Super Animation Catalogue 2.0

[ArchedThunder]

They've been outsourcing for almost 4 months now, I mean was all that for nothing? In addition to the 11 weeks of preperation.

We'll just have to wait and see how things go, things might not be all that bad.
The outsourcing is giving more time for the core staff, but they never stopped working on the episodes as they aired. Tu is someone who works on a ton of episodes, so it could just be that he's kinda short on time to do his work on early episodes in the ToP, but other animators will put out some really nice work, or maybe there is some misunderstanding here. We lack so much context here, I really wish we knew more because all we know is that "something" has gone wrong, but that's kind of a given most of the time with Super. Is it that the Battle Royale is just too much for the current state of the production? Is it just one episode that's having extra problems? Is it multiple? Is it the whole tournament? Are the problems major or minor? Is it something that can be fixed by throwing some more people at it? Can they throw more people at it? There's so many things we don't know that it's kinda hard to even speculate.

Just to clear things up a little since this has apparently exploded beyond this forum:

Tu's tone isn't particularly doom and gloom. It reads more like an animator going, "Oh man, work got tough pretty quickly!" than him condemning the entire tournament. Perhaps I could have better conveyed the tone there, but I essentially just pasted what my translator gave me.

Try to keep in mind going forward that some of Super's best episodes have been made under tight constraints. Having this new insight into the production of the show shouldn't change your expectations too much.

A rushed production doesn't always mean what you get on your screens is going to be poor, too. We've just had episode 90 that sounded like one of the more extreme cases of a poor schedule, and that turned out absolutely fine, if a little uninteresting.

It'd be best if you reserved your judgement and outrage until you can put these comments into context once the episodes begin airing.

Alright, so it could easily be case of Tu having to do a ton of cuts again on a Battle Royale episode, much like he did with episode 90.

[Saikyo no Senshi]

When does tiger mask end?

Toei has other projects too. The good animators who are now invested in Tiger Mask W will move there. As far as I know, the 20th Anniversary One Piece SP is the next big thing and good staff is definitely going there. Then, there's the KiraPri movie.

At best, DBS will get something for the finale of this arc, if Nagamine directs it himself and brings his pals along. So, yeah Tiger Mask W ending is not going to change the situation much.

[ArchedThunder]

Toei has other projects too. The good animators who are now invested in Tiger Mask W will move there. As far as I know, the 20th Anniversary One Piece SP is the next big thing and good staff is definitely going there. Then, there's the KiraPri movie.

At best, DBS will get something for the finale of this arc, if Nagamine directs it himself and brings his pals along. So, yeah Tiger Mask W ending is not going to change the situation much.

It wouldn't be the first time Super got some surprising new staff. Tiger Mask has quite a few people that work on it, I think it's fairly likely that Super at least manages to grab some of them, even if that doesn't mean getting some of the top dogs as regulars, which would be unlikely anyways. It would be nice to see some of the bigger names on Tiger Mask at least show up for a single episode.
Beyond animators there is also other staff members Super could grab that would help out, we already got one of the production managers for instance. It'd be awesome if we could get a writer or two, and maybe some storyboarders/directors and other kinds of staff members.

[HeroR]

Just to clear things up a little since this has apparently exploded beyond this forum:

Tu's tone isn't particularly doom and gloom. It reads more like an animator going, "Oh man, work got tough pretty quickly!" than him condemning the entire tournament. Perhaps I could have better conveyed the tone there, but I essentially just pasted what my translator gave me.

Try to keep in mind going forward that some of Super's best episodes have been made under tight constraints. Having this new insight into the production of the show shouldn't change your expectations too much.

A rushed production doesn't always mean what you get on your screens is going to be poor, too. We've just had episode 90 that sounded like one of the more extreme cases of a poor schedule, and that turned out absolutely fine, if a little uninteresting.

It'd be best if you reserved your judgement and outrage until you can put these comments into context once the episodes begin airing.

I actually read it that way and it make sense. This isn't a simple one vs one tourument. This is a battle royal with 80 fighters. The only comparison I can think of is One Piece's Dressrosa arc.

