Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

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Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by King-K9 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:46 am

Like, are people actually forgetting that Vegeta was never the main character? If you seriously expect Vegeta to be stronger than Goku for more than a few episodes then clearly you haven't caught on by now. Even in the Buu saga, Vegeta himself says that Goku is superior to him.

I always hear fans complain "Why couldn't Vegeta get to kill *insert random villain here*? Why does it always have to be Goku"? And I always say the same thing, Goku is the main character, and always will be the main character. Just because Vegeta is your favorite character, doesn't mean he's the star of the show. Whenever a villain dies, either Goku is responsible for it, or he is the reason another character managed to do it.

If Vegeta ever got to kill a villain, the writers would probably have Goku play a major part in it, otherwise it's just fanservice. Or he could be using an asspull like Trunks did in Super.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by PsionicWarrior » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:50 am

Vegeta is (supposed to be) Goku's everlasting rival. True that it makes sense for Goku to save the day as he is the main protagonist in the series but Vegeta could get a kill or two once in a while, him killing Freeza in RoF would have been great.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by VegettoEX » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:54 am

I mean, haven't you answered your own question? A fan of a character would sometimes like to see them get the limelight. That's really all there is to it.

In the case of Resurrection 'F', we were also coming off a direct comment from Toriyama himself saying:
Akira Toriyama wrote:As for Vegeta, in the event that there’s talk of another animated film, then next time, I’d like him to play the main role. (Of course, this is nothing more than intentions, and I haven’t decided anything at all.)
It was a little bit of a tease. Like when Gen Fukunaga told us we were going to get an uncut dub with the original music back in the mid-90s, and something totally different happened instead.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by King-K9 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:29 pm

VegettoEX wrote:I mean, haven't you answered your own question? A fan of a character would sometimes like to see them get the limelight. That's really all there is to it.

In the case of Resurrection 'F', we were also coming off a direct comment from Toriyama himself saying:
Akira Toriyama wrote:As for Vegeta, in the event that there’s talk of another animated film, then next time, I’d like him to play the main role. (Of course, this is nothing more than intentions, and I haven’t decided anything at all.)
It was a little bit of a tease. Like when Gen Fukunaga told us we were going to get an uncut dub with the original music back in the mid-90s, and something totally different happened instead.
Toriyama said that he'd LIKE to have him play the main role, not that he was going to. Maybe he could've worded it better, but people actually like they've been lied to. Also even though I technically didn't answer my question since I was anticipating a Vegeta fan to respond with how they feel.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:30 pm

Speaking as a DB fan in general, to me the kill doesn't matter, as long as the character have done interesting stuff in the arc or story that should be all that matters, like in the Buu arc Goku got the kill but it was Vegeta that came up with the idea. In the recent Black arc Vegeta played a more supportive role and that imo was much more satisfying and interesting then for example the Manga portrayal of the same arc where he is just shown constantly beating on the villains. In Resurrection "F" he didn't get the technical kill but his moment with Freeza was way more interesting and better than anything Goku got with Freeza.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by King-K9 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:33 pm

PsionicWarrior wrote:Vegeta is (supposed to be) Goku's everlasting rival. True that it makes sense for Goku to save the day as he is the main protagonist in the series but Vegeta could get a kill or two once in a while, him killing Freeza in RoF would have been great.
I personally dont mind the ending of ROF. The whole point of that movie was teaching Goku and Vegeta what they're flaws are. Goku is too laid back, which leads to the enemy getting the upper hand. Vegeta brags too much and toys with his opponent thus allowing them to do something unexpected, and instantly regain an advantage. It was supposed to be character development for the both of them.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:45 pm

Because DB is very long and Naruto (as an example) has managed to let other characters get the kill without it taking anything away from the main character so DB can do the same thing if it wanted to.

Vegeta has been a main character and a very popular one since he was introduced so at this point you'd think he would've gotten at least one main kill. The same thing applies to Zoro and Sanji in One Piece, It's a really long story yet for some reason Luffy has to always get the main fights and kills.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by ABED » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:53 pm

Vegeta has gotten plenty of important moments and kills. Other than Ginyu himself, Vegeta killed the rest of the team. He took advantage of others' work, but he still killed them. I like it when characters contribute in some tangible way to the story even if it's just being fodder for a bad guy. Chaozu giving his life was a great moment even though it did nothing. It helped show how tough Nappa was and how in over their heads his friends were.

