Kai Episode 92 (06 February 2011)

[Puto]

I wouldn't mind Kai not being reanimated so much if the footage had been treated properly back in the day instead of having been done using the cheapest materials possible. Look at Card Captor Sakura, for example; they used high quality stock and animation materials, and as such, they could do an amazing remaster for the Blu-ray release that looks absolutely gorgeous. If DBZ's footage looked anywhere near as good as that, I wouldn't have any problem with keeping the old animation. But as-is...

[AoiKageNoChikara]

No they do not, they are fans of inferior series.

As I'm seeing it... there's no inferior series here. only inferior people/fans... and if truly these are inferior series why do I keep finding praise among thousands of fans, with all that filler yet they still enjoy it, I do find db a superior series than naruto. yet "fans" want to prove me wrong, we're fans of the same thing! yet there's so much trouble between us fans that it almost makes me wish dragon ball would die away!. seriusly makes me sick it's such a hard thing to say.... "I just Love Z better. but this and this were better". or "Dbz was miles better here, yet this was really sweet" out of all things done in Kai, something has to come out good or even better. yet it's so hard...

I've seen people watching other anime (or games) that get seriusly generic music yet they enjoy it, But dragon ball fans pick on dragon ball? naruto/bleach fans would kill for their anime to get a Kai treatment yet... us the dragon ball fans just pick on every new thing we get... I know people just won't agree with me because I want... but aren't these type of comments a bit exagerated? to say the music is actually bad.... I would understand "This just doesn't feel like original dragon ball" and I even respect that one.... but to say it's bad no matter what, no discussion to it's level of dissapointment... to even put it down in front of a synthetized american score.... this just amazes to no end. but to each his own I guess... *scratches head*

Well, you don't have to try to persuade everyone who says the Kai version isn't good..

Well, I have the right to protect what I like as any hardcore original japanese fan has the right to defend it against hardcore funi/faulconer ones


Now I'm really finding it pointless to continue this, Before knowing it I kinda wanted to strike my opinion into others, sorry for that guys. I take my part of Blame, But I still die with my point of view. People are beign too unfair with Kai here, of course not everyone.

I'm off now, I'll wait for the next episode and do what many don't know how to do... watch and freaking enjoy. bye!

[Daimo-Rukiri]

I haven't been watching Kai"other than the US Dub" but I prefer the bgm for kai during Gohan's transformation far more than the Z version.
It's epic, it fit's the scene far better, it's orchestrated!

Spirit vs Spirit is far from a bad song heck I have the CD quality version on my ipod along with the original runs version at the same time, but this is just one of those scenes where you want absolutely NO FREAKING SINGING!

[Kendamu]

Some people say that the music wasn't Dragonball appropriate, but to me it felt Draonball video game appropriate... like maybe something from the PS1 era. Give that song a backbeat and it would fit right in with DBZ Legends.

Rightfully so, too, considering who is doing the music for the show.

[TripleRach]

I'm off now, I'll wait for the next episode and do what many don't know how to do... watch and freaking enjoy. bye!

Stop being so condescending.

This is a message board. People are going to talk about the show in detail. Sometimes they don't like everything they see or hear. And they have the right to express their thoughts in a civil manner, which is what everyone in this thread has done.

[AoiKageNoChikara]

I'm off now, I'll wait for the next episode and do what many don't know how to do... watch and freaking enjoy. bye!

Stop being so condescending.

This is a message board. People are going to talk about the show in detail. Sometimes they don't like everything they see or hear. And they have the right to express their thoughts in a civil manner, which is what everyone in this thread has done.

Everything you said is true... but opinions can be good and bad, some people disagree This version is better than Z (thus disagreeing with me). yet they atleast give it righteous credit (which makes me respect their opinion, it's now a good opinion, to each his own right?)... others don't and are beign extremely unfair with the show,they don't only say Z's better, but actually say the music in Kai is horrid... which is not...

Now please. let me go :S If my words and not true, they shouldn't budge any of you, Should a fool like me retain dialog with such mature people like you my friends? of course not, as a fool I am. my words should have no importance to you. I already said what I had to say, I want to go, if I go I won't be a nuisance, would you like anyone get a sight of you discussing with a clown? I think not.

