Anyone else CAN’T wait for Goku to re-attain Ultra Instinct and fully master it?

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

Agreed. He shouldn’t unlock it now

I'll be the first to admit I want to see Ultra Instinct again badly, like a lot of fans (see, it honestly works that we don't see UI too much, it leaves us wanting more, which is personally what I think should have been the case with SSB, but whatever). But man, the idea of Goku mastering something that Gods haven't been able to do for possibly centuries in just 20ish minutes is... ridiculous, now that I think about it, and I'm someone that wants to see him master it. But then again, the main culprit at fault here is the idea that the tournament is only 48 minutes. I honestly don't understand why it couldn't have taken place over a certain amount of hours instead.

Don't get me wrong, the idea that Goku and Freeza's fight on Namek lasted 5 minutes is equally ridiculous, but I was a kid back then who wasn't putting as much thought into the show while seeing it as I do now. And I'll tell you the whole 48 minutes thing just bothers me in all honesty. Jiren, quite possibly the most powerful being we have ever seen actually fight seriously in Dragon Ball history thus far... might get defeated in only 5 minutes. Again, this is just as ridiculous as Freeza, the "Emperor of the Universe" being beaten in that amount of time too, but the fact that it's happening again now bothers me more.

So he should mastered the technique of the gods in a few hours? In the grand scheme of things, how is that different from a few minutes?

I didn't say that specifically, I just said I wish the tournament were hours long instead of minutes. Him mastering the technique gods can't do is still a ridiculous feat no matter how you look at it or how much time it takes, even if I wouldn't mind it happening in spite of said ridiculousness.

[HeroR]

I didn't say that specifically, I just said I wish the tournament were hours long instead of minutes. Him mastering the technique gods can't do is still a ridiculous feat no matter how you look at it or how much time it takes, even if I wouldn't mind it happening in spite of said ridiculousness.

Except the gods have never really special until Super introduced the Gods of Destruction. Remember, the Kaioken and the Spirit Bombs are god techniques, and the creator never learned to master them.

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

I didn't say that specifically, I just said I wish the tournament were hours long instead of minutes. Him mastering the technique gods can't do is still a ridiculous feat no matter how you look at it or how much time it takes, even if I wouldn't mind it happening in spite of said ridiculousness.

Except the gods have never really special until Super introduced the Gods of Destruction. Remember, the Kaioken and the Spirit Bombs are god techniques, and the creator never learned to master them.

I don't totally understand what you're saying here, but I still stand by the point that Goku mastering a technique/transformation/form or whatever that gods have difficulty attaining in the first place (unlike Kaioken or Genki Dama) is still no small feat. A ridiculous feat, but "ridiculous" doesn't necessarily have to have a negative connotation to it.

[HeroR]

I don't totally understand what you're saying here, but I still stand by the point that Goku mastering a technique/transformation/form or whatever that gods have difficulty attaining in the first place (unlike Kaioken or Genki Dama) is still no small feat. A ridiculous feat, but "ridiculous" doesn't necessarily have to have a negative connotation to it.

I am saying that Goku has learned techniques of the gods faster and better than the gods since Dragon Ball. So him learning UI in the grand scheme of things isn't that ridiculous. It only seems that way since fans put the Gods of Destruction on a higher tier than the gods in Dragon Ball and Z.

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

I don't totally understand what you're saying here, but I still stand by the point that Goku mastering a technique/transformation/form or whatever that gods have difficulty attaining in the first place (unlike Kaioken or Genki Dama) is still no small feat. A ridiculous feat, but "ridiculous" doesn't necessarily have to have a negative connotation to it.

I am saying that Goku has learned techniques of the gods faster and better than the gods since Dragon Ball. So him learning UI in the grand scheme of things isn't that ridiculous. It only seems that way since fans put the Gods of Destruction on a higher tier than the gods in Dragon Ball and Z.

Still no small feat. Agree to disagree.

So, you want to get rid of the form! That is a unpopular opinion you have sir or madam. I like that you have your own opinion, but it's not going to happen at all.

Uh, no

What do you want then for Ultra Instinct?

Sorry if I wasn't clear: What I want would be for Goku to use Ultra Instinct as much as possible, but what I also agree with is that if the form got spammed like SSB, it would lose its luster. But what I understand as well is that us fans would find a way to complain regardless , which is why I fully agree with your point that Super is in a weird spot. That's all.

[Lionel]

Not exactly. Ultra Instinct by itself is a breath of fresh air with a clever mechanics idea helping to separate it from previous power ups. Where I find myself rolling my eyes is Goku predictably reawakening and honing it with the peanut gallery fawning over him as he partakes in another budget saving fist flurry with Jiren. I get it -- he's the protagonist and this show makes it a priority to reassert the paramountcy of his fighting status. But that doesn't mean the vapid repetitiveness can't be criticised. I suppose his exposure to god standard of fighting made him liable to achieve it eventually -- that "genius" status of his probably came in handy with justifying his acquisition of Ultra Instinct. Now I'm wondering if Vegeta won't reach the same level or if they're going to keep him relegated to a much lower position of strength.

[Amir]

There is simply no reason that even makes a tiny bit of sense for Goku to master it, it already as that Ultra Dodge hax which is pretty OP and he got it by breaking his limits after surviving near Jiren experience, he himself doesn't even know how to access to that form, it would be the most contrive thing ever if he suddenly masters it before the TOP ends.

[Ki Breaker]

Goku's complete UI vs Jiren will be the best fight of super, It's worth waiting for!

I'm just so curious as to who the next villain would be.

