Could Black have obtained Ultra Instinct?

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Lord Frieza
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Could Black have obtained Ultra Instinct?

Post by Lord Frieza » Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:47 pm

Ok so Goku has taken sins of mortals to new hights by not only gaining rivalling the power of the gods and gaining god ki but also gained a godly technique that even gods struggle to master. So as the title says could Black have done this?

Due to the nature of what Zamasu is trying to do, none is going to knowingly teach him. So lets say for "concept connivance" he finds some old godly scrolls about the Ultra Instinct and decides to work towards it.

ToshioWrites
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Re: Could Black have obtained Ultra Instinct?

Post by ToshioWrites » Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:00 pm

Yes

1. Zamasu took over the body of Goku a year ahead of Goku from when Trunks asked for help which meant the body he took had the muscle memory of Whis training

2. Goku accidentally got UI. He didn't achieve it during his training, he got pushed into a corner and broke through his shell, it's possible Goku Black could have been pushed that far and achieved it as well

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SupremeKai25
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Re: Could Black have obtained Ultra Instinct?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:29 am

Anyone can obtain Ultra Instinct. The technique is not limited to Saiyans (in that case, it wouldn't be a problem for Black, since he might have the soul of a Supreme Kai, but his body is still Saiyan). But, for example, even Future Zamasu could have reached Ultra Instinct, since it's a technique several Supreme Kais aspire to obtain. The same goes for Fused Zamasu, who was a Shinjin - Saiyan hybrid, actually.

However, it is important to note that it takes time and a lot of training to reach Ultra Instinct, and the duo didn't have a lot of time to train because they had a Multiverse to rebuild in their image. Although, as mentioned above, Goku achieved this form after he was cornered and finished. So perhaps Black could've also achieved this if all hope had been lost and he was cornered, which is quite interesting. I mean, when he was cornered by Vegeta, he was able to break through his limits thanks to the power of his anger and expanded his power to no end - a power that managed to transcend time and space. Black always unleashed his best when he was surrounded and cornered by his enemies. He thrived in those situations.

I also assume Zamasu knew about Ultra Instinct, since he was a natural prodigy in the field of comabat and considered a genius even amongst the Supreme Kais! He, - who was a mere apprentice -, was already praised as a genius by the Supreme Kais! That's astonishing! So he should know what Ultra Instinct is, since it's pretty common knowledge among the Gods.

According to Whis, Goku accomplished this by breaking the "shell" (his utmost limits to be exact) to his deeper potential, after his willpower collides with the Universe 7's Spirit Bomb. So Black's willpower would also need something very powerful (like U7's Spirit Bomb) to collide with, i assume.

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Re: Could Black have obtained Ultra Instinct?

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 2:14 pm

I was thinking of making a thread of this subject eventually.

Unpopular opinion, but no, I don't necessarily think so. At least, not nearly as easily as Goku obtained it. I believe that if Goku Black were cornered just like Goku was against Jiren, he'd definitely get a lot stronger, but I don't think it would result in Ultra Instinct. The form itself appears to be based on the real-life mental state known as Mushin, a state of complete mental clarity where the mind is expanded through the whole body with total awareness of and focus on everything and lets the body take charge with intuitive and spontaneous action.

Per Whis, it is extremely difficult for fighters in the DB Multiverse to get their own original bodies to "move on their own". There are those who have trained their minds and bodies extensively with the mental and physical training that martial arts and time bring, yet still haven't achieved the form. Thus, I think it would be even more difficult for Zamasu to get Goku's body to move on its own because it's not his own body, and not to mention if Goku's body moves in a way that Zamasu doesn't want it to move, it'll cause a lot of mental interference. While I acknowledge that Ultra Instinct is not a Saiyan-exclusive transformation, I believe this also harkens back Vegeta's statement to Goku Black as the former was beating the latter up, which was that only Goku can truly use his body to its fullest potential. I understand that Vegeta referred to Saiyan cells as well, but it also makes sense that the "fullest potential" could quite possibly be the "breaking of the shell" that Ultra Instinct introduces.

Therefore, per my personal analysis of Whis' and Vegeta's statements, if it's nearly impossible for one to get their own body to move at its own accord, break its limits and be used to its fullest potential, then it would be impossible for one person to get another person's body to instinctively move the way they want it to move. But of course, there's no way of knowing that any of this is true, so I don't completely rule out Black being able to hypothetically gain Ultra Instinct, but I still stand by the fact that it would be much more difficult for him to achieve and that it would require even more mind and body syncing and training than one attempting to obtain it with their own body.

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