DB Super Exciting Guide: Story

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Post by MajinVejitaXV » Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:36 pm

Hujio wrote:
The Tori-bot wrote:This has probably been answered prior to this question being asked, but what is the extra one for?
I honest to God accidentally ordered two. So, I don't know if I'm sending it to Herms, or maybe a contest, or I just have two copies. Apparently Mike and Corey want me to send it one of them, but I'll give Herms first dibs, or the newly re-surfaced DBW.
Mike is already ordering one and I gave you a new nickname, hence I should get it by default ;p

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Post by JulieYBM » Fri Mar 06, 2009 7:44 pm

Dayspring wrote:Regarding SSJ being a x10 multiplyer, it still works better with the manga than the Daizenshuu: Kaioken in the manga is described as working in temporary bursts (ie: lasts a few seconds), whereas SSJ is constant. That right there makes SSJ infinitely better than Kaioken x10, despite being equal in strength. Meanwhile, we know Kaiokens above your limit (and Kaio explains that x10 is the limit) works the same way, but DAMAGES your body, making it not as efficient as SSJ.

In other words, Kaioken x10 is a gambit move; either it's enough to defeat the opponent, or it's not. If it wins, yay, but if it doesn't, at least it doesn't cost you anything. However, if it doesn't win with kaioken x11 to x20, you've given your opponent an extra edge over you by wounding yourself.

This even removes the "dramatic effect" plothole of movie 5: Goku figured he'd need more than a x10 multiplyer to defeat Cooler, so he used Kaioken x20 in order to try to take him down. He later decided that a constant x10 is the best choice.

Back to Freeza, we know that the more energy you use, the less you have (until you rest to recooperate it). Let's say Freeza at 50% only had 25 million PL. Goku's 30 mil wouldn't be a big deal if it only lasted a few seconds. Even at kaioken x20, 60 million wouldn't be catastrophic since it means he's only about twice as strong as Freeza, and at that, only a few seconds. Yes, 60 million is a lot more than 25, but as we see, it hurt Freeza's hand greatly.

Plus Freeza lost a lot of energy against the Genkidama, so that means his 60 or 70% PL (not 50% anymore) would no longer equal anything near 25 million. If his weakened 70% dropped to 14 million or under, Freeza at 100% would be less than SSJ Goku's 30 million.
I highly doubt that matters. Toriyama seemed to have thought that he'd get about ten-times out of it but now that SSj is known for being a fifty-fold form it doesn't matter what he once thought. He was really making an off hand comment, I think.
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Post by Kingdom Heartless » Fri Mar 06, 2009 9:08 pm

But then, going by the damage logic, wouldn't Goku's power level been drastically lower aswell?
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Post by Bussani » Fri Mar 06, 2009 9:50 pm

x10 might have been Mr Toriyama's original plan, but it doesn't make as much sense if you ask me. Even if SSJ is more consistent than kaioken, at x10 kaioken (we think at least) Goku was getting his ass handed to him. SSJ completely blew Freeza out of the water. The two never seemed comparable to me.

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Post by Kingdom Heartless » Fri Mar 06, 2009 10:18 pm

Bussani wrote:x10 might have been Mr Toriyama's original plan, but it doesn't make as much sense if you ask me. Even if SSJ is more consistent than kaioken, at x10 kaioken (we think at least) Goku was getting his ass handed to him. SSJ completely blew Freeza out of the water. The two never seemed comparable to me.
Yeah, I'd have to agree with this.

And he didn't actually say "But that's not right, it's only this much," he just said it was his original plan. What he sees it as now is unknown.
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Post by Mike » Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:01 pm

I went to go pick this up on Amazon Japan and they want to charge me $31 for shipping. Am I doing something wrong, or is that what you paid, Hujio?

Are there any other places selling this book?

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Post by MajinVejitaXV » Fri Mar 06, 2009 11:10 pm

Mike wrote:I went to go pick this up on Amazon Japan and they want to charge me $31 for shipping. Am I doing something wrong, or is that what you paid, Hujio?

Are there any other places selling this book?

-Mike
Amazon Japan's shipping tends to be steep, especially on lower priced orders (the shipping doesn't faze you as much when you're ordering mass amounts of stuff or one more expensive item). Personally, I'd wait until Sasuga Books has the guide in stock and order it there. That's how I got the GT Perfect File books, and it was much less expensive than importing them alone.

-Corey

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Post by Herms » Sat Mar 07, 2009 9:14 pm

So according to the fold-out poster, it seems that there will be a second Super Exciting Guide volume, which will be called "Character Volume". The fold-out poster says that you can combine it with the fold-out poster included in this Character Volume to form a "big poster"; the seven dragonballs will all be hidden somwhere within this large image, and there a four within the Story Volume half of the poster. This explains the lack of important characters like Piccolo in the poster, and the fact that Vegeta's technically in there but almost completely cut out of the picture. Presumably they will be included on the second poster.

