Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Any general discussion regarding fan-created works of the Dragon Ball franchise, including AMVs, fan-art, fan-fiction, etc.

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Slangh
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Slangh » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:57 pm

ZeroNeonix wrote:
Slangh wrote:[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Saiyan society must be absolutely unstable. Ever since Bardock became king, there are all these other fools 'IMMA BE KING TOO DURRR' for no particular reason.
I imagine Saiyans probably had a respect for King Vegeta and didn't feel the need to usurp him. But Bardock got a vision of the future, and the only way he could prevent his planet's destruction was to become king. Bardock, however, hasn't earned the respect of the people yet, so of course they're all thinking the throne is up for grabs if they can prove themselves superior.
In previous pages Bardock mentions that the title of king is reserved for the strongest among the Saiyans, no matter how respected they are. This tradition also allows a king to be challenged after only one week after he's secured his title, so Bardock for example would hardly have any time to gain respect. I think he actually deserves immense respect because his rebellion freed the Saiyans from Freeza, which proves his allegiance to his race but eh... Look who's challenging him, they don't exactly look like royalty material. They're just doing it for the title. Say you've got a big dumb character like Broly or some other rebel, who's miles ahead of any Saiyan, becoming king through sheer strength alone. It would mean nothing because nobody would respect him. Others would have to gang up on him, kill him and elect another representative who is actually qualified for the job. For Saiyans I'd say some sort of democratic system would be the best way to go, as that would be based more on recognition of leadership, not just dumb strength.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Jesus-is Lord » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:33 pm

Slangh wrote:
ZeroNeonix wrote:
Slangh wrote:[spoiler]Image[/spoiler]
Saiyan society must be absolutely unstable. Ever since Bardock became king, there are all these other fools 'IMMA BE KING TOO DURRR' for no particular reason.
I imagine Saiyans probably had a respect for King Vegeta and didn't feel the need to usurp him. But Bardock got a vision of the future, and the only way he could prevent his planet's destruction was to become king. Bardock, however, hasn't earned the respect of the people yet, so of course they're all thinking the throne is up for grabs if they can prove themselves superior.
In previous pages Bardock mentions that the title of king is reserved for the strongest among the Saiyans, no matter how respected they are. This tradition also allows a king to be challenged after only one week after he's secured his title, so Bardock for example would hardly have any time to gain respect. I think he actually deserves immense respect because his rebellion freed the Saiyans from Freeza, which proves his allegiance to his race but eh... Look who's challenging him, they don't exactly look like royalty material. They're just doing it for the title. Say you've got a big dumb character like Broly or some other rebel, who's miles ahead of any Saiyan, becoming king through sheer strength alone. It would mean nothing because nobody would respect him. Others would have to gang up on him, kill him and elect another representative who is actually qualified for the job. For Saiyans I'd say some sort of democratic system would be the best way to go, as that would be based more on recognition of leadership, not just dumb strength.
Sayains are barbaric in nature, democracy will only turn into ugly facations and much civil unrest. For people like sayains, it's best to just have rule through monarachy. Though they are barbaric, they also have strong culture and monarchy is the best way I think sayains will find permissible. The problem with bardock is you have a ruler who struggles to represent the entirty of the people and therefore you have people who find him sorta illgitimate or non-respectable. Bardock lacks that charisma and sayain "dominance" that king vegeta espoused. Bardock is too.... progressive (I don't want to sound so politcal but it's the best I can think of)..like him insutiting team-work for people like sayains. He's not a loud-mouth and pompus which can cative an agressive race like the sayains therefore people don't respect him enough to want to leave him alone - even if he has objetcivly done some very good things. I feel like hanasia OR king vegeta would be a much better ruler for sayains then bardock. Bardock is an scientist who's just pretty powerful in combat as well, and it shows in his persoanility, charisma (or lack thereof to sayains) and overal demeanor - even though objectvily he's building the sayain kingdom quite nicely.
In conclusion:
Bardock is making the sayain empire objectvily better, but his personaility and attitude does not sit well with most of his citizens.
Huh...
Why does this feel so famliar? I'm trying to think... A leader who's making his nation stronger but has a personality/demeanor that turns off many of his citizens...... Hm.... I forgot. Sorry. :)

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by FoolsGil » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:40 pm

I personally think the Saiyan's right to rule wouldn't be as destabilized and chaotic as one would expect. Well not in this series, but consider this:

Most everyone in the universe except for Earth didn't know how to raise their energy. So third class, second class, elite, were big deals in the caste system. The only ones capable of challenging the King was an elite, were likeliest the smallest group, and if the King is the strongest warrior, it would likely be his son or daughter, who takes over (and we have evidence of the child being stronger than the parent constantly throughout the series), or some other elite sob who gets lucky when the King is getting too old to keep control. Now sure in DBM because apparently all Saiyans can raise their energy besides Bardock, Monkey Joe Blow could go ahead and challenge the King willy nilly, and the King would have to deal with constant challenges. But take away rising power levels, and the Saiyan monarchy wouldn't necessarily deteriorate.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by coola » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:17 pm

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Noah » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:32 pm

