What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

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What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by KBABZ » Fri Oct 19, 2018 10:54 am

This idea came to my head whilst writing this post. And that is, is there any lore established in the original anime trio of Dragon Ball, Z or GT that hasn't since been replaced with something else by Toriyama later in the manga, any of his post-manga information, or more modern projects like Dragon Ball Super? I'm honestly struggling to think of any! Stuff like the story of Bardock, the origin of the Dragon Balls, the Tsufruians, and others have mostly all been completely replaced. Is there any left??

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Kid Buu » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:04 pm

Yamcha playing baseball?
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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by KBABZ » Fri Oct 19, 2018 5:10 pm

Kid Buu wrote:Yamcha playing baseball?
That's what I was thinking, although I put that more into general filler rather than an attempt to expand the backstory and lore of the world and characters.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Desassina » Tue Oct 23, 2018 4:28 am

The pendulum room. It still exists in the lookout to me and it set up the saiyan threat quite well. Dunno about Mutaito, but he could work in case Piccolo Daimao was sealed in his youth, so that he didn't age gracefully like Kami. It was an important scene because there used to be a master with students who could have made the Earth a stronger place.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by KBABZ » Tue Oct 23, 2018 7:30 am

Desassina wrote:The pendulum room. It still exists in the lookout to me and it set up the saiyan threat quite well. Dunno about Mutaito, but he could work in case Piccolo Daimao was sealed in his youth, so that he didn't age gracefully like Kami. It was an important scene because there used to be a master with students who could have made the Earth a stronger place.
Ooh, that's a good one! I'm not familiar with the episodes it appears in.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by jjgp1112 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:19 am

KBABZ wrote:
Desassina wrote:The pendulum room. It still exists in the lookout to me and it set up the saiyan threat quite well. Dunno about Mutaito, but he could work in case Piccolo Daimao was sealed in his youth, so that he didn't age gracefully like Kami. It was an important scene because there used to be a master with students who could have made the Earth a stronger place.
Ooh, that's a good one! I'm not familiar with the episodes it appears in.
It was used when Goku was training for the 23rd tournament too!
Yamcha: Do you remember the spell to release him - do you know all the words?
Bulma: Of course! I'm not gonna pull a Frieza and screw it up!
Master Roshi: Bulma, I think Frieza failed because he wore too many clothes!
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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Gaffer Tape » Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:35 am

jjgp1112 wrote:
KBABZ wrote:
Desassina wrote:The pendulum room. It still exists in the lookout to me and it set up the saiyan threat quite well. Dunno about Mutaito, but he could work in case Piccolo Daimao was sealed in his youth, so that he didn't age gracefully like Kami. It was an important scene because there used to be a master with students who could have made the Earth a stronger place.
Ooh, that's a good one! I'm not familiar with the episodes it appears in.
It was used when Goku was training for the 23rd tournament too!
That was a different time room. Totally different design, and it was more heavily implicated that Goku actually physically traveled to the past rather than simply experiencing an event in his mind like in the pendulum room.
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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Desassina » Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:42 am

Ah, I knew that I got something wrong... Thanks for the input!

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by KBABZ » Tue Oct 23, 2018 9:57 am

Did remind me, though! I'd say that all of the backstory regarding Roshi's younger years hasn't been touched on in any way since then.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by jjgp1112 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:02 am

Gaffer Tape wrote:
jjgp1112 wrote:
KBABZ wrote: Ooh, that's a good one! I'm not familiar with the episodes it appears in.
It was used when Goku was training for the 23rd tournament too!
That was a different time room. Totally different design, and it was more heavily implicated that Goku actually physically traveled to the past rather than simply experiencing an event in his mind like in the pendulum room.
Oh, wow. Completely slipped my mind. It's been a minute since I've watched those episodes.
Yamcha: Do you remember the spell to release him - do you know all the words?
Bulma: Of course! I'm not gonna pull a Frieza and screw it up!
Master Roshi: Bulma, I think Frieza failed because he wore too many clothes!
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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by zarmack » Tue Oct 23, 2018 1:23 pm

Anything involving the Tuffles

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Kunzait_83 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:03 pm