Also, it's not true that the book lists the anime episode numbers for things like fights and whatnot. What it actually does it list the manga chapter number, but it calls these "episodes". So the guide's completely manga-based, listing the kanzenban volume and chapter number.
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Post by Dayspring » Sat Mar 07, 2009 10:07 pm

Herms wrote:So according to the fold-out poster, it seems that there will be a second Super Exciting Guide volume, which will be called "Character Volume". The fold-out poster says that you can combine it with the fold-out poster included in this Character Volume to form a "big poster"; the seven dragonballs will all be hidden somwhere within this large image, and there a four within the Story Volume half of the poster. This explains the lack of important characters like Piccolo in the poster, and the fact that Vegeta's technically in there but almost completely cut out of the picture. Presumably they will be included on the second poster.

Also, it's not true that the book lists the anime episode numbers for things like fights and whatnot. What it actually does it list the manga chapter number, but it calls these "episodes". So the guide's completely manga-based, listing the kanzenban volume and chapter number.
Fuck the daizenshuu, VIZ and Glenat should release this.

@Bussani and Kingdom Heartless: Eh heh heh... It is true that Goku took more damage, didn't he? :oops:
I don't think the x10 thing was an off-hand comment so much as an explanation as to why SSJ is so frakkin' godly. It makes sense to try and do a x10 so that later opponents aren't ridiculous, but he had already shown in-story that it has to be more than x40.
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Post by omae no kaasan » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:23 am

Also, it's not true that the book lists the anime episode numbers for things like fights and whatnot. What it actually does it list the manga chapter number, but it calls these "episodes". So the guide's completely manga-based, listing the kanzenban volume and chapter number.
Is that so? It really has been a long time hasn't it. Years ago I would have known that from a glance. ^o^;

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Post by Chibi Mystic Gohan » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:45 am

Who drew that cover?!

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Post by Chuquita » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:48 am

The cover really makes me wanna say Mr. Toriyama drew it, but you never know.


I love this guide's title, by the way. It's so deliciously DB. X3
"Super Exciting Guide". :mrgreen: I love it.
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Re: DB Super Exciting Guide: Story

Post by Miracles » Sun Mar 08, 2009 3:48 am

omae no kaasan wrote:Oh there's also a section which rates Goku's attributes throughout the series with stars. Didn't see anywhere that said Toriyama had input. Doubt it.
You gonna translate that part?

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Post by SSj_Rambo » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:15 am

There's a little write-up on this guide over on the V-Jump Blog:

http://vjumpbooks.com/staffblog/

Translation please? Even though it's probably all stuff we already know...

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Post by Hujio » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:47 am

Well, I'm not exactly sure how we (Herms and I) did it, but we have a page up for the guide on Kanzentai. Especially considering Herms doesn't have the book in his possession, so we resorted to me scanning half the book. For the most part, I think we got this page done in about 9 hours, all of which was pretty much done today. This has to be the fastest turn around we've ever had. Anyway, you can check out the page here, in the new Databook Guide! Incidentally, we haven't posted this on Kanzentai yet, so enjoy the "exclusive" links while they last. ;)

I don't know exactly when we'll have any "bonus coverage" for it, at least not until I send Herms his copy of the book (sorry Corey). I did get the poster scanned, so be sure to check that out. Oh, and the cover is indeed done by Toriyama, for anyone that's curious.

I'll just copy what Herms wrote earlier, which basically summarizes what we discovered earlier while "skimming" through it.
Herms wrote:So according to the fold-out poster, it seems that there will be a second Super Exciting Guide volume, which will be called "Character Volume". The fold-out poster says that you can combine it with the fold-out poster included in this Character Volume to form a "big poster"; the seven dragonballs will all be hidden somwhere within this large image, and there a four within the Story Volume half of the poster. This explains the lack of important characters like Piccolo in the poster, and the fact that Vegeta's technically in there but almost completely cut out of the picture. Presumably they will be included on the second poster.

Also, it's not true that the book lists the anime episode numbers for things like fights and whatnot. What it actually does it list the manga chapter number, but it calls these "episodes". So the guide's completely manga-based, listing the kanzenban volume and chapter number.
Oh, sorry for over-shadowing your post SSj_Rambo. :D

Anyway, Herms "the insomniac" has since gone to bed, so I think I'll follow suit. *falls asleep* (stupid daylight savings)
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Post by SSj_Rambo » Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:58 am

Hujio wrote:Oh, sorry for over-shadowing your post SSj_Rambo. :D
*Sighs*

It's okay... if you're gonna over-shadow it, it'd better be with something big like this! Thanks for the awesomely fast update! I'll get to reviewing this (and everything else that I haven't done yet ASAP... but it'll be tough with soccer season now in motion).

Great job guys!

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Post by Chibi Mystic Gohan » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:05 am

That cover was really done by Toriyama? It doesn't look like his "style"...

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Post by mysteriousdbzgt » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:15 am

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:That cover was really done by Toriyama? It doesn't look like his "style"...
I think over time, Toriyama's art style has changed a little bit when it comes to drawing Dragonball, but I think it looks is really nice.
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Post by Snail » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:21 am

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:That cover was really done by Toriyama? It doesn't look like his "style"...
Check out the Kanzenban covers, as well as the recent Dragon Warrior installments for a better look at his current style of artwork.

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Post by Chibi Mystic Gohan » Sun Mar 08, 2009 5:34 am

I own a ton of things with new Toriyama art (Kanzenban, Dragon Ball Landmark/Forever). I think this cover looks waaaaaay different. For instance, the adult Gokus are really skinny.

Just compare this to the cover of Dragon Ball Forever (2004).

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