How Dragon Ball Super Should Have Booked

[Doctor.]

Even Gohans reactions aren't as serious as Gokus should be. Mr Satan and Beerus are the only characters that give a shit apparently .

Even Mr. Satan barely gives a shit. He's like, "Please win!", but he's generally in a pretty good mood.

I've mentioned this in episode threads of yore, but I thought it was absolutely ridiculous that Mr. Satan and Gohan both seemed to be cheering for Goku against Botamo without any hints of internal conflict.

To be honest, I just think they're all overconfident that they're going to win the tournament (they have a pretty good track record of defeating foes, after all). I'm sure a reality check will pull them all back to Earth at some point.

[ChaosLordBrandon]

The implication is that Goku is shortsighted. He doesn't see how bad things could get until they have already gotten that bad.

I agree, which is why I though the way he kick-started the arc in episode 77 worked well, but his reaction in the face of immediate consequences (up to and including being called out by possible victims of the situation at the exhibition match) hasn't felt right.

Even Gohans reactions aren't as serious as Gokus should be. Mr Satan and Beerus are the only characters that give a shit apparently .

Goku didn't even care that much when Buu killed his wife or both of his sons.

Goku is just gonna fix every thing any ways. they tolled us this the moment the super dragon balls was the prize.

And nobody cares about any universe besides their on to.

all kais and gods pretty much said they care don't any universe besides there own to.

this ain't gonna be complex internal character conflic arc. db is not even the type of series that could even do that.

[Cipher]

I guess we just shouldn't care about tension or expect consistent character-based conflict again, since everything is going to work out. Do the characters know everything will work out? Did they read the script?

I can't wait to sit in front of a screen and feel dead for twenty minutes every week.

[ChaosLordBrandon]

[quote="Cipher"]I guess we just shouldn't care about tension or expect consistent character-based conflict again, since everything is going to work out. Do the characters know everything will work out? Did they read the script?

I can't wait to sit in front of a screen and feel dead for twenty minutes every week.[/quote]
But its in the ten year time span so you know everybody is gonna be safe tho lol.

your threads and post are great friend. i'm just saying that this is not gonna be some dark ark.

[Cipher]

its in the ten year time span so you know everybody is gonna be safe tho lol.

Everyone was always going to be safe because it's a kids' action manga/anime. No great irreversible tragedy is going to befall this world.

The tension always had to come from the execution then, and the way the characters were treated sincerely and treated the challenges levied at them sincerely. This is such a basic element of fiction-writing I barely even know how to combat what you're saying. Would you be comfortable with the characters never lifting a finger because they know the audience knows the situation is going to work out?

It doesn't have to be a dark arc; in fact I'd rather it be kind of whimsical and weird and frantic, just as the Boo arc was before it. But I'd like to see the characters handled consistently enough to understand what the threat means for them and their world. Otherwise why even watch the story? Even in the Boo arc, where Goku is hyper-bored and hyper-willing to take dangerous gambles for his own amusement, there are moments when it's made clear the situation is dire, and he meets those with flashes of, "I should've done this/shouldn't have done that." He's willing to permanently fuse with Mr. Satan, for God's sake.

[ChaosLordBrandon]

its in the ten year time span so you know everybody is gonna be safe tho lol.

Everyone was always going to be safe because it's a kids' action manga/anime. No great irreversible tragedy is going to befall this world.

The tension always had to come from the execution then, and the way the characters were treated sincerely and treated the challenges levied at them sincerely. This is such a basic element of fiction-writing I barely even know how to combat what you're saying. Would you be comfortable with the characters never lifting a finger because they know the audience knows the situation is going to work out?

i'm just saying the cast aren't taking this that seriously because this ain't gonna be dark arc.

ROF was a very serious arc and everybody besides Beerus and Whis took Freeza very seriously and it was still completely terrible, so I think super is not that good with serious arcs and with the black arc, another dark arc, which I saw everbody raged at it my statement has some truth to it.

I know exactly what you mean in your post. Infact I think your he user on this fourm Cipher. I'm just saying this ain't gonna be a dark arc is all.

[Cipher]

I know exactly what you mean in your post. Infact I think your he user on this fourm Cipher. I'm just saying this ain't gonna be a dark arc is all.

No worries, and no need to clarify that if we're discussing something about the series and wind up disagreeing; it's never personal. I'd still argue that characters reacting consistently and believably to threats was an element present throughout the manga that's been sorely missing this arc, and one that's important to the show working on any level, "dark" arc or otherwise, but it isn't a hill worth dying on. I also don't have much to add, as I think it's fairly self-evident. If you're enjoying the show as-is, I can't change that for you.

