Has team four star been good for dragonball?

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by DragonBallFoodie » Mon Sep 17, 2018 3:32 pm

Both bad and good.

I enjoy the jokes (Princess Trunks from Broly is epic), but I dislike how it points out issues in Toriyama's characterization and writing - issues he never thought about himself.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by MasenkoHA » Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:50 pm

GreatSaiyaJeff wrote:TFS may have an impact on the meme's of the franchise but overall on the franchise. Not really.
Basically this.

I think TFS has influenced perceptions of characters such as

Goku’s a negligent father

Piccolo is Gohan’s real dad

Yamucha is a loser

Mr.Popo is uber powerful and creepy

Nappa is a moronic dumbass

Stuff like that. Like others have stated you can not go to a dbz related video without seeing someone quoting TFS or referencing TeamFourStar


But its had zilch to do with Super or BoG or Kai. And sure I think TFS is responsible for some resurgence of Dragon Ball’s popularity. But honestly even without TFS being a thing most renewed fan interest would have happened due to BoG and Super plus the fact that millennials are sleeping with nostalgia

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Ssjcell » Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:04 pm

Yeah I think it's had an impact on the resurgance of the fan base. New Dragonball was going to be popular no matter what. It would be foolish to say that tfs hasn't at least renewed old fans interest . Say what you want but it's a solid product it's funny and they don't disrespect the franchise. For example before Goku teleports cell to King kais planet he tells gohan that the last year with Gohan was the best year of his life. Great moment that was handled as well as Dragonball z.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Waluigiman » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:02 pm

I am normally against it but at the same time I am going to be fair.

Bad:
1.It gave the franchise (the American one) the wrong people in which in some groups, they like the parody way more than the official material.
2. Funimation is easily influenced by it to the point it tries to be like it. This includes (more )flanderization and tired memes(although from what I had seen,not all are Team Four star based.) See the newer material for proof.
Good:
1.It made the American people care about Dragon Ball(Wrong reasons or not).
2. Nappa, Mr.Popo, Dende, and Guru became popular (for the wrong reasons). Normally no one will put much thought on them.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by SupremeKai25 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:23 pm

I love it. It helped launch the meme that Zamasu did nothing wrong by including it one of their Super abridged clips. The people must know that Zamasu did nothing wrong.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Gaffer Tape » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:54 pm

I think overall it's been very good for Dragon Ball. While being funny and amusing in its own right, I think its biggest asset is using its humor to illuminate weaknesses in the original writing. People can often bristle at criticism of their nostalgia pet, but when it's presented in a way that makes them laugh, they're much more amenable to it. On the other hand, those same parodies and exaggerations can get grating when they're taken at face value and presented as fact within the realm of the real series. It's quite the double edged sword. It makes fans aware of problems or even just tropes, but those same fans tend to view them in a very reductive light.

As silly as the comparison sounds, and bear with me, it reminds me of how annoyed I was as a 9 year old when The Brady Bunch Movie came out and how those intensified the more memetic aspects of that series. The whole "Marcia, Marcia, Marcia" thing is said all of one time in the series, and Jan is a relatively well-adjusted character with a few identity issues who, in one episode, is jealous of her older sister and is driven by an inner monologue. The movie parodies this by making her a psychotically jealous friendless misfit who hears voices in her head. Which is hilarious. But it's the exaggeration that people remember. And it tends to be the same with TFS. Goku's narrative tends to pull him out of the action or leave him dead coupled with one instance where he obliviously throws his son to the lions. Exaggerate that and tweak it so Goku is completely brain dead, his catchphrase is, "Bye, Son!" and Gohan has extreme abandonment issues. You can see where the idea germinates, and it is hilarious. But that's what people remember, and it does get frustrating when trying to analyze the actual events from the series only to have those same people pull out the, "Piccolo is Gohan's real dad, hur hur," mindset.

