Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Vegeta_Sama » Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:18 pm

Bebi Hatchiyack wrote:IMO the color of the hair is Gray/Grey/Silver white would have been rendered much differently
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
This picture (fan made Gohan Blanco) of how white really looks like for Dragon Ball. Migatte no Gokui mastered is silverish/gray/grey.
Man, it's really weird to think that a meme is now canon...
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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Asura » Sun Feb 18, 2018 2:58 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Asura wrote:
Kenneth La Torre wrote:I don’t see how people think this is a ssg recolored, when it clearly has a different type of hair. The hair is the same as UI omen, just silver. In my opinion, the preview made the form look gorgeous.
The hair is definitely not the same as UI Omen, it literally is just Goku's normal hair, but white. You can see the differences very clearly here.
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Umm no. The hair is the same as UI omen, just silver. You do know that toriyamas ssg recolor is not the one that’s going to be used right?
Are we looking at the same picture here? It’s very, very obvious that the two Gokus in that picture, one from Toriyama and the other from TOEI, have two different hair styles. The Toriyama version is the one people are calling an SSG recolor. I don’t know how you’re not seeing that.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:16 pm

Asura wrote:
Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Asura wrote:
The hair is definitely not the same as UI Omen, it literally is just Goku's normal hair, but white. You can see the differences very clearly here.
[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Umm no. The hair is the same as UI omen, just silver. You do know that toriyamas ssg recolor is not the one that’s going to be used right?
Are we looking at the same picture here? It’s very, very obvious that the two Gokus in that picture, one from Toriyama and the other from TOEI, have two different hair styles. The Toriyama version is the one people are calling an SSG recolor. I don’t know how you’re not seeing that.

Of course, but that’s not the one being used. The UI omen style hair below toriyamas drawing is the one that going to be used

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by DainIronfoot » Sun Feb 18, 2018 3:42 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Asura wrote:
Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Umm no. The hair is the same as UI omen, just silver. You do know that toriyamas ssg recolor is not the one that’s going to be used right?
Are we looking at the same picture here? It’s very, very obvious that the two Gokus in that picture, one from Toriyama and the other from TOEI, have two different hair styles. The Toriyama version is the one people are calling an SSG recolor. I don’t know how you’re not seeing that.

Of course, but that’s not the one being used. The UI omen style hair below toriyamas drawing is the one that going to be used

I'm already confused as to what you lads are discussing however regarding that picture... the top is Toriyama's version which is pretty much a recolor. Below that is Yamamuro's design of UI mastered for the anime. the two are very different. Yamamuro also made the design for UI Omen. The hair in particular is the biggest difference.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:08 pm

DainIronfoot wrote:
Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Asura wrote:
Are we looking at the same picture here? It’s very, very obvious that the two Gokus in that picture, one from Toriyama and the other from TOEI, have two different hair styles. The Toriyama version is the one people are calling an SSG recolor. I don’t know how you’re not seeing that.

Of course, but that’s not the one being used. The UI omen style hair below toriyamas drawing is the one that going to be used

I'm already confused as to what you lads are discussing however regarding that picture... the top is Toriyama's version which is pretty much a recolor. Below that is Yamamuro's design of UI mastered for the anime. the two are very different. Yamamuro also made the design for UI Omen. The hair in particular is the biggest difference.
To make it clear, what I’m saying is that the design being used is not toriyamas design. Dragon ball super, heroes, and even Xenoverse are using yamamuros design. So for people who are dissapointed that it is a ssg recolor, it isn’t. Its a UI omen recolor, or UI omen colored

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by buutenks » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:32 pm

It isnt a ssg recolor. Ssg makes Goku skinny. The one in the anime doesnt. So far, from the NEP, it looks awesome.

THo i suspect, the manga UI will proly be a ssg with white hair. So will suck for the manga in that aspect.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Marlowe89 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:40 pm

buutenks wrote:THo i suspect, the manga UI will proly be a ssg with white hair. So will suck for the manga in that aspect.
I'm not so sure about that. I think it's possible that Toriyama's art might be more of a rough draft conception than a finalized version, in which case the form seen in Yamamuro's art could easily be present in the manga as well. Ultimately, none of us know the process behind the suggestion to alter UI's appearance from Toriyama's design.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by buutenks » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:51 pm

Marlowe89 wrote:
buutenks wrote:THo i suspect, the manga UI will proly be a ssg with white hair. So will suck for the manga in that aspect.
I'm not so sure about that. I think it's possible that Toriyama's art might be more of a rough draft conception than a finalized version, in which case the form seen in Yamamuro's art could easily be present in the manga as well. Ultimately, none of us know the process behind the suggestion to alter UI's appearance from Toriyama's design.
Well, they altered it for good reason, it would have been a ssg recolor then.

