Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby ekrolo2 » Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:29 pm

Kuwabara wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:Z didn't have Goku power down then power back up in every single episode with every transformation back into it again being all "ER MAH GURD! ITS SUPAR SAIYADJIN!" the way every single episode the Survival Arc has done. Seriously, they do it almost every single time, they are completely unself aware of the fact Blue is not that special or a big deal any more yet they keep treating every time it shows back up as a big deal.


Super Saiyan stopped being a big deal too, look at Goten and Trunks in the Buu arc. What do you want, for all the Saiyans to stay in base? You could just close your eyes any time Gohan's not on screen.

Erm, what? My point is that they pointlessly power down just so the series can shout "ER MAH GURD! ITS BLUE/ULTIMATE GOLDEN FURIZA!!" over and over again as if they're still special or awe inspiring when they're not. Imagine if during the Cell fight, Goku either powered down SS or back to Base for no reason only so he can have a "spectacular" power up back to his SS forms full power, it would be beyond obnoxious and that's what they keep doing with Blue, Ultimate and Golden Freeza.
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Asura » Sun Dec 24, 2017 8:30 pm

Cell is just one enemy though. This tournament had tons of people in it, and having the Saiyans and Freeza transform is a way of signifying how powerful an enemy is.

This is why you don't see Gohan using his Ultimate form 24/7 so they can show different power tiers.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Kuwabara » Sun Dec 24, 2017 9:37 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:Erm, what? My point is that they pointlessly power down just so the series can shout "ER MAH GURD! ITS BLUE/ULTIMATE GOLDEN FURIZA!!" over and over again as if they're still special or awe inspiring when they're not. Imagine if during the Cell fight, Goku either powered down SS or back to Base for no reason only so he can have a "spectacular" power up back to his SS forms full power, it would be beyond obnoxious and that's what they keep doing with Blue, Ultimate and Golden Freeza.

It isn't pointless, they power down to conserve energy, transforming for more power as needed. Look, I get your point but disagree with this being such an obnoxious occurrence. The transformations last all of five or ten seconds at a time.
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Zillamon51 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:30 am

They should have given 18 a Cell flashback.

Since killing is a DQ offense, I wonder if Aniraza would have absorbed 18, and gotten even stronger, if he ate her.

I'm sure Vegeta landing hits on Jiren is giving some fans conniptions. Maybe Jiren is sandbagging it, only to turn around at the end and smack Vegeta down effortlessly. (Loved the callback to Cell underestimating the Final Flash, only to be like Oh shit, this is dangerous.)
Or maybe Vegeta really is performing far beyond his limits, which is a path to Ultra Instinct....
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby gofishus » Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:17 am

Zillamon51 wrote:They should have given 18 a Cell flashback.

Since killing is a DQ offense, I wonder if Aniraza would have absorbed 18, and gotten even stronger, if he ate her.

I'm sure Vegeta landing hits on Jiren is giving some fans conniptions. Maybe Jiren is sandbagging it, only to turn around at the end and smack Vegeta down effortlessly. (Loved the callback to Cell underestimating the Final Flash, only to be like Oh shit, this is dangerous.)
Or maybe Vegeta really is performing far beyond his limits, which is a path to Ultra Instinct....


not the first time we've seen Vegeta punch above his weight. see: SSJ2 Vegeta actually making Beerus sweat a little whereas SSJ3 Goku did nothing

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Arg » Mon Dec 25, 2017 6:15 am

Asura wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:I love this shot:



I like the layout and the idea of the shot, but the art itself looks pretty bad. A shot like that should have had some great, memorable art and instead it's just... bleh.


Also two things that bothered me this episode were...

1. Freeza's golden transformation animation reused AGAIN


They really wasted a golden opportunity to make that shot one of the more memorable ones by slipping in the art department. The golden transformation was already bothersome the first time they reused it... a really cheap cop out, would have preffered if they just animated his power up the same way they did everyone elses.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby ekrolo2 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:57 am

Kuwabara wrote:
ekrolo2 wrote:Erm, what? My point is that they pointlessly power down just so the series can shout "ER MAH GURD! ITS BLUE/ULTIMATE GOLDEN FURIZA!!" over and over again as if they're still special or awe inspiring when they're not. Imagine if during the Cell fight, Goku either powered down SS or back to Base for no reason only so he can have a "spectacular" power up back to his SS forms full power, it would be beyond obnoxious and that's what they keep doing with Blue, Ultimate and Golden Freeza.

It isn't pointless, they power down to conserve energy, transforming for more power as needed. Look, I get your point but disagree with this being such an obnoxious occurrence. The transformations last all of five or ten seconds at a time.

Ye, Ultimate doesn't take any more power then Base, it's designed as a critique of SS3s massive power boost but terrible stamina drain, Ultimate doesn't have the former, Gohan powering down from it doesn't conserve any power, it's just there for spectacle. Goku and Vegeta have, at the very least masteted SS1 to where they can stay in it for days at a time with negligible drain so once again, powering down is just there so we can Z movie every episode by having people pointlessly hold back just for a "big" power up moment.
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby King Jacku » Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:22 am

Does this Ep mark the first time that present 17 and Gohan have interacted with each other in Dragonball? I swear, during the recruitment arc, it didn't even seem like 17 knew who he was.

