Why a next generation series should be a PRIORITY

[mecha3000]

Here is the biggest problem being a mentor: it would go against his entire character.

Goku did not train Uub to replace him, he trained Uub to fight him!!

According to EoZ, he intented both...

Yeah, exactly. I mean, obviously Goku had selfish motives, but Uub doesn't know that.

Regarding Goten and Trunks as part of the 'new gen', I feel that one of the more subtle messages of the final chapter is that the age of the fighter is setting. DB had always been filled with characters whose lives revolved around fighting, but most of those characters are either too old and have retired or not interest in pursuing a life like that. Gohan never wanted to be a full-time martial artist, Goten and Trunks were clearly in it more for the fun of it and lost interest in as they grew older (hence Vegeta's comments) Pan and Uub may be the only exception, in the sense that they wanted to show that the spirit the story was known for wasn't completely gone, but there was definitely a hint of melancholy to that last chapter with Vegeta and Goku (and Piccolo I guess) technically being the only real fighters left.

You make a good point when talking about the manga. Still, the anime added the whole bit of Goku telling Goten and Trunks to keep training - to which they eagerly agreed. So, there's some precedent for that story to be told.

While I understand many of the replies, I just feel like many of you need to give this idea a chance first. We don't know if it would be good or not. If it failed, I would happily join in on the criticism even though I'd also be disappointed about its failure. Still, the series is called DRAGON BALL, not GOKU GAIDEN (although that'd be a kickass title). And once again, GOKU WOULD STILL BE A PART OF THIS. Remember how Goku was out of commission for a lot of Z? Well, it's kind of a similar idea here.

And someone answer me this: Were many of you clamoring for a series set in the ten-year time period OR did you want a series set after Z? I bet you that despite the interest in the ten-year period, most of you wanted an AFTER Z. I know Z's ending is the perfect closure for Goku's character (even though GT did it better IMO), but it can also represent the perfect beginning for Uub's character.

[Totamo]

Here is the biggest problem being a mentor: it would go against his entire character.

Goku did not train Uub to replace him, he trained Uub to fight him!!

According to EoZ, he intented both...

Yeah, exactly. I mean, obviously Goku had selfish motives, but Uub doesn't know that.

Regarding Goten and Trunks as part of the 'new gen', I feel that one of the more subtle messages of the final chapter is that the age of the fighter is setting. DB had always been filled with characters whose lives revolved around fighting, but most of those characters are either too old and have retired or not interest in pursuing a life like that. Gohan never wanted to be a full-time martial artist, Goten and Trunks were clearly in it more for the fun of it and lost interest in as they grew older (hence Vegeta's comments) Pan and Uub may be the only exception, in the sense that they wanted to show that the spirit the story was known for wasn't completely gone, but there was definitely a hint of melancholy to that last chapter with Vegeta and Goku (and Piccolo I guess) technically being the only real fighters left.

You make a good point when talking about the manga. Still, the anime added the whole bit of Goku telling Goten and Trunks to keep training - to which they eagerly agreed. So, there's some precedent for that story to be told.

While I understand many of the replies, I just feel like many of you need to give this idea a chance first. We don't know if it would be good or not. If it failed, I would happily join in on the criticism even though I'd also be disappointed about its failure. Still, the series is called DRAGON BALL, not GOKU GAIDEN (although that'd be a kickass title). And once again, GOKU WOULD STILL BE A PART OF THIS. Remember how Goku was out of commission for a lot of Z? Well, it's kind of a similar idea here.

And someone answer me this: Were many of you clamoring for a series set in the ten-year time period OR did you want a series set after Z? I bet you that despite the interest in the ten-year period, most of you wanted an AFTER Z.

Look, we already basically had a next gen and it was called GT. It focused on Trunks and Pan.



You know how it was received.

[mecha3000]

Look, we already basically had a next gen and it was called GT. It focused on Trunks and Pan.



You know how it was received.

Yeah, the whole GT argument is kind of getting redundant as if to say, stories can't evolve. I like how I wrote out so many points with my first post and most replies are just "GT happened, so I disagree" OR "DB is Goku's story and no one else's". However, I simply cannot change the way people feel and I honestly do respect all your opinions on this. Still, we'll just have to what Toei/Toriyama choose to possibly do next.

[Michsi]

You make a good point when talking about the manga. Still, the anime added the whole bit of Goku telling Goten and Trunks to keep training - to which they eagerly agreed. So, there's some precedent for that story to be told.

