"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion specifically regarding the "Dragon Ball Super" TV series premiering July 2015 in Japan, including individual threads for each episode.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dragono » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:26 am

HeroR wrote:
Dragono wrote:
HeroR wrote:
It still would be a smarter choice since Goten and Trunks are among the strongest characters in the series while Tien and Krillin has no real justification except the anime saying they're experience. All we got from the manga on Goten and Trunks is 'no kids'.
it would be smarter to bring those 2 just to knock them out in the second chapter?

and you know no one bought that experience excuse!
It would be more justifiable since Goten and Trunks are powerful. Why did they bother to bring Krillin and Tien despite knowing that they would be the weakest on the team?
I don't think you understand what I'm saying or you don't want to.


Tien and krillin went out first because toriyama wrote it that way and goten and trunks would have gone out first because they would have replaced those 2.


You can call it bad writing but its the truth and no one bought the experience the anime gave us and the only performance people were satisfied with was Roshi

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LightBing » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:31 am

FortuneSSJ wrote: Did Frost really believed in Freeza and went all out like that in the beginning?! He was smarter before...

Other thing that bothers me is that I'm not seeing any point of Freeza let him eliminate two fighters of his team...
These are connected. Freeza gained his trust by sacrificing the weaklings that's why it's believable, the old give and take.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by goku the krump dancer » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:11 am

A small part of me also thinks that Freeza also wanted to see just how strong Frost was in comparison to himself, which is why he told him to go all out first then he'd follow up. Once he probably realized the power gap, that's when he decided to end the charade.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by batistabus » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:12 am

HeroR wrote:Better yet, why weren't the strongest members protecting the weaker members? Who in their right mind would just leave the weak humans in the middle with no protection? At least in the anime, Gohan didn't do this until the stage was broken apart and everyone could reasonable hide and choose their battles. In fact, that's the reason why the humans lasted so long. Krillin stuck by people stronger than him, the same with Tien, and Roshi purposely went after weak fighters with powerful gimmicks..
Did you read the actual chapter or just a summary? The very first thing that happens is that Magetta splits the group apart. When Gohan tries to rush in and save Tenshinhan/Kame-Sen'nin, he is intercepted by the Trio de Dangers. Piccolo gets caught up fighting other members of Universe 9. The thing about a battle royale is that you don't always have control over who you're fighting.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Miracles » Thu Mar 22, 2018 3:05 am

batistabus wrote:
HeroR wrote:Better yet, why weren't the strongest members protecting the weaker members? Who in their right mind would just leave the weak humans in the middle with no protection? At least in the anime, Gohan didn't do this until the stage was broken apart and everyone could reasonable hide and choose their battles. In fact, that's the reason why the humans lasted so long. Krillin stuck by people stronger than him, the same with Tien, and Roshi purposely went after weak fighters with powerful gimmicks..
Did you read the actual chapter or just a summary? The very first thing that happens is that Magetta splits the group apart. When Gohan tries to rush in and save Tenshinhan/Kame-Sen'nin, he is intercepted by the Trio de Dangers. Piccolo gets caught up fighting other members of Universe 9. The thing about a battle royale is that you don't always have control over who you're fighting.
Exactly. That's the thing people just don't get. They are thinking the manga has people just standing there like they were in the anime.
People forget Kuririn was ringed out when he is distracted by Magetta and Frost blitzed him from Behind.
The manga does indeed have a better grasp of what a battle royale is.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by picc » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:53 am

Seen a few people comment on the lack of emotional punch when U9 went out, compared to the anime. I think the majority of that is due to the anime having sad dramatic music playing when they were erased, and the manga... obviously being unable to do that.

There were reaction shots in the manga just like there were in the anime, only we read right past those to get to the next panel. Whereas the anime can hold the shot and force you to watch everyone being shocked.

But its mostly the music. Unfair to compare the two mediums with that in mind.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Hawk9211 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 5:57 am

picc wrote:Seen a few people comment on the lack of emotional punch when U9 went out, compared to the anime. I think the majority of that is due to the anime having sad dramatic music playing when they were erased, and the manga... obviously being unable to do that.

