Is there anyone that stopped or decide not to watch Super?

[Gaffer Tape]

There's a lot that simply feels baffling. I remember waiting and waiting during the first arc for the Pilaf gang to explain why they were younger, or to have some role approaching their relevance in the movie version, and -- I don't even feel bad about spoiling this -- neither happens.

Ugh, this drives me so crazy. I mean, it may seem like a minor thing, and a thing that you should already know from the movies. But if I have to watch the movie to understand your retelling, then your retelling is a failure. And it's not as minor as it seems considering just how many episodes Pilaf and the gang are in. Every single time they're on screen, defying one of the most basic attributes of their existence that nearly every Dragon Ball fan knows, it calls massive attention to itself. They have had over 70 episodes now to devote any kind of throwaway line to this, and yet they have neglected to do so for a year and a half.

In fact, not only have they neglected to rectify the problem, they've doubled down on it! Because apparently (I'll speak vaguely to avoid spoilers as much as possible here), they decided to make it an issue that transcends timelines, despite the fact that the results require even MORE explanations in the other timelines!

[rereboy]

There's a lot that simply feels baffling. I remember waiting and waiting during the first arc for the Pilaf gang to explain why they were younger, or to have some role approaching their relevance in the movie version, and -- I don't even feel bad about spoiling this -- neither happens.

Ugh, this drives me so crazy. I mean, it may seem like a minor thing, and a thing that you should already know from the movies. But if I have to watch the movie to understand your retelling, then your retelling is a failure. And it's not as minor as it seems considering just how many episodes Pilaf and the gang are in. Every single time they're on screen, defying one of the most basic attributes of their existence that nearly every Dragon Ball fan knows, it calls massive attention to itself. They have had over 70 episodes now to devote any kind of throwaway line to this, and yet they have neglected to do so for a year and a half.

In fact, not only have they neglected to rectify the problem, they've doubled down on it! Because apparently (I'll speak vaguely to avoid spoilers as much as possible here), they decided to make it an issue that transcends timelines, despite the fact that the results require even MORE explanations in the other timelines!

Yeah. Glaring, missed opportunities that would be so easy to do and would significantly improve things drive me up a wall. And there are so many of them.

[Cipher]

Ugh, this drives me so crazy. I mean, it may seem like a minor thing, and a thing that you should already know from the movies. But if I have to watch the movie to understand your retelling, then your retelling is a failure. And it's not as minor as it seems considering just how many episodes Pilaf and the gang are in. Every single time they're on screen, defying one of the most basic attributes of their existence that nearly every Dragon Ball fan knows, it calls massive attention to itself. They have had over 70 episodes now to devote any kind of throwaway line to this, and yet they have neglected to do so for a year and a half.

In fact, not only have they neglected to rectify the problem, they've doubled down on it! Because apparently (I'll speak vaguely to avoid spoilers as much as possible here), they decided to make it an issue that transcends timelines, despite the fact that the results require even MORE explanations in the other timelines!

Yeah. It's still unbelievable to me for all of the reasons covered above.

It seems like something someone was supposed to write into an early script, but when it didn't happen, no one caught it. Which like ... what the hell? And why are they even there, receiving build-up, if they don't play a role in the first arc either in terms of plot or a punchline gag? It feels like no one was steering the ship.

I remember being one of the few, if not the only person, constantly focusing on that as the first arc aired, and I felt like I was in crazy town. Especially as people were saying things like, "Well, these adaptations are necessary for people who haven't seen the movies" right and left. "Oh, the Pilaf gang? Well, that's explained in the movie."

It's a "minor" problem, but it says so much about the series' production.

EDIT -- Speaking of their importance across timelines, the TV adaptation also manages to cut the subplot Toriyama picks up on for a certain relationship between characters in a later arc (since it cuts every funny or relevant part of their role in the movie). Oops.

[ekrolo2]

The Pilaf Gang can't be children no matter what, if you have them summon Shenron pre-Dende, they'd be teenagers by now and none of them look like it (and they're not Saiyan's so you can't even bullshit away as them genetically being runts) and if you do it post-Dende, it still doesn't work because they have 3 wishes!

[Cipher]

The Pilaf Gang can't be children no matter what, if you have them summon Shenron pre-Dende, they'd be teenagers by now and none of them look like it (and they're not Saiyan's so you can't even bullshit away as them genetically being runts) and if you do it post-Dende, it still doesn't work because they have 3 wishes!