[Ashy-kun]

I wouldn't mind Kai not being reanimated so much if the footage had been treated properly back in the day instead of having been done using the cheapest materials possible. Look at Card Captor Sakura, for example; they used high quality stock and animation materials, and as such, they could do an amazing remaster for the Blu-ray release that looks absolutely gorgeous. If DBZ's footage looked anywhere near as good as that, I wouldn't have any problem with keeping the old animation. But as-is...

To be fair, DragonBall Z was done by one of the cheapest, Scroogiest studios, and done in the late 80's and early 90's. Cardcaptor Sakura was not only done in the late 90's, when quality would have improved, but was done by a different studio anyway.

[Michsi]

To be fair, DragonBall Z was done by one of the cheapest, Scroogiest studios, and done in the late 80's and early 90's. Cardcaptor Sakura was not only done in the late 90's, when quality would have improved, but was done by a different studio anyway.

Toei is infamous for it's low budget politic.
Still, I think they did a better job with Dragonball and Sailor Moon than they do with One Piece and Digimon.
Think of battles like Goku vs. Cell or Goku vs. Piccolo, I don't see that level of animantion comming from them anymore. It's only in some movies that I see them invest more money and effort on. (I'm still crossing my thumbs for DB movie at the end of Kai )

It's one of the reasons why I'm actually happy they didn't redo Dragon Ball Z from scratch. Aside from the character desings they use now, the animation would've have been cheap.
I've seen the new special that came out for Raging blast 2 and frankly speaking, ugh.....

[MCDaveG]

I'm off now, I'll wait for the next episode and do what many don't know how to do... watch and freaking enjoy. bye!

Stop being so condescending.

This is a message board. People are going to talk about the show in detail. Sometimes they don't like everything they see or hear. And they have the right to express their thoughts in a civil manner, which is what everyone in this thread has done.

Everything you said is true... but opinions can be good and bad, some people disagree This version is better than Z (thus disagreeing with me). yet they atleast give it righteous credit (which makes me respect their opinion, it's now a good opinion, to each his own right?)... others don't and are beign extremely unfair with the show,they don't only say Z's better, but actually say the music in Kai is horrid... which is not...

Now please. let me go :S If my words and not true, they shouldn't budge any of you, Should a fool like me retain dialog with such mature people like you my friends? of course not, as a fool I am. my words should have no importance to you. I already said what I had to say, I want to go, if I go I won't be a nuisance, would you like anyone get a sight of you discussing with a clown? I think not.

There is nothing like bad or good opinion, only personal taste. Some people are acting like Conquistadors on the internet, when someone doesn't share their own belief or opinion, they are trying to convert him to share it, or at least are bitching and rude about it. Tolerancy and understanding is the Key for not only better civilization, but also better discussion.
It is also something, that lot of people is appearantly missing or unable to get.

[Chibi Mystic Gohan]

Now I'll answer this for myself. The voice of Wakamoto is not the same as in DBZ, it's definitely changed due to his age. But, the quality is still damn good. Personally I think I'd be an asshole to judge any of the voice actors or actresses because of their age.

I don't think it's necessarily his age, he's just changed his style of acting over the years. I'm used to the cool, calm and collected voices he used to do (with the occasional angry outburst) in the '80s and '90s, such as Coach from GunBuster, or Vicious from Cowboy Bebop, or Cell. Now, it seems like he's told to play every one of his characters like they're completely insane. (Emperor from Code Geass, Alexander Anderson from Hellsing, Oda Nobunaga from Sengoku Basara, etc.) It seems that style of speaking just carried over to his new Cell performance.

Really happen that Furukawa-san toned down his gutteral GOHAN! after the transformation, and it sounds more like it's in awe than concern. Piccolo's delivery of that always sounded way to angry in DBZ.

Really? I always loved how he delivered that in DBZ. One of my favorite parts of the transformation. I didn't have a problem with the delivery in DBKai, but it definitely stood out to me...

[Cipher]

Some people say that the music wasn't Dragonball appropriate, but to me it felt Draonball video game appropriate... like maybe something from the PS1 era. Give that song a backbeat and it would fit right in with DBZ Legends.