There were reaction shots in the manga just like there were in the anime, only we read right past those to get to the next panel. Whereas the anime can hold the shot and force you to watch everyone being shocked.

But its mostly the music. Unfair to compare the two mediums with that in mind.
And you have already seen the anime and as a result the basic story or in other words desensition.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by TKA » Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:38 am

jeffbr92 wrote:
Dude, if you don't like the anime you don't need to attack it to prove your point and you do that a LOT in this thread. Saying that the anime just diluted their presence with "filler" fights against fodder warriors is just blind hate.
1. It is impossible to show what the manga is doing right without going into what the anime did wrong.

2. I don't care about the anime. I don't care about convincing people the anime is bad. I couldn't care less about it if I tried. That being said, the anime absolutely diluted their presence by keeping them in the fight, but offscreen for many episodes. Then when it gave them focus, they immediately got taken out. That's rubbish and lessens the impact of their presence.
In the anime though they still were shameful eliminated
Yes, that's the point.
they had some decent screentime and took enemies with them, what's the problem they were fodders?
If the characters they eliminate are fodder that don't mean anything, why is it such an important detail that the humans have to eliminate them? Why not give those fodder eliminations to a more important character, who has a bigger role to play? Frost eliminated a team of fodder, which in turn played into Frieza's portrayal. That's infinitely better than "And Krillin eliminated this useless character before he got eliminated!"
We expect Tien and Krillin to take opponents out of their league like Hit?
Why do you expect that though? Toyotaro's manga never promised that these characters would be important. In fact, the manga makes it clear that many of these characters on the team are only on the team because they needed to fill up slots. The anime, meanwhile, promised that these characters would all be important in their filler recruitment episodes, and may or may not have delivered on that promise in the actual tournament. Any expectations you have that are not being met by the manga are there because of you.

-------------------------

Now let's see how much I talk about the anime:
No, their fandoms were treated better.
I'll take this ANY DAY of the week over them being in dozens of anime episodes doing absolutely nothing before they get some one-off episode that ends with them getting eliminated anyway. That has no impact on the plot or tension. Them getting taken out swiftly does.
Toei puts effort in all the wrong places.

You trick people into thinking characters are important to preserve drama. I shouldn't be able to look at a design and go "Ha, that person is fodder. Just hurry up and get them off my screen!" It's something the anime should've done since it decided to devote time to all the universes, rather than focusing the scope to just 6, 7 and 11.
Since March 10th, this is all I've said about the anime. I'm not down with all the character assassination you're trying to bring across, instead of actually addressing my points. I don't care about the anime. I care about the manga. I talk about what the manga does right that the anime may have slipped up on. I don't go around calling the anime trash like so many users in this thread do with the manga. I also don't feel the need to quote people telling them that I'm sad that they think the manga is trash.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:51 am


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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Hawk9211 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:35 am

Every volume is selling more and more 8) .I just hope toyotaro keeps improving at the same or even faster rate.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LightBing » Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:22 am

goku the krump dancer wrote:A small part of me also thinks that Freeza also wanted to see just how strong Frost was in comparison to himself, which is why he told him to go all out first then he'd follow up. Once he probably realized the power gap, that's when he decided to end the charade.
He asks Frost if he has another form which indicates what you wrote. He probably saw Frost and thought " that's a version of me, he's bound to be problematic". Which would be true if he had the Golden transformation, he would likely be in the top 10 strongest here.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Hawk9211 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 11:59 am

Toyotaro tweeted that it was the same time as Japan.The number of days till deadline.

It's google translate,but from what I understand toyotaro was on tour in Germany,and now he has less days till deadline.Does not make me happy especially after last chapter.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Raphael_Z » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:18 pm

LightBing wrote:
goku the krump dancer wrote:A small part of me also thinks that Freeza also wanted to see just how strong Frost was in comparison to himself, which is why he told him to go all out first then he'd follow up. Once he probably realized the power gap, that's when he decided to end the charade.
He asks Frost if he has another form which indicates what you wrote. He probably saw Frost and thought " that's a version of me, he's bound to be problematic". Which would be true if he had the Golden transformation, he would likely be in the top 10 strongest here.
Also, it's important to note that Frieza's plan in the manga makes total sense: gain the trust of your doppleganger by sacrificing two weaklings that are going to get ringed out anyways and who provide 0 advantages for your team, influence your doppleganger so he wastes energy taking out an enemy universe thus saving stamina for your own team, eliminate your doppleganger once you realize that he's nothing special in terms of power.

