Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[Miracles]

Yeah, unfortunately that looks like the case. Unless in the actual movie he is using SSBE but they didn't want to spoil that in the trailer. I don't know, I still have hope

Why do you care so much if ssbE is in the movie? All that means is the show is going to re-tell the arc once it comes back and the movie will be its own continuity, seperate from the manga, and in likelhood the returining anime....

Because if Vegeta achieves a new super powerful form that allows him to defeat a God of Destruction, and then inconspicuously doesn't use it in the next story arc, that's a problem. It fucks with the continuity of things especially when it comes to power scaling.

If they do an anime retelling though this won't be a problem. They could also add the other half of Toriyama's scirpt in there too.

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

[CTAkuma]

Why do you care so much if ssbE is in the movie? All that means is the show is going to re-tell the arc once it comes back and the movie will be its own continuity, seperate from the manga, and in likelhood the returining anime....

Because if Vegeta achieves a new super powerful form that allows him to defeat a God of Destruction, and then inconspicuously doesn't use it in the next story arc, that's a problem. It fucks with the continuity of things especially when it comes to power scaling.

If they do an anime retelling though this won't be a problem. They could also add the other half of Toriyama's scirpt in there too.

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

[RecolorSaiyan]

Sure there is since Toriyama is following his own continuity in which forms like SSBE and SSBKK do NOT exist

[PFM18]

Sure there is since Toriyama is following his own continuity in which forms like SSBE and SSBKK do NOT exist

He approved something very similar to SSBE in the manga. In both iterations, Vegeta broke his limits, if they pretend he didn't in the movie, that's an issue. It was either Toriyama's idea or he approved it for both so this should be part of "Toriyama's story"

[Miracles]

Because if Vegeta achieves a new super powerful form that allows him to defeat a God of Destruction, and then inconspicuously doesn't use it in the next story arc, that's a problem. It fucks with the continuity of things especially when it comes to power scaling.

If they do an anime retelling though this won't be a problem. They could also add the other half of Toriyama's scirpt in there too.

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Filler isn't Toriyama tho. In Toriyama's eyes red and Blue were more than enough to handle merged Zamas taking turns. It just means in this movie red and Blue are stronger than the anime's TOP version.

[Rakurai]

Because if Vegeta achieves a new super powerful form that allows him to defeat a God of Destruction, and then inconspicuously doesn't use it in the next story arc, that's a problem. It fucks with the continuity of things especially when it comes to power scaling.

If they do an anime retelling though this won't be a problem. They could also add the other half of Toriyama's scirpt in there too.

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

[RecolorSaiyan]

You might as well ask why minus is being animated and not Father of Goku stuff since its a "Toei film".

In Toriyama's continuity there is NO SSBE/CSSB/ SSBKK, etc. its very simple, there is God , Blue and UI above the golden forms and thats it

[PFM18]

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

[Marlowe89]

Toriyama "approving" a form exclusive to the anime doesn't actually mean very much. He's approved many things over the course of the franchise's history that he never conceptualized/reimagined himself, a lot of which wasn't even a part of the canon storyline.

Even if he came up with something relatively simple like "Vegeta broke his limits and boosted the power of Super Saiyan Blue", which is essentially what happened in the manga, that would just mean that Vegeta's Blue during the Tournament of Power was stronger than in previous arcs. But that's hardly relevant to the current film, so I doubt the story would go out of its way to mention it.

[Rakurai]

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

Vegeta broke his limits but didn't get a new form, he just got a power boost. It's no different than the whole "My Bulma!" shenanigan except it was "My pride!" this time.

Also I just realized I've been in the wrong thread. I thought I was discussing what was going to be in the Broly film lol.

[Miracles]

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

Approval = canon. Toriyama is the authority of HIS story. When he pens out HIS version ALONE it trumps all adaptations.

[PFM18]

Also I just realized I've been in the wrong thread. I thought I was discussing what was going to be in the Broly film lol.

...yeah we aren't talking about power levels as much so I could see why you would think that lol.

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

Approval = canon. Toriyama is the authority of HIS story. When he pens out HIS version ALONE it trumps all adaptations.

.....but he approved it in both of them. So wouldn't that mean "Approval=canon"? You're not making any sense.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Okay, let's try not to get caught up on what makes it in or not.

Let's work with what we actually have.

So, rage Broly seems to cap out at SSB Goku and Vegeta's level before turning Super Saiyan. I wonder though....... does his Super Saiyan form function like the normal Super Saiyan forms? I mean, it's not exactly a transformation from a normal base form, and it has blank eyes like SSRage Trunks did before he regained control of himself. I'm not sure if it has the same boost, and I'm guessing we won't get an answer until the film comes out.

[PFM18]

Okay, let's try not to get caught up on what makes it in or not.

Let's work with what we actually have.

