SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
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SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
So ... as of Ep. 86, we do not know what Super Saiyan Rage really is.
Do any of you have headcanons for what the form is/its explanation? I'd be curious to hear.
My headcanon is that SSRage is a Super Saiyan Grade 9, an even further invention of the Z Fighters to extend Super Saiyan. We know Super Saiyan Grades 1 - 6. Future Trunks' Improved Super Saiyan 2, in the manga when he fights Goku, is around SS3 power. I call this Super Saiyan Grade 7. Vegeta's Super Saiyan 2 Mutation that he fought against Beerus and used against Black in the manga is stronger than a SS3. I call this Super Saiyan Grade 8. As SSRage is stronger than both of these, it is Grade 9.
Do any of you have headcanons for what the form is/its explanation? I'd be curious to hear.
My headcanon is that SSRage is a Super Saiyan Grade 9, an even further invention of the Z Fighters to extend Super Saiyan. We know Super Saiyan Grades 1 - 6. Future Trunks' Improved Super Saiyan 2, in the manga when he fights Goku, is around SS3 power. I call this Super Saiyan Grade 7. Vegeta's Super Saiyan 2 Mutation that he fought against Beerus and used against Black in the manga is stronger than a SS3. I call this Super Saiyan Grade 8. As SSRage is stronger than both of these, it is Grade 9.
Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
Mine is that he is still in SS mode, but somehow he gets to have a bit of god ki around him, the blue aura. I don't like it, but that's the best I can think of. For that, they could have made him go SSB.
When the episode aired, I thought he was going SS3. It still wouldn't be enough, but he could have made something. Then the Ikari happened, I was like, what the f am I seeing.
When the episode aired, I thought he was going SS3. It still wouldn't be enough, but he could have made something. Then the Ikari happened, I was like, what the f am I seeing.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
After being around of SSB Vegeta, SSR Black, SSB Goku and Immortal Zamasu and fight with them, FT Trunks started unconsciously tapping into that realm of power.
The reason why he was able to pull it off it's because he's a hybrid and hybrids always shown to have the biggest potential.
The reason why he wasn't able to fully unlock SSB, it's because he can't control his ki like Goku/Vegeta learned under Whis and because he needs peace of mind to unlock that form, not rage. As result he got something close to SSB, but not the real thing.
I see SSIkari as an incomplete version of SSB. Just like False SSJ in Lord Slug Movie is an incomplete version of SSJ.
The reason why he was able to pull it off it's because he's a hybrid and hybrids always shown to have the biggest potential.
The reason why he wasn't able to fully unlock SSB, it's because he can't control his ki like Goku/Vegeta learned under Whis and because he needs peace of mind to unlock that form, not rage. As result he got something close to SSB, but not the real thing.
I see SSIkari as an incomplete version of SSB. Just like False SSJ in Lord Slug Movie is an incomplete version of SSJ.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
SSI cannot be what it is without some form of God ki existing, Saiyans need god ki to get to that level of power, besides gohan probably, he can get pretty high without god ki as well..
SSI is trunks tapping into god ki but still not knowing what is happening, just like us
SSI is trunks tapping into god ki but still not knowing what is happening, just like us
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
This is the conclusion I ended up coming to as well. I just wish Toei would've at least acknowledged this transformation instead of just leaving it up to interpretation. These people are terrible at their job.FortuneSSJ wrote:After being around of SSB Vegeta, SSR Black, SSB Goku and Immortal Zamasu and fight with them, FT Trunks started unconsciously tapping into that realm of power.
The reason why he was able to pull it off it's because he's a hybrid and hybrids always shown to have the biggest potential.
The reason why he wasn't able to fully unlock SSB, it's because he can't control his ki like Goku/Vegeta learned under Whis and because he needs peace of mind to unlock that form, not rage. As result he got something close to SSB, but not the real thing.
I see SSIkari as an incomplete version of SSB. Just like False SSJ in Lord Slug Movie is an incomplete version of SSJ.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
My personal headcanon (as mentioned above, but I will go into a little more detail) is that SSRage is not related to SSBlue.
Since yellow-haired Super Saiyan transformations are mostly based in rage and anger, SSRage is just an extension of Super Saiyan. However, it has a blue aura because it is on the level of SSBlue.
There seems to be two routes to get to that level of power. I see it as a fork in the road where a Saiyan can continue down the path of yellow hair which is rage, or they can continue down the god path where they learn forms that have better ki control. Goku and Vegeta went down the yellow-hair path, but turned around and changed courses to get stronger. Trunks continued on the yellow-hair path and the blue aura is a result of just being at such a high level.