The anime plan was beyond retarded and, among other things, involved almost ringing out Vegeta and wasting his own (Frieza's) and Gohan's stamina by putting up an unnecessary show in front of Frost. There was 0 reason for Frieza to go Golden in the anime and fight Gohan. 0 reason. Even if he didn't catch Frost by surprise, Frost is REALLY weak compared to Final Form Frieza. 0 reason.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Marlowe89 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:38 pm

picc wrote:Seen a few people comment on the lack of emotional punch when U9 went out, compared to the anime.
I don't understand that myself. Universe 9's erasure and its impact on the other characters are virtually the same in both versions; if anything, it's because of Bergamo's desperation, Piccolo's hesitation and Frieza's subsequent shamelessness about knocking the last one out that we get to feel any sympathy for them at all. In the anime, the final members of Universe 9 are instead taken out by a fanservicey Final Kamehameha, which isn't nearly as emotionally impactful.

Getting peeved about Tien and Krillin's elimination is entirely understandable, but in terms of overall storytelling, pacing and structure for this arc, the manga still has the advantage by far.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by prince212 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:49 pm

Hawk9211 wrote:Toyotaro tweeted that it was the same time as Japan.The number of days till deadline.

It's google translate,but from what I understand toyotaro was on tour in Germany,and now he has less days till deadline.Does not make me happy especially after last chapter.
That doodle looks to be that small guy from u11 that he added wings in the design , may be he will be in next chapter having some fights with u6 girls ...
yes , Toyo lost 5 days on that tour , so it’s gonna be worse than February having 28 days ..but he’s already with his hands on the papers ... I experienced those trips Japan- Europe and believe me , jet lag is worse than America - Europe
It was as if a whole lot of people ...were screaming in pain....

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Thu Mar 22, 2018 12:59 pm

Raphael_Z wrote:
LightBing wrote:
goku the krump dancer wrote:A small part of me also thinks that Freeza also wanted to see just how strong Frost was in comparison to himself, which is why he told him to go all out first then he'd follow up. Once he probably realized the power gap, that's when he decided to end the charade.
He asks Frost if he has another form which indicates what you wrote. He probably saw Frost and thought " that's a version of me, he's bound to be problematic". Which would be true if he had the Golden transformation, he would likely be in the top 10 strongest here.
Also, it's important to note that Frieza's plan in the manga makes total sense: gain the trust of your doppleganger by sacrificing two weaklings that are going to get ringed out anyways and who provide 0 advantages for your team, influence your doppleganger so he wastes energy taking out an enemy universe thus saving stamina for your own team, eliminate your doppleganger once you realize that he's nothing special in terms of power.

The anime plan was beyond retarded and, among other things, involved almost ringing out Vegeta and wasting his own (Frieza's) and Gohan's stamina by putting up an unnecessary show in front of Frost. There was 0 reason for Frieza to go Golden in the anime and fight Gohan. 0 reason. Even if he didn't catch Frost by surprise, Frost is REALLY weak compared to Final Form Frieza. 0 reason.
Freeza's plan in the manga was based on the assumption that Krillin, Roshi and Tenshinhan wouldn't contribute anything in the Tournament Of Power because of their strength. And that assumption was completely baseless, as while those three may be weak compared to rest of the team Universe 7 team, how they would have stacked up against the rest of the competitors from the other universes was completely undetermined as they never fought anyone from the other universes. So the assertion that Krillin and Tenshinhan wouldn't have be able to contributed anything to the Tournament Of Power is totally unfounded as we never saw Krillin do anything against anyone and Tenshinhan was put up against an opponent that we already know he couldn't beat. Freeza basically fucked himself over by reducing his chances of getting revived and increasing his chances of being erased by having two of his teammates needlessly eliminated. He could have earned Frost's trust to only to eventually betray him later without fucking himself and Universe 7 over. Freeza in the anime was WAY smarter with this approach.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dbzk1999 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:02 pm

