Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[PFM18]

Umm no... this form was the equivalent of ssbe from the anime. Goku already used his equivalent of kaioken, and its far weaker than this chapters vegeta.

Then SSJBE will probably be stronger as Toytotaro always tries to make them equal. I just can’t see him writing off the SSJBE with pupils. Plus it seems he’d been eliminated if that was as strong as he is going to get. Usually when he draws the characters or forms on V-Jumps cover they will appear.

Ssbe is as strong as ssbkk in the anime. So ssbe isnt a step above ssbkk. However, the manga actually chose to have ssbe vegeta to be above it.

well from what we see in the anime SSBE should be above SSBKK considering that they were even and performed equivalently in ep 123 and then in 126 Vegeta got a huge power boost that presumably put him a step above SSBKK.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Then SSJBE will probably be stronger as Toytotaro always tries to make them equal. I just can’t see him writing off the SSJBE with pupils. Plus it seems he’d been eliminated if that was as strong as he is going to get. Usually when he draws the characters or forms on V-Jumps cover they will appear.

Ssbe is as strong as ssbkk in the anime. So ssbe isnt a step above ssbkk. However, the manga actually chose to have ssbe vegeta to be above it.

well from what we see in the anime SSBE should be above SSBKK considering that they were even and performed equivalently in ep 123 and then in 126 Vegeta got a huge power boost that presumably put him a step above SSBKK.

I agree there. But i mean the form in general was shown as a power up equivalent to kk at first. But it looks like the manga gave it a far higher boost, with jiren no selling a cssb kaiokenlike goku, and jiren actually stated that vegeta was beyond anything goku had achieved, besides UIO.

[Kenneth La Torre]

I got a question for everyone. When do u think jiren started to use more power than what his god of destruction holds, in both anime and manga (i think the manga is too soon)? I think its an interesting question.
I believe he went beyond belmod against 129 uio goku. I dont think he has used more power than belmod in the manga yet.

[ankokudaishogun]

I got a question for everyone. When do u think jiren started to use more power than what his god of destruction holds,

when he was fighting SSBE and Blue Kaiohken at the same time.

[OhHiRenan]

Then SSJBE will probably be stronger as Toytotaro always tries to make them equal. I just can’t see him writing off the SSJBE with pupils. Plus it seems he’d been eliminated if that was as strong as he is going to get. Usually when he draws the characters or forms on V-Jumps cover they will appear.

Ssbe is as strong as ssbkk in the anime. So ssbe isnt a step above ssbkk. However, the manga actually chose to have ssbe vegeta to be above it.

well from what we see in the anime SSBE should be above SSBKK considering that they were even and performed equivalently in ep 123 and then in 126 Vegeta got a huge power boost that presumably put him a step above SSBKK.

If anything, the anime shows that SSBE and SSBKK are complete equals. I don't think Vegeta getting a boost in 126 brings him any higher than SSBKK in the same way that his boost in BoG didn't bring him any higher than Goku's SSJ3. Maybe for a bit, but definitely not as a general state of power. SSBE exists solely to put Vegeta back on Goku's level.

[Bullza]

Jiren says that Vegeta fought harder than Goku in his Ascended state from a moment ago.

So that has to be the "Kaio-ken" Blue right? Couldn't be Ultra Instinct because he hasn't fought him yet.

[ekrolo2]

Jiren says that Vegeta fought harder than Goku in his Ascended state from a moment ago.

So that has to be the "Kaio-ken" Blue right? Couldn't be Ultra Instinct because he hasn't fought him yet.

That's Power Stressed Blue, yeah.

[dragon boss z]

Jiren says that Vegeta fought harder than Goku in his Ascended state from a moment ago.

So that has to be the "Kaio-ken" Blue right? Couldn't be Ultra Instinct because he hasn't fought him yet.

No, Jiren said he DIDN'T fight harder than ascended form Goku. And I think he meant UI omen.

[Bullza]

Oh yeah he said fought back harder than anyone besides Goku's ascended state a moment ago. He never fought as Ultra Instinct though.

[LightBing]

Jiren says that Vegeta fought harder than Goku in his Ascended state from a moment ago.

