Character Motivation

[ABED]

Stemming from a discussion about Gohan at the Cell Games, it got me thinking of what is motiving the characters, be it surface level motivations and all the way down to the core of the characters. In a world where many stories get very convoluted, I think the simple fact that characters want something gets lost. That's all that a motivation is. Motivations answer the question "What does he/she want?" Feel free to be as detailed as you want.

To take a few, Goku wants to be the best martial artist he can be. That explains pretty much everything he ever does.
Kuririn wanted to get married.
Gohan wants to live a happy, peaceful, simple life. At his core, I think that explains everything. Yeah, he's willing to go on adventures and fight bad guys, but that's a means to an end.
Vegeta wants to be the most powerful warrior and wants everyone to know it. Unlike Goku who just wants to better himself for his own sake, Vegeta wants people to know he's stronger than them. It explains why Goku being stronger than him bothers him so much. Over time, he eventually re-evaluates and his arc is complete when he has no issue admitting Goku is better than him.

[ekrolo2]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

[ABED]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

I haven't seen Super but what you're saying is what I've come to expect from these revivals. The series end and then the revivals rip apart the characters' progress almost just to put it back together again.

I think Cell's motives are the same as Vegeta's.
Freeza wants power, but he's not a warrior like Vegeta is. He can physically fight, but it's not what drives him. He likes being a dictator and the wealth he steals from civilizations he destroys. He loves physically dominating people. He's a dictator, but not necessarily a totalitarian like Hitler and Stalin.

[Lord Beerus]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

[ekrolo2]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

[precita]

I think he just got surprised there was yet another Super Saiyan form out there. It's like crack to Vegeta, you think you're done but you see something new and you want it.

[LuckyCat]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

To be fair, Toriyama wrote Vegeta acknowledging Goku as number 1 in the context of it being the last big arc of his Dragon Ball story. If Toriyama had planned to keep going, it doesn't seem like he would've let that issue settle down, as evidenced in the Kanzenban ending.

In any event, it's perfectly believable that Vegeta would want to catch up and be a close number 2 to Goku, even if deep in his heart he knows he'll never beat him.

[ekrolo2]

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

To be fair, Toriyama wrote Vegeta acknowledging Goku as number 1 in the context of it being the last big arc of his Dragon Ball story. If Toriyama had planned to keep going, it doesn't seem like he would've let that issue settle down, as evidenced in the Kanzenban ending.

In any event, it's perfectly believable that Vegeta would want to catch up and be a close number 2 to Goku, even if deep in his heart he knows he'll never beat him.

And if he can't write him anymore without keeping that obnoxious trait going, the series should probably end or ditch him for another rival for Goku to bounce off of, it's not like there's a whole multiverse of people to- oh wait.

It's not a catching up thing, Vegeta's actively fighting to prove he's not inferior to Goku, that he's still the best when the Boo arc had him accept he can't be.

[LuckyCat]

And if he can't write him anymore without keeping that obnoxious trait going, the series should probably end or ditch him for another rival for Goku to bounce off of, it's not like there's a whole multiverse of people to- oh wait.

It's not a catching up thing, Vegeta's actively fighting to prove he's not inferior to Goku, that he's still the best when the Boo arc had him accept he can't be.

I know Vegeta will always say he's the best, but that's just his pride talking. The Buu saga statement could be read as a momentary inner-reflection of what Vegeta knew all along. Just because Vegeta acknowledges he's not number one (privately), that isn't going to stop him from being a prideful bastard who continuously puts up a strong front.

Also, I don't think we're going to get this satisfying ending you're hoping for in the new material because we're deep in serialized Marvel-like franchise territory now. That doesn't mean old characters can't be given new avenues to explore, and I think at least Super has attempted to do that with Vegeta, Krillin and to a lesser extent Gohan.

[Lord Beerus]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

I don't recall Vegeta being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku in BOG. The most we got out of Vegeta, in regards to being inferior to Goku, was that next time he would become a SSJG. I don't know how that would constitute to him being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku, especially since the it's piss easy to become a SSJG.

In ROF, I kinda get your point. Whis bluntly stated that Vegeta is always one step behind Goku and Vegeta did get annoyed when he brought it up but he wasn't exactly whiny or bitchy over it. He just took the advice Whis gave to improve himself in his stride and moved on.

[ABED]

This is why I want to watch it for myself because I am just taking you guys at your word even though it's clearly your interpretation of the story. For all I know, Ekrolo2 could be viewing any competitiveness Vegeta has towards Goku as being the same as it was in Z, even though it could be a radically healthier version of that. In Z, Vegeta wanted to best Goku out of insecurity.

[Dragonballgod19]

I'm curious to see what you'd think of current Vegeta since they've turned him into a whiny bitch about being inferior to Goku again whereas GT kept him being cool with it.

To me, it feels like they just did it because the concept of someone wanting to improve themselves just for the sake of it and who's not called Goku is one the writers can't seem to grasp.

Really vegeta better than he was in z because in z he was horrible and goku was turned into a retarded pussy in super who does nothing but lose

[Dragonballgod19]

This is why I want to watch it for myself because I am just taking you guys at your word even though it's clearly your interpretation of the story. For all I know, Ekrolo2 could be viewing any competitiveness Vegeta has towards Goku as being the same as it was in Z, even though it could be a radically healthier version of that. In Z, Vegeta wanted to best Goku out of insecurity.