[kinisking]

Even Gohans reactions aren't as serious as Gokus should be. Mr Satan and Beerus are the only characters that give a shit apparently .

Even Mr. Satan barely gives a shit. He's like, "Please win!", but he's generally in a pretty good mood.

I've mentioned this in episode threads of yore, but I thought it was absolutely ridiculous that Mr. Satan and Gohan both seemed to be cheering for Goku against Botamo without any hints of internal conflict.

Well Mr Satan did say last episode that he wouldn't rest easy until the tournament is over or something like that , so that's why I included him.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Even Gohans reactions aren't as serious as Gokus should be. Mr Satan and Beerus are the only characters that give a shit apparently .

Even Mr. Satan barely gives a shit. He's like, "Please win!", but he's generally in a pretty good mood.

I've mentioned this in episode threads of yore, but I thought it was absolutely ridiculous that Mr. Satan and Gohan both seemed to be cheering for Goku against Botamo without any hints of internal conflict.

Well Mr Satan did say last episode that he wouldn't rest easy until the tournament is over or something like that , so that's why I included him.

Contrast that with his general mood, it doesn't mean much.

[dbzfan7]

Alright now to book 86.

We have Dende point out where 17 is, so Goku can fly there. The flying stuff was needless and as a God, he can oversee the world with his eyes as did Kami from before. He's obviously kept tabs on 17 so he should know where he is. Goku can't teleport so he fly's there. 17 beats up some poachers, though because he's 17, he asks has a little competition with Goku on stopping poachers. Protecting wildlife while he cares for it, it's still a game in a sense when it comes to stopping poachers to give a little drastic change from how killing humans used to be a game. Of course 17 mentions no killing and they go about there way.

17 wins by playing dirty as he's not someone who wouldn't have a little fun messing with Goku to win. Though Goku mentions he came for a real fight and to test 17's strength. So 17 is interested as it's been a while since he fought anyone strong. He has been training. They fight and we'll say 17 is around SSJ3 level I guess to give him some leeway. Goku goes Blue to show off what the tournament will be like. He wins effortlessly.

Goku is impressed by 17's gains and tells about the tournament. 17 refuses and they don't bring up the whole destruction thing to contradict 17 from earlier. Instead of the poachers coming along, we will set up either 17 as a stamina fighter as he has unlimited stamina, or he and Goku could go for some maguffin upgrade like a powerful core for his cyborg enhancements, which maybe Whis suggests could work to help 17. Then the next episode is about that, rather than more poachers.

[The gr]

Since I'm seeing some threads bumped,I'm gonna bump this one

This battle royal have some frustrating decision,here are some that annoyed me

-they should have more screentime for obuni,focus on him in the recruitment instead of a jobber that got wasted & don't waste time with Totamo & the magical girls in ep 103 because they made the ep boring

-Changed dyspo personality, making him the hero of justice & with some funny quips instead of a smug super

-ep 98 should be structured better instead of having manufactured drama like

Chappil:ha ha I got iron skin,your done son goku

Son goku :oh no I'm struggling oh wait I got ss1 k bye your eleminated,I need a sense of danger & their ability need to be used creatively,they are more decision that annoyed but here a few

[Freeza9000]

If there was one thing to change in regards to EP 98, I would have to make Vegeta the first one of U7 to be eliminated by the Trio De Dangers.

[The gr]

If there was one thing to change in regards to EP 98, I would have to make Vegeta the first one of U7 to be eliminated by the Trio De Dangers.

Wait why,I want your reasoning,I'm interested because Vegeta is important because of bra & he is the second strongest member

I also wanted frost first form vs Krillin

[Freeza9000]

If there was one thing to change in regards to EP 98, I would have to make Vegeta the first one of U7 to be eliminated by the Trio De Dangers.

Wait why,I want your reasoning,I'm interested because Vegeta is important because of bra & he is the second strongest member

I also wanted frost first form vs Krillin

Because fuck Vegeta. He is the most overrated hot headed and just obnoxiously bland nowadays to the point where the thing he focuses about in the ToP is beating everyone the fuck up and OF COURSE FUCK KAKAROTTO!!! Rather than paying a single thought for his family and newborn daughter.

[avasatu]

Glad we're not in charge of it, reading this thread!