There's not much to add beyond Vegeta fans getting irritated because their guy didn't get the limelight.
Because DB is very long and Naruto (as an example) has managed to let other characters get the kill without it taking anything away from the main character so DB can do the same thing if it wanted to.
Maybe, but not every story has to do that. The main character is Goku so he takes precedent, but the other characters should either contribute in some way or why else are they there? Being the guy to deliver the final blow isn't the only way to contribute something important to the story. Even if Gohan and Kuririn and Vegeta hadn't done anything to Freeza, they were still important to the Namek arc. The hunt for the DBs allowed them all to play an important role in the outcome of the story.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by King-K9 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:55 pm

sintzu wrote:Because DB is very long and Naruto (as an example) has managed to let other characters get the kill without it taking anything away from the main character so DB can do the same thing if it wanted to.
But Naruto and Dragon ball are two completely different products. Also, the Dragon ball cast isn't as deep as the Naruto cast. Almost every character in Naruto has had a long running arc devoted to each of them. Most of the Dragon ball cast don't have that luxury. The only characters with long running arcs in this series are:
Goku
Vegeta
Gohan
Future Trunks
And Piccolo.

Every other character has either had a set of breif character development moments. Or a small rivalry with Goku (like Tien, Krillin and Yamcha).

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:24 pm

King-K9 wrote:Naruto and Dragon ball are two completely different products.
Being different products didn't stop Naruto and other Shonen from using what worked in DB so why can't DB use what works in other Shonen ?
ABED wrote:Maybe, but not every story has to do that.
I think they do, if there's a way to improve a story then I think the author should do it.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by ABED » Thu Apr 20, 2017 1:26 pm

That assumes that doing so is an improvement. I don't see it that way. It's another option out of a few.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by MozillaVulpix » Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:10 pm

And I always get a little bit annoyed when people say "Well, Gohan killed Cell, so clearly they can give to kill to someone else if they want to." The only reason that happened was because Gohan was becoming the literal protagonist of the story. And the protagonist generally defeats the arc villain. I guess with Future Trunks getting the last attack against Zamasu, things are a little different. But Vegeta getting the kill, at this point, would be more like a cool fanservice moment. Not a crucial plot element necessary for the story to be complete.
I could have gotten into anything...and yet I chose the story aimed at young Japanese boys about martial arts, and later about super-powerful aliens punching each other really hard.

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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:54 pm

MozillaVulpix wrote:Vegeta getting the kill, at this point, would be more like a cool fanservice moment. Not a crucial plot element necessary for the story to be complete.
It could be a main plot element if they wanted it to be. same thing with Piccolo, if they wrote him as the main character in a way that made sense then it would make sense.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by Boo Machine » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:09 pm

sintzu wrote: It could be a main plot element if they wanted it to be. same thing with Piccolo, if they wrote him as the main character in a way that made sense then it would make sense.
Well yeah, but you can say that for just about any character for just about any series. "It could work if they make it work."

But why would they want to make anyone else the main character? I can't really imagine them making Goku take a backseat to someone else. He is the face of the series after all.

Though I do understand the want for a character to have a big moment I don't see that big moment being killing whatever big bad boss.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by Chuquita » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:11 pm

I'm a fan of both Vegeta and Gokû; no I don't get mad about Gokû getting a kill.

If there's anything I'm upset/disappointed about, it's watching them slowly drift apart from one another over the past couple arcs. I realize it has to happen in order to keep EoZ canon, but their friendship in the first half of Super was a wish-fulfilled for me so seeing that breaking apart (though it seems like it's more on Vegeta who's changing priorities) makes me saddened and ultimately leads to me caring less about Super as a whole (which I guess has its upsides because I'm not spending as much time on it during this Omni Tournament arc atm).
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:59 pm

Boo Machine wrote:Why would they want to make anyone else the main character?

