Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

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Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:25 am

TOEI
. Dragon Box: The Movies ~ 2006

FUNimation
. Dragon Ball Z: Season 1 ~ 2007
. Dragon Ball Z: Dead Zone / The World's Strongest - Double Feature ~ 2008

The puzzle seems to line up perfectly, first TOEI did it and then FUNimation went ahead. So, had TOEI not done it then perhaps FUNimation wouldn't have gotten the idea to. Besides, I've always seen the Dragon Ball and Z movies in full screen aspect ratio and they look like the intended aspect ratio rather than the cropped, widescreen format which has picture chopped off.

Even if the Dragon Ball Z Orange Bricks (BD/DVD) had been in full screen format it would have been a somewhat decent release since it would have contained all of its picture but they decided to go 16x9 instead. I'll give props to FUNimation on Season 9, the ninth season honestly looks great (DVD version) but the cropping kinda bugs me. FUNimation's Ultimate Uncut Edition which was released in 2005 was in full screen format.

Putting all this 'what if' aside, the FUNimation Double Feature releases have more or less become the standard in just about every Western country so it seems extremely unlikely even FUNimation will bother to license the Dragon Box: The Movies.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:57 am

I doubt it. Remember, while the movies were produced in 4:3, everything was composed in the frame under the idea that it WOULD be cropped to 16:9 for when it was shown in the theaters. The cropping had already been done when they were first screened in 1987 onwards. Plus, DVDs don't have true widescreen like Blu-Rays do; the footage is still 4:3 but stretched to fill the screen by using non-square pixels, which saves space on the disc.

FUNimation meanwhile cropped DBZ to 16:9 to fill up the new HD screens which were all coming in widescreen, to look like they were keeping up with the times (and probably to fit more on the disc, as mentioned above). Problem there is that DBZ was NEVER composed with 16:9 in mind, which makes you feel like you're watching the show from under a cardboard box under a staircase; it feels consistently cramped, even with the selective pan and scan of the Blu-Rays and Kai TFC.

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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by Bruma rabu » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:58 am

Probably not, my guess for the reason why they cropped it is because of film damage. Its much easier and cheaper to cut that damaged part out than have to fix it. The DragonBall movies were made with 16:9 in mind, they were meant to be seen that way. Thats why toei released them in 16:9.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:01 am

Bruma rabu wrote:Probably not, my guess for the reason why they cropped it is because of film damage. Its much easier and cheaper to cut that damaged part out than have to fix it. The DragonBall movies were made with 16:9 in mind, they were meant to be seen that way. Thats why toei released them in 16:9.
If they were truly intended, it's hard to tell. To me, the movies are just like extended Dragon Ball and Z episodes at most so the cropping really irks me a tad.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by Bruma rabu » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:14 am

SuperCyan2 wrote: If they were truly intended, it's hard to tell. To me, the movies are just like extended Dragon Ball and Z episodes at most so the cropping really irks me a tad.
Who knows what was Toeis thought process when making the movies. All we know is that they animated it in full screen with the intentions of cropping it to wide. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but every release of the movies in Japan have been wide screen.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by PacificOceanDub » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:55 pm

All I know is, the cropping has never bothered me on the movies like it does on the episodes. I own all of the “Double Feature” releases (except movies 1/2) and have always thought they looked fine. Does anyone have anything to say about the Double Features on Blu-Ray? Specifically in comparison to the DVD versions? I’ve always been curious...

Only reason I don’t have the Movies 1 & 2 steelbook is because there is only one way to watch Movie 1 in my opinion, and that is the Pioneer/Ocean Dub release.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:10 pm

PacificOceanDub wrote:All I know is, the cropping has never bothered me on the movies like it does on the episodes. I own all of the “Double Feature” releases (except movies 1/2) and have always thought they looked fine. Does anyone have anything to say about the Double Features on Blu-Ray? Specifically in comparison to the DVD versions? I’ve always been curious...

Only reason I don’t have the Movies 1 & 2 steelbook is because there is only one way to watch Movie 1 in my opinion, and that is the Pioneer/Ocean Dub release.
I only have the Double Features of Movies 12 & 13 but kinda regret so, the picture quality looks too dark and with a ton of detail missing. Plus, the Japanese audio is in a completely unacceptable state.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by sintzu » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:31 pm

The movies were made with a potential crop in mind as that's how they're usually screened in theaters. When those movies were made the action and everything else was animated with that in mind so things weren't off when they did get cropped.

