Unpopular DB opinions

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Sykin
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Sykin » Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:26 pm

Noah wrote:
Sykin wrote:Super's power scaling actually isn't too bad.
Really? Then why don't you try to make sense with it? :)
This probably isn't the thread for that lol. It's just not as complex as some people like to make out to be as long as you pay attention to what characters say about things.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Ripper 30 » Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:48 am

Sykin wrote:Super's power scaling actually isn't too bad.
anyone can surpass ssj God nowdays in Super.
I prefer Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, DB/Z/GT Movies, Dragon Ball Super and Dragon Ball GT in Japanese.
For DBZ Kai and two new Movies I like both Dub and Sub. I Prefer Shunsuke Kikuchi Soundtracks over All other Composers.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by GamerSkull » Mon Jan 08, 2018 6:21 pm

This is my first post. I hope I'm doing this right. I'm quite new to forums in general.

I guess I'll just list all of my unpopular opinions at once:

- I don't consider anything but the manga and Bardock: Father of Goku as canon. I treat everything else, including Super, as a "what-if" story or something that happens in an alternate universe.
- Dragon Ball prior to the Saiyan arc was written better and had better characters in comparison to the "Z" portion.
- Goku should have been the only person to ever go Super Saiyan... and there should not have been further levels of the transformation.
- Super Saiyan 3 has an ugly design.
- Goku was a better character in early Dragon Ball, where he seemed to have actually gotten most of his development. He seems to stagnate/get worse after Freeza.
- The Cell arc is worse than the Buu arc.
- The Saiyan arc is the best of the "Z" arcs, and The Red Ribbon Army arc is the best of the original Dragonball arcs.
- I don't particularly like Vegeta's character post-Freeza or even understand his popularity. He's made things worse for the heroes in all the arcs afterwards despite being on their side.
- Vegeta should have stayed dead after Freeza killed him.
- I don't care much for the Vegeta x Bulma relationship and I certainly don't think Vegeta is that great as a husband or father.
- Goten is better than Kid Trunks.
- Goku should have stayed dead after the Cell arc and Gohan should have been the one to deal with Buu.
- I like Videl with her short hair better than her when she had pigtails.
- Bulma looks better with the purple hair she is depicted of having in the manga vs. the anime's blue.
- I think Chi-Chi during the 23rd Budokai is the hottest female design in the entire series.
- I feel like the earthling characters should have been given appropriate power-ups to keep up instead of degenerating out of relevance.
- I would have liked to see where the Yamcha x Bulma stuff could have gone had Toriyama not needed a plot device to create Trunks.
- I don't think Master Roshi should have been used in Super's current Tournament of Power, I rather liked the idea of him having reached his prime long ago and stepping down.
- While the baseball episode with Yamcha in Super was enjoyable enough, I loathe the fact that the meme has now been referenced in-universe.
- Yamcha memes have been overdone and I wish the character hadn't gotten so colossally screwed by the writing.
- If it wasn't obvious already, I think Yamcha is awesome.

And finally, my biggest one:

- With some tweaking here and there to bring about more closure to the series, the Namek/Freeza stuff should have been where Dragon Ball ended. And if not there, then the 23rd Budokai would be a previous arc with a fitting place for the series to end.

I'm sure I have more but I can't really think of any at the moment that bears mentioning. I hope I posted right. :P
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Lord Beerus » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:09 pm

Ripper 30 wrote:
Sykin wrote:Super's power scaling actually isn't too bad.
anyone can surpass ssj God nowdays in Super.
Happens to every SSJ form. SSJ was hyped up as huge deal on Namek. And it only had real importance for one major fight. Then it meant nothing after the arc it was introduced in as the main cast became stronger than a SSJ. Same deal with SSJ2 and SSJ3.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Ripper 30 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:52 am

Lord Beerus wrote:
Ripper 30 wrote:
Sykin wrote:Super's power scaling actually isn't too bad.
anyone can surpass ssj God nowdays in Super.
Happens to every SSJ form. SSJ was hyped up as huge deal on Namek. And it only had real importance for one major fight. Then it meant nothing after the arc it was introduced in as the main cast became stronger than a SSJ. Same deal with SSJ2 and SSJ3.
but in Super its literally everyone, the worst case was Future Trunks reaching ssj rage and is stronger than Ssj Blue vegetto despite only being ssj3 level. Roshi is unnecessarily over powered. we never got to see power scaling in such a bad way, even if it had inconsistent power scaling at times atleast some explanation was always there.
I prefer Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, DB/Z/GT Movies, Dragon Ball Super and Dragon Ball GT in Japanese.
For DBZ Kai and two new Movies I like both Dub and Sub. I Prefer Shunsuke Kikuchi Soundtracks over All other Composers.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by TheDipDap1234 » Tue Jan 09, 2018 5:09 am

I didn't like Jiren vs Goku special that much. I thought the fight was decent, but the spirit bomb scene was way too long, and UI Goku vs Jiren wasn't as good as I thought it was going to be. It also had WAY too many scenes with the people on the bench talking, and the Ribrianne vs Goku fight was unnecessarily long.