So that has to be the "Kaio-ken" Blue right? Couldn't be Ultra Instinct because he hasn't fought him yet.

While reading I thought it was Ultra Instinct since "a moment ago" that was what Goku was doing. But a single dodge barely qualifies as a fight... At the same time would Goku's power up state be refereed as Ascended.

Logically Vegeta would be between Ultra Instinct and Mastered SSJB. I don't know what to think.

[Kenneth La Torre]

This pretty much is like the anime, where vegeta ends up stronger than anyone besides goku ui and jiren

[Bergamo]

DBS Manga Tier list

Jiren+ tier: FP Jiren

Jiren tier: UI Sign Goku = Jiren

MSSB+ tier: Blue Vegeta(evolution)>FP Hit(time lag)>Blue Goku(power stressed)

MSSB tier: Blue Goku/Vegeta = Toppo = Hit > FP Kale* = Kefla = Gohan

MSSB- tier: MSSB Goku(non-serious) = SS Kale > Golden Frieza(non serious)

[Doctor.]

DBS Manga Tier list

Jiren+ tier: FP Jiren

Jiren tier: UI Sign Goku = Jiren

MSSB+ tier: Blue Vegeta(evolution)>FP Hit(time lag)>Blue Goku(power stressed)

MSSB tier: Blue Goku/Vegeta = Toppo = Hit > FP Kale* = Kefla = Gohan

MSSB- tier: MSSB Goku(non-serious) = SS Kale > Golden Frieza(non serious)

I wouldn't put Hit that high. Jiren one-shotted him.

[Bergamo]

DBS Manga Tier list

Jiren+ tier: FP Jiren

Jiren tier: UI Sign Goku = Jiren

MSSB+ tier: Blue Vegeta(evolution)>FP Hit(time lag)>Blue Goku(power stressed)

MSSB tier: Blue Goku/Vegeta = Toppo = Hit > FP Kale* = Kefla = Gohan

MSSB- tier: MSSB Goku(non-serious) = SS Kale > Golden Frieza(non serious)

I wouldn't put Hit that high. Jiren one-shotted him.

Hit was equal to MSSB Goku, and then he powered up, so I put him in MSSB+ tier. Blue Goku power stressed also got hit pretty hard and burned away all of Goku's remaining energy, and he just didn't seem as impressive to me.

[RandomGuy96]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

[Doctor.]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

I wonder if it was or if Toyotaro just took some ideas from the anime. Vegeta's portrayal doesn't really seem very Toriyama-esque. The prideful demeanor he exhibited that went along with his asspull seems like an attempt to cater to the fans who want to see the character recapture his "glory days" again, something I don't really see Toriyama caring all that much for.

[RandomGuy96]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

I wonder if it was or if Toyotaro just took some ideas from the anime. Vegeta's portrayal doesn't really seem very Toriyama-esque. The prideful demeanor he exhibited that went along with his asspull seems like an attempt to cater to the fans who want to see the character recapture his "glory days" again, something I don't really see Toriyama caring all that much for.

Toriyama basically did that in ROF. Vegeta's prideful demeanor being immediately smashed by his opponent who he arrogantly assumed was both weaker than him and a not a true fighter is also very Toriyama.

[Doctor.]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

I wonder if it was or if Toyotaro just took some ideas from the anime. Vegeta's portrayal doesn't really seem very Toriyama-esque. The prideful demeanor he exhibited that went along with his asspull seems like an attempt to cater to the fans who want to see the character recapture his "glory days" again, something I don't really see Toriyama caring all that much for.

Toriyama basically did that in ROF. Vegeta's prideful demeanor being immediately smashed by his opponent who he arrogantly assumed was both weaker than him and a not a true fighter is also very Toriyama.

Makes sense. I just thought Toriyama seemed set in having Vegeta as the character who now keeps swallowing his pride for the tiniest thing (usually for the sake of a gag but not necessarily).

[PFM18]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

Yup. I told people that it was going to be in both but they didnt buy it...

[Marlowe89]

So it seems that "Vegeta struggles with Topp, unlocks a new Blue power-up, beats him, and then jobs to Jiren" was in the outline. Interesting.

It probably was, but it seems that only the anime decided to make a brand new transformation out of it.