Desassina wrote:Dunno about Mutaito, but he could work in case Piccolo Daimao was sealed in his youth, so that he didn't age gracefully like Kami. It was an important scene because there used to be a master with students who could have made the Earth a stronger place.
While the anime included a visualized depiction of Mutaito's backstory, the story itself is still indeed there in the manga (explained by Muten Roshi without the anime's accompanying visuals). Both Mutaito's character as well as his backstory and relationship to Daimao and to Muten Roshi and Tsuru Sennin, are all 100% canon to the original manga.
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Kunzait's Wuxia Thread
Journey to the West, chapter 26 wrote:The strong man will meet someone stronger still:
Come to naught at last he surely will!
Zephyr wrote:And that's to say nothing of how pretty much impossible it is to capture what made the original run of the series so great. I'm in the generation of fans that started with Toonami, so I totally empathize with the feeling of having "missed the party", experiencing disappointment, and wanting to experience it myself. But I can't, that's how life is. Time is a bitch. The party is over. Kageyama, Kikuchi, and Maeda are off the sauce now; Yanami almost OD'd; Yamamoto got arrested; Toriyama's not going to light trash cans on fire and hang from the chandelier anymore. We can't get the band back together, and even if we could, everyone's either old, in poor health, or calmed way the fuck down. Best we're going to get, and are getting, is a party that's almost entirely devoid of the magic that made the original one so awesome that we even want more.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:It grinds my gears that people get "outraged" over any of this stuff. It's a fucking cartoon. If you are that determined to be angry about something, get off the internet and make a stand for something that actually matters.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Desassina » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:28 pm

I meant the strength debate that nobody likes to talk about. How would Goku match Mutaito when he had just killed Piccolo Daimao and former master couldn't face him? That's for another topic. Did Goku meet him through time travel? Because that was the contribution to the topic.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Kunzait_83 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:33 pm

Desassina wrote:I meant the strength debate that nobody likes to talk about. How would Goku match Mutaito when he had just killed Piccolo Daimao and former master couldn't face him? That's for another topic. Did Goku meet him through time travel? Because that was the contribution to the topic.
Gotcha. Sorry, misunderstood you.
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Kunzait's Wuxia Thread
Journey to the West, chapter 26 wrote:The strong man will meet someone stronger still:
Come to naught at last he surely will!
Zephyr wrote:And that's to say nothing of how pretty much impossible it is to capture what made the original run of the series so great. I'm in the generation of fans that started with Toonami, so I totally empathize with the feeling of having "missed the party", experiencing disappointment, and wanting to experience it myself. But I can't, that's how life is. Time is a bitch. The party is over. Kageyama, Kikuchi, and Maeda are off the sauce now; Yanami almost OD'd; Yamamoto got arrested; Toriyama's not going to light trash cans on fire and hang from the chandelier anymore. We can't get the band back together, and even if we could, everyone's either old, in poor health, or calmed way the fuck down. Best we're going to get, and are getting, is a party that's almost entirely devoid of the magic that made the original one so awesome that we even want more.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:It grinds my gears that people get "outraged" over any of this stuff. It's a fucking cartoon. If you are that determined to be angry about something, get off the internet and make a stand for something that actually matters.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Desassina » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:34 pm

No problem. By the way, what the hell is your avatar? I'm having trouble figuring it out :P Wait! Is it Majin Boo? Where did you get that render?

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Kunzait_83 » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:52 pm

Desassina wrote:No problem. By the way, what the hell is your avatar? I'm having trouble figuring it out :P Wait! Is it Majin Boo? Where did you get that render?
Yep, it's Boo.

Gifed it ages ago from the old Japanese Super Butouden 3 TV ad that was on a ton of fansub VHS tapes back in the day. I've used it from time to time as my avatar on here off and on since the mid 2000s (back when I used to have a massive collection of rotating avatars).
Last edited by Kunzait_83 on Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kunzait's Wuxia Thread
Journey to the West, chapter 26 wrote:The strong man will meet someone stronger still:
Come to naught at last he surely will!
Zephyr wrote:And that's to say nothing of how pretty much impossible it is to capture what made the original run of the series so great. I'm in the generation of fans that started with Toonami, so I totally empathize with the feeling of having "missed the party", experiencing disappointment, and wanting to experience it myself. But I can't, that's how life is. Time is a bitch. The party is over. Kageyama, Kikuchi, and Maeda are off the sauce now; Yanami almost OD'd; Yamamoto got arrested; Toriyama's not going to light trash cans on fire and hang from the chandelier anymore. We can't get the band back together, and even if we could, everyone's either old, in poor health, or calmed way the fuck down. Best we're going to get, and are getting, is a party that's almost entirely devoid of the magic that made the original one so awesome that we even want more.
Kamiccolo9 wrote:It grinds my gears that people get "outraged" over any of this stuff. It's a fucking cartoon. If you are that determined to be angry about something, get off the internet and make a stand for something that actually matters.
Rocketman wrote:"Shonen" basically means "stupid sentimental shit" anyway, so it's ok to be anti-shonen.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by sunsetshimmer » Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:57 pm

It's hard to talk about GT considering it takes place after Super anyway so if something, modern DB could prevent things from GT existing.
But i don't know if there is any tbh. I mean no one stated that earth Dragon Balls were the first one or that they don't gain any negative energy right?
So there isn't really anything that would retcon possibility of Black Star balls or Shadow Dragons existence.

