GT vs. Super: Which is more damaging to the series' image?

[DBZAOTA482]

As it turns out there's a lot of hate for Super within the fandom some even going as far as to act like it doesn't exist and claim GT as the true sequel to Dragon Ball Z. However, GT itself is still very much hated and is largely viewed as a poorly-executed mess.

One thing that's generally agreed upon is they're much inferior to what is one of the most popular and influential anime/manga in existence.

Now which one do you think disgraces the legacy of the original series more?

GT
-Lack of any real identity
-Goku Time
-Fight scenes had next to no choreography
-Made Japanese fans lose interest in Dragon Ball and pretty much killed the franchise (if not the extreme popularity DB received in the west it probably would've remained dead)

Super
-Retcon galore
-Major art/animation issues
-Problematic characterization
-Toriyama publically complained about the anime


Which is more damaging to the reputation of Dragon Ball?

[Kanassa]

I think Super is better than Z and I hated Gt, but... I don't think either damaged Dragon Ball's reputation to a noticeable degree. The reaction from haters to either is "I don't like this, so I'll ignore it because only Og and Z are REAL Dragon Ball". Really, these seem to only elevate Dragon Balls reputation. For the people that like them, it]s more good Dragon ball content, for those that hate them those series don't count enough to impact Dragon Ball's reputation.

[Dbzfan94]

I think Super is better than Z

I couldn't disagree more, but I'm interested to hear why you think that.

[Zephyr]

GT's been long and forgotten, and whose ultimate legacy is to be the brunt of memes, and to push merchandise on the backburner. And, even back when it came out, it really only served as a little epilogue to the anime's story. It has pretty much no bearing on the series' image. It now seems like it's been relegated to the red headed step child of the franchise. Pretty inoffensive.

Super, on the other hand, is currently still going, with no signs of stopping. It currently is getting to the point where it'll be at least twice as long as GT. I think its issues are far more consistent, pronounced, and significant than GT's issues ever were. And it's not a little capstone. It's now filling a void that never needed to be filled, existing as an interquel to an already finished story. That's harder to stick the landing for, in comparison to providing a chronologically-later epilogue, and yet it's even more sloppily being executed. And it finds a way to seemingly garner more praise in the fandom's collective unconscious (just in personal experience), seemingly based on little more than a marginal increase in Toriyama's involvement. The damage that can cause to the series' image is tremendous.

Gonna go with Super.

[PeanutSaiyan]

As an anime, Super has damaged the series immensely. Although the popularity behind the characters is so huge that I don't think it's irreversible if a well made show appears on the horizon , but it has greatly lowered the standard moving forward and that is the biggest tragedy.

[Dbzfan94]

GT's been long and forgotten, and whose ultimate legacy is to be the brunt of memes, and to push merchandise on the backburner. And, even back when it came out, it really only served as a little epilogue to the anime's story. It has pretty much no bearing on the series' image. It now seems like it's been relegated to the red headed step child of the franchise. Pretty inoffensive.

Super, on the other hand, is currently still going, with no signs of stopping. It currently is getting to the point where it'll be at least twice as long as GT. I think its issues are far more consistent, pronounced, and significant than GT's issues ever were. And it's not a little capstone. It's now filling a void that never needed to be filled, existing as an interquel to an already finished story. That's harder to stick the landing for, in comparison to providing a chronologically-later epilogue, and yet it's even more sloppily being executed. And it finds a way to seemingly garner more praise in the fandom's collective unconscious (just in personal experience), seemingly based on little more than a marginal increase in Toriyama's involvement. The damage that can cause to the series' image is tremendous.

Gonna go with Super.

Definitely. I never understood the idea of "manga creator involved = amazing." The original 13 movies have little to no Toriyama involvement and I enjoy (most of) them much more than I did the likes of Bog or RF.

[TheMikado]

GT's been long and forgotten, and whose ultimate legacy is to be the brunt of memes, and to push merchandise on the backburner. And, even back when it came out, it really only served as a little epilogue to the anime's story. It has pretty much no bearing on the series' image. It now seems like it's been relegated to the red headed step child of the franchise. Pretty inoffensive.

Super, on the other hand, is currently still going, with no signs of stopping. It currently is getting to the point where it'll be at least twice as long as GT. I think its issues are far more consistent, pronounced, and significant than GT's issues ever were. And it's not a little capstone. It's now filling a void that never needed to be filled, existing as an interquel to an already finished story. That's harder to stick the landing for, in comparison to providing a chronologically-later epilogue, and yet it's even more sloppily being executed. And it finds a way to seemingly garner more praise in the fandom's collective unconscious (just in personal experience), seemingly based on little more than a marginal increase in Toriyama's involvement. The damage that can cause to the series' image is tremendous.

Gonna go with Super.

Definitely. I never understood the idea of "manga creator involved = amazing." The original 13 movies have little to no Toriyama involvement and I enjoy (most of) them much more than I did the likes of Bog or RF.

I don't agree with everything but this is literally the correct answer.

[sintzu]

GT as flawed as it was, at least tried to be its own thing while Super although is overall better, is living on Z nostalgia and is a big merchandise commercial.

With GT being mostly ignored and Super being a mega $$$ hit, most will say GT did more harm cause no one payed much attention to it but that's why I think it didn't do much harm, no one cared about it and to most the franchise was the manga and the 2 original anime. Super on the other hand being so popular seems to be ruining its reputation due to how toy based it is and everyone being aware of it.