This was my exact thought watching that scene. Felt like something straight out of Ultimate Battle 22.

In that context, I kind of dig it. But I've never particularly felt that the PS1 era music matched Dragon Ball either. Funny that this almost feels more like 1992 than "Spirit vs. Spirit" though.

[Gaffer Tape]

I'm of two minds of the scene. I do agree with whoever said the music started up too abruptly. I think that contributes to people feeling that the scene goes by too fast. I loved the actual music part of this scene, but I have to say the choir ruined it for me. That's not to say that choirs are inherently bad or don't belong in Dragon Ball. Some of my favorite pieces of Kikuchi's score are choral pieces. But this one just fell flat. First of all, I have to say it sounds like it's synth rather than the real thing. I can't confirm that. But I'm of the opinion that orchestral-type music just loses all of its emotional weight when it's synthesized, and this choir just sounds light and fluffy. Even if it's not synthesized and is real people singing, it's the wrong kind of choir, the wrong vocal type, or the wrong kind of performance. It sounds like Christmas carols. This particular piece of music would have benefitted greatly if they'd dropped the choral part of it and just let the (very good) music stand on its own.

[sbk]

Just saw the next episode preview, and I can't believe they're going to show the redundant powerup again.. That could and should've easily been cut out. /facepalm
They're getting lazy with the filler cutting I think.

[JulieYBM]

Just saw the next episode preview, and I can't believe they're going to show the redundant powerup again.. That could and should've easily been cut out. /facepalm
They're getting lazy with the filler cutting I think.

You know that's probably not going to take more than the opening thirty seconds.

[Tsukento]

I've watched the scene again and again.

It made me realize just how underwhelming the scene ended up playing out. The music is *okay* but really...it lacks that special feel to it. It's kinda hard to describe. It definitely shows how lacking Kai's score is in variety. Hell, I just noticed that they even omitted the Oozaru roar that was used in the original. Instead it seems like they went with "powerful, wavey" sounds emitting from him. Again, hard to explain but you might get what I mean when listening to it. Honestly, we've had a good chunk of actual lyrical music made for not-so important scenes (Ginyu Special Corps. presenting themselves, Vegeta charging up against Reacoom and the assault on Freeza after transforming into his final form), yet the important scenes get stubbed with regular pieces (Trunks killing Freeza and this scene). It kinda makes me scratch my head and wonder why not doing something for the important scenes too?

I know this one has been beaten to death when people expected Super Dragon Soul for Goku's transformation (which I believe didn't fit with the situation), but I think this was the actual one time where it would have been absolutely perfect for the scene. While the footage comes from Z (well aware the scene's slightly shorter in Kai), it does show how well timed the song is with the actual transformation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AblY4CAjdpU

[MR.Mark]

My nostalgia-bias continues to make me enjoy spirit vs. spirit in all it's cheesy j-pop glory over the Kai version. That being said, Kai's version of the scene, FAR from sucked, it was just different, but hit all the right beats of what this moment in the story ment.

Overall this was way better than Kai's ssj Goku scene, atleast in japanese, as Sean's delivery in the dub majorly salvaged it with his far better scream.

[Son Wukong]

I knew I forgot to say something in my first post, which was about Ryou Horikawa. His vocal expression combined with the animated expression of Vegeta right when the Cell Juniors attack is absolutely orgasmic.

[Rory]

I know this one has been beaten to death when people expected Super Dragon Soul for Goku's transformation (which I believe didn't fit with the situation), but I think this was the actual one time where it would have been absolutely perfect for the scene. While the footage comes from Z (well aware the scene's slightly shorter in Kai), it does show how well timed the song is with the actual transformation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AblY4CAjdpU

I always forget how much I love the Latin scream.

[Vhanos]

The Gohan SSJ2 transformation scene.

Original Z > Kai

[Snail]

It's one of the reasons why I'm actually happy they didn't redo Dragon Ball Z from scratch. Aside from the character desings they use now, the animation would've have been cheap.
I've seen the new special that came out for Raging blast 2 and frankly speaking, ugh.....

QFT. That special for Raging Blast 2 was lazy, and uninspired. Just..no.