Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

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Kunzait_83
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Kunzait_83 » Sun Nov 12, 2017 5:32 pm

sangofe wrote:About GT's "finalty"... That's one of the things I didn't like, because I love Dragon Ball so much that I'd rather see it run for years and years.
Thus proving my point.

I'd rather Dragon Ball not be milked and wrung so dry as to become diluted and overloaded with cruddy and disposable junk overwhelming and outweighing the actual worthwhile material. Quality >>>> quantity. I cannot get my head around someone loving DB but actively WANTING its carcass to be picked clean simply because they can't pry themselves loose from it.

Its perfectly okay, much more healthy even, for something to run its course and have its time before finishing, going out on a high note, and then being just done and complete going forward while retaining its dignity and making way for new things to come up and take over: as opposed to the same things that older generations loved just endlessly and pointlessly repeating themselves over and over and over and lingering around on and on and on well past their prime and vastly overstaying their welcome and existing purely for the sake of those older folks' stubborn clingines and inability to let go of their rose-tinted past and discover new and more challenging things to freshly inspire them anew.

*Ahem*

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Nov 12, 2017 6:50 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:*Ahem*

-cue reboot failure conga line-
Man that one logo guy must be raking in the dough!

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by ABED » Sun Nov 12, 2017 7:52 pm

I loved Homecoming. It's right up there with Spider-Man 2. American comics and thus comic book movies are different from DB or a number of the movies you listed. It's not one single story written by one person. It's a story with a beginning and an infinite middle with varying degrees of continuity and different takes on the character. I see of the MCU as nothing more than their run with the character. And while I like Spider-Man 2, it would be irritating if all we ever got was those three Raimi movies since I only consider one of them to be good. DB is a completely different story. It was one story written by one person with a unique voice. GT was a flawed attempt to continue that story, so it's not the same thing as SM: Homecoming or Pirates 5 or the recent Power Rangers movie. It's more along the lines of something like the James Bond movies. One comes out every couple years with varying degrees of quality and each director bringing their take on the character with them. The issue isn't not letting the characters go, it's the level of quality.

I'm fine with letting things go, but I also like that I see new takes on 007 and Batman.

I also know that this makes me sound ambivalent about this issue, but I'm not. I don't have a dogmatic view of this sort of issue. It's more about rational expectations. I've been so disappointed by retreads and revivals that I have a healthy skepticism towards not letting the stories stay finished. On the other side, I've seen too many Bond movies that bounced back and found renewed energy that I can't every completely write off that franchise. Same with comic book movies. Yes, the original four Batman movies got worse and worse after the first one, but then we got Nolan's movies. Snyder's take wasn't to my liking, but maybe I'll enjoy Matt Reeves' take. DB was one man's story that had a beginning, middle, and end. GT tried to continue it, made a flawed but admirable college try and then ended. Battle of Gods was one of my favorites, so I'm not completely averse to the occasional return to that world, but we also spent over a decade after GT's end, so I was more used to having the story end. Given how much we got, I'm more than okay if it ended and stayed dormant.
Last edited by ABED on Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by ekrolo2 » Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:17 pm

DBs problem in comparison to say Batman or Spider-Man or Star Trek is that it's burned through a lot of its concepts, there's really very little left for it to go and where you can, Super's burning right through the rest of it. The logical escalation point is getting approached.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by sintzu » Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:28 am

Kunzait_83 wrote:Opposed to the same things that older generations loved just endlessly and pointlessly repeating themselves and lingering around well past their prime.
I don't know if this has always been the case but I've noticed (like the examples you brought up) that things nowadays either overstay their welcome and what's allowed to end is brought back for more. I'm OK with certain things as long as they have something to offer to fans and the original but how long can you realistically keep something's quality up before you run out of ideas and it just ends up living on past glory ? I haven't watched the simpsons but from what I've read it lost its quality around seasons 5-7 and ever since has just been living on those golden days.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by sangofe » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:22 am

Kunzait_83 wrote:
sangofe wrote:About GT's "finalty"... That's one of the things I didn't like, because I love Dragon Ball so much that I'd rather see it run for years and years.
Thus proving my point.

I'd rather Dragon Ball not be milked and wrung so dry as to become diluted and overloaded with cruddy and disposable junk overwhelming and outweighing the actual worthwhile material. Quality >>>> quantity. I cannot get my head around someone loving DB but actively WANTING its carcass to be picked clean simply because they can't pry themselves loose from it.

Its perfectly okay, much more healthy even, for something to run its course and have its time before finishing, going out on a high note, and then being just done and complete going forward while retaining its dignity and making way for new things to come up and take over: as opposed to the same things that older generations loved just endlessly and pointlessly repeating themselves over and over and over and lingering around on and on and on well past their prime and vastly overstaying their welcome and existing purely for the sake of those older folks' stubborn clingines and inability to let go of their rose-tinted past and discover new and more challenging things to freshly inspire them anew.

