Dead Zone - first installment weirdness (music cues, ending theme, nyoibo)

[jpranevich]

I just re-watched "Dead Zone", for the first time in Japanese with subtitles. It strikes me that, being released only 11-weeks or so after DBZ started, the majority of the work on this film must have been before DBZ designs and music were finalized.

Unless I misremember, is this is the only film with "Mystical Adventure" music cues? So was the music composed before Cha-La-Head-Cha-La? It does have that as the opening theme, but perhaps it was unavailable when the movie was being scored? Are there any other instances of "Mystical Adventure" in the DBZ score?

The final animation for Zenkai Power seems to be an earlier version than the DBZ series, with less complete animation although the music is the same.

The film also still uses the Nyoibo, despite it being at Kami's lookout. Toei made the same mistake in the "Wedding Dress" filler episodes. (I think it also appears in World's Finest, correct?) But anyone that read the manga should have known about that...

Any other "weirdness" that I missed?

[Kunzait_83]

DBZ Movie 2 (World's Strongest Guy) also contains Mystical Adventure music cues, as well as use of the Nyoi-Bo. AND heavy use of Muten Roshi as a front line fighter.

[kemuri07]

I've grown to love Dead Zone precisely because it still feels like a Dragonball movie. In fact, I'll go one further and say that this feels like a movie from an alternate timeline where DBZ was just still Dragonball (yes, yes I know that technically that's the case with the manga). Where Toriyama didn't go in the direction of aliens and space, and just doubled down on the mysticism of the original Dragonball series.

[Dr. Casey]

I've grown to love Dead Zone precisely because it still feels like a Dragonball movie. In fact, I'll go one further and say that this feels like a movie from an alternate timeline where DBZ was just still Dragonball (yes, yes I know that technically that's the case with the manga). Where Toriyama didn't go in the direction of aliens and space, and just doubled down on the mysticism of the original Dragonball series.

This is a nice and interesting way to think about things. Makes me want to rewatch the film.

[Captain-Sora]

DBZ Movie 2 (World's Strongest Guy) also contains Mystical Adventure music cues

Yeah, the motif pops up in a handful of pieces, right down to the opening title card. It plays in full during the sequence where Misokatsun's beaten. It's quite fitting that it'd still be featured so prominently, given the film's focus on the "World's Strongest Guy."

[Dragon Sponge]

I just re-watched "Dead Zone", for the first time in Japanese with subtitles. It strikes me that, being released only 11-weeks or so after DBZ started, the majority of the work on this film must have been before DBZ designs and music were finalized.

I think the production of this Movie started not long after the change of leadership of the Anime staff happened in late 1988. The first episode where the new producers were involved was EP 132, which was broadcasten on 2 November 1988, on day after the Raditz Fight started in the Manga.

The film also still uses the Nyoibo, despite it being at Kami's lookout. Toei made the same mistake in the "Wedding Dress" filler episodes. (I think it also appears in World's Finest, correct?) But anyone that read the manga should have known about that...

I checked the scene where 18 year old Son Goku meets his friends, and his Nyoibo can clearly be seen on his back, in both the Manga and Anime, which meens he didn´t left it behind between the eathern Gods Lookout & Karin Tower, not even in the Manga continuity. The reason why its later again between Lookout and Tower in the Saiyan Arc
is because Krillin, Yamcha, Tien, Chiaotzu & Yajirobi used it to climb up to the Lookout. It was never shown that they borrowed the Nyoibo in both the Manga & Anime but its the logical asumtion to be made and a pity that the Anime staff didn´t made a filler scene about it. However there are still some scenes in the Saiyan Arc where the Nyoibo is missing between the Lookout and the Tower.

[TheBigBoy]

This movie rules because of it's weirdness. The fight choreography is phenomenal, possibly the best across the entire series. I love how...grounded it is. It's really unlike anything that came after it. The movie is gorgeous too - those oranges really stick out in my brain. I'm a huge fan of the snappy pace as well. If I only had one piece of Dragon Ball media to show someone, I would probably have go with this.

I wish Kuririn was able to get a lick in against the bad guys at some point but maybe that's asking too much.