Tho people complained about Black Rose at first when they saw the drawings, but loved it while it happened on screen.

Plus, shirtless Goku lol, we havent had that since Namek.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:55 pm

I think maybe that is why they brought SSG back in the anime, so they could be like see Toriyama-sensei we have to make UI different. :lol:

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by wertham » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:59 pm

Looking at the two Toriyama designs side by side, you can see that the second one is not a recolor but a redrawn version. In fact, it's slightly bulkier (we can assume it's meant to be "normal sized Goku" in Toriyama's new standards).

[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]

It doesn't change the fact that it's only a recolor, but I think that maybe this "transformation" is another case of Toei making a big deal of something that is not pretended by Toriyama to be that much. It's only Goku with "angel" hair.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Marlowe89 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:59 pm

buutenks wrote:Well, they altered it for good reason, it would have been a ssg recolor then.
Oh, I certainly have no doubt about that. What I meant to say is that we're not really sure at what level this change was suggested. We see the updated design in Yamamuro's art, but was Yamamuro alone responsible for adjusting it? Did Toyotaro make the suggestion? Or was it the result of a discussion between multiple people overseeing the franchise's design elements? There's the "Dragon Ball Room" initiative so maybe that played a role as well, since there's inevitably a merchandising aspect to it.

I'm not sure if Goku will be shirtless in the manga per se, but I think it's very much possible that the hair and build for Toriyama's design might remain exclusively at the initial concept stage as opposed to reflecting a finalized version necessarily. I guess we'll see.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by KinguKurimuzon » Sun Feb 18, 2018 6:07 pm

Another one? Really? Isn't this like the 5th or 6th new transformation we've gotten within the past two arcs? There's been so much overexposure to new forms in the past few years that I just can't get excited for this stuff anymore, especially when their designs are so uninteresting and uninspired.
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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by 8bitdee » Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:01 pm

wertham wrote: It doesn't change the fact that it's only a recolor, but I think that maybe this "transformation" is another case of Toei making a big deal of something that is not pretended by Toriyama to be that much. It's only Goku with "angel" hair.
This.

Anyway, I can't believe there is a dislike for something because it's not bulky and full of muscles. I thought that testosterone-filled ideal of what a hero should look like was something only teenagers dreamed of, but bugger my ass, grown ass men still jizz over that.

I love Toriyama's design way more. It's simpler. It's more "Goku-like." It's more Dragonball-like, back when Goku was more relatable and not a mass of muscles bigger than his head.
I can only hope Toyotaro sticks more faithfully to it.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:28 pm

8bitdee wrote:
wertham wrote: It doesn't change the fact that it's only a recolor, but I think that maybe this "transformation" is another case of Toei making a big deal of something that is not pretended by Toriyama to be that much. It's only Goku with "angel" hair.
This.

Anyway, I can't believe there is a dislike for something because it's not bulky and full of muscles. I thought that testosterone-filled ideal of what a hero should look like was something only teenagers dreamed of, but bugger my ass, grown ass men still jizz over that.

I love Toriyama's design way more. It's simpler. It's more "Goku-like." It's more Dragonball-like, back when Goku was more relatable and not a mass of muscles bigger than his head.
I can only hope Toyotaro sticks more faithfully to it.
To be fair, Ultra Instinct Omen with the blue shirt on was basically exactly what you highlighted here.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by ZenkaiBoosts » Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:40 pm

8bitdee wrote:
wertham wrote: It doesn't change the fact that it's only a recolor, but I think that maybe this "transformation" is another case of Toei making a big deal of something that is not pretended by Toriyama to be that much. It's only Goku with "angel" hair.
This.

Anyway, I can't believe there is a dislike for something because it's not bulky and full of muscles. I thought that testosterone-filled ideal of what a hero should look like was something only teenagers dreamed of, but bugger my ass, grown ass men still jizz over that.

I love Toriyama's design way more. It's simpler. It's more "Goku-like." It's more Dragonball-like, back when Goku was more relatable and not a mass of muscles bigger than his head.
I can only hope Toyotaro sticks more faithfully to it.
Keep this in mind, Toriyama didnt want Vegetto in the future trunks arc

That was all Toyotaro...and Vegetto is the epitomy of a burte strength crutch to overwhelm

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by Marlowe89 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 10:18 pm

8bitdee wrote:I love Toriyama's design way more. It's simpler. It's more "Goku-like." It's more Dragonball-like, back when Goku was more relatable and not a mass of muscles bigger than his head.
Is it? Even in the anime, it's basically Goku's normal muscle mass with a slightly different hairstyle. It's still a very subtle design overall, white hair included.