King Piccolo

[majinwarman]

There is simply no reason that even makes a tiny bit of sense for Goku to master it, it already as that Ultra Dodge hax which is pretty OP and he got it by breaking his limits after surviving near Jiren experience, he himself doesn't even know how to access to that form, it would be the most contrive thing ever if he suddenly masters it before the TOP ends.

So, you don't want Goku to ever master Ultra Instinct due to it being OP.

[Lord Beerus]

I'm really conflicted. On one hand, Ultra Instinct is a form that has been foreshadowed since Super began, and part of me wants to see more of it. But at the same time, I'd rather have Ultra Instinct be a form that Goku doesn't master and kept as more of an ability that pops up every other arc to retain its mystique. I don't want Ultra Instinct to become just another form for Goku use at any convenience.

[HeroR]

I'm really conflicted. On one hand, Ultra Instinct is a form that has been foreshadowed since Super began, and part of me wants to see more of it. But at the same time, I'd rather have Ultra Instinct be a form that Goku doesn't master and kept as more of an ability that pops up every other arc to retain its mystique. I don't want Ultra Instinct to become just another form for Goku use at any convenience.

So you want it to be a Get Out of Jail Free card?

[Lord Beerus]

I'm really conflicted. On one hand, Ultra Instinct is a form that has been foreshadowed since Super began, and part of me wants to see more of it. But at the same time, I'd rather have Ultra Instinct be a form that Goku doesn't master and kept as more of an ability that pops up every other arc to retain its mystique. I don't want Ultra Instinct to become just another form for Goku use at any convenience.

So you want it to be a Get Out of Jail Free card?

Not per se. Have it be like a downplayed "Eleventh Hour Superpower" where he can only use to severely weaken an enemy but not completely defeat him/her/it.

[HeroR]

I'm really conflicted. On one hand, Ultra Instinct is a form that has been foreshadowed since Super began, and part of me wants to see more of it. But at the same time, I'd rather have Ultra Instinct be a form that Goku doesn't master and kept as more of an ability that pops up every other arc to retain its mystique. I don't want Ultra Instinct to become just another form for Goku use at any convenience.

So you want it to be a Get Out of Jail Free card?

Not per se. Have it be like a downplayed "Eleventh Hour Superpower" where he can only use to severely weaken an enemy but not completely defeat him/her/it.

Then what’s the point of the form if Goku isn’t even allowed to beat anyone with it? He could just keep Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan for that.

[Lord Beerus]

So you want it to be a Get Out of Jail Free card?

Not per se. Have it be like a downplayed "Eleventh Hour Superpower" where he can only use to severely weaken an enemy but not completely defeat him/her/it.

Then what’s the point of the form if Goku isn’t even allowed to beat anyone with it? He could just keep Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan for that.

It's real conundrum when you think about it. The show can't just act like Goku doesn't have the Ultra Instinct ability. But at the same time, how do you include the ability in future stories without turning into a "Instant Win" technique, all the while retaining the mystique of Ultra Instinct?

[Amir]

There is simply no reason that even makes a tiny bit of sense for Goku to master it, it already as that Ultra Dodge hax which is pretty OP and he got it by breaking his limits after surviving near Jiren experience, he himself doesn't even know how to access to that form, it would be the most contrive thing ever if he suddenly masters it before the TOP ends.

So, you don't want Goku to ever master Ultra Instinct due to it being OP.

No, please don't put words in my mouth. I want him to master it overtime in the next arc, like here he only got a taste of it's power and afterwards he'll train to master it.

I still want to see UI, but not in it's mastered state where Goku can just casually tap into it and also defend and attack without thinking.

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

I'm really conflicted. On one hand, Ultra Instinct is a form that has been foreshadowed since Super began, and part of me wants to see more of it. But at the same time, I'd rather have Ultra Instinct be a form that Goku doesn't master and kept as more of an ability that pops up every other arc to retain its mystique. I don't want Ultra Instinct to become just another form for Goku use at any convenience.

Exactly. Where I'm at right now.

[majinwarman]

There is simply no reason that even makes a tiny bit of sense for Goku to master it, it already as that Ultra Dodge hax which is pretty OP and he got it by breaking his limits after surviving near Jiren experience, he himself doesn't even know how to access to that form, it would be the most contrive thing ever if he suddenly masters it before the TOP ends.

So, you don't want Goku to ever master Ultra Instinct due to it being OP.

No, please don't put words in my mouth. I want him to master it overtime in the next arc, like here he only got a taste of it's power and afterwards he'll train to master it.

I still want to see UI, but not in it's mastered state where Goku can just casually tap into it and also defend and attack without thinking.

I understand what you're saying now. I can respect that you want Goku to take his time mastering Ultra Instinct. It could happen but it doesn't have much odds.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

A defence mechanism form can basically make them have their cake and eat it too as they like to draw tension out by Goku not going to his strongest form immediately. Like right now against Jiren if we knew he could use UI willingly but is still in SSGSS the fight is gonna not feel as good as it does currently because despite knowing he has a stronger form we know he can't access it.

[HeroR]

A defence mechanism form can basically make them have their cake and eat it too as they like to draw tension out by Goku not going to his strongest form immediately. Like right now against Jiren if we knew he could use UI willingly but is still in SSGSS the fight is gonna not feel as good as it does currently because despite knowing he has a stronger form we know he can't access it.

They can only do that for so long since that got old even in Naruto and comes off as 'plot' saving the character. I believed Bleach had the same problem with the Hallow form.

[omaro34]

Goku's complete UI vs Jiren will be the best fight of super, It's worth waiting for!

I'm just so curious as to who the next villain would be.

King Piccolo

LMAO.

With the recent news though no villain is coming unfortunately.