Funimation on the other hand took a show that was made and aired in 4:3 and just cut out the top and bottom without a second thought which resulted in a very messy presentation.

Kai also cropped Z but unlike Funimation they did it carefully, frame by frame to prevent important footage from being lost.

Both croppings aren't perfect as the show wasn't made with that in mind but the difference is that one tried to make it a natural transition while the other didn't give a sh*t.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:12 pm

sintzu wrote:Kai also cropped Z but unlike Funimation they did it carefully, frame by frame to prevent important footage from being lost.
And even then, for the original Kai run, it was only for the broadcast; the Blu-Rays were in 4:3.

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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:32 pm

KBABZ wrote:
sintzu wrote:Kai also cropped Z but unlike Funimation they did it carefully, frame by frame to prevent important footage from being lost.
And even then, for the original Kai run, it was only for the broadcast; the Blu-Rays were in 4:3.
The Japanese DVDs were in 16x9, interestingly. I think the French and German Blu-ray/DVD home releases all had the same aspect ratio, i.e., 16x9 as the Japanese release but unfortunately for these latecomers, it meant their only soundtrack was Kikuchi without the possibility of listening to any episodes with the original score by Yamamoto.

I wish the Yamamoto scandal had been delayed after the final Japanese Kai Blu-ray was out so we'd have the entire series with the Yamamoto score. :( Though, the episodes 96-98 at least had a better Kikuchi placement whereas 01-95 just felt like totally random.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:28 pm

SuperCyan2 wrote:I wish the Yamamoto scandal had been delayed after the final Japanese Kai Blu-ray was out so we'd have the entire series with the Yamamoto score. :( Though, the episodes 96-98 at least had a better Kikuchi placement whereas 01-95 just felt like totally random.
I'd argue that the Yamamoto scandal should have occurred before Kai; that way we'd have gotten a Kai with more thoughtful music placement that matches Z, rather than the slap-dash job done to rush it out on DVD mid-production that we're now stuck with.

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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:01 pm

KBABZ wrote:I'd argue that the Yamamoto scandal should have occurred before Kai; that way we'd have gotten a Kai with more thoughtful music placement that matches Z, rather than the slap-dash job done to rush it out on DVD mid-production that we're now stuck with.
Takaki would've been great to fill the shoes of Kai's composer role and what would have come afterwards but instead we got Sumitomo and that to me just feels so frustrating, Sumitomo's music is nowhere near as good as Kikuchi's, Yamamoto's, Takaki's or Tokunaga's, imo.

It's really unfortunate that TOEI can't just fire Sumitomo and hire a talented composer instead.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by KBABZ » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:47 pm

SuperCyan2 wrote:It's really unfortunate that TOEI can't just fire Sumitomo and hire a talented composer instead.
I liked the individual pieces in The Final Chapters, for me the base problem was a lack of variety, which Yamamoto also suffered during the late Namek arc.

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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by SuperCyan2 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 4:40 am

KBABZ wrote:I liked the individual pieces in The Final Chapters, for me the base problem was a lack of variety, which Yamamoto also suffered during the late Namek arc.
I liked it somewhat too but it gave me a vibe of being intended as a VGM soundtrack than a TV/Anime score.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by sintzu » Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:40 pm

SuperCyan2 wrote:It's really unfortunate that TOEI can't just fire Sumitomo and hire a talented composer instead.
If Toei starts a new anime instead of continuing Super we could get someone new to do the music. I don't think he's bad but I wouldn't miss him if he left as I think they could do better.
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Re: Did FUNimation borrow the idea of cropping Dragon Ball by TOEI?

Post by Gligarman » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:23 pm

I swear Dragon Ball is the Star Wars Special Edition of anime. It's as if it's so popular that they can't even make rational decisions regarding its distribution. I have NEVER in my decades of anime fandom ever seen any older anime series get cropped to 16:9. The absolute closest I can think of was one of the DVD releases for Ninja Scroll but even that was optional and has since been done away with. Hopefully one day the Dragon Boxes won't be the only option for a proper release in the States.

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