Overall Would You Say The Dragonball Fandom Is Positive Or Negative Compared To Other Fandoms?

[KBABZ]

It was always kinda negative but imo it was never this bad before TFS became “mainstream DB” for casual fans and the series revival with Battle of Gods.

As someone who got into the series via those two things, that sounds a wee bit like gatekeeping to me. How exactly has that made it worse?

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

[BrolyKale]

It depends on a lot of things... I'd say it can be both, just like any other fandoms.

[Kataphrut]

It was always kinda negative but imo it was never this bad before TFS became “mainstream DB” for casual fans and the series revival with Battle of Gods.

As someone who got into the series via those two things, that sounds a wee bit like gatekeeping to me. How exactly has that made it worse?

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

Maybe. I think that's just what you get with more people taking an interest in the franchise, which is never a bad thing. It's also easier to find out things about the series now compared to, say, when it blew up in the West in the late 90s.

[KBABZ]

As someone who got into the series via those two things, that sounds a wee bit like gatekeeping to me. How exactly has that made it worse?

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

Maybe. I think that's just what you get with more people taking an interest in the franchise, which is never a bad thing. It's also easier to find out things about the series now compared to, say, when it blew up in the West in the late 90s.

Very true. I think the DB Abridged thing has applied misconceptions to many fans about what the show actually is, that's it's just some aged narmy artifact of the late 90s rather than being late 80s/early 90s anime classic that mixes storytelling both comedic and series. Exacerbating that is the age-old conflict of those who appreciate the Japanese side of the show vs those who refuse to acknowledge it all ("There ain't nothin' more American than Dragon Ball Z!"), particularly when mass media coverage on sites like IGN and Buzzfeed in the shadow of BoG, Super and Super-Broly almost exclusively start with the Funi dub as their go-to rather than the original, and make frequent references to lines of thinking popularized by Abridged such as how much Yamcha sucks, Krillin dying in every arc and Goku being a terrible dad. I'd argue that before Abridged there were far more people who took DBZ seriously than after.

But I went on a bit of a rant there. Not every person who has watched Abridged thinks like that, and not every person who was introduced to and prefers Super is unable to talk about the classic run of the franchise.

[Dbzfan94]

It was always kinda negative but imo it was never this bad before TFS became “mainstream DB” for casual fans and the series revival with Battle of Gods.

As someone who got into the series via those two things, that sounds a wee bit like gatekeeping to me. How exactly has that made it worse?

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

What? There’s no gatekeeping. It’s just observations I’ve made over the years.

With the abridged, you have the fans who only like abridged and not the actual series. They think it’s the definitive version and/or believe it’s superior to the original material. As such the memes are everywhere. Go check literally any DB video on YouTube, you’re bound to see quotes from TFS. Talking Dragon ball with these fans is borderline impossible because of this, and creates a bigger divide than the stupid sub vs dub debate could ever dream of creating. (In contrast, you don’t see Yugioh fans acting like YGOTAS is how they actually are in canon.)

And then with the 2013 revival, it’s what KBABZ said. Influx of new fans who started with Super bring totally different viewpoints. You have the new fans, or fans that hasn’t watched in years and returned via Super loving it. And then you have some old fans who are disappointed with how the series is going and dont agree with whatever Toei is doing. Put those two groups in a room on an equal playing room and it’s bound to go bad.

[Choujin Daizenshuu]

Very true. I think the DB Abridged thing has applied misconceptions to many fans about what the show actually is, that's it's just some aged narmy artifact of the late 90s rather than being late 80s/early 90s anime classic that mixes storytelling both comedic and series. Exacerbating that is the age-old conflict of those who appreciate the Japanese side of the show vs those who refuse to acknowledge it all ("There ain't nothin' more American than Dragon Ball Z!"), particularly when mass media coverage on sites like IGN and Buzzfeed in the shadow of BoG, Super and Super-Broly almost exclusively start with the Funi dub as their go-to rather than the original, and make frequent references to lines of thinking popularized by Abridged such as how much Yamcha sucks, Krillin dying in every arc and Goku being a terrible dad. I'd argue that before Abridged there were far more people who took DBZ seriously than after.

I'm sorry but anyone who thinks that Dragon Ball Z is as American as apple pie thanks to its runaway success on CN needs to get their head examined. It's a Japanese cartoon show intended for a Japanese audience. Period. Its success in the west doesn't change that fact.

Hey, it's great that we have western fans of the show now but let's not forget who is the real target audience here...

[Mister_Popo]

A board is made for discussion. So we are open to disagree.
Debating is sometimes hard, but it does not need to get personal.

It's not because you disagreed once or twice, you always have to disagree.
That does not add up to the community feeling.