[Sodhi]

We know that Super's production is not the best and the animators have to rush to meet deadlines, I don't know what's the surprise there. These comments are coming from Tu,the guy who is there for almost every episode either doing KA or corrections, he probably has his work cut out for him. As for now I believe that things will turn out fine when we get there, we are still few episodes away from the TOP even starting.

[SaiyanGod117]

When does tiger mask end?

Toei has other projects too. The good animators who are now invested in Tiger Mask W will move there. As far as I know, the 20th Anniversary One Piece SP is the next big thing and good staff is definitely going there. Then, there's the KiraPri movie.

At best, DBS will get something for the finale of this arc, if Nagamine directs it himself and brings his pals along. So, yeah Tiger Mask W ending is not going to change the situation much.

If Toei is prioritizing right, they would send those animators to Super, even if they don't wanna work on it, they can't do anything about chain-of-command.

[ArchedThunder]

Baseless speculation time!
Maybe Tu really proved himself to the higher ups with episode 90 and now they're giving him a bunch of cuts for the first few Battle Royale episodes, Higashide style.

[Noah]

It's not just unlikely, it's just not the case whatsoever. It's very common for companies to animate extra promo material prior to the real products airing. Kyoto Animation do it all the time, and even to absurd levels of quality.

Gosh, I think I never saw so much fluidity in my life, this piece was really good.

I have some slightly worrying news from Yong-ce Tu. He posted: "I expected the mass battle's production to go wrong, but I didn't think it'd happen so soon". So, uh... that's not great to hear. Hopefully the final results on screen don't reflect the craziness behind the scenes.

Well, I think we all could expect that, I mean 80 people fighting at the same time could be a huge mess in terms of animation, but I think they will handle it.

Although why not go into the format of the past tournament in Champa arc? It would be a safe route for everyone and they could even drag more episodes better in this format.

There was plenty of ugliness in the Future Trunks arc.

Shots, but not really animation.

This is probably a matter of preference, but I think this one was ugly.

[Razyos]

This is probably a matter of preference, but I think this one was ugly.

Wow, do you really think? That's one of my favourite cuts! You can feel the power in that scene

[Noah]

Wow, do you really think? That's one of my favourite cuts! You can feel the power in that scene

The Galick Gun at the end was nice, but I don't like the art much.

[Ajay]

This is probably a matter of preference, but I think this one was ugly.

Wow, do you really think? That's one of my favourite cuts! You can feel the power in that scene

Don't worry, I love it too. I used to be a bit iffy on Manabe's art earlier on in Super, but he's really grown on me, and is now one of my favourites. Funnily enough, it was this episode that sealed the deal for me. His Vegeta and Black towards the end were so good.

[Nasryyy]

This is probably a matter of preference, but I think this one was ugly.

Wow, do you really think? That's one of my favourite cuts! You can feel the power in that scene

Don't worry, I love it too. I used to be a bit iffy on Manabe's art earlier on in Super, but he's really grown on me, and is now one of my favourites. Funnily enough, it was this episode that sealed the deal for me. His Vegeta and Black towards the end were so good.

towards the end it's mixed with ide and tate and manabe i didn't even recognize him there i wish if you could show us some examples

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

It's pure Manabe. Everything you saw in the end is all by Manabe.

[Ajay]

It's pure Manabe. Everything you saw in the end is all by Manabe.

To be really pedantic, there is an Ide correction and some 2nd KA clean-up, but otherwise yeah, it's all Manabe in terms of the raw animation.

It's a shame we don't see more of Manabe's action work. I really, really like it!

[Razyos]

It's a shame we don't see more of Manabe's action work. I really, really like it!

Same! I'm sure we'll get plenty of awesome scenes from him in the tournament super soon

[DragonBalllKaiHD]

Hopefully by the start of the tournament, Toei unhooks Manabe's leash and lets him go all out. It would be for a pure fun entertainment. Yoshitaka says that the tournament is something we should all be looking forward to, because it's going to be crazy.

