Color Correcting the Dragon Box - 3 Part Spectacular

[genjosanzo8]

^^ It's from the second DBZ Level set.

Thanks!


Regarding color correction, is Avidemux a good program to use? I've been tinkering around with the color tools on there and I can't tell if I'm satisfied with the results or not. I'll try to post some screens later. One particularly obnoxious thing I have noticed about the program however is that it puts the audio out of sync, even if you mux another track onto it. It's like it adds an extra frame or two, something like that.

i use virtualdub with color mill or white balance plug-in but some members here use after effect , premiere or avisynth
you can use colordirector too .
It depends on what you have, the source you use (after effect doesn't accept mp4 or mkv for exemple)

i don't do the better color correction here so i can't really help you but i hope someone could help you

[gogeta97]

I've been messing around with some color corrections in Virtualdub recently and uploaded some clips to Youtube. Let me know what you guys think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeQ4H_0KAR4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fc7pEwLhbjc

I used color corrections kei has uploaded to his channel for reference so I'm assuming these must be relatively accurate. I am absolutely an amateur though so all criticisms are welcome.

[genjosanzo8]

i think it is not too bad what virtual dub filter did you use for these clip?

[ect5150]

I am absolutely an amateur though so all criticisms are welcome.

Two small points---

1) It appears you are "crushing the blacks"... which means you will lose some details in darker areas of the picture. For example, see the video you posted (screen shot below). You've almost removed some detail in Cell's chest area (that grey-ish streak highlight across the top of his chest). I've included my own adjustment along with the original (not the exact same frame though). I imagine if you were doing a different episode (e.g. some Freeza deep space epsiode), you can see the loss of detail much easier.

[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

However, unless you do something very time consuming and fancy, that's how you get that nice deep rich blue sky in your screenshot. Some people here are completely against "crushing the blacks" but I think its somewhat personal preference (I do it to some extent as well when I balance the blacks just as the guide tells us to balance the whites).

2) This might just be a bandwidth issue for you, but I would upload some higher bitrate video clips. The artifacting in the video makes me wonder if some other issues are bitrate/compression related or are from your own color corrections.

Otherwise, nice work so far... the colors/hues seem to be moving in the right direction.

[genjosanzo8]

i found some interesting virtual dub filter and here is the result for what i can do
left is dbox right is my encode at the bottom a old tvrip with true color (but few tint)

[gogeta97]

i found some interesting virtual dub filter and here is the result for what i can do
left is dbox right is my encode at the bottom a old tvrip with true color (but few tint)

It's definitely an improvement, but the colors on the fixed screen look a little too washed out. You might need to up the saturation a bit.

[genjosanzo8]

it is intentionnaly, dragon box are over saturated, i found it better on my tv

[Ajay]

It's still too desaturated. Not by much, but it's an issue.

I've seen that filter on another user's work, but it contained horrendous ghosting in the dark areas, which destroyed the image. It also broke red tones.

I can see the bad red tones here, but obviously I can't determine ghosting from a still image.

[genjosanzo8]

on the right a dark screen another exemple... i have used 3 filter for that

[spoiler]

an exemple with goku

cels of goku


[/spoiler]
i don't see anything in the dark area and for color for me it seems good (for me )

here a sample
https://1fichier.com/?z0xxd2togj

[ect5150]

an example with Goku
[spoiler][/spoiler]

Playing Devil's Advocate here. The whites and the blacks seem to be off in general... see below-
[spoiler]

[/spoiler]
Sampling the eyes in both images, the one on top (which is the one on your right), has too little red. The one on bottom (your left) has too much green.

The blacks aren't balanced either (I didn't screen-shot that). Also, in the top image, the blue is maxed. To me, this sets off a red flag. It suggests the blue might have been boosted too much. I stress might here. Boosting the whites too much is akin to crushing the blacks. Honestly, some episodes in the Dragon Boxes just seem to have certain color channels boosted beyond reason (some Buu episodes are this way). I personally have just started balancing the whites and the luminance of the eyes to about 83 (in the screenshots, they are higher... 97 & 98). You could balance the whites... even them.. and then alter the L value (which will lower the RGB values all simultaneously... they'll be balanced, but just slightly darker).

