Strongest Earthling

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Re: Strongest human

Post by dbzfan7 » Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:35 pm

I posted if you count Oob he would be #1 and everyone would move down a spot. I personally don't count him since he is a direct descendant of Boo as a human. Oob's power comes from Boo who is an alien. Every other human was born human without any alien connection. Not sure what Tenshinhan is?

Also where does Mutaito place?
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!

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Re: Strongest human

Post by Flamzeron » Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:47 pm

Herms wrote:The Toriyama quote in question is from his DB Tenkaichi Densetsu joint interview with Takao Koyama and Masako Nozawa:
Toriyama:
Kuririn was originally supposed to be just a minor role, so to have him become Goku’s best friend in the blink of an eye…

Koyama:
Well, he is the strongest Earthling male.

Toriyama:
You’re right, he is the strongest among the Earthlings. But in spite of that, he tends to end up in a bad way, so I thought, “once in a while, I have to let him be happy,” and had him get married. (laughs)
The promotional pamphlet for Battle of Gods has little bios on the main characters, with Kuririn's bio describing him as the strongest Earthling warrior.

There's that Yamcha quote mentioned above.

Awhile back Shueisha had this website where you'd answer questions and it would tell you which DB character you were most like. To go along with this it featured summaries of the characters, and Kuririn's made prominent mention of him being the strongest Earthling, seemingly to console whoever was matched up with him. I can't remember what they said for Tenshinhan (or Yamcha, for that matter).

I remember that Viz's character bios at the start of their volumes describe Kuririn as the strongest Earthling but a weakling compared to the other main characters. Something like that. I think they started using this description of him around the Cell era.

The games Supersonic Warriors and Ultimate Butoden both have "What If?" stories where Kuririn single-handedly defeats various major villains up to and including Boo. OK, OK, I guess we really can't count that.

I feel like there's a bunch of stuff I'm forgetting, and at least half these things aren't what most people would consider "canon". But it's kinda interesting how much stuff there is out there labeling Kuririn the strongest Earthling. I don't think there's really anything equivalent for Tenshinhan, take that as you will.
Thanks for clearing that up, Herms. Kuririn seems to get a bit of hate, at least from dub fans. I'm actually kind of glad to know that he is considered the strongest human, even if it proves my theory with Tenshinhan wrong.
Last edited by Flamzeron on Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by Marco Polo » Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:57 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:I posted if you count Oob he would be #1 and everyone would move down a spot. I personally don't count him since he is a direct descendant of Boo as a human.
He is a direct descendant of his parents, who are human. He just happens to have inherited Uub's ki or soul or whatever you want to call it.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by hleV » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:10 pm

dbzfan7 wrote:I posted if you count Oob he would be #1 and everyone would move down a spot. I personally don't count him since he is a direct descendant of Boo as a human. Oob's power comes from Boo who is an alien. Every other human was born human without any alien connection. Not sure what Tenshinhan is?

Also where does Mutaito place?
Oshit. You just brought up an incredibly valid point about Tenshinhan... Kuririn is the strongest human because Tenshinhan is not a human! (Well, not any more than, say, Gohan...)
Though I doubt that Yamcha took that into consideration when declaring Kuririn the strongest human (nobody probably even knew of Tenshinhan's alien...-ness).

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Re: Strongest human

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:43 pm

Tenshinhan is about as human with his three eyes as noseless Kuririn. :)
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
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I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by mysticboy » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:50 pm

Android 17.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by DBZAOTA482 » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:52 pm

mysticboy wrote:Android 17.
His strength is artificially gained.
fadeddreams5 wrote:
DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.
jjgp1112 wrote: Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.

I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by hleV » Mon Dec 31, 2012 7:58 pm

DBZAOTA482 wrote:Tenshinhan is about as human with his three eyes as noseless Kuririn. :)
There are animal-headed humans as well, but they aren't stated to be aliens. Tenshinhan is stated be an alien (or that one of his parents is, can't remember), so there you have it.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by Kaboom » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:18 pm

Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait waaaaait.

There's even some brand-new information for Battle of Gods that STILL labels Kuririn as the strongest Earthling? Among a handful of other things I didn't even know about?

Why the HELL is anyone still trying to argue for Tenshinhan then? :wtf:
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Flamzeron » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:23 pm

Kaboom wrote:Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait wait waaaaait.

There's even some brand-new information for Battle of Gods that STILL labels Kuririn as the strongest Earthling? Among a handful of other things I didnt' even know about?