On the other other hand, those same exaggerations, as heretical as it sounds, sometimes make for far more interesting characters than the real series gave us. I am totally serious. To pick just one example, Tenshinhan is boring and lifeless in The Cell Arc (and, well, honestly, pretty much any point after The Piccolo Arc). But TFS picked up on that one line of him being angered by Vegeta's presence and ran with it, creating a whole new dynamic between those characters. They even carried forward the consequences of Cell being stopped by Tenshinhan's Kikoho and turned that into an ongoing rivalry. The end result is a wonderful deadpan snarker of a character who has far more dimension to him than the "guy who stands around in the background and occasionally uses one life-threatening technique" corner that Toriyama had thoroughly driven him into by that point. While a lot of these elements often push over into parody territory (because that's what it is), I'm not going to lie: character interactions and relationships sometimes have a lot more meat and spark to them in TFS than they do in the original series.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by ekrolo2 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:05 pm

Gaffer Tape wrote: But it's the exaggeration that people remember. And it tends to be the same with TFS. Goku's narrative tends to pull him out of the action or leave him dead coupled with one instance where he obliviously throws his son to the lions. Exaggerate that and tweak it so Goku is completely brain dead, his catchphrase is, "Bye, Son!" and Gohan has extreme abandonment issues. You can see where the idea germinates, and it is hilarious. But that's what people remember, and it does get frustrating when trying to analyze the actual events from the series only to have those same people pull out the, "Piccolo is Gohan's real dad, hur hur," mindset..
On the opposite end of the spectrum, TFS has also done a really good job of pointing out or outright rejecting certain fan perceptions also tossed around as facts, also for the sake of a laugh. Vegeta's death on Namek perfectly illustrates this point: TFS Goku and MANY in the fandom think Vegeta was an evil bastard because Freeza made him that way to give the character an excuse for his actions, then TFS Vegeta says the truth: "Oh no, I'd still definitely be evil!" when Goku asks him if Freeza not being around would've made him a better person. Vegeta was always gonna be a rabid dog, Freeza just made him a subservient dog.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by ABED » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:45 pm

But if I want legit criticism, I won't turn to TFS any more than I would turn to Honest Trailers for film criticism. Honest Trailers is less film criticism than nitpicks.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by 8000 Saiyan » Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:10 pm

I REALLY, REALLY doubt that a parody show was the reason for Dragon Ball Super existing and I doubt that Toei has heard of them. Why would they bother watching something that is really just a parody of their show?

They've done some good things like bringing fans back into the franchise and you can see that fans really like what they do, so I don't really see anything wrong with it. On the other hand, the TFS fandom can be quite annoying, like often saying how Yamcha is a loser and that Piccolo is Gohan's father.

One embarassing moment coming from a TFS fan was asking Sean Schemmel if he liked TFS when Masako Nozawa was right there. Thankfully, Schemmel handled the situation well.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:38 pm

I wouldn't give TeamFourStar that much credit and attribute the success of their Dragon Ball Z Abridged series as to somehow being instrumental to the creation of Dragon Ball Super. That beast was the result of the Battle Of Gods and Resurrection F being so successful.

I do think that TeamFourStar have played a small but significant role in providing for the masses of Dragon Ball fans in the West (more specifically the USA) an extremely well made, streamlined and alternate take on Dragon Ball Z, that while at its heart is an affectionate parody, carries enough earnest effort in rotating the plot somewhat and sprucing up the dialogue -- and by that process, giving the abridged series its own unique identity to make it its own wholesome show -- while also retaining that distinctive Dragon Ball charm, whimsy and character progression and personality dynamics. It's made even better by the fact that the abridged series came at a time when Dragon Ball desperately needed some kind of unique content for fans to latch onto (2009-10).

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by RandomGuy96 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:40 pm

I think their overall effect is equivalent to a rounding error.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Cursed Lemon » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:39 pm

In terms of visibility and maintaining a certain relevance in the collection consciousness (before DBS premiered)? I don't think it's possible to argue otherwise.

In terms of sales? Despite their best efforts to the contrary with those intros...probably not.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by zDBZ » Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:09 pm

Gaffer Tape wrote:I think overall it's been very good for Dragon Ball. While being funny and amusing in its own right, I think its biggest asset is using its humor to illuminate weaknesses in the original writing. People can often bristle at criticism of their nostalgia pet, but when it's presented in a way that makes them laugh, they're much more amenable to it. On the other hand, those same parodies and exaggerations can get grating when they're taken at face value and presented as fact within the realm of the real series. It's quite the double edged sword. It makes fans aware of problems or even just tropes, but those same fans tend to view them in a very reductive light.