*Ahem*


]
As long as it doesn't become complete Shit and feels like Dragon Ball, I'm fine with it getting "milked". I want new content to enjoy.
Last edited by sangofe on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by sangofe » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:27 am

sintzu wrote:
sangofe wrote:All that planning is something very different from what Toriyama ever has done. There's a big difference right there.
Toriyama seems to be planning things now as the plot feels like it has a bit more of forshadowing than his original manga did. We have Sadal for a potential U6 visit, 4 unseen universes for a potential future tournament set up & The grand priest and some of the angles have been acting odd so that's another thing they might be saving for a future arc.
Judging from things Toyotaro has said in interviews, he's probably done with the story of this one and has already started working on the next saga. The anime staff probably know that. And the Planet Sadla stuff could just as well be an upcoming filler (I really hope it's not but we don't know) Of course this is me guessing but there's neither proof of what you're saying here that he's planning ahead. I don't know why you think he seems to be doing that. I don't get that feeling.
Last edited by sangofe on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:18 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by ABED » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:18 am

what I've read it lost its quality around seasons 5-7 and ever since has just been living on those golden days.
Nah, it's more like season 9 or 10. I would also like to point out that shows and movies can rebound. While I do think The Simpsons is past its prime, there are plenty of really good newer episodes. The show is simply not new nor as groundbreaking as it once was. When it was new, the show was controversial. It's tame by comparison with contemporary shows.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by sintzu » Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:36 am

sangofe wrote:Of course this is me guessing but there's neither proof of what you're saying here that he's planning ahead. I don't know why you think he seems to be doing that.
They've brought up Sadal more than once since 2016's Champa arc for example which could point to them having some plans to go there.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by sangofe » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:15 am

sintzu wrote:
sangofe wrote:Of course this is me guessing but there's neither proof of what you're saying here that he's planning ahead. I don't know why you think he seems to be doing that.
They've brought up Sadal more than once since 2016's Champa arc for example which could point to them having some plans to go there.
Still, this is you just guessing and assuming. Having said that, I hope it'll happen.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Sailor Haumea » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:31 am

This is a flawed question - it assumes that GT was bad.

It isn't.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Luso Saiyan » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:32 am

No, I never hated GT. I simply don't like it.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Duo » Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:44 pm

I've tried multiple times to revisit the series over the years, but I get so bored after a couple of episodes that I either start skipping around or just stop watching. I greatly enjoy the soundtrack, at least, and Super Saiyan 4 is still one of the best transformation designs in the series.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by SingleFringe&Sparks » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:27 pm

GT's main flaw to me was that it was underwhelming in terms of just the delivery of most things that it didn't feel as dynamic as Z and questionable (nitpick-able) plot-holes. I see a lot of wasted potential in GT's good direction and not just as an extension to the series, but how it connected things better aesthetically and conceptually. I don't nitpick the character portrayals as much as other people do, because its summarizes that in just being underwhelming. I do however appreciate what it tried to do more conceptually, especially over my more recent dislike of Super. GT tried to unify things at the least, with its lore and with how they considered the SS4 transformation actually having symbolic aesthetics for Goku (intentional or not).

tl;dr I don't hate GT, it underwhelmed but I respect its qualities, and that it put story over marketing (even if thats what killed it).
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by DragonBallKing » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:33 pm

I never hated it in the first place. :) But then again I haven't watched it since 2007 but I plan to watch It all the way through in Japanese for the first time after I finish Z.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by 90sDBZ » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:18 pm

I've never hated GT. I don't like some of the stupid and dull stuff that happens early on, but overall I do like it for what it is. The Baby saga was really enjoyable, and while the Super 17 saga went a little overboard with it's craziness, the Shadow Dragon saga is actually pretty damn imaginative and has an eerie foreboding atmosphere that serves it well. I really like the sequence were the 7 dragons are shown spreading across the earth, and I like how their identities are kept hidden so you don't know what to expect from them. The ending I have mixed feelings about. It's sad in a real kind of way, which is both good and bad. Aside from that SS4 is a really cool design.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Basaku » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:28 pm

Never hated it, but there wasn't that much to like about it either.

I guess I appreciate it a *tiny* bit more after seeing Super repeat some of the very same mistakes (some of them by none other than Toriyama himself...) but that's it. And honestly, with Super soon approaching twice the lenght and wealth of content GT had and without any doubt far eclipsing it further on (ragrdless if under the same name or not), GT is becoming more and more an irrelevant blip in DB history's, treated less and less official each day by both the fanbase and the companies & creators involved. DB will go beyond it and either remake it, incorporate its elements (like Super did with Broly) or just let it become more and more incompatible and serve only as design source for video game characters to fill up the numbers. Hoping for the further, some of the GT's aspects are worth 'carrying over', like the always-popular SSJ4 design, some ideas for the arcs (Shadow Dragons) etc.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by lancerman » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:41 am

GT wasn't bad, but it clearly made with same spirit and intent Toriyama had for the series, and Super is living proof of that.

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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Robo4900 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:38 am

I've always liked GT.
And to this day, I will always maintain that the excellence of the Blue Water dub was a large part of that. Not just from the generally good casting and acting, or the accurate scripts, but also because it kept the original music, which has been the best part of GT all along.

In fact, I still prefer GT to Super. Better animation and music, the Japanese voices were better(I mean, it was 20 years ago now; their voices just aren't as strong as they used to be. It's not something that can be helped), and of course, what is probably a large part of it is, naturally, my personal bias for GT since it was the sequel to Z and the franchise conclusion I grew up with -- not only does it give me a preference for GT, but it also makes me conflicted on Super retconning GT out of mainstream continuity.
Of course, preferring GT doesn't mean I don't like Super, despite my frequent pot shots at it; Dragon Ball has always been about having fun, with continuity being secondary to enjoyment, particularly in the anime(Dr. Gero vs Dr. Flappe, the first and second wishes on the balls being 8 months apart, Garlic Jr. in Z, etc. Most of that is filler, of course. :lol: ), so I think there's plenty of room for two different sequels to Z.

I just really hope that when the story goes past Z in the new timeline, they don't redo GT storylines. Much more interesting to do new stuff anyway.
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Re: Do you still hate Dragonball GT?

Post by Avenant » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:20 pm

GT was made to capitalize on the popularity of DragonBall and that clearly shows in the poorly rushed story and character development. That being said, I do have the curiosity to watch it again. But I also want to hate it, so I'll have to wait until my bias is a little less intense. Super is far superior in my opinion and a continuation of the series in the true spirit of it's predecessors, though it too a capitalization on the continually growing popularity.
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