I highly prefer Goten over kid Trunks in Z.

ChiChi is one of the best characters of the series.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:35 am

Ripper 30 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:
Ripper 30 wrote: anyone can surpass ssj God nowdays in Super.
Happens to every SSJ form. SSJ was hyped up as huge deal on Namek. And it only had real importance for one major fight. Then it meant nothing after the arc it was introduced in as the main cast became stronger than a SSJ. Same deal with SSJ2 and SSJ3.
but in Super its literally everyone, the worst case was Future Trunks reaching ssj rage and is stronger than Ssj Blue vegetto despite only being ssj3 level. Roshi is unnecessarily over powered. we never got to see power scaling in such a bad way, even if it had inconsistent power scaling at times atleast some explanation was always there.
It's not literally everyone. It's only really the heavy hitters that can challenge or completely defeat SSJG Goku:
- Gohan
- Hit
- Vegeta
- All the Hakaishin
- All the Angels
- Grand Priest
- Jiren
- Toppo
- Dyspo
- Freeza
- #17
- Zamasu
- Goku Black

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Super_Divine_Genki » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:59 pm

TheDipDap1234 wrote:ChiChi is one of the best characters of the series.
I'm not sure how far up the list Chi Chi is for myself, but I pretty much agree. I also really like the strange, yet fitting, dynamic of the Goku/Chi Chi relationship. Both characters are dialed up to the extreme in their own way. For not being a top-tier character, Chi Chi has got a strong screen presence whenever the series gives her the time.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by KuririnNoKotoKa » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:16 pm

ekrolo2 wrote:Goku should've been 100% to blame for the Tournament of Power happening, them trying to pussyfoot around it by saying "Oh Zeno, this dumb kid cares enough about the advancement of multiversal civilization to plan a massive eradication but just forgot about it!" annoys the crap out of me.

And don't tell me "Well it was actually DUR GURANDU PRIEST! who wants to do that because he's evil!". You people think Goku's turned into a serial killer the second he smirks, someone smirking or being morally apathetic about death is not the sign of evil.
Did you miss episode 81?

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Onibaku » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:22 pm

GamerSkull wrote:- Goten is better than Kid Trunks.
Finally someone who gets it

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by The Patrolman » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:50 am

I think the Copy Vegeta filler arc was entertaining at the best.
The Last Jedi is a terrible movie

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by ABED » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:09 am

Canon is interesting, but few care about it. They just want something to enjoy. So I think we should just let it go. Canon doesn't matter.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by DragonBallKing » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:23 pm

Most of the Japanese Kai replacements good and some are great like the Ginyu force except for Recoome, and also nappa. I actually think JPN Kai suffers more because of Wakamoto's modern take on cell, It sounds so goofy and over the top that I can hardly take it seriously.
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Original Dragon Ball arcs ranking: 23rd Budokai, Saiyan, 21st Budokai, Red Ribbon, Freeza, Piccolo Daimao, 22nd Budokai, DB Hunt, Cell, Buu

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by DragonBallKing » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:27 pm

ABED wrote:Canon is interesting, but few care about it. They just want something to enjoy. So I think we should just let it go. Canon doesn't matter.
It matters because otherwise Toei/Tori would have just put Broli in Super instead of creating Kale.
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Original Dragon Ball arcs ranking: 23rd Budokai, Saiyan, 21st Budokai, Red Ribbon, Freeza, Piccolo Daimao, 22nd Budokai, DB Hunt, Cell, Buu

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by DragonBallKing » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:28 pm

The Patrolman wrote:I think the Copy Vegeta filler arc was entertaining at the best.
That's how I feel about the last jedi. :D
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Original Dragon Ball arcs ranking: 23rd Budokai, Saiyan, 21st Budokai, Red Ribbon, Freeza, Piccolo Daimao, 22nd Budokai, DB Hunt, Cell, Buu

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sintzu
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by sintzu » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:39 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:It's not literally everyone. It's only really the heavy hitters that can challenge or completely defeat SSJG Goku.
Krillin went up against SsjB Goku...somehow.

Roshi went from being 22nd Tenkaichi Tien's level to one of the strongest characters in the 8 universes...somehow.

Gohan went from being one shotted by 1st form Freeza to Goku's level just by training with Piccolo who's even weaker than him...somehow.

