Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

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MaskedRider
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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by MaskedRider » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:01 am

Ya' know, after Champa yelled at his team to keep on fighting and the Grand Priest reaffirmed that the contestants should be fighting really drove home the "we're just pawns" narrative Goku talked about in the tournament with universe six. I hope something comes out of that because the Grand Priest sounded really annoyed when they stopped fighting.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by KidGoku>3 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:16 am

The biggest - thing I could say was I wish Goku had landed a couple hits on Jiren. I didn't like that Jiren was barely phased even then. Because such a fantastic transformation deserved some Goku laying the smack on Jiren even if it was temp. Other than that can't stand Brienne, hope she gets eliminated fast. Seems like Vegeta will make sure of that. Speaking about Vegeta, the writers need to move on from the old Vegeta. They still write him like during the Freeza saga. He's moved on, he's different. He's good now. Such a Vegeta would never pass on lending his energy for such a cause. He would've probably donated his energy even before the Freeza saga for the cause. I didn't like that part. Freeza should've been the one passing on as he is inherently evil. Vegeta would never pass on helping out, especially now.

Other than that....FANTASTIC EPISODE mainly because of Goku and his transformation. Legit by far my fav transformation ever. Love at first sight. I thought that SSJ4 was my fav transformation ever but this one, easily surpassed it. The black, silver beast like eyes, his attitude, aura....SEXY, BEASTLY, OTHERWORLDLY. I'm dying to see him again in this form, this time really kicking @ss. Finally the serious Goku. He was such a badass. What a character. Perfection.

I hope this form is unique to Goku. Please don't pass it around to Gohan, Vegeta like they did with SSJ1, SSB etc. Then the transformations lose their meaning to me. Give Vegeta a new form unique to him if you have to, same for others. I like when a move is unique to an individual. Same with transformations. I know it must be hell to do so many different ones for everyone but please do Toei, use it in spurts but so.

Did I say how awesome Goku's new form is ? So sexy it makes me reconsider my sexuality. I never been this thirsty.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by gohan_black » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:13 am

anyone else noticed that for the first time they used music that was exclusive to the turnks arc untill now.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by SansrivaaL » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:24 am

MaskedRider wrote:Ya' know, after Champa yelled at his team to keep on fighting and the Grand Priest reaffirmed that the contestants should be fighting really drove home the "we're just pawns" narrative Goku talked about in the tournament with universe six. I hope something comes out of that because the Grand Priest sounded really annoyed when they stopped fighting.
Patience my friend, sooner or later Goku's bout to lay the smackdown on their asses.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:28 am

SansrivaaL wrote:
MaskedRider wrote:Ya' know, after Champa yelled at his team to keep on fighting and the Grand Priest reaffirmed that the contestants should be fighting really drove home the "we're just pawns" narrative Goku talked about in the tournament with universe six. I hope something comes out of that because the Grand Priest sounded really annoyed when they stopped fighting.
Patience my friend, sooner or later Goku's bout to lay the smackdown on their asses.
He very well could, given that this is the power that all gods fear.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by BlueBasilisk » Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:14 am

MaskedRider wrote:Ya' know, after Champa yelled at his team to keep on fighting and the Grand Priest reaffirmed that the contestants should be fighting really drove home the "we're just pawns" narrative Goku talked about in the tournament with universe six. I hope something comes out of that because the Grand Priest sounded really annoyed when they stopped fighting.
This could lend some weight to the idea that an outside villain might pop up and everyone will join forces to fight them off. Everyone was moving toward Jiren after he seemed to have killed Goku. A real "you just came to the wrong neighborhood" moment. :lol:

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Olympian » Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:19 am

TheOne wrote:
Are you really trying to fight me on this?
I wouldn`t need to.
TheOne wrote:Krillin took 7 years off from fighting after the cell games. Barely fought in the Buu Saga, and retired from fighting again. He just recently became active and all of a sudden he's a powerhouse? Not likely. The same thing for Roshi.
You`re trying to think rationally over something that we`ve seen happen before. When Raditz came ver, how many years there was of peace? Three? Five? Didn`t you have Roshi even claim Goku looked a bit weaker for having been more a father than a fighter in those years?