Since yellow-haired Super Saiyan transformations are mostly based in rage and anger, SSRage is just an extension of Super Saiyan. However, it has a blue aura because it is on the level of SSBlue.
There seems to be two routes to get to that level of power. I see it as a fork in the road where a Saiyan can continue down the path of yellow hair which is rage, or they can continue down the god path where they learn forms that have better ki control. Goku and Vegeta went down the yellow-hair path, but turned around and changed courses to get stronger. Trunks continued on the yellow-hair path and the blue aura is a result of just being at such a high level.
Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I imagine it's a perversion of Super Saiyan Grade Three mixed with god ki, something brought on by Trunks' instinctual knowledge of the existence of Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan, but having not done enough meditation to fully open the doors to that realm of ki.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I guess it could be considered an alternate, more advanced version of the SSJ3 form, or rather, the true successor to SSJ2. That's the best explanation I've got.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
SSRAGE is just a transformation triggered by a desesperated moment, it's really no different from ssj and ssj 2.
But my take on it, would be that it represents Trunks's all hidden potential being unleashed, or a hybrids only transformation (i want Gohan to achieve it as well)
But my take on it, would be that it represents Trunks's all hidden potential being unleashed, or a hybrids only transformation (i want Gohan to achieve it as well)
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I still hope for Gohan to get it instead of blue... With a proper explanation... Even more about the blue aura
Rage alne is not explanation enough for me
Rage alne is not explanation enough for me
Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
Super Saiyan Rage is the result of Trunks transforming into his Ultra Super Saiyan 2 form which he used against Vegetables several episodes prior and then that blue aura bringing him back down to normal size.
He essentially has all that power but without losing any of the speed.
That's why you see him bulk up, it's why his footsteps are heavy, why he's so much stronger, why his eyes go white and why his hair goes spiky.
He essentially has all that power but without losing any of the speed.
That's why you see him bulk up, it's why his footsteps are heavy, why he's so much stronger, why his eyes go white and why his hair goes spiky.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
Super Saiyan Ikari is unlocked by Future Trunks's agony on the mockery the Zamasu duo did on Trunks's attempts to save people. They were damning Trunks for breaking the time travel taboo of the gods and essentially labeling Trunks's actions for a better future for the past as sins. Which if it weren't for Trunks saving Goku from a heart virus, Black wouldn't have taken Goku's body and as Black puts it, Trunks killed the Earthlings himself (that includes his own mother and other dead humans). Pretty much saying that the shenanigans that's happening in Trunks's future was a byproduct of his own good intentions of saving the past. Of course, anyone would be put over the edge after finding that out.
Hell, the arc even showed Trunks suffering from psychological disorders like PTSD and attacking Goku since he was mistaking him for Goku Black.
Hell, the arc even showed Trunks suffering from psychological disorders like PTSD and attacking Goku since he was mistaking him for Goku Black.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
Well, we have to remember the context that Super Saiyan Rage appeared in.
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Future Trunks entered the form after becoming enraged beyond his limits by Future Zamasu and Goku Black mocking his earnest attempts at saving his future by way of basically smugly saying that all of this was his fault, that he's to blame for everything bad that's ever happened.
When he transforms into the form, his body begins to bulk up before slimming down, he gains a slight tint of blue aura after slimming down to normal, his hair becomes even spikier, and his eyes go pure-white for a bit before returning to normal Super Saiyan colour.
After transforming, his new state allows him to fight on par with Goku Black for a bit. Eventually, he seems to "regain control", so to speak, with his eyes returning to normal and him having a full handle over his newfound power. He can even transform into it freely after that point, and every time he transforms into Super Saiyan Rage from that point on, his hair grows spikier, his golden aura gains a slight blue tint within, and his body starts bulking up before slimming down again.
===
The name and context surrounding the form obviously means it's attributed to rage, pure anger. At that point, Future Trunks had already raged out, resulting in his first transformation into a Super Saiyan when Future Gohan died, grew extremely powerful, and even gained the SS2 form.
We only have one other instance of a character possessing SS2 without any god forms getting a rage boost in the series and reaching new heights thought impossible: Vegeta.
Perhaps Super Saiyan Rage is what happens when a SS2 gains a rage boost so phenomenal and pure that it elevates the Saiyan into unfathomable heights of strength. Vegeta raged out into a mutant SS2 that had surpassed every other main cast member, up until Goku became a SSG, but he didn't keep its power or have a hint of a blue aura. Maybe Super Saiyan Rage is what happens when a SS2-possessing Saiyan is strong enough to maintain that power as a permanent form, since Future Trunks was a lot stronger than that Vegeta, or perhaps when he has had exposure to the pressure of God Ki.