Marlowe89 wrote:
picc wrote:Seen a few people comment on the lack of emotional punch when U9 went out, compared to the anime.
I don't understand that myself. Universe 9's erasure and its impact on the other characters are virtually the same in both versions; if anything, it's because of Bergamo's desperation, Piccolo's hesitation and Frieza's subsequent shamelessness about knocking the last one out that we get to feel any sympathy for them at all. In the anime, the final members of Universe 9 are instead taken out by a fanservicey Final Kamehameha, which isn't nearly as emotionally impactful.

Getting peeved about Tien and Krillin's elimination is entirely understandable, but in terms of overall storytelling, pacing and structure for this arc, the manga still has the advantage by far.
Eh, I’d say that what makes the anime version more impactful than the manga version was Roh begging Zeno not to do it, followed by Zeno erasing them so nonchalantly. That honestly invoked more sympathy from me, showed that Zeno doesn’t care if you’re begging, if you lose, you’re gone.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cetra » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:06 pm

Marlowe89 wrote:
picc wrote:Seen a few people comment on the lack of emotional punch when U9 went out, compared to the anime.
I don't understand that myself. Universe 9's erasure and its impact on the other characters are virtually the same in both versions; if anything, it's because of Bergamo's desperation, Piccolo's hesitation and Frieza's subsequent shamelessness about knocking the last one out that we get to feel any sympathy for them at all. In the anime, the final members of Universe 9 are instead taken out by a fanservicey Final Kamehameha, which isn't nearly as emotionally impactful.

Getting peeved about Tien and Krillin's elimination is entirely understandable, but in terms of overall storytelling, pacing and structure for this arc, the manga still has the advantage by far.
The anime was a lot more emotional with the whole Universe 9 affair beginning with their entire grief during the Exhibition match which they left totally pissed with the words that Universe 7 shall be erased. And then because of that grudge they immediately went all out against just this Universe in the Survival Tournament. They were so driven by anger and then gave it their all just to lose because - well - Goku and Vegeta simply are pretty much the most powerful guys in the tournament (and yes, I know Jiren is stronger at the beginning, leave me alone, guys). So their whole thing against this universe was a lot stronger and from the get-go a lot more emotionally invested. The only thing I can't give the anime is that they made Bergamo Super 17 and then did not give him the chance to use that ability because he would definitely have done a lot with it. This whole Sidra and Rou thing with Sidra erasing a town as well as Rou being Zamasu 2.0 all the time, where even Freeza acted like he tried to team up with them and then them ultimately - well, Rou, Sidra took it like a boss - begging for mercy left a lot more impact on the emotional side. Toyble did not invest that much and this also led to less gain. Also, yes, the Final Kamehameha was fan service. But it was a proper response to another team up attack that stood for their ultimate try to save their own universe.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by prince212 » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:12 pm

Lord Beerus wrote: Freeza in the anime was WAY smarter with this approach.
I don’t like to compare , but since everybody does .... freeza manga acts like the freeza that we knew from before ( at least in this 2 last chapters ) freeza anime is ambiguous, very inconsistent since the beginning , to the point that he donate energy to Goku just to say one of the most unexpected things he made .
Freeza mvp manga in this beginning :thumbup:
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Re: "Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cetra » Thu Mar 22, 2018 1:15 pm

prince212 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote: Freeza in the anime was WAY smarter with this approach.
I don’t like to compare , but since everybody does .... freeza manga acts like the freeza that we knew from before ( at least in this 2 last chapters ) freeza anime is ambiguous, very inconsistent since the beginning , to the point that he donate energy to Goku just to say one of the most unexpected things he made .
Freeza mvp manga in this beginning :thumbup:
So what you say is that you like manga Freeza more because he is more one-dimensional and this way he is more recognizable for you? For an already so one-dimensional character as Freeza is I do not like that at all. I am glad they did a bit more with him in this arc. At least it was something.
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