17 went from being weaker than Cell arc Goku to being on Blue Goku's level by...protecting a forest.

Future Trunks went from Ssj2 to Blue Vegetto's level...because of hope...I guess.

The original manga had its issues but nothing ever got this bad where things just stopped making sense. The above (among many other examples) is simply lazy writing on everyone's part including Toriyama's.
July 9th 2018 will be remembered as the day Broly became canon.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Lord Beerus » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:25 pm

sintzu wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote:It's not literally everyone. It's only really the heavy hitters that can challenge or completely defeat SSJG Goku.
Krillin went up against SsjB Goku...somehow.

Roshi went from being 22nd Tenkaichi Tien's level to one of the strongest characters in the 8 universes...somehow.

Gohan went from being one shotted by 1st form Freeza to Goku's level just by training with Piccolo who's even weaker than him...somehow.

17 went from being weaker than Cell arc Goku to being on Blue Goku's level by...protecting a forest.

Future Trunks went from Ssj2 to Blue Vegetto's level...because of hope...I guess.

The original manga had its issues but nothing ever got this bad where things just stopped making sense. The above (among many other examples) is simply lazy writing on everyone's part including Toriyama's.
It's well established that Goku, and many other characters in the show, can manage his strength even when he's their either in a ridiculous powerful form or just ridiculously strong by default. I mean, if the characters could control their energy they would be blowing up the planet by just powering up. You miight as well start asking why Krillin or Mr Satan didn't implode from when Perfect Cell hit him or why Bulma's head wasn't taken off her shoulder from when Beerus slapped her. It's really a non-issue. Especially since the episode in question made it clear that Krillin wouldn't be able to defeat a Base Saiyan tier character in raw power.

Roshi is nowhere near one of the strongest characters in the 8 universes. He got flattened like a pancake by Base Goku from a single Kamehameha. And we don't see he perform any better than that in the Tournament Of Power.

I don't see what the issue is. Piccolo trained with a 4 year old Gohan for 6 months an became 10 times stronger from it in the Saiyan arc. Gohan spent several months training off-screen and reached the point where he could challenge SSJ Goku evenly (Episode 75). And that is a pretty big deal considering that it was already established that Goku's base form was stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks (Episode 45 and 46). So Gohan already made huge gains from training with Piccolo after the events of ROF (Episode 30).

#17 did off-screen training. Nothing new or fundamentally broken about that as characters make massive leaps in strength doing what he's done. And considering it's been more than ten years, it's nothing really to get your knickers in a twist about.

Future Trunks is an unusual case. But we've seen that rage can close the gap in power, despite how large it may be (Gohan in the Saiyan, Namek and Cell arc and Vegeta in Battle Of Gods), so it's plausible.

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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by sintzu » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:38 pm

Lord Beerus wrote:It's well established that Goku can manage his strength even when he's in a ridiculous powerful form or just ridiculously strong by default.

Roshi is nowhere near one of the strongest characters in the 8 universes.

Piccolo trained with a 4 year old Gohan for 6 months and became 10 times stronger from it in the Saiyan arc.

Gohan spent several months training off-screen and reached the point where he could challenge SSJ Goku evenly (Episode 75).

#17 did off-screen training. Nothing new or fundamentally broken about that.

Future Trunks is an unusual case.
If he's going to fight on a level close to Krillin's then why bother transforming to any form let alone his strongest one in the first place ?

He took down 2-3 characters if I remember correctly and went up against Frost so he's powerful but we're never told why.

He also trained alone for 6 months which most likely played a major role in his power boost.

Normal training should be nowhere near as effective as training with Whis.

There's nothing broken about going from Cell arc Ssj Goku's level to Black arc SsjB Goku's level by doing normal training on earth ? In that case shouldn't Vegeta have gotten that strong between the cell and Buu arcs as he had a similar amount of time and Bulma's gravity room ?

It'd be OK if it was the only case.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by ABED » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:44 pm

DragonBallKing wrote:
ABED wrote:Canon is interesting, but few care about it. They just want something to enjoy. So I think we should just let it go. Canon doesn't matter.
It matters because otherwise Toei/Tori would have just put Broli in Super instead of creating Kale.
I don't see the connection. And canon is whatever they say it is, so it's a moo point.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions

Post by Noah » Fri Jan 12, 2018 4:58 pm

ABED wrote:
DragonBallKing wrote:It matters because otherwise Toei/Tori would have just put Broli in Super instead of creating Kale.
I don't see the connection. And canon is whatever they say it is, so it's a moo point.
I also don't see the connection, because Toei/Toriyama introducing Kale felt more like a reference to Broly than a 'canon' issue (something never officially stated in this franchise).
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