It wasn't healthier and unlike z vegeta actually friends with everyone now

[Dragonballgod19]

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

I don't recall Vegeta being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku in BOG. The most we got out of Vegeta, in regards to being inferior to Goku, was that next time he would become a SSJG. I don't know how that would constitute to him being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku, especially since the it's piss easy to become a SSJG.

In ROF, I kinda get your point. Whis bluntly stated that Vegeta is always one step behind Goku and Vegeta did get annoyed when he brought it up but he wasn't exactly whiny or bitchy over it. He just took the advice Whis gave to improve himself in his stride and moved on.

Goku is nothing more than a giant retarded pussy in super at least vegeta got character development and is a family man lol goku fanboys

[ABED]

This is why I want to watch it for myself because I am just taking you guys at your word even though it's clearly your interpretation of the story. For all I know, Ekrolo2 could be viewing any competitiveness Vegeta has towards Goku as being the same as it was in Z, even though it could be a radically healthier version of that. In Z, Vegeta wanted to best Goku out of insecurity.

It wasn't healthier and unlike z vegeta actually friends with everyone now

What wasn't healthier?

[Lord Beerus]

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

I don't recall Vegeta being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku in BOG. The most we got out of Vegeta, in regards to being inferior to Goku, was that next time he would become a SSJG. I don't know how that would constitute to him being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku, especially since the it's piss easy to become a SSJG.

In ROF, I kinda get your point. Whis bluntly stated that Vegeta is always one step behind Goku and Vegeta did get annoyed when he brought it up but he wasn't exactly whiny or bitchy over it. He just took the advice Whis gave to improve himself in his stride and moved on.

Goku is nothing more than a giant retarded pussy in super at least vegeta got character development and is a family man lol goku fanboys

Um.. what? I don't mean to be an asshole but, how much of Super have you watch to come to that conclusion. Because based off of that comment it doesn't seem like you watched a lot of episodes or you've just seen brief clips of some episodes on YouTube.

[Doctor.]

Super Vegeta's motivation is a believable extension of his development from Z. Hell, the first few episodes even make it a point to have Vegeta recap his speech to Goku at the end of the Boo arc. It's just a way less extreme change than GT, he still wants to become better than Goku, he just acknowledges that he's not better, whilst previously Vegeta would delude himself into believing he is.

What I find character regression is how he keeps referring to himself as "Vegeta-sama" from the Black arc onwards. That's Cell arc Vegeta. That super inflated ego is not a part of the real Vegeta anymore.

[Dragonballgod19]

Super Vegeta's motivation is a believable extension of his development from Z. Hell, the first few episodes even make it a point to have Vegeta recap his speech to Goku at the end of the Boo arc. It's just a way less extreme change than GT, he still wants to become better than Goku, he just acknowledges that he's not better, whilst previously Vegeta would delude himself into believing he is.

What I find character regression is how he keeps referring to himself as "Vegeta-sama" from the Black arc onwards. That's Cell arc Vegeta. That's not the real Vegeta anymore.

Vegeta does things in super that not even buu saga vegeta would do and vegeta not only is a family man now unlike cell saga vegeta, and unlike z vegeta in super is friends with everyone

[ekrolo2]

In what regard has Vegeta become a a whiny bitch?

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

I don't recall Vegeta being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku in BOG. The most we got out of Vegeta, in regards to being inferior to Goku, was that next time he would become a SSJG. I don't know how that would constitute to him being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku, especially since the it's piss easy to become a SSJG.

In ROF, I kinda get your point. Whis bluntly stated that Vegeta is always one step behind Goku and Vegeta did get annoyed when he brought it up but he wasn't exactly whiny or bitchy over it. He just took the advice Whis gave to improve himself in his stride and moved on.

I'm talking about the Super arcs, not the movies where Vegeta's back to business as usual within a couple episodes and is such a bitch, he thinks he'll get God power on his own.

[Lord Beerus]

Because he's whiny and bitching about being inferior to Goku, again when he shouldn't care about that anymore, just train and improve for the sake of it. It's gotten toned down somewhat in recent arcs but in BoG and F he's insufferable.

I don't recall Vegeta being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku in BOG. The most we got out of Vegeta, in regards to being inferior to Goku, was that next time he would become a SSJG. I don't know how that would constitute to him being whiny or bitchy about being inferior to Goku, especially since the it's piss easy to become a SSJG.

In ROF, I kinda get your point. Whis bluntly stated that Vegeta is always one step behind Goku and Vegeta did get annoyed when he brought it up but he wasn't exactly whiny or bitchy over it. He just took the advice Whis gave to improve himself in his stride and moved on.

I'm talking about the Super arcs, not the movies where Vegeta's back to business as usual within a couple episodes and is such a bitch, he thinks he'll get God power on his own.

I still don't see how that's Vegeta whiny or bitchy for wanting to get stronger especially since he witnessed Goku be become a god to fight another god. And Vegeta already affirmed in Episode 2 that while he acknowledged that Goku was the strongest Saiyan, he wouldn't stop to push him and become stronger and eventually the strongest there is.