So, rage Broly seems to cap out at SSB Goku and Vegeta's level before turning Super Saiyan. I wonder though....... does his Super Saiyan form function like the normal Super Saiyan forms? I mean, it's not exactly a transformation from a normal base form, and it has blank eyes like SSRage Trunks did before he regained control of himself. I'm not sure if it has the same boost, and I'm guessing we won't get an answer until the film comes out.

....Well on Thursday we will know basically everything about the movie we want to know, that is, assuming we want to know it lol.

[zarmack]

It's not a problem. SSBE is an anime original, therefore nothing more than adaptation from Toriyama's original script.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Filler isn't Toriyama tho. In Toriyama's eyes red and Blue were more than enough to handle merged Zamas taking turns. It just means in this movie red and Blue are stronger than the anime's TOP version.

The "Toriyama has nothing to do with filler" myth needs to die:
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/rumor/general/

[ssj3kakarot]

Toei filler is Toei filler. Maybe in a future Toei anime they'll do a Broly movie retelling and include them.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

Approval = canon. Toriyama is the authority of HIS story. When he pens out HIS version ALONE it trumps all adaptations.

^^ This!

Just because it wasn't his idea, doesn't make it filler. He approved it upon review, thus saying " Ya know, I can go along with this. Stamp of approval." If he didn't want it, he'd probably do something about it. Now to be honest, I'm not entirely sure what power he has when it comes to stuff like this.

Yes, the manga would be approved by AT as well, and there are differing iterations of Vegetas pride boost; one with a new form, and one without. Confusing? Not really. Only if the anime and the movie don't have this form would I say it's kinda wonky. Now if the manga version of the Broly story HAS SSBE, then that is equally wonky. But Movie and Anime are the same vein, as I'm concerned. When in doubt, Popo knows best.

[Miracles]

.....but he approved it in both of them. So wouldn't that mean "Approval=canon"? You're not making any sense.

I'm sorry. Meant =/= canon. Approval doesn't mean canon.

That is not an excuse not to include Goku and Vegeta's forms which they have easy access to and are superior to regular blue

Filler isn't Toriyama tho. In Toriyama's eyes red and Blue were more than enough to handle merged Zamas taking turns. It just means in this movie red and Blue are stronger than the anime's TOP version.

The "Toriyama has nothing to do with filler" myth needs to die:
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/rumor/general/

I know Toriyama inputs in "filler." That wasn't the point. When Toriyama HIMSELF writes an entire script for Super, everything else takes a backseat.

It isn't Toei filler. Vegeta broke his limits in the manga too. Again, pretending as though Vegeta didn't break his limits when he did in both iterations of the story is an issue, call it whatever you want, but Toriyama approved it on two separate versions of the story.

Approval = canon. Toriyama is the authority of HIS story. When he pens out HIS version ALONE it trumps all adaptations.

^^ This!

Just because it wasn't his idea, doesn't make it filler. He approved it upon review, thus saying " Ya know, I can go along with this. Stamp of approval." If he didn't want it, he'd probably do something about it. Now to be honest, I'm not entirely sure what power he has when it comes to stuff like this.

Yes, the manga would be approved by AT as well, and there are differing iterations of Vegetas pride boost; one with a new form, and one without. Confusing? Not really. Only if the anime and the movie don't have this form would I say it's kinda wonky. Now if the manga version of the Broly story HAS SSBE, then that is equally wonky. But Movie and Anime are the same vein, as I'm concerned. When in doubt, Popo knows best.

I'm so sorry. I made a mistake. I meant approval=/= canon. What I mean is when the author approves something someone else does for him doesn't mean it has authority over what the author himself does.

[TheSaiyanGod]

Toriyama "approving" a form exclusive to the anime doesn't actually mean very much. He's approved many things over the course of the franchise's history that he never conceptualized/reimagined himself, a lot of which wasn't even a part of the canon storyline.

Even if he came up with something relatively simple like "Vegeta broke his limits and boosted the power of Super Saiyan Blue", which is essentially what happened in the manga, that would just mean that Vegeta's Blue during the Tournament of Power was stronger than in previous arcs. But that's hardly relevant to the current film, so I doubt the story would go out of its way to mention it.

The fact that these ideas are not from Toriyama does not mean that they should simply be ignored. Toriyama approved some ideas from TOEI / Toyotaro to be implemented in a DB continuity (DBS), which means that they can be used later.
Considering that the movie will continue the events of the anime and considering that most of the public watches the anime and reads the DBS manga, then ignoring things presented in both media makes no sense.

SSG was not an idea of Toriyama, but of Toyotaro.

On a scan of the film, it is said that SSG would appear on DBS Broly as it did on the Toyotaro manga. That is, this was not Toriyama's idea, but he approved for the manga and was subsequently used for the film.

I doubt that TOEI has no influence on what to insert into the film, mainly being a continuation of the anime

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

Guys, let's not get caught up on if something makes it in or not in DBS: Broly. Unlike a previous argument on I had here about wording semantics, this one doesn't serve to shed light on how the information would reflect strength interpretations.

Let's just stay on track with seeing what kind of bonkers power levels it'll bring us.

[ankokudaishogun]

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