I am not very long here. But i do have the impression there are lot of personal vendettas going on for no reason (why? because someone likes ... and i don't?).
That's intellectually unfair and we all make mistakes ... but let's keep it sporty guys.
We have a lot to discuss but at the end we also share the same passion, so we have a lot in common too.
We have to be able to 'forgive' a hard or wrong word and start all over again.

If i have ever said something wrong or hurtful against a fellow boarder myself, then i can say 'my apologizes bro, maybe i used the wrong words but it wasn't personal'.

There is a lot of prestige going on about 'knowing the most about DB', almost like a ratrace.
Every fan should be accepted within a community and get a fair chance, regardless of how much he or she knows about the franchise, when they feel a need to interact about it.
It's our goal to spread and share our knowledge, but that shouldn't be driven by ego or hatred.

Feel free to comment or disagree on this matter.

[Ripper 30]

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

Maybe. I think that's just what you get with more people taking an interest in the franchise, which is never a bad thing. It's also easier to find out things about the series now compared to, say, when it blew up in the West in the late 90s.

Very true. I think the DB Abridged thing has applied misconceptions to many fans about what the show actually is, that's it's just some aged narmy artifact of the late 90s rather than being late 80s/early 90s anime classic that mixes storytelling both comedic and series. Exacerbating that is the age-old conflict of those who appreciate the Japanese side of the show vs those who refuse to acknowledge it all ("There ain't nothin' more American than Dragon Ball Z!"), particularly when mass media coverage on sites like IGN and Buzzfeed in the shadow of BoG, Super and Super-Broly almost exclusively start with the Funi dub as their go-to rather than the original, and make frequent references to lines of thinking popularized by Abridged such as how much Yamcha sucks, Krillin dying in every arc and Goku being a terrible dad. I'd argue that before Abridged there were far more people who took DBZ seriously than after.

But I went on a bit of a rant there. Not every person who has watched Abridged thinks like that, and not every person who was introduced to and prefers Super is unable to talk about the classic run of the franchise.

Yes, they are annoying as hell and even go as far as saying that abridged is better than original and Toriyama owes one to Tfs to make such a bad story watchable in parody form.

[Kunzait_83]

It's also easier to find out things about the series now compared to, say, when it blew up in the West in the late 90s.

Not even remotely close to true. The internet was very much around in the late 90s, and Dragon Ball/Toriyama fan sites were a dime a dozen even back then: some of them were certainly crap that were filled with bad info, but plenty were also very much legit and accurate (much more so than even the present day Dragon Ball Wiki, which is often written more like the dumpier sites from back then). Hell, Kanzenshuu's own origins dates back to the late 90s.

So long as you had an internet connection (even if it was just dial-up) and knew how to work a search engine (which back then was probably more likely to be Yahoo or AltaVista rather than Google), looking up information about Dragon Ball - even accurate info - wasn't very hard to do at all circa 1998/1999. And even much earlier than that.

[zarmack]

Very true. I think the DB Abridged thing has applied misconceptions to many fans about what the show actually is, that's it's just some aged narmy artifact of the late 90s rather than being late 80s/early 90s anime classic that mixes storytelling both comedic and series. Exacerbating that is the age-old conflict of those who appreciate the Japanese side of the show vs those who refuse to acknowledge it all ("There ain't nothin' more American than Dragon Ball Z!"), particularly when mass media coverage on sites like IGN and Buzzfeed in the shadow of BoG, Super and Super-Broly almost exclusively start with the Funi dub as their go-to rather than the original, and make frequent references to lines of thinking popularized by Abridged such as how much Yamcha sucks, Krillin dying in every arc and Goku being a terrible dad. I'd argue that before Abridged there were far more people who took DBZ seriously than after.

I'm sorry but anyone who thinks that Dragon Ball Z is as American as apple pie thanks to its runaway success on CN needs to get their head examined. It's a Japanese cartoon show intended for a Japanese audience. Period. Its success in the west doesn't change that fact.

Hey, it's great that we have western fans of the show now but let's not forget who is the real target audience here...

And don't even get me started on the idiots who think DB is more popular/respected in the West than in Japan smh. That is all sorts of wrong. Same with the folks who complain about Goku's Japanese voice yet have no problems with other male Japanese anime protagonist being voiced by women.

[zarmack]

Really? I'd say the Youtube comments are just under IGN board and Gamefaq forum for the cesspool of the Dragon Ball fandom.

IGN and Gamefaqs feature the worst members of ALL fandoms, especially the latter. Gamefaqs is a cesspool of mental retardation.

[Kataphrut]

It's also easier to find out things about the series now compared to, say, when it blew up in the West in the late 90s.

Not even remotely close to true. The internet was very much around in the late 90s, and Dragon Ball/Toriyama fan sites were a dime a dozen even back then: some of them were certainly crap that were filled with bad info, but plenty were also very much legit and accurate (much more so than even the present day Dragon Ball Wiki, which is often written more like the dumpier sites from back then). Hell, Kanzenshuu's own origins dates back to the late 90s.

