I think Toriyama's time is over with the Dragonball series

[Lujin_16]

If the Dragonball series will come back than without Akira and my mind says Toyotarō will do his stuff completely...

It does not mean that he will do nothing anymore but maybe only Dragonball movies in future..

[Khandom101]

If the Dragonball series will come back than without Akira and my mind says Toyotarō will do his stuff completely...

It does not mean that he will do nothing anymore but maybe only Dragonball movies in future..

Hahahaha, this post made me laugh. I humbly disagree.

[prince212]

If the Dragonball series will come back than without Akira and my mind says Toyotarō will do his stuff completely...

It does not mean that he will do nothing anymore but maybe only Dragonball movies in future..

Noooooooo . The way he’s doing it’s ok , reciently he stated that he’s happy not drawing and involved in the storytelling , he has time to write something big to keep this for lots of years to come , and I hope he will .. but he’s never been like oda , he’s more a freestyler , and day by day looks like , but it will be nice .

[PFM18]

If the Dragonball series will come back than without Akira and my mind says Toyotarō will do his stuff completely...

It does not mean that he will do nothing anymore but maybe only Dragonball movies in future..

I vehemently disagree. Toyotaro would be a massive downgrade in my opinion. Tototaro does a good job with art but as far as writing goes he does a very poor job in my opinion. Lol personally I want Toriyama to keep doing Dragon ball for years more

[Doctor.]

They're both terrible writers and I would prefer someone who knows what they're doing and has some sort of vision rather than treating Dragon Ball as a little nostalgic side-project you can't be arsed to put more than 5 minutes of work into, like Toriyama does, or as a way to prove yourself to senpai and showcase your fanbase credibility to the masses, in Toyotaro's case.

[PFM18]

They're both terrible writers and I would prefer someone who knows what they're doing and has some sort of vision rather than treating Dragon Ball as a little nostalgic side-project you can't be arsed to put more than 5 minutes of work into, like Toriyama does, or as a way to prove yourself to senpai and showcase your fanbase credibility to the masses, in Toyotaro's case.

Wait so You think Toriyama is a terrible writer but you are a regular on this site? That makes no sense to me

[SuperCyan2]

Akira from the Virtua Fighter series or the post-apocalyptic anime movie?

[Doctor.]

They're both terrible writers and I would prefer someone who knows what they're doing and has some sort of vision rather than treating Dragon Ball as a little nostalgic side-project you can't be arsed to put more than 5 minutes of work into, like Toriyama does, or as a way to prove yourself to senpai and showcase your fanbase credibility to the masses, in Toyotaro's case.

Wait so You think Toriyama is a terrible writer but you are a regular on this site? That makes no sense to me

I think Toriyama's a terrible writer now.

[Metalwario64]

Akira from the Virtua Fighter series or the post-apocalyptic anime movie?

It's so annoying when people refer to him on by his given name.

[Zephyr]

I thought Battle of Gods, Jaco, and Resurrection F were completely fine.

They just need to stop making TV anime, since he's not as hands-on there, and Toei's script writers can't seem to adapt his painfully minimal notes very well.

[PFM18]

They're both terrible writers and I would prefer someone who knows what they're doing and has some sort of vision rather than treating Dragon Ball as a little nostalgic side-project you can't be arsed to put more than 5 minutes of work into, like Toriyama does, or as a way to prove yourself to senpai and showcase your fanbase credibility to the masses, in Toyotaro's case.

Wait so You think Toriyama is a terrible writer but you are a regular on this site? That makes no sense to me

I think Toriyama's a terrible writer now.

I struggle to see how his writing is so different in quality now than it was before but I guess everybody has their opinion.

[Gaffer Tape]

I don't know enough about the production of the series to know where the blame lies. I don't know if it's Toriyama's notes, Toei interpreting or expanding them poorly, or some combination of the two. So I can't say for sure whether it's Toriyama who needs to step down. All I know is that somebody needs to, because Dragon Ball Super's writing has become just an unmitigated disaster.

[Sani007]

I think only Toriyama can write Dragon Ball. He understands his characters and only he can bring the true DB mood.

[ulisa]

They're both terrible writers and I would prefer someone who knows what they're doing and has some sort of vision rather than treating Dragon Ball as a little nostalgic side-project you can't be arsed to put more than 5 minutes of work into, like Toriyama does, or as a way to prove yourself to senpai and showcase your fanbase credibility to the masses, in Toyotaro's case.