[jpranevich]

I checked the scene where 18 year old Son Goku meets his friends, and his Nyoibo can clearly be seen on his back, in both the Manga and Anime, which meens he didn´t left it behind between the eathern Gods Lookout & Karin Tower, not even in the Manga continuity.

Wow. I have read and watched that section several times. I had assumed the presence of the bo in the anime was a Toei error, but I guess it was supposed to be there. I can forgive the Wedding Dress saga now as well. It is a shame we never saw Kuririn or Tenshinhan use it in the anime filler... did we EVER see anyone other than Goku use the pole at any time? It was implied that Grandpa Gohan could use it, but it was never seen (to my recollection).

The more I think about it, the more I like this movie. I agree with the other commenter that the fight choreography was fantastic, although at times it seems the characters would randomly forget they could fly. (Still, they were not as used to it as they would be later in the series.) I love that we got a real Kami fight for once, plus a tad more background on the events that led to the creation of Piccolo Sr. so long ago. We even had a brief Chichi fight! (Although I wish she would have been slightly more effective. She *is* a good fighter, just not on Goku's level.) Garlic seems at times like he was written as a more-evil version of Pilaf, but that's probably okay too.

This movie also seems to start the "transformation as power-up" trope which would become so common later. I think there are a few examples before this (Oozaru, of course, but probably someone... maybe the movie #1 villain? I am blanking on others) but here it is absolutely clear that Garlic and his henchmen all have powered-up forms. I think this is also a relatively early use of Kuririn-as-comic-relief which became to prevalent during later Z; most of original DB had him as an earnest character. Seeing him be the butt of the joke, plus getting peed on, is more inline with how he'll be treated in the Cell arc.

A lot to digest in this movie. I might watch it again to see what else I see.

[Dragon Sponge]

did we EVER see anyone other than Goku use the pole at any time?

In the "Worlds Strongest" Movie, Son Gohan has the Nyoibo with him when he comes into Dr. Willows Lab. At one point he tries to attack Willow with it but gets instead hit by him and loses the Staff, which gets catched by Son Goku, who used the Staff soon after that against Dr. Willow.

[jpranevich]

I checked the scene where 18 year old Son Goku meets his friends, and his Nyoibo can clearly be seen on his back, in both the Manga and Anime, which meens he didn´t left it behind between the eathern Gods Lookout & Karin Tower, not even in the Manga continuity. The reason why its later again between Lookout and Tower in the Saiyan Arc
is because Krillin, Yamcha, Tien, Chiaotzu & Yajirobi used it to climb up to the Lookout. It was never shown that they borrowed the Nyoibo in both the Manga & Anime but its the logical asumtion to be made and a pity that the Anime staff didn´t made a filler scene about it. However there are still some scenes in the Saiyan Arc where the Nyoibo is missing between the Lookout and the Tower.

I just checked episode 17 and there is no Nyoibo leading to Kami's lookout, despite having all of our second-favorite characters up there training. And while THAT is worth a separate thread, it is unfortunate that they did not better-connect that training with the anime filler they did around DB#120s. (Other than the brief revisit to the time room, although that was much better done in DB with the extended trip to Kamesennin's past, rather than have everyone travel to some strange Saiyan planet.)

[Attitudefan]

The character designs also still look much more Dragon Ball than they do Z, with just a bit more edge and grit to the line work. The characters also look exactly as they do in the Chala opening, which is pretty cool. I only wish Yamcha and Tenshinhan were there.

I also really like the fact that ki blasts were only used as finishers. Gohan's blast to Garlic really signifies how dangerous his ki is, without laying a hand on anyone.

I kinda wish the movies kept using the Mystical Adventure cues as a bit of a trope.

[jjgp1112]

The first movies definitely seemed to be in line with late DB's tone, but I think once the Movies became a twice a year thing Toei just settled on churning out lazy plots.

[Dr. Casey]

I also really like the fact that ki blasts were only used as finishers. Gohan's blast to Garlic really signifies how dangerous his ki is, without laying a hand on anyone.