While I understand many of the replies, I just feel like many of you need to give this idea a chance first. We don't know if it would be good or not. If it failed, I would happily join in on the criticism even though I'd also be disappointed about its failure. Still, the series is called DRAGON BALL, not GOKU GAIDEN (although that'd be a kickass title). And once again, GOKU WOULD STILL BE A PART OF THIS. Remember how Goku was out of commission for a lot of Z? Well, it's kind of a similar idea here.

And someone answer me this: Were many of you clamoring for a series set in the ten-year time period OR did you want a series set after Z? I bet you that despite the interest in the ten-year period, most of you wanted an AFTER Z. I know Z's ending is the perfect closure for Goku's character (even though GT did it better IMO), but it can also represent the perfect beginning for Uub's character.

I have always been an adherent of the idea that you can make a good story out of anything. You could even make a story centered around Oolong be good.
It all comes down to execution. However, there are things people want and things people don't want. In order to sell something that the majority doesn't want, you need to make that thing exceptionally good. So yes, in theory, you could make a great story with the next gen and have that be successful, but the odds are against you. Anime is expensive, so they can't just assign money to any idea; Toei has production issues, so chances of a hypothetical next gen having the quality needed to convince people to stick around are very low; recent story ideas have been mostly a miss with the audience, so I can't see them giving the new kids a story that will woo the fans. Basically, it's the fandom's fondness for the characters that keeps them tethered to the show, and if you lose that without compensating heavily in other areas, you'll probably end up with a flop.

As for your question: I am very happy they chose to focus on this time period, because I still want to see Krillin, Bulma and the other humans be a part of it all, however small it may be. Krillin with grey hair just makes me sad. The only reason I would've wanted it all to be set after Z was to go a different direction than what GT did. We already know Toriyama has his own version of what happens after Z, so it's not like GT would've been the biggest wall in their way.

[Bullza]

I agree. Uub, Pan, Goten, and Trunks deserve to be main characters with Gohan, Vegeta , Piccolo and Goku taking mentor roles.

The series would die a very quick death if they ever did something like that.

Half the reason that GT sucked was because main characters like Gohan, Vegeta and Piccolo hardly had any role and instead the obnoxious Pan and the boring Trunks were main characters. Even then that still at least Goku.

No a series without those characters as the main characters would never work.

[precita]

Why do you say that when we've never seen it before? You have no idea how a series with Pan, Uub, Trunks, Goten in a more prominent role would go. People need to get GT or their fanfiction theories out of their minds.

[ulisa]

I apparently am an odd one out as I always considered Gohan as part of the “next generation” despite the huge gap in age. So id count him as an older warrior/teacher to the younger ones but still capable of learning himself. I tend to think you would have to “ease” people into a next generation show though I think it could work eventually. Maybe start with a transition period where old characters have equal spotlight then gradually shift them into more “mentor” roles but allow them strong “guest spots” occasionally.

[Kaio_Krazy]

If they actually do this, then that's neat I guess, but I just can't drum up any excitement within myself for it. Goten and kid Trunks are some of my most despised characters, so them being center stage, grown up or not, doesn't appeal to me. Pan and Uub don't mean anything, because we've seen so little of them, so they might as well be new characters.

One thing I never see brought up on this topic, is why the whole "next gen" thing was set up in the first place. Toriyama was ending the series, so there was no need to follow up on this plot point. He could leave it ambiguous, he could say "Ten years later, Goku takes on a student, and all the kids are doing shit too" and not have to worry, cause it was done. He could leave it up to all the little bastards who read his comic to imagine what happened next, cause he was finally free to go teach that dinosaur to ride a ball. Had he had to continue, I highly doubt he would have done the ten year skip at all, let alone all the next gen talk. Just a thought.

If this is what you guys want, that's fine, more power to you. But personally, I think it's time to let Dragon Ball rest in peace.

[Totamo]

Look, we already basically had a next gen and it was called GT. It focused on Trunks and Pan.



You know how it was received.

Yeah, the whole GT argument is kind of getting redundant as if to say, stories can't evolve. I like how I wrote out so many points with my first post and most replies are just "GT happened, so I disagree" OR "DB is Goku's story and no one else's". However, I simply cannot change the way people feel and I honestly do respect all your opinions on this. Still, we'll just have to what Toei/Toriyama choose to possibly do next.

But, it was a next gen story and the best parts were Goku.

[pacz360]

It doesn't have to be a Monkey's Paw scenario. It's possible to have the best of both worlds. All it takes is good writing, direction and proper planning, and you can have a series that reaches the middle ground of focusing on the new generation of fighter while also retaining Goku and Vegeta's roles as central characters. It would be perhaps a bit difficult to pull off, but it can work.

True tho with toei I have doubt

[Ilikepictures-meh]

Look, we already basically had a next gen and it was called GT. It focused on Trunks and Pan.



