What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

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Toxin45
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What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 19, 2018 4:46 am

What type of new villains you want to see in dragon ball super if it returns after the dragon ball super movie? 12 universes and yet I don't think of new villains there the antagonists of super are just Beerus,Frieza,Hit,Zamasu/goku black,and Jiren. But only Frieza and goku black/Zamasu are actual villains. Beerus,hit,and Jiren are not really evil so what type of new true villains will show up?

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Vijay » Sat May 19, 2018 4:56 am

One word: Broly

I kinda miss powerhouses like Broly, Bojack, Janemba or even Hirudergarn-esque baddies that talk less, act more

I get Super's slogged with childish slapstick humor, but considerin how RoF was not & yet it still managed to set BO at fire, why not nother serious badass villain?

Pure full-on rampage. No more pulling the punches. About 15-20 minutes backstory, some humor in 1st & 2nd Act. Bang-on, on the face kinda action for last 30 minutes

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Polyphase Avatron » Sat May 19, 2018 7:18 am

Vijay wrote:I kinda miss powerhouses like Broly, Bojack, Janemba or even Hirudergarn-esque baddies that talk less, act more
Jiren was like that, wasn't he?
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Vijay » Sat May 19, 2018 7:45 am

Polyphase Avatron wrote:
Vijay wrote:I kinda miss powerhouses like Broly, Bojack, Janemba or even Hirudergarn-esque baddies that talk less, act more
Jiren was like that, wasn't he?
Not exactly

Dude suffered quite a bit of "Nakama" & "tragic-childhood" syndrome I usually associate with cliched villains ranging frm Naruto~Bleach~Fairy Tail~list goes on & on

Moreover, felt like was cheap version of an OP character. Kinda like Omega Shenron. Not really an organic, omnipotent original badass without any restraints

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by sunsetshimmer » Sat May 19, 2018 8:42 am

Dragon Ball needs good female main villain at last.
The closest thing we got were Towa and Android 21 in games, but in anime all female villains are only side-villains, like Android 18, Oceanus Shenron, Princess Snake or Zangya.

Speaking of Jiren, he made Omega Shenron look like very well written villain lol
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by JazzMazz » Sat May 19, 2018 8:52 am

sunsetshimmer wrote:Dragon Ball needs good female main villain at last.
The closest thing we got were Towa and Android 21 in games, but in anime all female villains are only side-villains, like Android 18, Oceanus Shenron, Princess Snake or Zangya.

Speaking of Jiren, he made Omega Shenron look like very well written villain lol
Well, Jiren is better than Omega Shenron, for the simple fact that Jiren actually is a character.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by BlueBasilisk » Sat May 19, 2018 9:05 am

I'd like more magic users. Not too many of those in the main continuity. Someone who's not just a punch punch beefwall. Or even a huge nerd like Fu.
JazzMazz wrote:Well, Jiren is better than Omega Shenron, for the simple fact that Jiren actually is a character.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Kataphrut » Sat May 19, 2018 9:10 am

I feel like at some point I need to make a big post explaining how Jiren was the Villain of the Universe Survival arc (which is different from being a "rival" or an "antagonist") but it's not pertinent to the topic.

A good change of pace might be to have a villain that relies on brains rather than brute strength. I'm thinking something like an evil authority figure or mad scientist. Sure, we've had guys like Commander Red and Dr Gero, but they were never meant to be taken seriously. I want an intelligent, non-action villain who can still be treated as a credible threat. Obviously such a character would get snapped in half by the likes of Vegeta the moment they said the wrong thing, so we'd need a way to make them threatening. Maybe have some sort of power-nullifying McGuffin like in FighterZ to bring our heroes down to normal, then throw in a couple of powerful henchman to handle the bulk of the fighting.

Maybe you could joke that the henchmen are actually only as strong as, I dunno, an upper-tier Freeza soldier and once the heroes eventually regain their full power, they become laughably easy. Like, one of them could have just gotten done beating the shit out of Vegeta, then goes to make a move on Krillin, who'd been cowering behind him. Krillin fires a blast the exact moment the power nullifier de-activates and takes him out in one shot. The punch-line is Vegeta's reaction when he wakes up to see the dude that was destroying him got taken out by Krillin.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by sunsetshimmer » Sat May 19, 2018 9:36 am

JazzMazz wrote: Well, Jiren is better than Omega Shenron, for the simple fact that Jiren actually is a character.
Yeah, character with no personality that was sitting in place for 30 episodes.
Best villain ever.