That's actually not a problem; at least no more so than Trunks' and Goten's appearances are. If they made the wish within a year of the androids arriving, they'd be the same biological age as Trunks. That's the route Toyotaro took explicitly in the manga.

Regardless, if you're only watching Super, you'd never know why they're young in the first place.

[ekrolo2]

The Pilaf Gang can't be children no matter what, if you have them summon Shenron pre-Dende, they'd be teenagers by now and none of them look like it (and they're not Saiyan's so you can't even bullshit away as them genetically being runts) and if you do it post-Dende, it still doesn't work because they have 3 wishes!

That's actually not a problem; at least no more so than Trunks' and Goten's appearances are. If they made the wish within a year of the androids arriving, they'd be the same biological age as Trunks. That's the route Toyotaro took explicitly in the manga.

Still, Mai looks way too much like a little kid to pass off as someone who'd be 12-13 or possibly 14 now. Pilaf and Shu were short before but are we really gonna pretend that everyone except Gohan on this planet stays a runt until they're within spitting distance of legal adulthood?

[Cipher]

Still, Mai looks way too much like a little kid to pass off as someone who'd be 12-13 or possibly 14 now. Pilaf and Shu were short before but are we really gonna pretend that everyone except Gohan on this planet stays a runt until they're within spitting distance of legal adulthood?

I guess so. I feel like we're getting into a separate issue, which is Super's being stuck in sitcom time. Babies can be born, but no can age or change drastically despite years passing.

[floofychan333]

I haven't even started watching it yet because I'm still a few episodes away from finishing Dragon Ball Z and I'll probably just watch the dub.

[Majin Buu]

I have not watched it. Like a previous poster I was also kind of annoyed when it was announced and even more so when Toei declared that it would be at least 100 episodes because as someone in my late 20s with a full time job I no longer have the time or energy to devote to another 100+ episode long runner. I'm generally not the type of person that needs more of a series if I was satisfied with how it turned out. I was satisfied with how the original series turned out and because of that I personally wish Dragon Ball was allowed to just exist as a completed work without these continuous attempts to make it the new hotness; but I know that will never happen because Dragon Ball is the big money maker, and that gravy train needs to keep rolling.

Another reason I was annoyed by Super's announcement is because I knew there would eventually be new developments and retcons that would start to ruin stuff from the original series for me (which I still hold dear) since that had already been happening since Battle of Gods came out; and lo and behold, the Future Trunks arc did just that by overriding Future Trunks' happy ending from the Cell arc. That being said, there are some interesting concepts in that arc that have me intrigued enough to check it out (though I had to spoil myself on the story to get interested enough in the first place), so messing up Future Trunks' life more may end up feeling justified to me depending on if I enjoy the arc or not.

Also, the music is a huge turn off for me. The few pieces of Sumitomo's score I've listened to just don't feel like Dragon Ball to me, it feels "off".

[sintzu]

The Pilaf Gang can't be children no matter what, if you have them summon Shenron pre-Dende, they'd be teenagers by now and none of them look like it and if you do it post-Dende, it still doesn't work because they have 3 wishes!

It's another example of changing something that didn't need to be changed.

Not only does that not make sense but the last time we saw them was when King Piccolo dropped them out of his plane so technically they shouldn't even be alive.

If you're only watching Super, you'd never know why they're young in the first place.

Which shows how rushed into production it was.

I was satisfied with how the original series turned out and because of that I personally wish Dragon Ball was allowed to just exist as a completed work without these continuous attempts to make it the new hotness.

This is what happens when a franchise gets really popular.

On the plus side at least Toriyama ended the original story when he felt like it should end instead of dragging it out for $$$ so if you just like that then you don't have to watch what's being released now cause that story was already completed.

[Gaffer Tape]

Not only does that not make sense but the last time we saw them was when King Piccolo dropped them out of his plane so technically they shouldn't even be alive.

Actually, the last time we saw them was after they crashed into the ground, at which point they demonstrated that, aside from a few cartoony-looking bumps and bruises, they were perfectly fine and certainly alive.

[sintzu]

Actually, the last time we saw them was after they crashed into the ground, at which point they demonstrated that, aside from a few cartoony-looking bumps and bruises, they were perfectly fine and certainly alive.

Never mind then but the point of their age not making sense still stands.

[Man-Child]

With previous series you mean Z? or GT?