===
Future Trunks entered the form after becoming enraged beyond his limits by Future Zamasu and Goku Black mocking his earnest attempts at saving his future by way of basically smugly saying that all of this was his fault, that he's to blame for everything bad that's ever happened.
When he transforms into the form, his body begins to bulk up before slimming down, he gains a slight tint of blue aura after slimming down to normal, his hair becomes even spikier, and his eyes go pure-white for a bit before returning to normal Super Saiyan colour.
After transforming, his new state allows him to fight on par with Goku Black for a bit. Eventually, he seems to "regain control", so to speak, with his eyes returning to normal and him having a full handle over his newfound power. He can even transform into it freely after that point, and every time he transforms into Super Saiyan Rage from that point on, his hair grows spikier, his golden aura gains a slight blue tint within, and his body starts bulking up before slimming down again.
===
The name and context surrounding the form obviously means it's attributed to rage, pure anger. At that point, Future Trunks had already raged out, resulting in his first transformation into a Super Saiyan when Future Gohan died, grew extremely powerful, and even gained the SS2 form.
We only have one other instance of a character possessing SS2 without any god forms getting a rage boost in the series and reaching new heights thought impossible: Vegeta.
Perhaps Super Saiyan Rage is what happens when a SS2 gains a rage boost so phenomenal and pure that it elevates the Saiyan into unfathomable heights of strength. Vegeta raged out into a mutant SS2 that had surpassed every other main cast member, up until Goku became a SSG, but he didn't keep its power or have a hint of a blue aura. Maybe Super Saiyan Rage is what happens when a SS2-possessing Saiyan is strong enough to maintain that power as a permanent form, since Future Trunks was a lot stronger than that Vegeta, or perhaps when he has had exposure to the pressure of God Ki.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I like to think that God Ki for Saiyans is sort of contagious, Goku got it from his God boost, passed it on to Vegeta in training and then Vegeta passed it on to Trunks in training. Trunks wasn't given the proper training to unlock Blue, but his intense rage in that moment allowed him to do a "dirtier" mixing of Super Saiyan and God Ki.
Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I've my headcannon somewhat explained here:
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Basically, over the course of Super. We see Vegeta hinting to Cabba to "remember this pain" when he KOd him as a Super Saiyan Blue.
Why would he say something weird as that? Unless of course that helps in achieving SSJBlue.
Black also managed to reach his SSJB's variant SSJ Rosé after getting beaten up by Vegeta Blue.
Over the course of the arc we see Vegeta training Trunks and later Trunks get repeateadly beat up by Black's Rosé and the he reaches a turning point when finally tap into this ki due to extreme exposure. But, because he didn't use an empty mind and rather rage, that's why he became SSJI. If he were to train that, I think the yellow portion of the aura would give place to the blue.
As for him bulking up and then down. That's simply attributed to a body change, that Goku, Vegeta and Black had when accessing Godly power. They all get somewhat slimmer and suffer massive visual muscular change. And Trunks went through similar change when transforming.
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Basically, over the course of Super. We see Vegeta hinting to Cabba to "remember this pain" when he KOd him as a Super Saiyan Blue.
Why would he say something weird as that? Unless of course that helps in achieving SSJBlue.
Black also managed to reach his SSJB's variant SSJ Rosé after getting beaten up by Vegeta Blue.
Over the course of the arc we see Vegeta training Trunks and later Trunks get repeateadly beat up by Black's Rosé and the he reaches a turning point when finally tap into this ki due to extreme exposure. But, because he didn't use an empty mind and rather rage, that's why he became SSJI. If he were to train that, I think the yellow portion of the aura would give place to the blue.
As for him bulking up and then down. That's simply attributed to a body change, that Goku, Vegeta and Black had when accessing Godly power. They all get somewhat slimmer and suffer massive visual muscular change. And Trunks went through similar change when transforming.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
My head cannon is as follows:
After Super Saiyan 2, there are two roads to improvement; one reached through hard work and training, and the other by sheer anger and rage.
Super Saiyan 3 is the result of the training path.
Super Saiyan Rage is the result of the anger path, which is similar to how Super Saiyan is reached and how Gohan reached Super Saiyan 2.
I believe Super Saiyan Rage gives the user a taste of god ki, but it is very limited. The user's power runs out even faster than Super Saiyan 3. Like the Super Saiyan God ritual, the only way to maintain that power is for others to transfer their ki to you.
On a side note, I believe Vegeta'a Quake of Fury is the "False Super Saiyan" version of Super Saiyan Rage. I think that because he appeared to surpass Super Saiyan 3 as a Super Saiyan 2 and was briefly able to push Beerus to use more of his strength. He was also able to follow Goku and Beerus' Fight whereas no one else could.