Who is fighting with kid Vegeta again...?
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by coola » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Noah wrote:Who is fighting with kid Vegeta again...?
Hanasia, mother of Kakarotto and Raditz :)
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Jackalope89 » Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:07 pm

Noah wrote:Who is fighting with kid Vegeta again...?
The author's OC.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Noah » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:00 pm

Not a fan of Salagir, but I got say he has some good points about Super:

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Fionordequester » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:21 pm

Hmm...I'm having trouble parsing what he's saying; so I decided to "relocalize" it in my own words, see if I get the intent behind it.
Salagir wrote:The show just rubs me the wrong way. It's really just another Dragon Ball GT; they know it's not feasible to try and create a sequel series (especially 20 years after the fact), so it's clear they're just doing it for the money, rather than for any sort of artistic value. For me, Dragon Ball Super is a cartoon, pure and simple; and the Dragon Ball cartoons never caught me. As for the manga, it moves way too fast... which is a shame because it's drawn very well.

And then there's Goku and Vegeta. Yes, we KNOW they're the most popular characters, with Trunks being No. 2... but come on! We want to see NEW characters... or perhaps some old ones being brought back, I don't know. Just stop shoving those two in our faces over and over. I mean obviously Goku's always going to be the hero, but they totally butchered Gohan's character in order to accomplish that. And Vegeta...well everything he does is just fanservice.

Besides that, DB Super's got two main characters to follow around. Both are equally important...and that's just not right. DB, DBZ, even GT, we ALWAYS had just one character; and that was Goku. Vegeta was there, but he was often behind other characters, like Mirai Trunks, Teen Gohan, and even Gotenks.

This radical change in DB Super demonstrates to me a desire to milk a fan-favorite for all he's worth. Hence, Vegeta becomes just as important as Goku; not for any ARTISTIC reasons, but because they want to draw in more fans. So he's just fan-service, just like how Golden Freeza, Mirai Trunks, and Goku Black were just fan-service. They were all safe choices, and they took advantage of that.

Now, obviously you could say the same about DBM. But that's because it IS fanfiction! Of course that's going to be written to appeal to other fans! That's just to be expected.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Jesus-is Lord » Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:12 am

Really salgir, you had to roast the manga? ARGH that makes me triggered a little. SALAGIR WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you could have just roasted the anime and praised the manga.. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: That comment tempts me sorta want to boycott dragon ball multiverse...it's to fast? whaaat? Did he not see the black arc? and who cares if it's to fast, it's not like toyotaro is skipping story, it's just at this moment things are fast because HELLO, we got a hulk smashing everyone!!!! I mean, you people people as weak as rusty Kuririn and roshi, to being on god of destruction level..you think this tourney is going to be very competitive? SALAGIR!!!!!!! WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:17 am

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by TheDragonBallGuy75 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:35 am

Salagir can preach all he likes about DBS being a poorly written cash cow, but come on, it's not like he has a narrative leg to stand on either. As much as I enjoy DBM for its' fanservice fights and god level art (at least in the main story, praise Asura) it's attempts to string together a decent plot continually fall flat on their face. Over 10 years, we've seen multiple intriguing plot threads be resolved almost instantaneously with little consequence. Zen Buu trying to absorb Broly, Zen Buu's revolt, Ginyu switching into Bra's body and now potentially Babidi's revolt. Each and every time, these events served as little more than a distraction from the tournament at large.

Now, people can make the Chekhov's gun argument and say that these events have been building up to a greater series of events later on where all these special abilities that were revealed come into play. However, given the slow release schedule of this comic, I have little faith that's actually the case. It seems that many of these events just served as a way for Salagir to buy time while he thought of more ideas for his fights. Though, I'm happy to be corrected in the coming months and years if I turn out to be wrong. :)
Salagir wrote:
The show just rubs me the wrong way. It's really just another Dragon Ball GT; they know it's not feasible to try and create a sequel series (especially 20 years after the fact), so it's clear they're just doing it for the money, rather than for any sort of artistic value. For me, Dragon Ball Super is a cartoon, pure and simple; and the Dragon Ball cartoons never caught me. As for the manga, it moves way too fast... which is a shame because it's drawn very well.

And then there's Goku and Vegeta. Yes, we KNOW they're the most popular characters, with Trunks being No. 2... but come on! We want to see NEW characters... or perhaps some old ones being brought back, I don't know. Just stop shoving those two in our faces over and over. I mean obviously Goku's always going to be the hero, but they totally butchered Gohan's character in order to accomplish that. And Vegeta...well everything he does is just fanservice.

Besides that, DB Super's got two main characters to follow around. Both are equally important...and that's just not right. DB, DBZ, even GT, we ALWAYS had just one character; and that was Goku. Vegeta was there, but he was often behind other characters, like Mirai Trunks, Teen Gohan, and even Gotenks.

This radical change in DB Super demonstrates to me a desire to milk a fan-favorite for all he's worth. Hence, Vegeta becomes just as important as Goku; not for any ARTISTIC reasons, but because they want to draw in more fans. So he's just fan-service, just like how Golden Freeza, Mirai Trunks, and Goku Black were just fan-service. They were all safe choices, and they took advantage of that.