Look the massive gains Goku got after he dies with Kai. Look the fast gains all the others made with God in less than a year. From Cell to Buu you had the same happen to Gohan. All it took was one power unlock and he skyrockets. Want more powerups outtanowehereTM? In those seven years of peace Vegita seemingly trains hard but it`s still not as powerful (not even an equal) than someone who was dead and got a new form out for himself but this pales in comparison with two children getting SuperSaiyan at respectively seven and eight years old, despite not having any of the fighting pedigree of the older cast or the experience someone like Gohan had to endure to become one. Just poof! There it was.

This is what comes down to a main cast mostly composed of prodigies. Kuririn`s training showed improvement and sparring on a level that is clearly higher than anything he showed in the Buu saga, Roshi was flat out mention to have been secretely training and be more powerful than he`s ever been, #17 went from failing to fend off Cell to also evenly spar with GokuBlue, Chiatzu went from being unable to imobilize Nappa the slighetest to being able to hold current base Goku and gag as it may, Yamcha went from being mistaken for Namek + gains Goku to a guy that survives attacks and kicks from Gods of Destruction and is able to strongly pat Beerus in the back. I`m not even mentioning current Freeza but remember how the 2008 movie was about how a new villain showing up with the level of the old Freeza didn`t scare the cast anymore? Look how many drew the lot with a wish to to fight him.

They very much obviously are all more powerful. That`s a staple in the manga, the main cast trails behind Goku to varying degrees.
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Yamcha + Roshi = Yamoshi

Coincidence? I think not

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Pluto » Tue Oct 10, 2017 1:37 pm

waku waku, toki toki, definitely.

nothing beats my relationship with DB, but there is this tiny issue that i have with it, sometimes.

die hard fans will know the right word for it, art or animation, i am not sure, this bugs the shit out of me, it just puts DB way too much in the generic anime world.
most of you watch probably all the stuff out there, or at least watch it to have it on your list of stuff you like, so you may feel a bit offended by my parallels, but i just cant get much ahold of the "generic anime".

here's what i mean by generic, those body positioning stands, it's what one find in many other anime, very unnatural shaped standings.

i gave everything a try, naruto, bleach, vampire this, vampire that, the guy that never splits in two pieces (pun intended), just not my cup of tea.

i just like my DB to be what it is, an island in imagination, an unreachable and unmatchable fantasy, something that needs no reference from other peers, and it saddens me that the rotational work of directors/animators/whatevers use reference outside of DB's originality.

---

outside of that, some epic evolving happening, i am not sure about you guys, but Beerus was about to burst in tears if the ape didnt come back, and whis was hyped happy as my 2y old kid. and that genkidama collapse in to a black-hole like sphere...

that bribribritch is annoying, sorry. and so are jirens feet...dont skip feet day.
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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Olympian » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:18 pm

There`s better Manga/Anime for me but that is neither here or there, Dragonball is significantly important and a vintage classic that gets better with age *sniffs air*
Ki Breaker wrote:

Yamcha + Roshi = Yamoshi

Coincidence? I think not

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by KidGoku>3 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:30 pm

So Ultra Instinct is just a skill right ?
Goku's silver eyes, slit pupil, blackish hair with grey tints, aura are not part of Ultra Instinct but rather his new limit breaker transformation right ? Not ultra instinct ?
Is it fair to say there are 2 different things at play here ? Combined ?

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Nero<>Akira » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:38 pm

Nickolaidas wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:The only real hiccup in that episode was Vegeta not giving energy for the Genki Dama. What was up with that? I can only hope this was done intentionally for an energy conserving purpose on Vegeta's end that he will elaborate on later. As of now, it was a little out of character for Vegeta to act like that.
I'm wondering if they did it to validate him having enough power to kick Ribrianne away, but as the same time this would imply that all power-donators are now at minimum strength, and I'm pretty sure that ain't the case.