Also, I find it kinda weird how everyone listens to Gohan now, I guess he had to earn their respect. 17 was even looking at Gohan waiting for the signal to attack... Such a contrast to their future counterparts :lol:

Awesome episode btw, loved the team work, and 17 was sick at the end.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Slaythe » Mon Dec 25, 2017 9:03 am

I hope we get 17 and Gohan together vs Toppo !!!

Reverse Future of Trunks !! :lol:

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Polyphase Avatron » Mon Dec 25, 2017 9:43 am

Since it seems like the mods aren't going to make an official thread for this episode, I might as well post my thoughts on it here:

- The sub here spells it as "Anilaza", I know the r and l problem with Japanese but which one is it really intended to be?
- I know I keep harping on this, but with their universe on the line you'd figure at least some of the more pragmatic fighters like Gohan, 17, or 18 would try attacking before the transformation is complete...
- The deep guitar riffs here remind me of some of the movie scores... I wonder if that was intentional?
- I'll reiterate that I do like Aniraza's design
- Jiren doesn't look impressed...
- Is Universe 3's Kaioshin implying that this fusion was never tested before?
- Well yeah, Dypso, it wouldn't exactly make much sense for it to ignore your team. It's just focusing on Universe 7 first (like all of them do).
- Odd, the arena floor looks like it was burnt/melted by Vegeta's attack there. We haven't seen that before in the tournament (that I recall).
- The heavy footfalls are definitely a nice touch
- Sensing the presence and locations of 5 enemies at once is really something so extraordinary?
- Echolocation is faster than ki sensing? And if they were moving faster than the speed of sound, that wouldn't even work. Toei writing again makes no sense.
- And here comes the Janemba attack. You know, I always wondered if he could open those portals inside of people... but then again, killing isn't allowed here
- I'm not even going to question the mechanics of Freeza moving at super speed and stopping instantly in mid-air to kick Goku when flight isn't allowed...
- I wonder if they're ever going to tie Freeza's 'my X moved on its own' joke to Ultra Instinct...
- What does Freeza mean when he says he needs Goku because he's already dead? Does he think he could win the tournament without him if he were alive?
- What does it intend to do by catching you? I don't know, maybe throw you off the edge? Makes the most sense
- No, apparently it's going to eat them instead. Weird. And 18 doesn't even do anything to try to stop it. Fire a ki blast into its mouth at least.
- Well there goes the last female fighter in the tournament. It's a sausagefest from now on.
- Okay, I get that you're allowed to fly if you have wings, but you should at least have to flap them...
- Reusing Freeza's same transformation sequence is kind of cheap IMO
- I think I've complained about this before, but using the Ultimate Battle theme for anything other than Ultra Instinct kind of cheapens it
- I also would have preferred Freeza to use something other than a death beam here, perhaps a death ball of his own to counter Aniraza's. It just doesn't really give the feeling that he's giving it his all when he's only using one finger, even if it is his signature attack
- Is Goku still too exhausted to use Kaio-ken again? Because now would be a good time...
- I notice that 17 stopping his attack isn't really causing the team to be pushed back any faster... I guess he wasn't contributing that much
- Going through the sphere like that was a pretty damn cool move
- I also like how they're taking 17's forcefield, which was just a one-off technique in the original manga and anime, and developing it into a multi-purpose fighting style (including both here and what he did to Damon)
- Okay, I have to say that was a pretty awesome battle
- So if Mosco can talk normally in his real form why does he talk in beeps in his robot suit?
- Are they saying Aniraza would have won if its reactor hadn't been damaged?
- Wait, Universe 7 led by Goku? I thought Gohan was the team leader? And Toppo was the leader of Team Universe 11?

This was the best episode in a while IMO

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby NeoKING » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:40 am

Polyphase Avatron wrote:Since it seems like the mods aren't going to make an official thread for this episode, I might as well post my thoughts on it here:

- The sub here spells it as "Anilaza", I know the r and l problem with Japanese but which one is it really intended to be?


His name is a pun on "Lasagna" so it is supposed to be an "L."

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Hugo Boss » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:42 pm

Polyphase Avatron wrote:Since it seems like the mods aren't going to make an official thread for this episode, I might as well post my thoughts on it here:

- Is Universe 3's Kaioshin implying that this fusion was never tested before?
- What does Freeza mean when he says he needs Goku because he's already dead? Does he think he could win the tournament without him if he were alive?
- Is Goku still too exhausted to use Kaio-ken again? Because now would be a good time...
- I notice that 17 stopping his attack isn't really causing the team to be pushed back any faster... I guess he wasn't contributing that much
- Are they saying Aniraza would have won if its reactor hadn't been damaged?
- Wait, Universe 7 led by Goku? I thought Gohan was the team leader? And Toppo was the leader of Team Universe 11?