Off the top of my head, though I'm sure I could make a list 50 times this length if I had a notepad and pencil and rewatched the entire series. I also think I could make a list at least half as long for Z, as a disclaimer.

Production: I'd just triple the animation quality, make the music more epic/suspenseful more consistently, amp up the battle damage and shockwaves/lightning and the sounds when blows are exchanged. I'd also stop the "TATATATATATA" during melee combat. Heck, I think I'd scrap the loopy looking unchoreographed fighting altogether.

Story: I don't care for the SSG ritual. It should need approval in the form of some phrase by the Supreme Kai, if not the current GoD, in addition to its current requirements. It feels far too easy and contrived. Goku would not absorb the power of SSG into his base. Rather, he would remark how he felt that the essence of it stayed within him, and begin a frantic search to reacquire it. Innovative and intense training strategies would be a larger focus of the show in general. RoF can't happen, and Frieza can't have been blown to bits by Trunks. Instead, he will have been mentally training himself all this time, to be brought back as True Golden Frieza right off the bat, and his training will be expanded upon and shown to be much more grueling. I'm thinking creepier toys during this montage and everything. I see no reason for Goku and Vegeta to have gone into the RoSaT for 3 years. I'd rather them have gone into the staff for maybe 1. It makes the U6 scaling more palatable, not to mention it is heavily implied that Goku and Vegeta are severely plateaued using regular, mortal methods of training such as the RoSaT. When the U6 tourney comes around, I want a concrete update on Goku's base power level, even if it's not a number. I also want, at some point, rough SSG and SSB multipliers from their previous forms (though the manga more or less provides us the latter). I want the Saiyans to both have access to SSG, and as a result of severe training (which will have been heavily emphasized, as I said earlier). Cabba is more fodder to Vegeta, though Vegeta still wishes to train him to unlock SS. As cool as it was, Hit surviving KK x 10 makes no sense when the show explicitly says he doesn't power up when he improves. Therefore, I'd like an explanation similar to the manga, with Hit a little stronger than he was there. No Kaioken x anything but 2. Skip Copy Vegeta. Getting bored, might do the second half of the show later.

Scaling things not mentioned above: Any percentage statement Beerus gave about his power when he fought Goku would be omitted. Goku's starting base power would have been made clear, relative to his Buu saga self, and will be updated fairly directly at some point toward the beginning of every major arc. Remove all instances of suspected SBG and replace them with either SSG or a more believable feat. Give the GP one combat feat, but not something direct such as an event within a fight. Something subtle. Getting bored, may do more later.

[The gr]

[
Because fuck Vegeta. He is the most overrated hot headed and just obnoxiously bland nowadays to the point where the thing he focuses about in the ToP is beating everyone the fuck up and OF COURSE FUCK KAKAROTTO!!! Rather than paying a single thought for his family and newborn daughter.

him going out first would be the biggest twist in super & quite frankly the franchise ,don't worry Vegeta will show concern for his family

Give the GP one combat feat, but not something direct such as an event within a fight. Something subtle. Getting bored, may do more later.

I think is better to have the angels neutral,what can feat can you give to the great priest

[Kastex]

how the movies and series should have went is that goku got SSG from the ritual, then after training with whis, goku and vegeta would learned how to master SSG, instead of SSB. it's complete horseshit for frieza to have been stronger than SSB. then instead of kaioken, goku would have beat hit by transforming into SSB for the first time. they could have made it clear at that time the form is more powerful and perfect ki control, but drains more stamina. hit would have still been seen as a powerhouse, yet not as strong as SSB, which would have made sense, instead of needing SSBx10 to beat him....

so then the form that would have been overused throughout the series would have been SSG instead of SSB. it would make sense if SSG has near perfect ki control too just without the power that comes with SSB, since it is essentially a base god form, rather than a powered up form. also they should have made it clear that the only reason it's called super saiyan god is because the ritual also produces super saiyans by forcing the 6 participating saiyans to unlock or transform into the super saiyan (super saiyan pan confirmed).

when it came around to the tournament exhibition battles, it would make much more sense if goku took out bergamo using SSG, rather than SSB and kaioken. it doesn't make sense how bergamo survived that. and as for the tournament, goku and vegeta would have used SSG for their final kame instead of SSB, which was vegito level shit, and should have killed everyone instantly. you can say that since they have perfect ki control they can just turn down their power level, but then what would be the point of combining their attacks for that?

dragon ball super would have been SOOOO much better if they actually put thought into the story and how things play out.

