The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Lord Beerus » Sun Aug 06, 2017 11:46 am

There is still plenty of tension as there are still 48 fighters left, and many of them we haven't even seen yet in action. Give the arc some time.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Lionel » Sun Aug 06, 2017 12:44 pm

It's been a cacophony of cackles and food playing since the beginning. Witnessing the erasure of Universe 9 apparently wasn't enough for the likes of Methiop/Napapa to eliminate their opponent quickly and then move on. No -- they had to exhaust precious time torturing Kale because... They felt like it? I would expect this sort of conduct from a genocidal madman like Freeza who has no emotional connections to anyone. Many of the other characters didn't exhibit such needless brutality towards their opponents, albeit they suffered from character afflictions of their own such as incompetence and short-sightedness. If these characters were truly acting with a stone-cold solemn demeanour then it would have been all out war with gnashing, limbs flying, and God tier empowered attacks being used to dispatch as many opponents as possible while seizing moments of weakness to hopefully defeat the stronger ones without depleting themselves in a prolonged engagement. None of this is proven to be the case though. Most participants are treating the situation as if it were a typical sport that they should enjoy without having to overexert themselves.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by fadeddreams5 » Sun Aug 06, 2017 1:51 pm

This series seldom takes itself seriously (the Black arc was a miracle), but I'll give it the benefit of the doubt until the fodder characters are gone. I feel Universe 7 is a little cocky at the moment.

Still, even after Uni 7 is at its brink, I just expect the main characters in the stand making goofy faces, Zeno clapping, and Goku fapping off of his opponent's strength as opposed to saying something heroic like "I won't let my universe down!" If this arc had any intentions of going serious mode, you'd think one fighter from the multiverse would use Talk No Jutsu on Zeno by now.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by GreatSaiyaJeff » Sun Aug 06, 2017 2:34 pm

The only real reason I don't feel as much tension is that we all know that U7 will be ok. After all this takes place before the end of Z. So we know the main cast will be ok. However their is tension for the other universes. AFter all we have no idea if they will fully make it out of this or not.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Kanious » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:11 pm

Akyon wrote:It's not even Universe 7 though that don't seem to be taking anything seriously;

Toppo trying to conserve energy rather than going with Jiren to take down Goku immedietely is a little peculiar, considering he knows how dangerous he is.
Jiren not making sure Kale gets blasted out the ring was dumb. That single act really screwed his team over in the following episode. Great work.
Jiren standing around bored out of his skull with his arms crossed is ridiculous when the lives of everyone he cares about is on the line.
Hit destroys Nairirama's arm disabling him but leaves him in for a few minutes to walk slowly towards Vegeta before vanishing because...err...
Napapa got demolished by Frieza but Frieza couldn't be bothered to eliminate him because...?
Caulifla mirrors Goku's "YAY YAY YAY A FIGHT" mentality so she's naturally also there.
things has to be this way... or Jiren, Toppo, Hit, Kale, Vegeta and Goku would eliminate 74 characters in one episode and the arc would be only those fighting, and Jiren or Hit would probably win easily in 1-3 episodes.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Akyon » Sun Aug 06, 2017 3:55 pm

Kanious wrote:
Akyon wrote:It's not even Universe 7 though that don't seem to be taking anything seriously;

Toppo trying to conserve energy rather than going with Jiren to take down Goku immedietely is a little peculiar, considering he knows how dangerous he is.
Jiren not making sure Kale gets blasted out the ring was dumb. That single act really screwed his team over in the following episode. Great work.
Jiren standing around bored out of his skull with his arms crossed is ridiculous when the lives of everyone he cares about is on the line.
Hit destroys Nairirama's arm disabling him but leaves him in for a few minutes to walk slowly towards Vegeta before vanishing because...err...
Napapa got demolished by Frieza but Frieza couldn't be bothered to eliminate him because...?
Caulifla mirrors Goku's "YAY YAY YAY A FIGHT" mentality so she's naturally also there.
things has to be this way... or Jiren, Toppo, Hit, Kale, Vegeta and Goku would eliminate 74 characters in one episode and the arc would be only those fighting, and Jiren or Hit would probably win easily in 1-3 episodes.
Well no, it doesn't neccesarily.

Goku, Vegeta, and Frieza could be busy fighting seriously against Jiren/Hit/Toppo/Kale whilst the weaker fighters get their match ups. Simultaneous action allowing the weaker guys to get some time to shine and makes it look like the strong guys aren't dicking about, they're just in tough matches.

Honestly wouldn't be hard to do.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by ClutchBangstrip » Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:05 pm

LOL We're only 5 episodes in.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Shuby » Mon Aug 07, 2017 12:40 pm

ClutchBangstrip wrote:LOL We're only 5 episodes in.
The arc has been going on longer than the Black arc, yet there is no sufficient build-up or seriousness from the beginning.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Asura » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:00 pm

Shuby wrote:
ClutchBangstrip wrote:LOL We're only 5 episodes in.
The arc has been going on longer than the Black arc, yet there is no sufficient build-up or seriousness from the beginning.
No build-up? We had 6 months of build-up lol.