Toriyama's design inserts all the traits of SSG such as the hairstyle and thinner-than-usual build, which is what people seem to be complaining about. I'd say the designs from both Toriyama and Yamamuro are just about equally as simple, but one is less "copypasted" for lack of a better term.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by TheShadowEmperor8055 » Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:33 pm

ChiefWamsutta wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote: Pleasantly surprised you remembered that :lol:
I really like what you said. I feel like it rings true here. It seems Toriyama never intended to have "UI hair". So, as far as we know, UI Goku could easily have been intended to have SSGod hair.

We can't confirm or deny that UI Goku was not intended by Toriyama, but based on his Mastered UI, it seems the hair was intended to be SSGod style.
Indeed. It still baffles me how fans are so certain something is anime-only and not in Toriyama's outline, which is an outline they have never seen and will likely never see in their lives, wtf.

Hell, the whole "Namekian Book of Legends" in the BoG saga appeared in neither the movie or the manga, but the anime, and yet it's revealed to be a Toriyama detail. Seriously, those fans have no way of knowing what is and isn't in Toriyama's outline and they need to quit acting like they do.

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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by majinwarman » Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:06 am

TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:
ChiefWamsutta wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote: Pleasantly surprised you remembered that :lol:
I really like what you said. I feel like it rings true here. It seems Toriyama never intended to have "UI hair". So, as far as we know, UI Goku could easily have been intended to have SSGod hair.

We can't confirm or deny that UI Goku was not intended by Toriyama, but based on his Mastered UI, it seems the hair was intended to be SSGod style.
Indeed. It still baffles me how fans are so certain something is anime-only and not in Toriyama's outline, which is an outline they have never seen and will likely never see in their lives, wtf.

Hell, the whole "Namekian Book of Legends" in the BoG saga appeared in neither the movie or the manga, but the anime, and yet it's revealed to be a Toriyama detail. Seriously, those fans have no way of knowing what is and isn't in Toriyama's outline and they need to quit acting like they do.
Fans like to believe they know more than they really do. Some fans may have insider information but not most fans who claim to know what is in Toriyama's manuscript. The only people who know what is in it is Super's writers, directors, producers, and Toyotaro.
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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by HeroR » Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:12 am

majinwarman wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote:
ChiefWamsutta wrote:
I really like what you said. I feel like it rings true here. It seems Toriyama never intended to have "UI hair". So, as far as we know, UI Goku could easily have been intended to have SSGod hair.

We can't confirm or deny that UI Goku was not intended by Toriyama, but based on his Mastered UI, it seems the hair was intended to be SSGod style.
Indeed. It still baffles me how fans are so certain something is anime-only and not in Toriyama's outline, which is an outline they have never seen and will likely never see in their lives, wtf.

Hell, the whole "Namekian Book of Legends" in the BoG saga appeared in neither the movie or the manga, but the anime, and yet it's revealed to be a Toriyama detail. Seriously, those fans have no way of knowing what is and isn't in Toriyama's outline and they need to quit acting like they do.
Fans like to believe they know more than they really do. Some fans may have insider information but not most fans who claim to know what is in Toriyama's manuscript. The only people who know what is in it is Super's writers, directors, producers, and Toyotaro.
It's easy actually.

Anything fans don't like, it's Toei's fault. Anything they do like, It's Toriyama or Toyo's idea. Like fans spent years blaming Toei for retelling the movies in Super as a cheap money grab when it was Toriyama's idea. Worst, Toriyama said it was his idea before Super started, but for some reason fan just forgot about it.
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Re: Mastered Ultra Instinct [Spoiler Discussion Thread]

Post by majinwarman » Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:23 am

HeroR wrote:
majinwarman wrote:
TheShadowEmperor8055 wrote: Indeed. It still baffles me how fans are so certain something is anime-only and not in Toriyama's outline, which is an outline they have never seen and will likely never see in their lives, wtf.

Hell, the whole "Namekian Book of Legends" in the BoG saga appeared in neither the movie or the manga, but the anime, and yet it's revealed to be a Toriyama detail. Seriously, those fans have no way of knowing what is and isn't in Toriyama's outline and they need to quit acting like they do.
Fans like to believe they know more than they really do. Some fans may have insider information but not most fans who claim to know what is in Toriyama's manuscript. The only people who know what is in it is Super's writers, directors, producers, and Toyotaro.
It's easy actually.

Anything fans don't like, it's Toei's fault. Anything they do like, It's Toriyama or Toyo's idea. Like fans spent years blaming Toei for retelling the movies in Super as a cheap money grab when it was Toriyama's idea. Worst, Toriyama said it was his idea before Super started, but for some reason fan just forgot about it.
Toei is just a easy target to throw blame. I disagree with the notion that Toriyama is blameless.
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