Yep, the series was much more reserved with ki blasts at that point. Ki blasts were outright rare prior to the 22nd Budokai, to the point where the Dodonpa in episode 60 was only the second one introduced. After that they became somewhat more common, but they were still limited to the point where they were discrete in number. Aside from Chaozu's Dodonpa spamming against Krillin, ki blasts in any given battle were all specific, story-related attacks that were countable on one or (less frequently) two hands. 'Generic ki blasts' weren't really a thing until the Namek era. The battles against Nappa and Vegeta might have started more of a trend in that direction, but I haven't actually watched DBZ since 2008 and don't remember very clearly. I do remember that the Radditz battle was more original Dragon Ball style though, with a discrete and easily listed number of ki attacks. Overall, Dragon Ball treated ki attacks with the same kind of reverence that Saiyans treated the SSJ form with in Z. Vegeta and Gohan aspired to become Super Saiyans, Krillin and Yamcha aspired to be able to shoot ki attacks.

More of an observation than a criticism or anything, though. I actually really like how the achievements and accomplishments of the past become more and more overshadowed as time goes along, to the point where stuff that was considered impressive in early Dragon Ball (Master Roshi mastering the Kamehameha after 50 years or mastering Korin's training in three) seem laughably pitiful later on. I see a sort of unintended parallelism to the real world, where technology and human accomplishments are constantly advancing and evolving. To use a random, simple example, the way that the spread of color television during the mid-1960s was an amazing achievement that required decades of work, that some considered impossible, and that took the remainder of the 1970s and 1980s to fully spread throughout the world... but now elementary schoolers take for granted that their cell phones can record hours of videos in resolutions that didn't even exist period until the 2000s. The cheapening of things like ki blasts, flying, and SSJ forms reminds me of the real world in that respect, in the sense of what was once amazing eventually becoming just a fact of life you take for granted.

I've never seen any of the movies besides 1 and 8, but I really should sometime. One of the best things about them is sure to be the very gradual evolution from being rooted in the late Dragon Ball/very beginning of Z era, to the very different world of the Buu arc.

[jpranevich]

Aside from Chaozu's Dodonpa spamming against Krillin, ki blasts in any given battle were all specific, story-related attacks that were countable on one or (less frequently) two hands. 'Generic ki blasts' weren't really a thing until the Namek era.

I think you are right, but there are some strange exceptions. Gohan, despite not having ANY training except being left in the wilderness, uses a generic ki-blast to light a camp fire in one of the filler episodes. I just watched it last week, but I do not recall which one. It struck me because I was looking forward to seeing the first episode where Gohan can consciously use ki, fly, etc. and I didn't expect any of that to be before Piccolo's training.

[DragonBallKing]

Dead Zone has my favorite art style of any Dragon Ball anime, I really would like to see characters from later arcs like Cell drawn in a more early Z art style.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think you are right, but there are some strange exceptions. Gohan, despite not having ANY training except being left in the wilderness, uses a generic ki-blast to light a camp fire in one of the filler episodes. I just watched it last week, but I do not recall which one. It struck me because I was looking forward to seeing the first episode where Gohan can consciously use ki, fly, etc. and I didn't expect any of that to be before Piccolo's training.

You're thinking of episode 11, which is the Vegeta and Nappa go to Arlia episode. But while the majority of the content of that episode is filler, that particular scene with Gohan, where he uses a ki blast to light the fire on which he is going to cook his tail steak, is directly from the manga.

[KBABZ]

I think you are right, but there are some strange exceptions. Gohan, despite not having ANY training except being left in the wilderness, uses a generic ki-blast to light a camp fire in one of the filler episodes. I just watched it last week, but I do not recall which one. It struck me because I was looking forward to seeing the first episode where Gohan can consciously use ki, fly, etc. and I didn't expect any of that to be before Piccolo's training.

You're thinking of episode 11, which is the Vegeta and Nappa go to Arlia episode. But while the majority of the content of that episode is filler, that particular scene with Gohan, where he uses a ki blast to light the fire on which he is going to cook his tail steak, is directly from the manga.

And to expound here, in the manga (and as a result, Kai) it's very much played as being at the END of Gohan's six month wilderness training. It's still a bit implausible to me that he would have learned Ki control on his own, but the sheer length of time gives it at least some justification. He's also not treated as being able to fly in either Kai or the manga, he just "does it" when he and Krillin depart so Goku can fight Vegeta, meaning he kinda learns it from out of nowhere (although sheer nerves could explain why he doesn't use it during the Nappa battle).