WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

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Cure Dragon 255
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WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:02 pm

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DQTx_DEWsAYdpNN.jpg

WOW! That's awesome. And it seems Old Toriyama was more open to alterations like old Bardock and so on.
Marz wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by ABED » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:21 pm

Hate is a strong word and it's unclear exactly what he means by unnatural durations.
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by KBABZ » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:37 pm

And what's the source for that image?

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Grimlock » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:56 pm

What exactly is this and where is his hate over filler fights? :eh:
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Ariesx222 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:33 am

Is it fight filler in general or is there a specific fight he was referring to?

This is vague.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by sintzu » Wed Dec 06, 2017 2:37 am

Ariesx222 wrote:Is it fight filler in general or is there a specific fight he was referring to?

This is vague.
Goku's fight with Freeza laster nearly 20 episodes so that's what he's most likely talking about (assuming the interview is real).
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Baggie_Saiyan » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:18 am

Toriyama mentioned he doesn't mind people changing his work in another interview so this might have some legitimacy. But like the others have said an actual source would be nice.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by ABED » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:27 am

sintzu wrote:
Ariesx222 wrote:Is it fight filler in general or is there a specific fight he was referring to?

This is vague.
Goku's fight with Freeza laster nearly 20 episodes so that's what he's most likely talking about (assuming the interview is real).
It's also long in the manga.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Michsi » Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:45 am

Where exactly is this from ? It's nice to see all sorts of interviews from back them crop up, but this seems like an excerpt from something bigger.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Totamo » Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:06 am

ABED wrote:
sintzu wrote:
Ariesx222 wrote:Is it fight filler in general or is there a specific fight he was referring to?

This is vague.
Goku's fight with Freeza laster nearly 20 episodes so that's what he's most likely talking about (assuming the interview is real).
It's also long in the manga.
There was literally an episode where Goku and Freeza just stare at each other while recapping what happens the previous one.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by ABED » Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:47 am

Totamo wrote:
ABED wrote:
sintzu wrote:
Goku's fight with Freeza laster nearly 20 episodes so that's what he's most likely talking about (assuming the interview is real).
It's also long in the manga.
There was literally an episode where Goku and Freeza just stare at each other while recapping what happens the previous one.
It's still a long fight. The added material is mostly cutaways to what's happening to Bulma or what's going on back on Earth, not clip shows. I don't even recall this episode you are referring to. The only clip show I remember from the Freeza fight was the one at the end where it's Freeza remembering the fight with Goku before he tries to kill Goku using the energy Goku gave him.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by rereboy » Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:18 am

ABED wrote: It's still a long fight.
All the more reason to not make it even longer.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by ABED » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:03 am

rereboy wrote:
ABED wrote: It's still a long fight.
All the more reason to not make it even longer.
Well, to be fair, the actual added bits of fighting were fine. It's the extraneous stuff like the cutaways to Bulma and Earth that was the problem. I quite enjoy Gohan trying to buy time when he thinks his father is dead.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by KBABZ » Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:22 am

ABED wrote:
rereboy wrote:
ABED wrote: It's still a long fight.
All the more reason to not make it even longer.
Well, to be fair, the actual added bits of fighting were fine. It's the extraneous stuff like the cutaways to Bulma and Earth that was the problem. I quite enjoy Gohan trying to buy time when he thinks his father is dead.
I don't mind that either because it feels more "earnest" somehow, in particular because it doesn't feel like the filler is trying to derail the A Story. In Kai at least, Gohan wants to help his dad, he gets back, puts up a good fight, then Goku appears and says that he's got this. It doesn't last more than three or five minutes in the grand scheme of the episode, and it doesn't feel like it's trying to purposefully delay and stretch out the proceedings like, say, Tao climbing Korin Tower does.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by ABED » Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:36 am

Which is ironic because that's exactly what Gohan is trying to do.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
Happiness is climate, not weather.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by VegettoEX » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:01 am

I don't have any real opinions over the content, but I too would ask that a source is always provided for these types of conversations. It's not worth even bringing up if its legitimacy can't be validated.

For what it's worth, this doesn't feel like our translation style (super stilted and broken), and sure enough it doesn't match up with anything we have on the site (or in our archives half-translated not yet up on the site).
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Herms » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:44 am

Yeah, this is just another fake interview. Nothing to see here folks.
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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Dbzfan94 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:57 am

Totamo wrote:]There was literally an episode where Goku and Freeza just stare at each other while recapping what happens the previous one.
What episode was this? I don't remember this at all.

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by Cure Dragon 255 » Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:38 pm

VegettoEX wrote:I don't have any real opinions over the content, but I too would ask that a source is always provided for these types of conversations. It's not worth even bringing up if its legitimacy can't be validated.

For what it's worth, this doesn't feel like our translation style (super stilted and broken), and sure enough it doesn't match up with anything we have on the site (or in our archives half-translated not yet up on the site).
I'm extremely sorry! I know sources are indispensable and so on! I took it from a twitter post that's an interview with Rumiko Takahashi and Akira Toriyama. I will try to provide more solid sourcing!
Marz wrote: Wed Jul 21, 2021 11:27 pm "Well, the chapter was good, the story was good and so were the fights. But a new transformation, in Dragon Ball? And one that's ugly? This is where we draw the line!!! Jump the Shark moment!!"

This forum is so over-dramatic that it's not even funny.
90sDBZ wrote: Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:44 pm19 years ago I was rushing home from school to watch DBZ on Cartoon Network, and today I've rushed home from work to watch DBS on Pop. I guess it's true the more things change the more they stay the same. :lol:

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Re: WOW! Toriyama hated the fight filler even back then!

Post by VegettoEX » Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:11 pm

Ah, thanks. That's a little more helpful. Julian was working on the Akira Toriyama x Rumiko Takahashi interview, so I asked him about it. Posting on his behalf here.

You're probably referring to this interview on Rumic World, which is from TeLePAL (issue #3) in 1986; unfortunately they skip over entire questions toward the end (in addition to getting the name of the magazine wrong), but this part is still in the middle of the last page.

Here's the section it's from-

Image

Here's the Rumic World translation:
Rumic World wrote:It is often the case that one anime episode contains about three chapters of original manga stories. What do you think about that, as a manga creator?

Toriyama: Because anime and manga are different than each other, I prefer they do things that way rather than making unnatural “durations” in anime. I want them to fill up the durations by moving characters properly.

Takahashi: I agree. But I don’t want them to rearrange stories so much that I can’t understand where some story lines came from. The important thing is the eagerness of anime creators since it is designed to appear on TV screens.
Here's the in-progress translation we're working on-
SaiyaJedi wrote:--In anime, three episodes of the original comic can be made into a single episode. As the author, what do you think about that?

Toriyama: Really, comics and animation are different, so it's better than inserting weird "breaks" [or "pauses" or another word; thinking about how to best adapt this]. I'd rather they cover those "breaks" with movement.

Takahashi: Right. They can do things roughly, so you can no longer see how things got that way in the story, and when that sort of this happens, it poses a problem. It comes down to the passion of those turning into animation. That really comes out on screen.
One MAJOR piece of context to keep in mind: this interview is from before the Dragon Ball anime started!!!
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