Personally I'm not seeing the issue. The only ones not taking it too seriously are Goku, Vegeta, and Freeza. Which makes perfect sense as to why they're not taking it that seriously. Goku and Vegeta just want to fight strong opponents, and well Freeza is Freeza who knows what he has up his sleeve. Gohan's group is clearly taking this seriously, as are 17 and 18.

Aside from the gag with this latest episode, I haven't seen anything to suggest other people aren't taking this tournament seriously.

I think there's a lot of tension for me personally, because I don't know who could be next for U7 so it's really interesting to me to see the elimination order for them. Same for whenever Caulifla/Cabba/Hit and even Kale (she's a bit more likeable now that she's getting away from being a Broly) are on screen because I don't want them to get knocked out.

Once we get closer and closer to the end with few fighters remaining, there's definitely going to be a ton of tension. People say U7 is obviously going to win so there's no tension but you don't know that for sure, and given our heroes horrendous track records of coming out as the winners of an arc, it may even be more likely that they don't win.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by HybridSaiyan » Mon Aug 07, 2017 1:08 pm

There would be a heck ton of tension If It was Movie Toei Goku in there instead of Modern Toei Goku, trust me.
He'd be taking everything serious, yet he'd be concerned over all the other innocent people / universes getting erased and try to prevent it.

He'd shout "NO, DON'T DO IT XENO!" And have a full on angry / shocked expression. I can even imagine him trying to attack Xeno!

Goku hasn't even acknowledged Krillin getting knocked out yet. What the flying fucks?!

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by PeanutSaiyan » Mon Aug 07, 2017 2:28 pm

It's the writing. It's so poorly written and the concept is so poorly executed that it's very hard to invest emotionally in anything.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Blackstripe » Mon Aug 07, 2017 2:46 pm

HybridSaiyan wrote:There would be a heck ton of tension If It was Movie Toei Goku in there instead of Modern Toei Goku, trust me.
He'd be taking everything serious, yet he'd be concerned over all the other innocent people / universes getting erased and try to prevent it.

He'd shout "NO, DON'T DO IT XENO!" And have a full on angry / shocked expression. I can even imagine him trying to attack Xeno!

Goku hasn't even acknowledged Krillin getting knocked out yet. What the flying fucks?!
This is literally how Akira Toriyama believes Gokuu should be written. That's why Toei is doing it that way.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:30 pm

Blackstripe wrote:
HybridSaiyan wrote:There would be a heck ton of tension If It was Movie Toei Goku in there instead of Modern Toei Goku, trust me.
He'd be taking everything serious, yet he'd be concerned over all the other innocent people / universes getting erased and try to prevent it.

He'd shout "NO, DON'T DO IT XENO!" And have a full on angry / shocked expression. I can even imagine him trying to attack Xeno!

Goku hasn't even acknowledged Krillin getting knocked out yet. What the flying fucks?!
This is literally how Akira Toriyama believes Gokuu should be written. That's why Toei is doing it that way.
Yep. Akira Toriyama has gone on record to state he doesn't like how much the anime (the animes and movies) played up Goku's heroism:
Akira Toriyama wrote:There’s how, basically, Son Goku from Dragon Ball doesn’t fight for the sake of others, but because he wants to fight against strong guys. So once Dragon Ball got animated, at any rate, I’ve always been dissatisfied with the “righteous hero”-type portrayal they gave him. I guess I couldn’t quite get them to grasp the elements of “poison” that slip in and out of sight among the shadows.
And those were his thoughts given back in 1996. Fast forward to when Battle Of Gods was being released, and his mentality remained the same:
Akira Toriyama wrote:At any rate, I wanted him to have the sense of being that rare guy who seeks only “to become stronger than before”, so much so that it feels like “there’s no one as pure as this person”. And while he does end up saving everyone as a result of that, he himself at least has a very pure sincerity about “wanting to become stronger”. What I wanted to depict the most was the sense that he might not be a good guy at all, although he does do good things as a result.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by gofishus » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:06 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:
Blackstripe wrote:
HybridSaiyan wrote:There would be a heck ton of tension If It was Movie Toei Goku in there instead of Modern Toei Goku, trust me.
He'd be taking everything serious, yet he'd be concerned over all the other innocent people / universes getting erased and try to prevent it.

He'd shout "NO, DON'T DO IT XENO!" And have a full on angry / shocked expression. I can even imagine him trying to attack Xeno!