I don't think Super Saiyan Rage can be mastered or improved upon like Super Saiyan 3 can, and even if it could, it's more beneficial to focus on mastering that godly ki and reaching Super Saiyan Blue.
After Super Saiyan 2, there are two roads to improvement; one reached through hard work and training, and the other by sheer anger and rage.
Super Saiyan 3 is the result of the training path.
Super Saiyan Rage is the result of the anger path, which is similar to how Super Saiyan is reached and how Gohan reached Super Saiyan 2.
I believe Super Saiyan Rage gives the user a taste of god ki, but it is very limited. The user's power runs out even faster than Super Saiyan 3. Like the Super Saiyan God ritual, the only way to maintain that power is for others to transfer their ki to you.
On a side note, I believe Vegeta'a Quake of Fury is the "False Super Saiyan" version of Super Saiyan Rage. I think that because he appeared to surpass Super Saiyan 3 as a Super Saiyan 2 and was briefly able to push Beerus to use more of his strength. He was also able to follow Goku and Beerus' Fight whereas no one else could.
I don't think Super Saiyan Rage can be mastered or improved upon like Super Saiyan 3 can, and even if it could, it's more beneficial to focus on mastering that godly ki and reaching Super Saiyan Blue.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I feel like it's exclusive to Half Saiyajins as it channels the emotion from their Human side. And there should be a transformation exclusive to Full Saiyajins, maybe something similar to SSJ4.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
It established that intense emotions can lead to incredible spikes in power and can even be the bridge from one Super Saiyan form to another, as shown with Goku, Gohan and Vegeta. And with Future Trunks being a half-breed Saiyan, it already put him ahead of the Super Saiyan transformation curve with easier access to new form and gives you better access to more latent power. And considering that he became a SSJ in his very early teen with no special training and he was able able to raise his SSJ2 form to being comparable to SSJ3 Goku from training with Kaioshin, it obvious that Future Trunks had a hell of lot of hidden power, and just need the right trigger to tap into all of it.
All the rage, anger and frustration that's been brewing inside of Future Trunks from all the many years of mentally and emotionally exhausting conflicts finally reached the boiling point when Future Trunks was made to feel guilty from Goku Black and Zamasu's scathing speech about how his selfishness of using a time machine in a last ditch effort to interfere with events in the past to save everyone in his world was in itself responsible for instigating all the events that caused misery for him, his friends, his family, billions all over the world, trillions though the multiverse and the stability of the Kaioshin and Hakaishin system. The importance of the mockery and shaming that Goku Black and Zamasu did towards Future Trunks really runs far deeper than people realise. They were essentially blaming him for everything that went wrong with Android and Cell arc and basically belittling him for taking a desperate course of action to save his world by using time travel instead of just letting Goku die from the Heart Virus and effectively prevent anything about the Zamasu arc happening. They were basically making Future Trunks feel like the worst person in history because he wanted protect what was left of humanity in his timeline and in the process making it seem as though every person that had died in his timeline was all his fault because he was being "selfish". Future Trunks was being made to feel great guilt just for his existence. That's what drove Future Trunks to his breaking point. He'll be damned if he's gonna be made out to be the villain for trying to save his world and have all the mortals that Goku Black slaughtered in his timeline feel like it should rest on his shoulders when there was nothing he could do about that.
Unable to cope with that mental burden, or any other kind, Future Trunks emotions flared up like nothing before and it mutated into a new Super Saiyan form that maximises how much power a Saiyan can draw from raw and intense emotion and Super Saiyan Rage was born. It exists as formal representation of the epitome of anger and rage, with a calm and pure heart, fueling power. Just like Super Super and Super Saiyan 2 before it.
All the rage, anger and frustration that's been brewing inside of Future Trunks from all the many years of mentally and emotionally exhausting conflicts finally reached the boiling point when Future Trunks was made to feel guilty from Goku Black and Zamasu's scathing speech about how his selfishness of using a time machine in a last ditch effort to interfere with events in the past to save everyone in his world was in itself responsible for instigating all the events that caused misery for him, his friends, his family, billions all over the world, trillions though the multiverse and the stability of the Kaioshin and Hakaishin system. The importance of the mockery and shaming that Goku Black and Zamasu did towards Future Trunks really runs far deeper than people realise. They were essentially blaming him for everything that went wrong with Android and Cell arc and basically belittling him for taking a desperate course of action to save his world by using time travel instead of just letting Goku die from the Heart Virus and effectively prevent anything about the Zamasu arc happening. They were basically making Future Trunks feel like the worst person in history because he wanted protect what was left of humanity in his timeline and in the process making it seem as though every person that had died in his timeline was all his fault because he was being "selfish". Future Trunks was being made to feel great guilt just for his existence. That's what drove Future Trunks to his breaking point. He'll be damned if he's gonna be made out to be the villain for trying to save his world and have all the mortals that Goku Black slaughtered in his timeline feel like it should rest on his shoulders when there was nothing he could do about that.