I tend to think Toriyama needs an editor that isn’t afraid to tell him when something doesn’t work or doesn’t add up well. He definitely has some great ideas but the way he chooses to execute them isn’t always the best. Likewise, he also has some terrible ideas but I think he’s so well respected now that people are reluctant to tell him that.

While I don’t despise the new stuff as it does have some gems in it, I think his older material was better edited and put together. I recognize Toriyama’s style is a “make it up as you go” type but it still needs to make sense and not completely throw away previously established facts.

[PFM18]

I don't know enough about the production of the series to know where the blame lies. I don't know if it's Toriyama's notes, Toei interpreting or expanding them poorly, or some combination of the two. So I can't say for sure whether it's Toriyama who needs to step down. All I know is that somebody needs to, because Dragon Ball Super's writing has become just an unmitigated disaster.

Why do we have to go looking for a problem? To me this is an example of "If it isnt broke dont fix it" the Tournament of Power has brought as an amazingly epic and enjoyable arc.(at least to me) and the Zamasu Arc outside of the ending was fantastic. I don't know how you can objectively say that episode 130 isn't the best episode in the history of the series. Anybody expecting there to be this super alaborate story and deep plotlines is blinded by their nostalgia if they think this is so different from DBZ and ODB . this series was never meant to be extremely complex and in-depth. I don't know I just don't think anything needs to be changed except more consistent animation which from the looks of the movie it has already been fixed.

[Doctor.]

Anybody expecting there to be this super alaborate story and deep plotlines is blinded by their nostalgia if they think this is so different from DBZ and ODB

I don't have any nostalgic attachment towards the franchise and Super still can't touch the original series. This excuse is stupid.

[PFM18]

Anybody expecting there to be this super alaborate story and deep plotlines is blinded by their nostalgia if they think this is so different from DBZ and ODB

I don't have any nostalgic attachment towards the franchise and Super still can't touch the original series. This excuse is stupid.

It isn't necessarily an excuse. i am not excusing anything considering I didn't concede the notion that Super needs fixing and then make an excuse for it. I was just trying to rationalize the hatred for it because I don't really understand it. Like I said episode 130 is to many(including me) the single greatest episode of the entire franchise. And for good reason it had everything going for it. If anything the story elements have progressed further especially from the painfully generic villain who is "evil just for the sake of being evil" in contrast with Zamasu and his motives and Jiren being the main antagonist but still a good person.

[Marlowe89]

I thought Battle of Gods, Jaco, and Resurrection F were completely fine.

They just need to stop making TV anime, since he's not as hands-on there, and Toei's script writers can't seem to adapt his painfully minimal notes very well.

The anime does have strong character moments at times, occasionally even surpassing the more-grounded manga's approach, but I agree overall. This is why I have such high hopes for the upcoming film.

[Zephyr]

this series was never meant to be extremely complex and in-depth.

No, it wasn't. But it managed to be reasonably nuanced and well written, when crafted directly by Toriyama's hand.

Your accusation of nostalgia-reliance is odd, especially when directed at Gaffer Tape, who is literally smack dab in the middle of an in-depth analysis of the series, evaluating it based on his present thoughts and feelings. Hardly a nostalgia-trip gush-fest. And I've rewatched the series several times since my initial viewing, and have read large chunks of the manga, and my thoughts have evolved quite a bit over time. The writing back then in comparison to Super is radically different when it comes to story trajectory and characterization. Looking at the behind the scenes production of the two runs of the series (original run, and revival run) I think it's fairly clear why there's such a stark difference.

Toriyama's a gifted cartoonist and character writer. In Super, he's not directly doing either. He's making designs for characters and giving bullet points. That's not how the original manga's story was created, week-by-week, over the course of ten years. Back then, he drew and wrote it, every step of the way. Now, he's simply giving another studio very minimal notes on what to draw and write. Sure, Toei can deliver well-choreographed and animated battles, but that's about it. And without an authorially-consistent and structurally-sound narrative backbone, it's all style over substance.

[sintzu]

Based on how GT turned out and what's going on with Boruto, both which had little to no involvement from their original authors, Toriyama stepping down would be a bad idea, at least now.

Before Toriyama took over BOG, Beerus was going to be a Baby clone who infects people with evil. We recently found out that Kale was their idea because they wanted a Broly clone, out of all the things they could've done with those universes, a Broly clone was the best they could come up with.

The DB franchise is at an all time high so Toriyama won't be able to keep up with it and will eventually step down but now isn't the time as the people working with him (Toyotarou, Toei's writers & the DB room) aren't ready to fully take over. This is not to say Toriyama's writing is perfect as it has a lot of issues but at least it's pushing the lore forward.