OR, maybe they had Vegeta reject the donation to seem like an ass, but then redeem himself by shielding Goku from the Love Heroine (making the audience go 'there, see? He's still a hero!') Not sure.
Vegeta never even donated for the spirit bomb against boo. he came up with the idea sure but he didn't give any energy himself. i thought it was stupid at first but then saved goku from ribrianne. it did seem just out of pride but he isn't stupid either.
Zamasu is the best DB villain besides Freeza (and this is only the case because the current Super arc elevated Freeza to be that good).

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Tue Oct 10, 2017 2:40 pm

KidGoku>3 wrote:So Ultra Instinct is just a skill right ?
Goku's silver eyes, slit pupil, blackish hair with grey tints, aura are not part of Ultra Instinct but rather his new limit breaker transformation right ? Not ultra instinct ?
Is it fair to say there are 2 different things at play here ? Combined ?
It's hard to say for sure. The Ultra Instinct itself is the thing that's feared by all the gods, for they have yet to master it and it's apparently an extremely advanced and effective martial arts technique.

However, the episodes also make it clear that besides that, nobody knows what else is going on with Goku. We might get clarification on this later, depending on where the story takes us with this new evolution of Goku. For now, let's just assume that this is mostly the Ultra Instinct at work here until we learn more in the coming episodes.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by HeroR » Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:27 pm

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
KidGoku>3 wrote:So Ultra Instinct is just a skill right ?
Goku's silver eyes, slit pupil, blackish hair with grey tints, aura are not part of Ultra Instinct but rather his new limit breaker transformation right ? Not ultra instinct ?
Is it fair to say there are 2 different things at play here ? Combined ?
It's hard to say for sure. The Ultra Instinct itself is the thing that's feared by all the gods, for they have yet to master it and it's apparently an extremely advanced and effective martial arts technique.

However, the episodes also make it clear that besides that, nobody knows what else is going on with Goku. We might get clarification on this later, depending on where the story takes us with this new evolution of Goku. For now, let's just assume that this is mostly the Ultra Instinct at work here until we learn more in the coming episodes.
I think the form gave Goku UI, not that UI is the form since it was noted by 17 and Piccolo that Goku’s speed and power drastically increased along with his odd movements. UI can explained a speed increase, but not the power since Blue/Kaioken x20 did crap to Jiren while Goku’s new form grazed him and even winded him.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:32 pm

HeroR wrote:
PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
KidGoku>3 wrote:So Ultra Instinct is just a skill right ?
Goku's silver eyes, slit pupil, blackish hair with grey tints, aura are not part of Ultra Instinct but rather his new limit breaker transformation right ? Not ultra instinct ?
Is it fair to say there are 2 different things at play here ? Combined ?
It's hard to say for sure. The Ultra Instinct itself is the thing that's feared by all the gods, for they have yet to master it and it's apparently an extremely advanced and effective martial arts technique.

However, the episodes also make it clear that besides that, nobody knows what else is going on with Goku. We might get clarification on this later, depending on where the story takes us with this new evolution of Goku. For now, let's just assume that this is mostly the Ultra Instinct at work here until we learn more in the coming episodes.
I think the form gave Goku UI, not that UI is the form since it was noted by 17 and Piccolo that Goku’s speed and power drastically increased along with his odd movements. UI can explained a speed increase, but not the power since Blue/Kaioken x20 did crap to Jiren while Goku’s new form grazed him and even winded him.
Well, the Ultra Instinct is the movement of the body without any input from the mind. Whis also taught Goku and Vegeta to raise their Ki only when they attack to maximize their power when striking. It's possible that the Ultra Instinct could take this to the extreme by autonomously putting all of a user's power into each singular strike, thus allowing him/her to do damage to just about anyone, given that the energy would be so focused. In fact, I'm gonna post this on the Ultra Instinct thread I posted.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by HeroR » Tue Oct 10, 2017 3:38 pm

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote: Well, the Ultra Instinct is the movement of the body without any input from the mind. Whis also taught Goku and Vegeta to raise their Ki only when they attack to maximize their power when striking. It's possible that the Ultra Instinct could take this to the extreme by autonomously putting all of a user's power into each singular strike, thus allowing him/her to do damage to just about anyone, given that the energy would be so focused. In fact, I'm gonna post this on the Ultra Instinct thread I posted.
Not likely since no one noted that Goku’s power goes up when he’s attacking. They said that Goku in general got vastly stronger and faster. In fact, when Goku attacked Jiren, Gohan said that more than Goku’s speed went up, so there’s a noticeable speed boost along with UI.