If there is one thing that might be retconned it's a fact that Kais didn't pick Rildo and other machine-mutants when looking for ToP team but if i am not mistaken they were in hurry and just took people from Earth without doing research so even that doesn't seem to erase possibility of their existence. Also, we don't know how strong Rildo was at this point (it's still 10 years gap remember)

It was also said that Pan never saw dragon balls before GT and Super kinda replace this when Pan is sick, but:
-It was also anime-only scene. So it's a filler retconning a filler.
-Pan was a baby so she simply might not remember seeing them

But Goku's fear of needles from Z doesn't seem to be retconned in any way unless Goku would be scared of Frost.
"I will concede that your feelings are worthy of the mightiest of Saiyans. However, there is more to my power than just this. Before you die, I will show it to you. This is the difference in power, between the primitive Saiyans and the evolved Tsufruians." ~Baby Vegeta

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by Lukmendes » Tue Oct 23, 2018 6:53 pm

sunsetshimmer wrote:It's hard to talk about GT considering it takes place after Super anyway so if something, modern DB could prevent things from GT existing.
But i don't know if there is any tbh. I mean no one stated that earth Dragon Balls were the first one or that they don't gain any negative energy right?
So there isn't really anything that would retcon possibility of Black Star balls or Shadow Dragons existence.

If there is one thing that might be retconned it's a fact that Kais didn't pick Rildo and other machine-mutants when looking for ToP team but if i am not mistaken they were in hurry and just took people from Earth without doing research so even that doesn't seem to erase possibility of their existence. Also, we don't know how strong Rildo was at this point (it's still 10 years gap remember)

It was also said that Pan never saw dragon balls before GT and Super kinda replace this when Pan is sick, but:
-It was also anime-only scene. So it's a filler retconning a filler.
-Pan was a baby so she simply might not remember seeing them

But Goku's fear of needles from Z doesn't seem to be retconned in any way unless Goku would be scared of Frost.
Well, there are things like Freeza being far stronger in Super and not having golden form in GT, Supreme Kai and Kibito separating, Pilaff gang being old, god forms' existance, among possible others that would make putting GT and Super in the same continuity questionable, although some could easily be changed back (Kibito and Supreme Kai could just fuse again for whatever reason and Pilaff could end up making a stupid wish again), but something like the god forms existing already makes it eyebrow raising worthy, it'd need a dumb retcon like the ones that happen in super hero comics, so it's not impossible at least...
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 12:08 am My man, all Goku had to do was go SSJ3 and shock Vegeta so much the M on his head would have turned into an L and Buu would have never happened.

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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by sunsetshimmer » Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:11 pm

Lukmendes wrote:
Well, there are things like Freeza being far stronger in Super and not having golden form in GT, Supreme Kai and Kibito separating, Pilaff gang being old, god forms' existance, among possible others that would make putting GT and Super in the same continuity questionable, although some could easily be changed back (Kibito and Supreme Kai could just fuse again for whatever reason and Pilaff could end up making a stupid wish again), but something like the god forms existing already makes it eyebrow raising worthy, it'd need a dumb retcon like the ones that happen in super hero comics, so it's not impossible at least...
Those are some contradictions but they don't really retcon anything introduced directly in GT which is the topic here i guess.
If it was GT Frieza who said that he never trained before and he reached new form in 4 months but in Super he would train for much longer and didn't get new form or such big boost, then we could say that Super totally retconned that thing because it would make it impossible for GT Frieza to transform and get so strong.
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Re: What Anime-only lore has not been retconned, replaced, or outdated?

Post by KBABZ » Tue Oct 23, 2018 8:20 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:
Desassina wrote:No problem. By the way, what the hell is your avatar? I'm having trouble figuring it out :P Wait! Is it Majin Boo? Where did you get that render?
Yep, it's Boo.
Thanks for switching from that flashing orange one, it was super-distracting.

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