the effective point, could have definitely benefitted some of the fight scenes this chapter.