You know how it was received.

Yeah, the whole GT argument is kind of getting redundant as if to say, stories can't evolve. I like how I wrote out so many points with my first post and most replies are just "GT happened, so I disagree" OR "DB is Goku's story and no one else's". However, I simply cannot change the way people feel and I honestly do respect all your opinions on this. Still, we'll just have to what Toei/Toriyama choose to possibly do next.

But, it was a next gen story and the best parts were Goku.

Claiming GT is a next gen story is delusional. It was purely a Goku story, it even ignored most of the cast, old and new. The ones they actually kept around for a consistent basis was only around to get rescued by Goku.

Vegeta got some love in the end yo get the fusion in, 18 got to help Goku in the "Super 17" arc, everyone else gets rescued by Goku or does nothing of note till the show got cancelled. You're GT counter argument is embarrassingly weak.

[Ilikepictures-meh]

I apparently am an odd one out as I always considered Gohan as part of the “next generation” despite the huge gap in age. So id count him as an older warrior/teacher to the younger ones but still capable of learning himself. I tend to think you would have to “ease” people into a next generation show though I think it could work eventually. Maybe start with a transition period where old characters have equal spotlight then gradually shift them into more “mentor” roles but allow them strong “guest spots” occasionally.

This is how they should do it, Goku and the others shouldn't just be pushed aside, but the younger characters should be eased into more prominent roles, along side the others, more team based battles anyone

[Totamo]

Yeah, the whole GT argument is kind of getting redundant as if to say, stories can't evolve. I like how I wrote out so many points with my first post and most replies are just "GT happened, so I disagree" OR "DB is Goku's story and no one else's". However, I simply cannot change the way people feel and I honestly do respect all your opinions on this. Still, we'll just have to what Toei/Toriyama choose to possibly do next.

But, it was a next gen story and the best parts were Goku.

Claiming GT is a next gen story is delusional. It was purely a Goku story, it even ignored most of the cast, old and new. The ones they actually kept around for a consistent basis was only around to get rescued by Goku.

Vegeta got some love in the end yo get the fusion in, 18 got to help Goku in the "Super 17" arc, everyone else gets rescued by Goku or does nothing of note till the show got cancelled. You're GT counter argument is embarrassingly weak.

Oh right, I totally forgot where Goku, Pan and Trunks travel through space for a fourth of the series doesn't make a next gen story. Despite the fact, that Pan had the second most screentime in that show does not make a next gen story. Pan being the only person other than Goku to defeat a shadow dragon, doesn't make it next gen. She was the only one besides Mr satan posses by baby and was key to Goku unlocking his super saiyan 4 doesn't make it next gen. Pan standing alongside the other saiyans giving Goku power doesn't make it next gen. Or how about that GT SPECIAL ABOUT GOKU JR, NOT MAKING GT A NEXT GEN STORY!!!!!!!


I totally believe you and don't think you are being asinine.


I remember from that series than I would like to honestly.

[Faisal Shourov]

Dragon Ball has no end goal, the show can practically continue forever. DB is all about enjoying the adventure. If you feel you're getting tired of the DB characters, trying watching another show

DB without Goku is not DB. Goku is Dragon Ball. Goku is more important to Dragon Ball than Naruto was to Naruto.

[Whatever]

But, it was a next gen story and the best parts were Goku.

Claiming GT is a next gen story is delusional. It was purely a Goku story, it even ignored most of the cast, old and new. The ones they actually kept around for a consistent basis was only around to get rescued by Goku.

Vegeta got some love in the end yo get the fusion in, 18 got to help Goku in the "Super 17" arc, everyone else gets rescued by Goku or does nothing of note till the show got cancelled. You're GT counter argument is embarrassingly weak.

Oh right, I totally forgot where Goku, Pan and Trunks travel through space for a fourth of the series doesn't make a next gen story. Despite the fact, that Pan had the second most screentime in that show does not make a next gen story. Pan being the only person other than Goku to defeat a shadow dragon, doesn't make it next gen. She was the only one besides Mr satan posses by baby and was key to Goku unlocking his super saiyan 4 doesn't make it next gen. Pan standing alongside the other saiyans giving Goku power doesn't make it next gen. Or how about that GT SPECIAL ABOUT GOKU JR, NOT MAKING GT A NEXT GEN STORY!!!!!!!


I totally believe you and don't think you are being asinine.


I remember from that series than I would like to honestly.

By that logic,the saiyan saga was next gen story because Gohan played an important part in taking Vegeta down.

If somebody believes GT was a next gen story he is the one being asinine.