You should balance the blacks too and pick a low value of L when doing the blacks though. How low depends on the episode/scene. I usually grab Goku's hair personally.

I should also say it's entirely possible that you just balanced the colors in a different scene... and the the pics above are from a reel that has a different color balance.

[genjosanzo8]

the perfect color correction cannot be done by ourself, it can only be done with film masters, if you correct the white and the black on the video, it will play with the dark and bright area and you will lose some details, i have balance colour to reduce maximaly red, green, yellow or blue tint when i see on tv but keeping all details from the screen... i use white balance in bright image to reduce color cast but keeping all that can be seen in bright and dark area,

if you correct the black you will have the same thing as the season sets for the dark area
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]
as you seen the dark area lack details on the first screens but the second you saw all details, it goes the same with bright scene i know that the goal is to have all white thing to be white but i don't think it is possible to color corrected perfectly without destroying some things, so i choose to keep very minimal tint (when i see on tv i didn't notice these few tint) but to keep all details awaiting eventually new things like level sets (if i remember even level set are not perfectly white)
like you see here the white in these men eye is far for trully white

[ect5150]

if you correct the black you will have the same thing as the season sets for the dark area
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

This statement just isn't true. The images you have posted have "crushed the blacks." By that I mean the black level itself has been completely lowered.

When you speak of removing the color cast using the whites, you are targeting the white only. Without targeting the blacks, you are leaving the color cast in the darker areas of the picture. In other words, using an eyedropper tool and sampling those pixels, you'll find that the original image may have had 15% more red in the eyes of a character. After the removal, the 15% of those targeted white pixels are now balanced. The issue is your black pixels will still have 15% more red in them. It isn't as noticeable since the levels are so low--- but it exists.

Speaking specifically, the linear transformation you've applied to the color channels are always start at the origin... which allows the blacks to keep the color cast in them. You can balance the blacks... not push them down to where excessive detail is lost.

It's also worth mentioning what you said is true though. The eyes on the film probably aren't always 100% white. We're just assuming they are using white paint on the animation cells. When correcting the color, you must have something to target. Targeting the eyes to be pure white seems reasonable. The same can be said of Goku's hair. I'm assuming they are using a true black of some kind, so I balance the blacks. Now--- how dark is the true black? That's the real issue I'm trying to point out here. The screens you've posted, they are an extreme... versus something that is slightly brighter (a very very very dark grey... but the grey is balanced... no hint of red in it).

Make sense? Normally, I try to post screen shots for this, but I don't have a great example on the hard drive, and I would have to dig to find an episode. To be honest, it might be worth posting the screens for others.

[genjosanzo8]

thanks for that, i use these screenshots because i haven't screens to post , but even if they are extreme they are what i mean, i didn't say that it cannot be done , just that the result is okay for me, i didn't notice these 15% on my tv, i don't know how to do that with the black with virtual dub, in after effect i didn't found the result better ( i am not a after effect professionnal)

[ect5150]

thanks for that, i use these screenshots because i haven't screens to post , but even if they are extreme they are what i mean, i didn't say that it cannot be done , just that the result is okay for me, i didn't notice these 15% on my tv, i don't know how to do that with the black with virtual dub, in after effect i didn't found the result better ( i am not a after effect professionnal)

To be clear - I'm just using the 15% number as an example. I didn't measure anything in anyone's posts. I've only started to notice it myself after I measure these things in Photoshop (using the eyedropper tool to look at the RGB values).

just that the result is okay for me,

Ultimately, this is all that matters since none of us have the masters nor do we have a fantastic way to reference the actual proper colors. Film seems to get damaged over time, animation cels start to fade, etc...

[genjosanzo8]

sure, or extract each frame and correct one by one lol

[genjosanzo8]

Color correcting Dragon Ball Z

[Metalwario64]

I think that's too pale and desaturated.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I think that's too pale and desaturated.

Keep in mind that there's no way to correct the colors perfectly unless you have the entire broadcast version (or the original film) at your disposal. It's a trade-off, they traded a bit of saturation for a more accurate representation of the color proportions.

[genjosanzo8]

I think that's too pale and desaturated.

like these cel?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I think that's too pale and desaturated.

like these cel?

This looks fantastic!