And honestly Jiren had nothing except pure strength, while Omega had many powers like regeneration, elemental powers absorbing dragon balls and transferring his soul into other dragons bodies.

So sorry, but for me Jiren is much worse villain/antagonist (call it what you want).
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by JazzMazz » Sat May 19, 2018 10:38 am

sunsetshimmer wrote:
JazzMazz wrote: Well, Jiren is better than Omega Shenron, for the simple fact that Jiren actually is a character.
Yeah, character with no personality that was sitting in place for 30 episodes.
Best villain ever.

And honestly Jiren had nothing except pure strength, while Omega had many powers like regeneration, elemental powers absorbing dragon balls and transferring his soul into other dragons bodies.

So sorry, but for me Jiren is much worse villain/antagonist (call it what you want).
Again, mediocre gimmicks don't make for an interesting villain, especially if all the gimmicks are kind of just second to the fact that his just really strong.

At least Jiren had some kind of character arc, and was far better presented generally, with some actually good fights.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by ABED » Sat May 19, 2018 10:53 am

The one star Dragon is only in a handful of episodes and even they feel like they go on for too long, but him being a pure evil bastard just out for destruction is fine. Given that he's born of pure evil, it makes sense that he'd be pure evil.

Zamasu, a villain who believed they were doing the universe a service, sounded refreshingly new.

Perhaps a villain that wasn't out for mass destruction or domination but simply wanted to kill Goku because he felt Goku's love of battle had largely negative consequences would be different. I don't think that's been done before.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Toxin45 » Sat May 19, 2018 11:04 am

ABED wrote:The one star Dragon is only in a handful of episodes and even they feel like they go on for too long, but him being a pure evil bastard just out for destruction is fine. Given that he's born of pure evil, it makes sense that he'd be pure evil.

Zamasu, a villain who believed they were doing the universe a service, sounded refreshingly new.

Perhaps a villain that wasn't out for mass destruction or domination but simply wanted to kill Goku because he felt Goku's love of battle had largely negative consequences would be different. I don't think that's been done before.
Well Zamasu became more corrupted and pretty much became an omincidal mad good at the end and pretty much got erased by Zeno even he got tecnically what he wanted. Right The Tournament of power kinda like that but it was a secret test of character.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Grimlock » Sat May 19, 2018 11:11 am

Toxin45 wrote:What type of new villains you want to see in dragon ball super if it returns after the dragon ball super movie?
• Firstly, a Janemba villain. One that manipulate reality and objects as awesome as he does. Or better yet, I want Janemba himself, because I fear that most of the designs would be horrible. Janemba has a cool design as well. Just give him a personality and the capability to make sentences, then we're all good.

• Secondly, Mira and Towa (and Fu, if possible). I would like to see what would Toriyama do with villains that threats the time of Dragon Ball. It would also serve as a comparison with Dimps take on it. Who would do better?

• And thirdly, a villain that threats the Megaverse in the same level as First Firmament from Marvel Comics did. I want a giant being (way bigger than Super Shenlong) capable of destroying all there is.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Sat May 19, 2018 11:30 am

Villains that manipulate rather than directly fight would be a nice change of pace.

For example, the original idea for the villain in the original script for Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods was a villain that imbued people with evil, thus making them fight and do evil things; he was gonna be the reason the Saiyans were a bunch of murderous assholes in Universe 7 in that original script.

Someone like that, turning our heroes against one another? That'd be AWESOME.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by ABED » Sat May 19, 2018 11:45 am

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:Villains that manipulate rather than directly fight would be a nice change of pace.

For example, the original idea for the villain in the original script for Dragon Ball Z: Battle of Gods was a villain that imbued people with evil, thus making them fight and do evil things; he was gonna be the reason the Saiyans were a bunch of murderous assholes in Universe 7 in that original script.

Someone like that, turning our heroes against one another? That'd be AWESOME.
I like the idea of a manipulator, but I'm glad they didn't go with the idea that the Saiyans were magically turned into murderous bastards.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by ulisa » Sat May 19, 2018 4:16 pm

I’ve always loved the idea of a manipulative and cunning villain. Dragonball definitely has a track record of “new bad guy, new power up” and while I do enjoy those antagonists, I’d love to see a villain who isn’t necessarily battle strong but through other means is a threat. The concept of turning the heroes against one another is one I really can get behind.