I can't really imagine them making Goku take a backseat to someone else. He is the face of the series after all.
Why wouldn't they ? it gives them more to do and it'll build up the franchise even more.

Nartuo is the face of his franchise yet he always took backseat to others and still does. It didn't take anything away from him so why would it take anything away from Goku ?
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by Boo Machine » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:12 pm

sintzu wrote:
Boo Machine wrote:Why would they want to make anyone else the main character?

I can't really imagine them making Goku take a backseat to someone else. He is the face of the series after all.
Why wouldn't they ? it gives them more to do and it'll build up the franchise even more.

Nartuo is the face of his franchise yet he always took backseat to others and still does. It didn't take anything away from him so why would it take anything away from Goku ?
I don't feel that just because one thing works for one series it means it's going to work for another.

That being said I suppose "backseat" wasn't a great way of phrasing it. More like I can't see them ripping the Main character role away from Goku. I'm aware that Stuff like Naruto and One piece had other character doing other things and didn't always focus on Naruto and Luffy. But Naruto and Luffy always stayed the main characters. Especially Luffy who always beats the big bad. I'd totally be up for other characters like Piccolo or Vegeta getting a moment, whatever that moment may be, but I don't feel like giving them the main character role JUST to be the one to kill the Big Bad of whatever arc is going to happen or if it would really even work.

The story would kind of have to revolve around them for it to not be awful. Like with the future Trunks arc, Trunks got the "final Blow", but it was an arc that centered around him and his issues. I feel if Vegeta got the Final Blow on Freeza in the Golden Freeza arc, it would have been awful. Awful because Vegeta was pretty much only a spectator the entire time with Goku doing the bulk of fighting. If the arc was centered on Vegeta then I'd understand.

Anywho I don't feel like Vegeta really NEEDS to kill anyone. He is already such a good character in his own right. But it's not because he killed anyone but because of his character arc. He doesn't need to kill a Big Villain to prove himself. He already has so many great moments. Just, Ya know, not as many as Goku.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:20 pm

Boo Machine wrote:Naruto and Luffy always stayed the main characters. Especially Luffy who always beats the big bad.

I'd totally be up for other characters like Piccolo or Vegeta getting a moment, whatever that moment may be, but I don't feel like giving them the main character role JUST to be the one to kill the Big Bad of whatever arc is going to happen or if it would really even work.

I don't feel like Vegeta really NEEDS to kill anyone. He is already such a good character in his own right.
I agree with Luffy cause he always got the final battle but in Naruto Sasuke took over on a regular basis like when he fought Itachi and Danzo.

I don't want it to be like Gohan and Cell where it kind of came out of nowhere. With Piccolo for example I'd like an arc (nothing too long) of him going after the Namakien book of legends and taking down whoever has it.

At this point he doesn't cause he has a lot of great moments under his belt but I feel like sometime down the line he should get an arc to himself.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by Boo Machine » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:27 pm

sintzu wrote:
I agree with Luffy cause he always got the final battle but in Naruto Sasuke took over on a regular basis like when he fought Itachi and Danzo.
Well he had to be the one to kill Itachi. If it was anyone else it would be kind of lame. I don't know about Danzo, since, honestly I stopped following Naruto after the Kage meeting or something.
sintzu wrote:At this point he doesn't cause he has a lot of great moments under his belt but I feel like sometime down the line he should get an arc to himself.
For Vegeta I can only really see one option for him to have his own arc at this time, and that is Planet Salad. Should they ever visit perhaps there shall be a conflict waiting for him there. Wasn't there an interview where Akira expresses interest in giving Vegeta a story? I don't remember too well but I believe it was during Resurrection F or a little after it came out.
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Re: Why do Vegeta fans get mad whenever Goku gets a kill?

Post by sintzu » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:29 pm

Boo Machine wrote:Wasn't there an interview where Akira expresses interest in giving Vegeta a story? I don't remember too well but I believe it was during Resurrection F or a little after it came out.
It was before RF was announced and he said he was interested in Vegeta playing the main role which he so far has in Black's manga arc so maybe that's what he was talking about.
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