Now, obviously you could say the same about DBM. But that's because it IS fanfiction! Of course that's going to be written to appeal to other fans! That's just to be expected.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by VegettoEX » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:46 am

Jesus-is Lord wrote:Really salgir, you had to roast the manga? ARGH that makes me triggered a little. SALAGIR WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! you could have just roasted the anime and praised the manga.. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: That comment tempts me sorta want to boycott dragon ball multiverse...it's to fast? whaaat? Did he not see the black arc? and who cares if it's to fast, it's not like toyotaro is skipping story, it's just at this moment things are fast because HELLO, we got a hulk smashing everyone!!!! I mean, you people people as weak as rusty Kuririn and roshi, to being on god of destruction level..you think this tourney is going to be very competitive? SALAGIR!!!!!!! WHY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by FoolsGil » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:11 am

Fionordequester wrote:Hmm...I'm having trouble parsing what he's saying; so I decided to "relocalize" it in my own words, see if I get the intent behind it.
Salagir wrote:The show just rubs me the wrong way. It's really just another Dragon Ball GT; they know it's not feasible to try and create a sequel series (especially 20 years after the fact), so it's clear they're just doing it for the money, rather than for any sort of artistic value. For me, Dragon Ball Super is a cartoon, pure and simple; and the Dragon Ball cartoons never caught me. As for the manga, it moves way too fast... which is a shame because it's drawn very well.

And then there's Goku and Vegeta. Yes, we KNOW they're the most popular characters, with Trunks being No. 2... but come on! We want to see NEW characters... or perhaps some old ones being brought back, I don't know. Just stop shoving those two in our faces over and over. I mean obviously Goku's always going to be the hero, but they totally butchered Gohan's character in order to accomplish that. And Vegeta...well everything he does is just fanservice.

Besides that, DB Super's got two main characters to follow around. Both are equally important...and that's just not right. DB, DBZ, even GT, we ALWAYS had just one character; and that was Goku. Vegeta was there, but he was often behind other characters, like Mirai Trunks, Teen Gohan, and even Gotenks.

This radical change in DB Super demonstrates to me a desire to milk a fan-favorite for all he's worth. Hence, Vegeta becomes just as important as Goku; not for any ARTISTIC reasons, but because they want to draw in more fans. So he's just fan-service, just like how Golden Freeza, Mirai Trunks, and Goku Black were just fan-service. They were all safe choices, and they took advantage of that.

Now, obviously you could say the same about DBM. But that's because it IS fanfiction! Of course that's going to be written to appeal to other fans! That's just to be expected.
It's utterly ironic that he derides GT and Super, and justifies the ridiculous choices he made because it's "fanfiction." I've read fanfics and seen fan videos that made me question the original choices of the canon series, and I've read fanfics and seen fan videos that actually made me feel more for the original characters more than the canon series. I hope the next big fan manga, if it ever comes out, doesn't follow Salagir's example. Be better than canon, or at least meet it in quality.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by ekrolo2 » Tue Aug 14, 2018 10:37 am

FoolsGil wrote:It's utterly ironic that he derides GT and Super, and justifies the ridiculous choices he made because it's "fanfiction." I've read fanfics and seen fan videos that made me question the original choices of the canon series, and I've read fanfics and seen fan videos that actually made me feel more for the original characters more than the canon series. I hope the next big fan manga, if it ever comes out, doesn't follow Salagir's example. Be better than canon, or at least meet it in quality.
The fanfiction thing does matter though as an important distinction. Yes, you can read a fic that rivals or some ways or even all of them surpasses the original or rivals it in quality, just as you can read some utter dreck, however, it's still fanfiction. It's the work of someone doing it for fun who wants to write a particular series because they want to see something happen. Them messing things up can get annoying but it's ultimately negligible, it's not an official big product that'll get a push from Toei the world over and leave a permanent mark.

Super has no such excuse: it's done by Toei themselves with Toriyama actively involved, the guy who made all this stuff in the first place and when it fucks up, that's a LOT harder to just ignore. It's an official product made by professionals paid to do this, to continue the series in an official capacity and they keep screwing it up except the animation staff. When the guy who made the series and the people responsible for realizing his story ideas who've done so for decades now screw up, that's a big mark you can't just shrug off like a mediocre to a bad fan comic like DBM, even a popular one.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by coola » Wed Aug 15, 2018 3:42 pm

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by FoolsGil » Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:17 pm

Too bad we already saw the Raichi v U13 Vegeta fight, we know U3 Vegeta is going to die when he's an adult.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by miguelnuva1 » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:35 pm

Salagir is entitled to his opinion but.other than the RF arc the entire super was better than multiverse to this point. Nearly every point he says is a negative in Super he has done the same thing in multiverse or worse.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by coola » Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:47 am

Image
Not sure if it Salgir who made scenarios for Specials, but most of them are god awful:
- Out of character characters
- Fights that drag on
- Crazy power levels
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by SSJgogeto » Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:31 pm

SSJgogeto wrote:Probably she will be the new queen.
Seems like I was right.

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