Why the HELL is anyone still trying to argue for Tenshinhan then? :wtf:
I wasn't aware that Kuririn being the strongest was an actual fact. I thought it was a rumor at first. I apologize for my ignorance.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by hleV » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:25 pm

I'll just repeat in case anyone missed it. Tenshinhan is not a human.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by Super Saiyan Turlast x4 » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:30 pm

I don't see how Tien's heritage changes Yamcha's statement. For all we know, Yamcha was never aware of Tien being a descendant from those people. Based on the story and everything we know of Tien up to that point, he's an earthling. A powerful one, but still an earthling nonetheless.
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Bussani » Mon Dec 31, 2012 8:34 pm

Kaboom wrote:Why the HELL is anyone still trying to argue for Tenshinhan then? :wtf:
I'm not really surprised by that in the slightest. People place different levels of importance upon different pieces of evidence, e.g. some might ignore a statement from a guide--even from the author himself at times--because they feel it contradicts the manga. I suppose it ties back to what Mike said about canon in his article: some people will take the author's word as canon, while others might not consider anything after the story is complete, even if it comes from the author, to be so.

Still, all of these things mentioning that Kuririn is the strongest are pretty interesting.
hleV wrote:I'll just repeat in case anyone missed it. Tenshinhan is not a human.
The quotes don't say he's just the strongest human, though, right? They say strongest Earthling, and Tenshinhan has always been considered one of the Earthlings (unlike Goku, Piccolo--even Gohan, I think, despite the fact that he was born on Earth).
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Saiga » Mon Dec 31, 2012 9:17 pm

Titan wrote:
Saiga wrote: For Kurirn vs Tenshinhan, the official battle powers show that even before having his potential unlocked Kuririn was steadily bridging the gap between the two.
Really? Let's see, when Raditz came to the Earth Tenshinhan was given a BP of 250 and Kuririn 206,
later, according to the Daizenshuu, Tenshinhan is given 1830 and Kuririn 1770.
Hmmm, it seems that Tenshinhan is the one augmenting the gap between the two.
You're thinking about it the wrong way - think about the proportional gap between the two fighters, not the flat number, as well as the rate of improvement. Tenshinhan improved by 7.32 times over the year gap, Kuririn improved by 8.59 times. Kuririn's battle power was only 82.4% of Tenshinhan's before the year gap, and 96.7% either. He was improving at a faster rate than Tenshinhan and closing the gap.

@hlev and others The guidebooks say that Tenshinhan is an Earthling. He descends from the "Three Eyed Clan" who themselves descended from an alien race, but he's still considered an Earthling.

So yeah, Kuririn is officially stronger.

@Ketchup_Revenge Kuririn's power continued to grow after that fight, according to V-Jump he had a battle power of 75,000 during the battle with Freeza.
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Gokuden » Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:05 pm

Yamcha is the strongest human in all categories; he's social, strong, a Casanova, he can provide to his family with the money he makes from pro-baseball, he can take care of shape-shifting pets, he can make a girl's heart melt with a smile, why didn't he sleep with Maron? He can rob banks, he can rob travelers, he can rob hearts, he's very good with his hands, fingers, and spatial cognitive abilities (see spirit-ball), he's got a cool-looking fighting style.

Thus, Yamcha is easily the strongest human in DragonBall.
We need more Yamucha love-affairs on this forum.

Goku was the strongest looking humanoid in DragonBall.

If Tenshinhan is a hume, then Goku is as well.
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Saiga » Mon Dec 31, 2012 10:18 pm

Gokuden wrote:
If Tenshinhan is a hume, then Goku is as well.
Er... no. Goku has absolutely no human blood in him, unlike Tenshinhan.
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Titan » Tue Jan 01, 2013 8:21 am

Saiga wrote:
Titan wrote:
Saiga wrote: For Kurirn vs Tenshinhan, the official battle powers show that even before having his potential unlocked Kuririn was steadily bridging the gap between the two.
Really? Let's see, when Raditz came to the Earth Tenshinhan was given a BP of 250 and Kuririn 206,
later, according to the Daizenshuu, Tenshinhan is given 1830 and Kuririn 1770.
Hmmm, it seems that Tenshinhan is the one augmenting the gap between the two.
You're thinking about it the wrong way - think about the proportional gap between the two fighters, not the flat number, as well as the rate of improvement. Tenshinhan improved by 7.32 times over the year gap, Kuririn improved by 8.59 times. Kuririn's battle power was only 82.4% of Tenshinhan's before the year gap, and 96.7% either. He was improving at a faster rate than Tenshinhan and closing the gap.

@hlev and others The guidebooks say that Tenshinhan is an Earthling. He descends from the "Three Eyed Clan" who themselves descended from an alien race, but he's still considered an Earthling.

So yeah, Kuririn is officially stronger.

@Ketchup_Revenge Kuririn's power continued to grow after that fight, according to V-Jump he had a battle power of 75,000 during the battle with Freeza.
Well, i think it is all a matter of perspective. Personally, i think it is highly unlikely that Daizenshuu's staff was using your reasoning,
but, it is possible. For instance, in the anime ( i´m not sure about the manga), if i'm not mistaken, after Kami's training, Tenshinhan is mentioned as the one who did awesome progresses above the others. Correct me if i'm wrong.