Z. I should've clarified.

[Cipher]

Another reason I was annoyed by Super's announcement is because I knew there would eventually be new developments and retcons that would start to ruin stuff from the original series for me (which I still hold dear) since that had already been happening since Battle of Gods came out; and lo and behold, the Future Trunks arc did just that by overriding Future Trunks' happy ending from the Cell arc. That being said, there are some interesting concepts in that arc that have me intrigued enough to check it out (though I had to spoil myself on the story to get interested enough in the first place), so messing up Future Trunks' life more may end up feeling justified to me depending on if I enjoy the arc or not.

As someone who was super cynical about that arc when it was first announced, I will say that I wound up being a big supporter by (or maybe solely because of) the end of its run. Super's usual episodic blemishes are there, so I'm still not telling anyone to rush out and watch it, but I think it's one of the bits of Super so far that's felt narratively worthwhile.

A lot of that owes itself to Trunks not being locked into a concluded character arc the way Goku and Vegeta are though (I'd feel so differently about the series' overall addition to the story if its two protagonists could just grow and change, and the Trunks arc isn't free from this issue; he's just there to take some weight off it). In fact, the original run hardly delves into his character or his world at all, or at least it's all pretty background by the end of the Cell arc. Trunks is a fairly unique character for Dragon Ball, so Super had plenty of avenues for mining his world for one more interesting story.

But yeah. I definitely went from "Messing up Trunks' life more is such a cynical way to get another storyline out of the series" to "If the series has to continue, messing up Trunks' life more was definitely the right way to go." For whatever that's worth. Is it justified enough to bring back the series just to tell that story? No. Is it more justified than the other material we've gotten in Super so far? I'd say yeah, probably. At least it had a little weight and verve behind it in the end.

[Majin Buu]

In fact, the original run hardly delves into his character or his world at all, or at least it's all pretty background by the end of the Cell arc.

That's one of the areas where I think the anime improved on the original story, via the Trunks TV special.

[Big Green The Yoshi]

Not really, but I just started watching it. I'm on Universe 6.

[Vijay]

I'll be frank. I'm not an ardent DBZ fan

Despite having spent over 1000 dollars on DragonBall related items: Box sets, manga, toys, games hell DBZ was & still is my Oxygen, Water & Food

I think there are MUCH superior, hardcore DBZ fans who I think have dedicated their entire life (such as Herms, Mike who went to great extent of actually forming a Website such as Kanzenshuu & giving exhaustive amount of infos frm Animators to Voice Actor/Actresses to Merchandise Sales etc)

With that being said, I am humbled to say I'm one of the most casual DragonBall fan & YES!

I 've washed my hands off Super clean da moment I saw Egyptian Cat & weird "tubelight" server/guardian in a DragonBall franchise

Despite my hate on Frieza as villain (thx to TOEI's 20 filler episodes & Uchiyama & Ebisawa Yukio's traumatic drawings in Frieza Saga) I felt RoF Arc to be slightly....bearable

Rest is meh. Personally GT > Supa

[floofychan333]

The Pilaf Gang can't be children no matter what, if you have them summon Shenron pre-Dende, they'd be teenagers by now and none of them look like it (and they're not Saiyan's so you can't even bullshit away as them genetically being runts) and if you do it post-Dende, it still doesn't work because they have 3 wishes!

That's actually not a problem; at least no more so than Trunks' and Goten's appearances are. If they made the wish within a year of the androids arriving, they'd be the same biological age as Trunks. That's the route Toyotaro took explicitly in the manga.

Still, Mai looks way too much like a little kid to pass off as someone who'd be 12-13 or possibly 14 now. Pilaf and Shu were short before but are we really gonna pretend that everyone except Gohan on this planet stays a runt until they're within spitting distance of legal adulthood?

I've noticed that kids in Dragon World go through a drastic growth spurt and instantly look like adults by age 16 or 17. Goku looked like he was 8 at age 15.

[floofychan333]

Not only does that not make sense but the last time we saw them was when King Piccolo dropped them out of his plane so technically they shouldn't even be alive.

Actually, the last time we saw them was after they crashed into the ground, at which point they demonstrated that, aside from a few cartoony-looking bumps and bruises, they were perfectly fine and certainly alive.

Additionally, they appeared in the filler episodes at the end of DB but I guess those don't count.

[ekrolo2]

I've noticed that kids in Dragon World go through a drastic growth spurt and instantly look like adults by age 16 or 17. Goku looked like he was 8 at age 15.

That's a Saiyan thing and only Goku had that til Super. Gohan aged normally as did Future Trunks who looked his appropriate age when the special happened. Roughly the same age present Trunks is as the moment yet he remains a runt