Unable to cope with that mental burden, or any other kind, Future Trunks emotions flared up like nothing before and it mutated into a new Super Saiyan form that maximises how much power a Saiyan can draw from raw and intense emotion and Super Saiyan Rage was born. It exists as formal representation of the epitome of anger and rage, with a calm and pure heart, fueling power. Just like Super Super and Super Saiyan 2 before it.
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Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
I like this thread. Much more level-headed comments here rather than all of the flailing around going on back when Super #61 aired and for some time afterwards. Of course, now, there's the added benefit of hindsight and being able to marathon the entire arc.
In addition to what others have said, don't underestimate the power of renewed vigor. F.Trunks was utterly completely defeated mentally, emotionally, physically,etc. before he'd made the trip back to the past. Upon reuniting with everyone again, and then spending time with both Vegeta and Goku, he'd been exposed to realms that he'd never imagined were possible (as JulieYBM mentioned). The rest of the chain-of-events (that we'd seen much of through F.Trunks perspective) led to a satisfying event occurring that will go down as a highlight moment in the franchise. Another thing to note is that F.Trunks appeared unable to sustain that form for long, as he was shown to have powered-down before he'd "switch it on" again afterwards.
As for the transformation itself, it's definitely rage-induced Ascended SSJ (SSJ2 mutation?) combined with having subconciously conjured up godly ki. That could help explain why F.Trunks was able to put up a stronger outing as he was coming from a place of a forced extreme emotional trigger culmination rather than coming from a place of control and tranquility. The resulting ground-shaking footsteps I assume were brought on initially from the extreme heavy pressure being emitted upon being in that new state. My only problem with F. Trunks appearance prior to that throughout the arc was that his SSJ/SSJ2 were not consistent with how he was seen back at the end of the Cell/Artificial Humans arc. He was drawn more closely to resemble his 17-year-old self rather than the more powered-up variation that he was left on which bothered me because I appreciate attention to detail.
The execution in Super has been somewhat flat for me at times, but not in this case. Well done.
In addition to what others have said, don't underestimate the power of renewed vigor. F.Trunks was utterly completely defeated mentally, emotionally, physically,etc. before he'd made the trip back to the past. Upon reuniting with everyone again, and then spending time with both Vegeta and Goku, he'd been exposed to realms that he'd never imagined were possible (as JulieYBM mentioned). The rest of the chain-of-events (that we'd seen much of through F.Trunks perspective) led to a satisfying event occurring that will go down as a highlight moment in the franchise. Another thing to note is that F.Trunks appeared unable to sustain that form for long, as he was shown to have powered-down before he'd "switch it on" again afterwards.
As for the transformation itself, it's definitely rage-induced Ascended SSJ (SSJ2 mutation?) combined with having subconciously conjured up godly ki. That could help explain why F.Trunks was able to put up a stronger outing as he was coming from a place of a forced extreme emotional trigger culmination rather than coming from a place of control and tranquility. The resulting ground-shaking footsteps I assume were brought on initially from the extreme heavy pressure being emitted upon being in that new state. My only problem with F. Trunks appearance prior to that throughout the arc was that his SSJ/SSJ2 were not consistent with how he was seen back at the end of the Cell/Artificial Humans arc. He was drawn more closely to resemble his 17-year-old self rather than the more powered-up variation that he was left on which bothered me because I appreciate attention to detail.
The execution in Super has been somewhat flat for me at times, but not in this case. Well done.
Re: SSRage is still unknown; what's your headcanon?
My headcanon is that it's not really a new form per se, but more of a powerup because of Trunks rage. Similarly to Gohan in the original DB, he could increase his power by a large margin because of his rage. Trunks could, because of his age/experience with SSJ, harness that rage-induced power boost into his SSJ form.
Welp, it still doesn't hold up imo. It is just plot induced stupidity. I really don't feel that this powerup is in anyway coherent with the rest of series. They just needed Trunks to be cool and strong, because it is afterall, his arc.
Welp, it still doesn't hold up imo. It is just plot induced stupidity. I really don't feel that this powerup is in anyway coherent with the rest of series. They just needed Trunks to be cool and strong, because it is afterall, his arc.