Plus, when everyone is gathered to help Gohan against Cell, Tenshinhan is also able to hold his own longer than Kuririn.
But, looking at those Battle powers, how do you explain Gohan's BP of 2800?
We know that Gohan only touches that level for a brief period of time when he gets angry against Nappa while using Masenko.
It is quite possible that 1830 refers to Tenshinhan's weakened Kikoho.

Plus, let's not forget that it is stated in the manga that Tenshinhan is more talented than Kuririn and a prodigy, if you
look at their performances in the 23º TB, it seems that Tenshinhan extended the gap between the two.
Kuririn even wonders if Tenshinhan is human.
Saiga wrote:
Gokuden wrote:
If Tenshinhan is a hume, then Goku is as well.
Er... no. Goku has absolutely no human blood in him, unlike Tenshinhan.
What about Gohan?

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Re: Strongest human

Post by Saiga » Tue Jan 01, 2013 8:57 am

What makes it so unlikely to use that reasoning? The proportional difference should matter more. Think about how huge a different between a 5 and a 10 would be in battle, yet the same "flat" difference is negligible between 99,995 and 100,000.

Are you talking about the anime against Cell? Because I don't remember the others stepping in in the manga, apart from Vegeta. Needless to say the anime isn't the most consistent when it comes to the strength of characters.

Yeah, it's possible that his battle power of 1,830 referred to his Kikoho. I honestly hadn't thought of that. However, I'm not sure why they'd include that as his battle power reading (Gohan's was taken from the manga, so that makes sense).

I don't remember it being stated that Tenshinhan was more talented than Kuririn, but even if it was that doesn't mean the status quo will be maintained. Sure Tenshinhan was stronger at the 23rd, but so what? We see the difference isn't that great later on.

Gohan's a half breed, but with more emphasis on his Saiyan heritage. Tenshinhan isn't even half alien, so he's not in the same boat.
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Re: Strongest human

Post by Titan » Tue Jan 01, 2013 9:12 am

Saiga wrote:What makes it so unlikely to use that reasoning? The proportional difference should matter more. Think about how huge a different between a 5 and a 10 would be in battle, yet the same "flat" difference is negligible between 99,995 and 100,000.

Are you talking about the anime against Cell? Because I don't remember the others stepping in in the manga, apart from Vegeta. Needless to say the anime isn't the most consistent when it comes to the strength of characters.

Yeah, it's possible that his battle power of 1,830 referred to his Kikoho. I honestly hadn't thought of that. However, I'm not sure why they'd include that as his battle power reading (Gohan's was taken from the manga, so that makes sense).

I don't remember it being stated that Tenshinhan was more talented than Kuririn, but even if it was that doesn't mean the status quo will be maintained. Sure Tenshinhan was stronger at the 23rd, but so what? We see the difference isn't that great later on.

Gohan's a half breed, but with more emphasis on his Saiyan heritage. Tenshinhan isn't even half alien, so he's not in the same boat.

I think that Gohan's BP of 2800 can explain why Tenshinhan is given 1830, that's all.
How do you explain Piccolo's BP of 3500?
It seems more logic that he achieved that level with Makkansappo considering that
Yamcha with a BP of 1480 has some trouble to beat a Saibaman who is supposed to have 1200, while Nappa with 4000 beats Piccolo
easily.

When everyone was firing blasts at Cell in the final battle, Tenshinhan is able to hold his own longer than Kuririn which means that he was stronger. You can say that the anime isn't always consistent, but, it is something official, isn't it?

Kame Sennin and Goku both say that Tenshinhan is a prodigy and during Ten vs Goku at the 23º TB, Kuririn wonders if Tenshinhan is human considering that he has become so strong.
You cannot dismiss the fact that Kame Sennin trained Kuririn and Goku was pretty good at evaluating fighters, therefore, if Tenshinhan is more talented, how can Kuririn close the gap while doing the same training as Tenshinhan?

When you say that 250 to 206 isn't a big difference, maybe you should consider the fact that Piccolo Daimaoh with a BP of 201
was able to smash Goku with 180.
Plus, if the difference was small, we have to wonder why Kuririn was so impressed with Tenshinhan's performance in the 23º TB.

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Re: Strongest human

Post by hleV » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:57 am

Saiga wrote:The guidebooks say that Tenshinhan is an Earthling. He descends from the "Three Eyed Clan" who themselves descended from an alien race, but he's still considered an Earthling.
Oh, so Tenshinhan isn't simply half human half alien? If he's only a descendant from an alien race, then I guess it does make sense to consider him more of a human than Gohan and others.

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