So long as you had an internet connection (even if it was just dial-up) and knew how to work a search engine (which back then was probably more likely to be Yahoo or AltaVista rather than Google), looking up information about Dragon Ball - even accurate info - wasn't very hard to do at all circa 1998/1999. And even much earlier than that.

Mass internet access didn't become culturally ubiquitous until arguably the mid 2000s and has only gotten moreso since the rise of smart-phones and better access to high speed broadband. I'm not saying those resources weren't available back then, but it was harder to find and the kids that were watching DBZ in the late 90s weren't going to go looking for it.

As someone who got into the series via those two things, that sounds a wee bit like gatekeeping to me. How exactly has that made it worse?

I think what he's referring to is how both of those brought in a huge influx of fans old and new (mostly old) to the forefront, and that just makes it more likely for heated discussions to break out into something worse simply because there's more people in the room with conflicting opinions and outlooks about the property.

What? There’s no gatekeeping. It’s just observations I’ve made over the years.

With the abridged, you have the fans who only like abridged and not the actual series. They think it’s the definitive version and/or believe it’s superior to the original material. As such the memes are everywhere. Go check literally any DB video on YouTube, you’re bound to see quotes from TFS. Talking Dragon ball with these fans is borderline impossible because of this, and creates a bigger divide than the stupid sub vs dub debate could ever dream of creating. (In contrast, you don’t see Yugioh fans acting like YGOTAS is how they actually are in canon.)

And then with the 2013 revival, it’s what KBABZ said. Influx of new fans who started with Super bring totally different viewpoints. You have the new fans, or fans that hasn’t watched in years and returned via Super loving it. And then you have some old fans who are disappointed with how the series is going and dont agree with whatever Toei is doing. Put those two groups in a room on an equal playing room and it’s bound to go bad.

People are allowed to like what they like. Those things boosting the popularity of the series and bringing in more people invites more varied discussion. Don't begrudge people for having a laugh at Ghost Nappa or getting excited for Goku vs Jiren, let them have their own space in the clubhouse. People liking different things or quoting memes seems pretty harmless compared to what goes on in actually awful fanbases like Star Wars.

[KBABZ]

Mass internet access didn't become culturally ubiquitous until arguably the mid 2000s and has only gotten moreso since the rise of smart-phones and better access to high speed broadband. I'm not saying those resources weren't available back then, but it was harder to find and the kids that were watching DBZ in the late 90s weren't going to go looking for it.

You don't need mass internet availability for people to form their own chat rooms and fansites.

[Dbzfan94]

People are allowed to like what they like. Those things boosting the popularity of the series and bringing in more people invites more varied discussion. Don't begrudge people for having a laugh at Ghost Nappa or getting excited for Goku vs Jiren, let them have their own space in the clubhouse. People liking different things or quoting memes seems pretty harmless compared to what goes on in actually awful fanbases like Star Wars.

What?
Did you even read what I said? I’m not begrudging anyone for liking DBS or TFS. I didn’t say they couldn’t like those things, so stop playing the victim and putting words in my mouth.

All I’m saying is the fandom has become much shittier these past few years.

[ABED]

I honestly don't think the overall Star Wars or DB fanbase are bad. The douchebags are loud, but they aren't the majority.

[Kataphrut]

What?
Did you even read what I said? I’m not begrudging anyone for liking DBS or TFS. I didn’t say they couldn’t like those things, so stop playing the victim and putting words in my mouth.

All I’m saying is the fandom has become much shittier these past few years.

Because...people are leaving DBZA quotes in Youtube videos and arguing about whether Super is good or not? That's what you said. Doesn't make a fandom worse.

[CTAkuma]

What?
Did you even read what I said? I’m not begrudging anyone for liking DBS or TFS. I didn’t say they couldn’t like those things, so stop playing the victim and putting words in my mouth.

All I’m saying is the fandom has become much shittier these past few years.

Because...people are leaving DBZA quotes in Youtube videos and arguing about whether Super is good or not? That's what you said. Doesn't make a fandom worse.

No because behavior and misinformation are spread around thanks to TFS, hell there was an article saying DBA was superior to the classic etc.

[Dbzfan94]

What?
Did you even read what I said? I’m not begrudging anyone for liking DBS or TFS. I didn’t say they couldn’t like those things, so stop playing the victim and putting words in my mouth.

All I’m saying is the fandom has become much shittier these past few years.

Because...people are leaving DBZA quotes in Youtube videos and arguing about whether Super is good or not? That's what you said. Doesn't make a fandom worse.

No because behavior and misinformation are spread around thanks to TFS, hell there was an article saying DBA was superior to the classic etc.

^exactly.

[MasenkoHA]

, hell there was an article saying DBA was superior to the classic etc.

I believe that’s called an opinion.

Not one I necessarily agree with (less we’re taking the US Z dub) but an opinion