As silly as the comparison sounds, and bear with me, it reminds me of how annoyed I was as a 9 year old when The Brady Bunch Movie came out and how those intensified the more memetic aspects of that series. The whole "Marcia, Marcia, Marcia" thing is said all of one time in the series, and Jan is a relatively well-adjusted character with a few identity issues who, in one episode, is jealous of her older sister and is driven by an inner monologue. The movie parodies this by making her a psychotically jealous friendless misfit who hears voices in her head. Which is hilarious. But it's the exaggeration that people remember. And it tends to be the same with TFS. Goku's narrative tends to pull him out of the action or leave him dead coupled with one instance where he obliviously throws his son to the lions. Exaggerate that and tweak it so Goku is completely brain dead, his catchphrase is, "Bye, Son!" and Gohan has extreme abandonment issues. You can see where the idea germinates, and it is hilarious. But that's what people remember, and it does get frustrating when trying to analyze the actual events from the series only to have those same people pull out the, "Piccolo is Gohan's real dad, hur hur," mindset.

On the other other hand, those same exaggerations, as heretical as it sounds, sometimes make for far more interesting characters than the real series gave us. I am totally serious. To pick just one example, Tenshinhan is boring and lifeless in The Cell Arc (and, well, honestly, pretty much any point after The Piccolo Arc). But TFS picked up on that one line of him being angered by Vegeta's presence and ran with it, creating a whole new dynamic between those characters. They even carried forward the consequences of Cell being stopped by Tenshinhan's Kikoho and turned that into an ongoing rivalry. The end result is a wonderful deadpan snarker of a character who has far more dimension to him than the "guy who stands around in the background and occasionally uses one life-threatening technique" corner that Toriyama had thoroughly driven him into by that point. While a lot of these elements often push over into parody territory (because that's what it is), I'm not going to lie: character interactions and relationships sometimes have a lot more meat and spark to them in TFS than they do in the original series.
This.

I'll add Nail, Yamcha, and pretty much all of the movie villains to the list that are more interesting in the parody.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:14 pm

Nope. The memes have been so engrained in the fanbase that so many people consider them “canon” now

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Doctor. » Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:20 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:Nope. The memes have been so engrained in the fanbase that so many people consider them “canon” now
Most of them were already around before TFS was a thing, though.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sat Sep 22, 2018 9:48 pm

Doctor. wrote:
Dbzfan94 wrote:Nope. The memes have been so engrained in the fanbase that so many people consider them “canon” now
Most of them were already around before TFS was a thing, though.
I mean yeah but now they're EVERYWHERE and grossly exaggerated. You cant go anywhere on the internet thats Dragon Ball related and see someone quoting TFS

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Apslup » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:54 pm

Definitely not. While it is iconic in the Western Fanbase and helped bring in new fans in during the relatively uneventful period of the late 2000's and early 2010's (up to Battle of God's release). I know because I was one of them (DBZA is how I first discovered DBZ).

But it's limited to the Western Fanbase and I doubt anyone in Japan knows about it lol.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by ABED » Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:05 pm

How does that work where you find DB through a parody? It's like watching Spaceballs before you see Star Wars.
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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by Forte224 » Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:40 pm

I really enjoyed TFS until it started trying to be serious. Right around Cell's reveal it's like they started to try to do a hybrid show where it was half parody, half serious, like with the dialogue before Piccolo and Kami fused. It's at these points where the voice acting starts to break down for me and the flaws become more apparent too. If you want to be serious, I'll be judging it with more seriousness as well. And the VAs aren't good enough for a serious dub.

After this point, even the humor became too on the nose, as if it was them saying "Look how funny we are". Add to that their starting to reference their old work a bit too much, and the show really hasn't stayed consistently good.

In this way, I think it's been bad for Dragon Ball, at least from an internet community stand point. The show became so insanely popular, that its momentum can't really be stopped. So now when TFS does serious scenes or lame jokes, fans go crazy and praise it in over the top fashions no matter how good or bad it really was. And, of course, we've reached the point where you can't watch a YouTube video and read the comments without a TFS reference or an "I can't wait for the TFS version" comment.

The exaggeration of characters traits hasn't helped either. Especially with Goku.

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Re: Has team four star been good for dragonball?

Post by CTAkuma » Mon Sep 24, 2018 4:55 pm

TFS reminds me a lot of Rick and Morty, both have varying quality, both think they are smart, both are incredibly hit or miss and both have rabid fans who recite everything they say as if they are the holy gospel of comedy

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