- I think so. Paparonni also implied it was life-risking.
- Freeza needs Goku to beat Jiren, so when everyone is tired I think he will try to be the only remaining warrior and get the Super Dragon Balls.
- Goku is possibly thinking that saving energy to fight Jiren is the best even if they risk themselves. He used kaioken against that black hole combo though.
- I noticed that, but perhaps it wouldn’t make much difference.
- I had the impression they weren’t pushing at full power and decided to rely on 17’s plan before doing that final push.
- That bugged me as well. Maybe that comes from the idea that Goku is the emotional support of the team. Same for Jiren. The real leaders aren’t representing that much.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby TheDipDap1234 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:55 pm

Slaythe wrote:I hope we get 17 and Gohan together vs Toppo !!!

Reverse Future of Trunks !! :lol:


18 also being there would make it a lot better for obvious reasons
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby IndieBooToo » Mon Dec 25, 2017 3:38 pm

Cool episode. 17 was based af and needs to win the tournament if not Frieza but we know it's gonna be Goku.



Also lol I can't believe people are taking the NEP of Vegeta barely getting a hit or two on a heavily suppressed Jiren takes this as Vegeta being stronger than SSBKKx20 Goku. 1. He's working with Goku to take on Jiren while Goku and Hit had to fight him one on one. 2. Jiren barely even look phased at all from any of those hits and is literally just holding back.

Jiren will power up a little more near the end after Vegeta's Final Flash does nothing to him and then proceed to destroy Vegeta until Goku awakens UI again in 123 so he could take on a more serious Jiren. Once Vegeta is eliminated then we'll have the real fight begin.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Gig » Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:20 pm

I am a bit confused about 2 things:
- If the flying monster would have destroyed the whole arena, also U11 would have lost. Why didn't they do something?
- Why eating an enemy? If you kill him, you are disqualified. If you don't kill him, he may attack you from inside. And you will have to extract it from your body in some way because he will still bw counted "in" unless you toss him! Just grab him, bring him to the edge and toss him down...

However I liked the episode. The monster might have used the warp punches longer...

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Torturephile » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:40 pm

Gig wrote:- Why eating an enemy? If you kill him, you are disqualified. If you don't kill him, he may attack you from inside. And you will have to extract it from your body in some way because he will still bw counted "in" unless you toss him! Just grab him, bring him to the edge and toss him down...

Probably to absorb its energy and purge it, preferably from the butt near the stage's edge for extra humiliation. Just a guess.
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby MrEmperorChampa » Tue Dec 26, 2017 2:01 am

Wow, this episode got quite a lot of praise than I thought. Not to say it was a bad episode, I mean look at the fantastic animation cuts and sequences, but this video explores quite a bit on what sours the episode and Super as a whole: https://youtu.be/Rxe8NF9sO30

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Supersaiyanbulla » Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:23 am

IndieBooToo wrote:Cool episode. 17 was based af and needs to win the tournament if not Frieza but we know it's gonna be Goku.



Also lol I can't believe people are taking the NEP of Vegeta barely getting a hit or two on a heavily suppressed Jiren takes this as Vegeta being stronger than SSBKKx20 Goku. 1. He's working with Goku to take on Jiren while Goku and Hit had to fight him one on one. 2. Jiren barely even look phased at all from any of those hits and is literally just holding back.

Jiren will power up a little more near the end after Vegeta's Final Flash does nothing to him and then proceed to destroy Vegeta until Goku awakens UI again in 123 so he could take on a more serious Jiren. Once Vegeta is eliminated then we'll have the real fight begin.

He’s not working with goku this is literally said to be Vegeta vs jiren not goku and Vegeta vs jiren and barely look phase wtf are you trolling
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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Freeza9000 » Tue Dec 26, 2017 3:44 am

MrEmperorChampa wrote:Wow, this episode got quite a lot of praise than I thought. Not to say it was a bad episode, I mean look at the fantastic animation cuts and sequences, but this video explores quite a bit on what sours the episode and Super as a whole: https://youtu.be/Rxe8NF9sO30

Just when the cancer in this fanbase continues to remain unneutralized. *Sigh*

What's honestly the appeal behind these kinds of videos? It's basically yet again another temperamental guy behind his screen uploading what he believes will be the most relevant rant in the DB society to WAKE UP THE SUPER FANBOYS in the most mundane way possible. Screaming and hissing redundantly at your computer screen with won't help get your point across. The fact that this guy has the audacity to bring up cognitive dissonance is astoundingly laughable.

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Re: Super Episode 121 (23 December 2017)

Postby Slaythe » Tue Dec 26, 2017 1:05 pm

TheDipDap1234 wrote:
Slaythe wrote:I hope we get 17 and Gohan together vs Toppo !!!

Reverse Future of Trunks !! :lol:


18 also being there would make it a lot better for obvious reasons


In the manga, 17 killed Gohan alone. So 18 wasn't needed.


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