I'm all for Tate, Manabe, Higashide, Tu, and especially Shida and Ken, to go all crazy with key animation. It needs to be bigger than #66, with the episode storyboarded and directed by legendary Nagamine.

[ArchedThunder]

It has been awhile since it's felt like Manabe has been able to go all out with his animation. His episodes so far this arc have been pretty nicely spaced, so hopefully when he shows up to supervise again he's able to deliver some awesome stuff like he did in 63.
I do wonder when his next episode is. I'm still thinking the tournament will start on 95 and I feel like Tate will open up the tournament. Manabe could always be with Tate, but so far they've seemingly kept their bigger supervisors separate from each other this arc, instead pairing them with outsource supervisors (or "lower" supervisors like Kitano). Tate on 95 with 9 weeks would be awesome, and it would certainly make me feel better about his cut on 91, then Manabe could be on 96 with 9 weeks as well. The only issue with this is episode 94, who the hell gets that? If the tournament starts on 95 and they want to save Tate and Manabe for it then there is kind of a weird gap in the schedule. They could always pair Yashima with a few people, maybe even TAP or something. Nashizawa seems to work fairly well under pressure, so maybe pair him with TAP for 94 instead?

EDIT: This also made me wonder if Nashizawa took Golden Week off, because if he did then there were technically 5 weeks between his 83 and 89, so if that's the case then 94 would make sense to be Nashizawa and TAP again.

[Hit!!]

No, I don't see them doing a sequel series. And unless the tone drastically changes like Z or they bring in new cast like Baruto, there is no point making a new Dragon Ball series.

Production purposes or wanting it to be known that they are going past end of Z. They don't have to abandon the Super name for a sequel either, they can just add an extra thing to the title, or they can just treat the production of the next arc as a separate show for production purposes, but keep the name as just Dragon Ball Super.

I think they already tried that for the Universe Survival Arc and given recent news, it seems like it's not going very well.

I believe they should just try to slowly fix the schedule just as they have been doing arc after arc. I'm not all too optimistic for what is to come in the next few episodes, but i'm pretty damn sure it's not gonna be nearly as bad as episode 24 and 33.

I'm worried it will come out just like the Trunks Arc though, like someone said before me, mediocre animation most of the time and good animation in really important moments.

As of now, the Universe Survival Arc has been consistent, not too good, but not mediocre either. I don't want Super to lose that consistency and go back to how it was again.

[ArchedThunder]

I think they already tried that for the Universe Survival Arc and given recent news, it seems like it's not going very well.

I believe they should just try to slowly fix the schedule just as they have been doing arc after arc. I'm not all too optimistic for what is to come in the next few episodes, but i'm pretty damn sure it's not gonna be nearly as bad as episode 24 and 33.

I'm worried it will come out just like the Trunks Arc though, like someone said before me, mediocre animation most of the time and good animation in really important moments.

As of now, the Universe Survival Arc has been consistent, not too good, but not mediocre either. I don't want Super to lose that consistency and go back to how it was again.

If that were the case we'd probably have some pretty different staff at the beginning of the arc, but we didn't. We have a few new people and a few people replaced, but most of the core staff is the same. The improvements seen this arc were likely the same as they've done in the past, just on a bit of a larger scale.

And as Ajay cleared up before, you shouldn't take Tu's comment as the production falling apart.

[Hit!!]

Just to clear things up a little since this has apparently exploded beyond this forum:

Tu's tone isn't particularly doom and gloom. It reads more like an animator going, "Oh man, work got tough pretty quickly!" than him condemning the entire tournament. Perhaps I could have better conveyed the tone there, but I essentially just pasted what my translator gave me.

Try to keep in mind going forward that some of Super's best episodes have been made under tight constraints. Having this new insight into the production of the show shouldn't change your expectations too much.

A rushed production doesn't always mean what you get on your screens is going to be poor, too. We've just had episode 90 that sounded like one of the more extreme cases of a poor schedule, and that turned out absolutely fine, if a little uninteresting.

It'd be best if you reserved your judgement and outrage until you can put these comments into context once the episodes begin airing.

Thanks for the explanation.

Well, lets hope things turn out ok.