There’s also the concept of removing the ability of power ups and energy attacks. I’ve seen fans throw around ideas of ki-restriction spells, bands etc and while I don’t know a real good way to implement it, the concept intrigues me because it brings back the importance of basic martial arts training.

There’s also the idea...what about an enemy that is sheer numbers? The main cast of Dragonball is absurdedly powerful so why not introduce an enemy that isn’t necessarily stronger but has overwhelming numbers? The second Cooler movie, while hardly a favorite, touched on this a bit and I think it could work well.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by ABED » Sat May 19, 2018 4:20 pm

ulisa wrote:I’ve always loved the idea of a manipulative and cunning villain. Dragonball definitely has a track record of “new bad guy, new power up” and while I do enjoy those antagonists, I’d love to see a villain who isn’t necessarily battle strong but through other means is a threat. The concept of turning the heroes against one another is one I really can get behind.

There’s also the concept of removing the ability of power ups and energy attacks. I’ve seen fans throw around ideas of ki-restriction spells, bands etc and while I don’t know a real good way to implement it, the concept intrigues me because it brings back the importance of basic martial arts training.

There’s also the idea...what about an enemy that is sheer numbers? The main cast of Dragonball is absurdedly powerful so why not introduce an enemy that isn’t necessarily stronger but has overwhelming numbers? The second Cooler movie, while hardly a favorite, touched on this a bit and I think it could work well.
DB has a few antagonists over the years whose powers aren't limited to sheer brute strength. Off the top of my head - The 2 Star Dragon's toxic powers sap people of their strength, Guldo's time freeze powers require strategy to beat, and Ginyu's body switch was very effective.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by Mister_Popo » Sat May 19, 2018 4:24 pm

Perhaps a Mysterio-like-villain that creates illusions and mindgames. One that can fight as well, but no Jiren-power, just a lot of tricks. Basically a badass version of Shantza.
Make him a real threat in the sense even the Gods cannot sense where he really is. UI could be used to feel instinctively how to hit him.
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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by SupremeKai25 » Sat May 19, 2018 4:33 pm

A good change of pace might be to have a villain that relies on brains rather than brute strength.
Wasn't that basically Zamasu? He couldn't rely on brute strength alone since he was just a Kai, he was no match for a Saiyan, so he resorted to scheming behind everyone's back to steal the power of Goku for himself.

Honestly, the only problem is that the new villain, no matter how refreshing or innovative they are, will never surpass Zamasu in terms of villainy and achievements. Why? Because Zamasu despised mortals and Gods alike and was able to become
immortal and even merge with the fabric of the Universe and transcend time and space. I fail to see how any future villain could eclipse Zamasu.

Even Jiren felt like nothing compared to Zamasu. Why? Because, with Zamasu, the entire Multiverse was at stake, whereas with Jiren, the stakes were much lower. So, Yes, it will be hard to write a villain that will feel more threatening and dangerous than Zamasu.

Regardless of that, I would love a villain who brings people back from the dead as mindless zombies. Like the Night King from GoT. The only problem is that zombies in Dragon Ball are just silly, they are not frightening or scary. In general, I'd just like to see a villain who turns friend against friend, who spreads havoc and discord amongst his enemies, and who works from the shadows.

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Re: What type of new villains in future dragon ball series

Post by ulisa » Sat May 19, 2018 4:42 pm

ABED wrote:DB has a few antagonists over the years whose powers aren't limited to sheer brute strength. Off the top of my head - The 2 Star Dragon's toxic powers sap people of their strength, Guldo's time freeze powers require strategy to beat, and Ginyu's body switch was very effective.
You’re right and I like those angles. It seems lately though that it boils down to sheer battle power and strength. I’d love to see a return to other tactics. I always thought they wasted the time freeze ability; there could have been a lot more done with that. I’ve also thought the idea of an enemy that could mess with the concept of time to their advantage could have interesting ramifications—the heroes think it’s been 2 hours when it’s been 2 years or something like that. Maybe an ability to prematurely age or juvenilize an opponent, manipulate the landscape, there’s lots of different angles. I’m also not against an enemy that reflects attacks back at you or cannot be hurt by energy blasts or ki attacks.

Going off the idea of a manipulator villain, I’d love to see something done with the idea of the Seven Star Dragon/Buu’s ability to absorb someone’s battle strength and take their body. While it definitely had its issues, the idea of making Goku hold back so he doesn’t kill someone he cares about has potential. I also thought it was a neat call back to the Cell saga and Goku’s inability to go all-out against his son.
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