[Prince of Vegetables]

Dragon Ball Super. GT didn't make as many mistakes

[cheddarsword]

I see far more hate for GT, even today. Most people who "hate" Super haven't given it much of a chance which I can only assume is because of the lackluster retelling of BoG and Rez F.

GT was far more damaging. I'm not even sure Super can be called damaging at all. At least, compared to GT.

Dragon Ball Super. GT didn't make as many mistakes

GT only had two seasons. It didn't have enough time to make as many mistakes. That being said, in it's short time, the mistakes it made were bigger.

[Prince of Vegetables]

I see far more hate for GT, even today. Most people who "hate" Super haven't given it much of a chance which I can only assume is because of the lackluster retelling of BoG and Rez F.

GT was far more damaging. I'm not even sure Super can be called damaging at all. At least, compared to GT.

Dragon Ball Super. GT didn't make as many mistakes

GT only had two seasons. It didn't have enough time to make as many mistakes. That being said, in it's short time, the mistakes it made were bigger.

That is true. But Super doesn't feel like Dragon Ball

[cheddarsword]

I see far more hate for GT, even today. Most people who "hate" Super haven't given it much of a chance which I can only assume is because of the lackluster retelling of BoG and Rez F.

GT was far more damaging. I'm not even sure Super can be called damaging at all. At least, compared to GT.

Dragon Ball Super. GT didn't make as many mistakes

GT only had two seasons. It didn't have enough time to make as many mistakes. That being said, in it's short time, the mistakes it made were bigger.

That is true. But Super doesn't feel like Dragon Ball

Fair point, but the same could be said about Dragon Ball as a whole after Goku married Chichi. DB and DBZ go in such different directions that they almost feel like two different IPs.

People change. That has actually been one of Dragon Ball's best story points. To see Vegeta acting like a father is just a further evolution of his character that had only been lightly shown in the Buu saga. Goku going after stronger and stronger opponents is also a further evolution of his character that had always been seen. He's just strong enough to hold his own against the upper layer of gods now. There just hasn't been any real repercussions until now.

Super feels like Dragon Ball's natural evolution to me. I know not everyone will agree with that though. Yeah, it has mistakes. They all do. But GT's method of resolving characters ends just doesn't work for me.

Piccolo left to rot in hell after turning around completely years ago? Goku going off into the ether never to be seen by his family again? 17's family loses their loving husband and father?

I like GT. But there's plenty about GT I just plain hate as well.

[Boo Machine]

I hope this thread doesn't devolve into a "Lets bash GT/Super" dumping ground, but...

I don't think either does any damage to the series. Even if they were both the most horrible thing to exist I don't see how they can damage the image. I can't imagine anyone hating Dragonball because of Gt or Super. But maybe I'm just ignorant.

They're just extra entries into a series that finished a long time ago. Whether they're good or bad, the original is still there to enjoy.

I like both for the most part, so take that for what you will.

[sintzu]

I can't imagine anyone hating Dragonball because of Gt or Super. They're just extra entries into a series that finished a long time ago.

This is true for people who know about the franchise like everyone here but someone looking from the outside will think it's just a toy commercial based on Super's image.

[ekrolo2]

Broly and Resurrection F are far worse than either.

[Boo Machine]

I can't imagine anyone hating Dragonball because of Gt or Super. They're just extra entries into a series that finished a long time ago.

This is true for people who know about the franchise like everyone here but someone looking from the outside will think it's just a toy commercial based on Super's image.

From my experience, people from the outside enjoy GT/ and super, mostly, and the thought of a show being a toy commercial never really crosses their mind. Plus, I don't feel like being a toy commercial makes a show automatically bad.

[GreatSaiyaJeff]

That's kind of tough since GT did bring SSJ4 which has been a merchandise heaven. SS Blue doesn't seem to have nearly as the same appeal. But maybe that's just me, so I'm not sure if any of these series are damaging, they both have their fans and haters. Evolution did damage though, but luckily we got Battle of God's out of it.

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

First and foremost we should ask ourselves has either GT or SUPER damaged the franchise image at all?

Have they done anything offensively damanging worth noting? IMO then being lackluster or having sloopy execution is not damaging at all when even the original series had the same problems of sloopy and lackluster execution (YMMV on when and what level said problems were back then).

[Jinzoningen MULE]

First and foremost we should ask ourselves has either GT or SUPER damaged the franchise image at all?

Have they done anything offensively damanging worth noting? IMO then being lackluster or having sloopy execution is not damaging at all when even the original series had the same problems of sloopy and lackluster execution (YMMV on when and what level said problems were back then).

The introduction of Beerus totally devalues Freeza's character, so BoG definitely did.

[DBZAOTA482]

That's kind of tough since GT did bring SSJ4 which has been a merchandise heaven. SS Blue doesn't seem to have nearly as the same appeal. But maybe that's just me, so I'm not sure if any of these series are damaging, they both have their fans and haters. Evolution did damage though, but luckily we got Battle of God's out of it.

I wouldn't say Evolution damage the series' image at all. If anything it revitalized the image as it got Toriyama back into the series and showed that people still value Dragon Ball even throughout the years.