[Totamo]

Claiming GT is a next gen story is delusional. It was purely a Goku story, it even ignored most of the cast, old and new. The ones they actually kept around for a consistent basis was only around to get rescued by Goku.

Vegeta got some love in the end yo get the fusion in, 18 got to help Goku in the "Super 17" arc, everyone else gets rescued by Goku or does nothing of note till the show got cancelled. You're GT counter argument is embarrassingly weak.

Oh right, I totally forgot where Goku, Pan and Trunks travel through space for a fourth of the series doesn't make a next gen story. Despite the fact, that Pan had the second most screentime in that show does not make a next gen story. Pan being the only person other than Goku to defeat a shadow dragon, doesn't make it next gen. She was the only one besides Mr satan posses by baby and was key to Goku unlocking his super saiyan 4 doesn't make it next gen. Pan standing alongside the other saiyans giving Goku power doesn't make it next gen. Or how about that GT SPECIAL ABOUT GOKU JR, NOT MAKING GT A NEXT GEN STORY!!!!!!!


I totally believe you and don't think you are being asinine.


I remember from that series than I would like to honestly.

By that logic,the saiyan saga was next gen story because Gohan played an important part in taking Vegeta down.

If somebody believes GT was a next gen story he is the one being asinine.

You do know many fans on this site believe Gohan was main character of Z, right? Especially where Goku is just straight up not around. So Z would be considered a next Gen story and one I even said worked for specific reasons.







Soooooooooo, who is being asinine again?

[Hawk9211]

It doesn't have to be a Monkey's Paw scenario. It's possible to have the best of both worlds. All it takes is good writing, direction and proper planning, and you can have a series that reaches the middle ground of focusing on the new generation of fighter while also retaining Goku and Vegeta's roles as central characters. It would be perhaps a bit difficult to pull off, but it can work.

True tho with toei I have doubt

That's true,with proper execution anything is possible.As my friend michsi said before you can have a good story even with oonlong.

However,a story is its characters or they are at least a very big part of it and in dragon ball where plot and world building is barebones,the story is its characters.Throughout the story we were following goku and his friends adventures,now taking out those characters is essentially taking out dragon ball.You are left with another identical story that may be good or bad,that's why I am against a main story that is focused on someone else.

I could get behind a spin off set in dragon ball universe,but a main story focusing on some other characters is a big no.

[Lionel]

Goku may be the face of Dragon Ball but I doubt the producers are willing to completely phase out the supporting cast whom they know have such a strong following. Take out Goku and the series might very well tank, but if the inverse were to happen would the appeal or revenue really remain the same? It's probably why they chose to drudge up the has-been "relics" from decades ago and prop them up as centrepiece accessories in the promotions. Maybe they feel they need to appeal to those long-time fans and enthusiasts who can remember a day when people like Krillin and Tenshinhan had some merit on a battlefield. Why can't they just push ahead with the recently established members of the Super cast and hope they stand on their own merit? I would like to know that. If you have so much conviction in the Super formula then don't try to entice fans of the old school with these promotional stunts.

[Doctor.]

I don't understand why some people feel the transition would have to be instant. Nobody in their right mind wants to start a new series and erase the old characters from the cast. Just like characters like Launch, Oolong, Roshi and Yajirobe fell into irrelevancy and made way for characters like Gohan, Piccolo and Vegeta, so would the older characters give way for Pan, Oob & co. Dragon Ball has always functioned like this, it replaces old characters, whose arcs are over, with new ones.

I can't understand how some think this is a new idea.

Plus, if you're so desperate to keep what you consider Dragon Ball's essence, you can still have Goku in a central position even with a rejuvenated cast.

[TekTheNinja]

I don't understand why some people feel the transition would have to be instant. Nobody in their right mind wants to start a new series and erase the old characters from the cast. Just like characters like Launch, Oolong, Roshi and Yajirobe fell into irrelevancy and made way for characters like Gohan, Piccolo and Vegeta, so would the older characters give way for Pan, Oob & co. Dragon Ball has always functioned like this, it replaces old characters, whose arcs are over, with new ones.

I can't understand how some think this is a new idea.

Plus, if you're so desperate to keep what you consider Dragon Ball's essence, you can still have Goku in a central position even with a rejuvenated cast.

Exactly. People in this thread just keep repeating the whole "Dragon Ball isn't Dragon Ball without Goku" thing even though it's been said several times that no one is asking to take Goku away. I seriously don't get why that's just been ignored each time it's said.

Also, GT is IN NO WAY a next gen story. Pan isn't really being trained or advancing in any way, Uub is hardly there, people call the show Goku Time for a reason...