It was also noted that Goku grew stronger as he fought.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Pluto » Tue Oct 10, 2017 4:27 pm

Nero<>Akira wrote:
Nickolaidas wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:The only real hiccup in that episode was Vegeta not giving energy for the Genki Dama. What was up with that? I can only hope this was done intentionally for an energy conserving purpose on Vegeta's end that he will elaborate on later. As of now, it was a little out of character for Vegeta to act like that.
I'm wondering if they did it to validate him having enough power to kick Ribrianne away, but as the same time this would imply that all power-donators are now at minimum strength, and I'm pretty sure that ain't the case.

OR, maybe they had Vegeta reject the donation to seem like an ass, but then redeem himself by shielding Goku from the Love Heroine (making the audience go 'there, see? He's still a hero!') Not sure.
Vegeta never even donated for the spirit bomb against boo. he came up with the idea sure but he didn't give any energy himself. i thought it was stupid at first but then saved goku from ribrianne. it did seem just out of pride but he isn't stupid either.
That Genkidama wouldve been a lot stronger if that guy raised his hand, probably saw Frieza doing it and got all jealous...
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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by KidGoku>3 » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:00 pm

Well UI is a skill. Like Whis said mind without mind fighting without thinking. It's not a visual effect. It's changing the WAY you fight not the way you look.
Goku looks vastly different from any other transformation. So UI is definately NOT a transformation. It's a skll you attain in whatever form you are. A skill that can be amplified with the form you are in but not related to a form. When Whis taught him this lesson about fighting without thinking Whis never knew about this transformation all he knew was SSB/SSG and based on that he said it was attainable for them.

I think people get confused and think UI is the form. When it's a skill, accompanied with a new form.

I really am not a big fan of the blue transformation aka SSB so I hope this new form is here to stay for a while. Cause it is legit the best transformation ever, bar none.
And I don't even think this is his full transformation, it's like he tapped into a small % of what its capable of. We've yet to see his slit pupils, or spiky hair or the more present vivid aura. That mastered form combined with the UI skill is going to be so lit. This is like a small taste of what is coming. Hopefully the wait won't be too long.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by BlueBasilisk » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:22 pm

Someone on the DBZ subreddit pointed out this really quick frame in the NEP:
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Looks like Jiren's not so invincible after all. Right after this he goes into a backflip and goes sliding through some rocks.

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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Telamon » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:30 pm

BlueBasilisk wrote:Someone on the DBZ subreddit pointed out this really quick frame in the NEP:
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Looks like Jiren's not so invincible after all. Right after this he goes into a backflip and goes sliding through some rocks.
Hmm, interesting. Bit silly as Hit seemed to have some trouble against the cat guy but is actually able to land a hit on Jiren.
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Re: Super Episode 109-110 (8 October 2017)

Post by Asura » Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:30 pm

BlueBasilisk wrote:Someone on the DBZ subreddit pointed out this really quick frame in the NEP:
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Looks like Jiren's not so invincible after all. Right after this he goes into a backflip and goes sliding through some rocks.
Queue people causing a shitstorm over Hit > UI Goku.

I think it does make sense though. Goku fought Jiren with brute strength, he didn't have any special techniques or tricks up his sleeve aside from the Spirit Bomb, and all Kaioken did was make him more powerful. In contrast, Hit is a very technical character with a unique fighting style that Jiren will probably have a little difficulty at first getting used to in addition to Hit's ability to constantly evolve and get stronger as he fights, but I fully expect Jiren to get the hang of Hit's techniques down and then curb-stomp him.

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