Goku hasn't even acknowledged Krillin getting knocked out yet. What the flying fucks?!
This is literally how Akira Toriyama believes Gokuu should be written. That's why Toei is doing it that way.
Yep. Akira Toriyama has gone on record to state he doesn't like how much the anime (the animes and movies) played up Goku's heroism:
Akira Toriyama wrote:There’s how, basically, Son Goku from Dragon Ball doesn’t fight for the sake of others, but because he wants to fight against strong guys. So once Dragon Ball got animated, at any rate, I’ve always been dissatisfied with the “righteous hero”-type portrayal they gave him. I guess I couldn’t quite get them to grasp the elements of “poison” that slip in and out of sight among the shadows.
And those were his thoughts given back in 1996. Fast forward to when Battle Of Gods was being released, and his mentality remained the same:
Akira Toriyama wrote:At any rate, I wanted him to have the sense of being that rare guy who seeks only “to become stronger than before”, so much so that it feels like “there’s no one as pure as this person”. And while he does end up saving everyone as a result of that, he himself at least has a very pure sincerity about “wanting to become stronger”. What I wanted to depict the most was the sense that he might not be a good guy at all, although he does do good things as a result.
well there you have it from Toriyama himself. No one should defend Goku's lack of heroics in Super at this point anymore. he is supposed to be more of an asshole than he was in DBZ according to how Toriyama envisioned him.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by HybridSaiyan » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:43 pm

gofishus wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:
Blackstripe wrote:
This is literally how Akira Toriyama believes Gokuu should be written. That's why Toei is doing it that way.
Yep. Akira Toriyama has gone on record to state he doesn't like how much the anime (the animes and movies) played up Goku's heroism:
Akira Toriyama wrote:There’s how, basically, Son Goku from Dragon Ball doesn’t fight for the sake of others, but because he wants to fight against strong guys. So once Dragon Ball got animated, at any rate, I’ve always been dissatisfied with the “righteous hero”-type portrayal they gave him. I guess I couldn’t quite get them to grasp the elements of “poison” that slip in and out of sight among the shadows.
And those were his thoughts given back in 1996. Fast forward to when Battle Of Gods was being released, and his mentality remained the same:
Akira Toriyama wrote:At any rate, I wanted him to have the sense of being that rare guy who seeks only “to become stronger than before”, so much so that it feels like “there’s no one as pure as this person”. And while he does end up saving everyone as a result of that, he himself at least has a very pure sincerity about “wanting to become stronger”. What I wanted to depict the most was the sense that he might not be a good guy at all, although he does do good things as a result.
well there you have it from Toriyama himself. No one should defend Goku's lack of heroics in Super at this point anymore. he is supposed to be more of an asshole than he was in DBZ according to how Toriyama envisioned him.
That's the problem If you followed heroic Goku for the last 20+years lmao. If Toei had just made him an asshole to begin with, people wouldn't have cared for his attitude in Super.

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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Metalwario64 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:43 pm

I still think this is because we know that everything's going to end okay, because this takes place before the end of Z.

Sure, there will be surprises and there can still be good story telling, but there will never be a sense of "will our heroes make it?"
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by sintzu » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:52 pm

Metalwario64 wrote:I still think this is because we know that everything's going to end okay, because this takes place before the end of Z.

Sure, there will be surprises and there can still be good story telling, but there will never be a sense of "will our heroes make it?"
Even if we didn't know EOZ we'd still know they'll be OK simply because it's DB.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by Metalwario64 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:55 pm

sintzu wrote:
Metalwario64 wrote:I still think this is because we know that everything's going to end okay, because this takes place before the end of Z.

Sure, there will be surprises and there can still be good story telling, but there will never be a sense of "will our heroes make it?"
Even if we didn't know EOZ we'd still know they'll be OK simply because it's DB.
Throughout the series, there were at least a few moments where all seemed lost (biggest was when Daimao killed Shen Long). That's impossible entirely now, because we've seen what comes after.

There can still be surprises, but there is no sense of danger for the characters simply because it's a prequel.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by sintzu » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:59 pm

HybridSaiyan wrote:That's the problem If you followed heroic Goku for the last 20+years lmao. If Toei had just made him an asshole to begin with, people wouldn't have cared for his attitude in Super.
That's not entirly Toei's fault cause even in the manga Goku had some heroic things about him. for example he decided to take the fights with the androids out of the city to not get anymore people killed.
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Re: The stakes couldn't be higher yet there is no tension at all

Post by MR.Mark » Tue Aug 08, 2017 3:03 am

sintzu wrote:
HybridSaiyan wrote:That's the problem If you followed heroic Goku for the last 20+years lmao. If Toei had just made him an asshole to begin with, people wouldn't have cared for his attitude in Super.
That's not entirly Toei's fault cause even in the manga Goku had some heroic things about him. for example he decided to take the fights with the androids out of the city to not get anymore people killed.
Not only that, he also said while coming to terms with his Saiyan heritage that he'd fight for the sake of the dead Nameks against Freeza. He also told Buu and Bobidi to stop killing innocents.

Goku is selfish but he's a decent man.

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