[Dragon Ball Gus]

how the movies and series should have went is that goku got SSG from the ritual, then after training with whis, goku and vegeta would learned how to master SSG, instead of SSB. it's complete horseshit for frieza to have been stronger than SSB. then instead of kaioken, goku would have beat hit by transforming into SSB for the first time. they could have made it clear at that time the form is more powerful and perfect ki control, but drains more stamina. hit would have still been seen as a powerhouse, yet not as strong as SSB, which would have made sense, instead of needing SSBx10 to beat him....

so then the form that would have been overused throughout the series would have been SSG instead of SSB. it would make sense if SSG has near perfect ki control too just without the power that comes with SSB, since it is essentially a base god form, rather than a powered up form. also they should have made it clear that the only reason it's called super saiyan god is because the ritual also produces super saiyans by forcing the 6 participating saiyans to unlock or transform into the super saiyan (super saiyan pan confirmed).

when it came around to the tournament exhibition battles, it would make much more sense if goku took out bergamo using SSG, rather than SSB and kaioken. it doesn't make sense how bergamo survived that. and as for the tournament, goku and vegeta would have used SSG for their final kame instead of SSB, which was vegito level shit, and should have killed everyone instantly. you can say that since they have perfect ki control they can just turn down their power level, but then what would be the point of combining their attacks for that?

dragon ball super would have been SOOOO much better if they actually put thought into the story and how things play out.

What about Super Saiyan Rose?

[Kastex]

how the movies and series should have went is that goku got SSG from the ritual, then after training with whis, goku and vegeta would learned how to master SSG, instead of SSB. it's complete horseshit for frieza to have been stronger than SSB. then instead of kaioken, goku would have beat hit by transforming into SSB for the first time. they could have made it clear at that time the form is more powerful and perfect ki control, but drains more stamina. hit would have still been seen as a powerhouse, yet not as strong as SSB, which would have made sense, instead of needing SSBx10 to beat him....

so then the form that would have been overused throughout the series would have been SSG instead of SSB. it would make sense if SSG has near perfect ki control too just without the power that comes with SSB, since it is essentially a base god form, rather than a powered up form. also they should have made it clear that the only reason it's called super saiyan god is because the ritual also produces super saiyans by forcing the 6 participating saiyans to unlock or transform into the super saiyan (super saiyan pan confirmed).

when it came around to the tournament exhibition battles, it would make much more sense if goku took out bergamo using SSG, rather than SSB and kaioken. it doesn't make sense how bergamo survived that. and as for the tournament, goku and vegeta would have used SSG for their final kame instead of SSB, which was vegito level shit, and should have killed everyone instantly. you can say that since they have perfect ki control they can just turn down their power level, but then what would be the point of combining their attacks for that?

dragon ball super would have been SOOOO much better if they actually put thought into the story and how things play out.

What about Super Saiyan Rose?

what do you mean?

[Dragon Ball Gus]

how the movies and series should have went is that goku got SSG from the ritual, then after training with whis, goku and vegeta would learned how to master SSG, instead of SSB. it's complete horseshit for frieza to have been stronger than SSB. then instead of kaioken, goku would have beat hit by transforming into SSB for the first time. they could have made it clear at that time the form is more powerful and perfect ki control, but drains more stamina. hit would have still been seen as a powerhouse, yet not as strong as SSB, which would have made sense, instead of needing SSBx10 to beat him....

so then the form that would have been overused throughout the series would have been SSG instead of SSB. it would make sense if SSG has near perfect ki control too just without the power that comes with SSB, since it is essentially a base god form, rather than a powered up form. also they should have made it clear that the only reason it's called super saiyan god is because the ritual also produces super saiyans by forcing the 6 participating saiyans to unlock or transform into the super saiyan (super saiyan pan confirmed).

when it came around to the tournament exhibition battles, it would make much more sense if goku took out bergamo using SSG, rather than SSB and kaioken. it doesn't make sense how bergamo survived that. and as for the tournament, goku and vegeta would have used SSG for their final kame instead of SSB, which was vegito level shit, and should have killed everyone instantly. you can say that since they have perfect ki control they can just turn down their power level, but then what would be the point of combining their attacks for that?

dragon ball super would have been SOOOO much better if they actually put thought into the story and how things play out.

What about Super Saiyan Rose?

what do you mean?

What would you change about that? Also, would Goku Black also be able to transform into a Super Saiyan God?