If Kid Buu had fought against Vegito and faired better than Super Buu, then we could make conclusions about Kid Buu being stronger than Super Buu. Instead, we got SS3 Goku versus Kid Buu. From that, we can only conclude that Kid Buu is stronger than Fat Buu. Considering Goku didn't think he could take on Super Buu (Gohan absorbed), but he thought it wouldn't be fair to fight Kid Buu while fused, that indicates that Vegito > Super Buu > Kid Buu > SS3 Goku > Fat Buu.Hugo Boss wrote:Putting aside tons of assumptions based on half read stuff, I think Kid Boo being the strongest Majin Boo seems in line with how Toriyama likes to portray his strongest characters. Besides, going against the trend of getting stronger each time a strong fighter is absorbed kinda fits the unexpectability of Dragon Ball style. I believe Freeza and Cell underwent a similar process, specially Cell as he powered-up even more despite not absorbing No.18 after recovering from his life-risking attack.
Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
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ZeroNeonix
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
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DB▪Magnum-Expert
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
I don't think you can say that all the Kid Buu supporters are trolls. I know you didn't say that and instead said "most", but not all kid Buu supporters are trolls at all. I do, however, agree that most of them are trolls or either people who simple cherrypick information and purposedly misinterpret the scans they bring.GreatSaiyaman123 wrote:most, if not all, of the Pure Boo > Super Boo supporters can be identified as trolls or fanboys and the most known ones (Not getting into names here, but some people should know) are banned on most forums.
People I'm always keen to Debate with for the sole purpose of increasing experience and joy:
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
You can make a case of Goku not being enough to beat Super Boo, despite he never trying it anyway, but Kid Boo is another matter. It’s very possible that they understimated him exactly by the reasons you mentioned, he is not fused with anyone else and has a small build in comparison to the other Boos. The tension around the conclusion of that fight also gives me the impression Gohan and Gotenks weren’t quite capable of stopping Kid Boo.ZeroNeonix wrote:If Kid Buu had fought against Vegito and faired better than Super Buu, then we could make conclusions about Kid Buu being stronger than Super Buu. Instead, we got SS3 Goku versus Kid Buu. From that, we can only conclude that Kid Buu is stronger than Fat Buu. Considering Goku didn't think he could take on Super Buu (Gohan absorbed), but he thought it wouldn't be fair to fight Kid Buu while fused, that indicates that Vegito > Super Buu > Kid Buu > SS3 Goku > Fat Buu.Hugo Boss wrote:Putting aside tons of assumptions based on half read stuff, I think Kid Boo being the strongest Majin Boo seems in line with how Toriyama likes to portray his strongest characters. Besides, going against the trend of getting stronger each time a strong fighter is absorbed kinda fits the unexpectability of Dragon Ball style. I believe Freeza and Cell underwent a similar process, specially Cell as he powered-up even more despite not absorbing No.18 after recovering from his life-risking attack.
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Dragon Ball Daisuki
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
How would any of this really work though? Like literally, how would that work with numbers?
Let's put aside all of those other character statements and sources (some good, some specious) and as an experiment, just use the SEG multipliers. Okay, so "Super Saiyan" is supposed to be 50x Goku's normal battle power, "Super Saiyan 2" is supposed to be twice as strong as that, and "Super Saiyan 3" is supposed to be four times as strong as that, right? So if Goku's normally a "1", his other levels would look like this?
Goku (Base): 1
Goku (SSJ): 50
Goku (SSJ2): 100
Goku (SSJ3): 400
So for Kid/Pure Boo to be the strongest, that means you'd have to squeeze all of Boo's permutations between 100 and 400, right?
On this scale, the fat, childlike Majin Boo who first appeared would have to be at least 100, since he was pretty comfortably above Goku and Vegeta using SSJ2, but in order to give us as much room as possible, let's just lowball him and put him at 100. Goku thought he could obliterate Pure Boo with SSJ3's full power (400), but again, just to be generous, let's highball Pure Boo and say he's even with Goku's 400. So now Boo's levels (allowing maximum space for Pure Boo to be the strongest) should look like this:
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): ??
Boo (Super): ??
Boo (Gotenks): ??
Boo (Gohan): ??
Boo (Pure): 400
Let's try to fill those other Boos in! When the fat Boo split from the thin Boo, it was stated (by Piccolo or the narrator, who can remember which?) that the fat Boo stood no chance against the thin Boo. So really the thin Boo should be higher than 100, but again, in the interest of giving as much room as possible for Pure Boo to be the strongest, let's lowball him and say he's only 100. Provided that, at a minimum, "Super Boo" is the sum of the two Boos added together (to clarify, this isn't the only possibility; I know a lot of folks out there believe it to be a product of multiplication rather than addition, but this is just to give us a bare minimum), then he should be at 200, right? Let's plug those in!
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): 100
Boo (Super): 200
Boo (Gotenks): ??
Boo (Gohan): ??
Boo (Pure): 400
This form of Boo was said to be equal, if not a bit inferior to Gotenks as a SSJ3; but again, to make things simple, let's just say they are equal and Gotenks is also at 200. We're only at the half-way mark to Pure Boo, so there's still a lot of room for him to be the strongest. But uh-oh! It looks like Majin Boo went and absorbed some folks!
Again, operating under the assumption that the product of Boo's absorption is at a minimum equal to the sum of Boo and his victims, this would make Boo (Gotenks) a 400. Goku showed up to fight this Boo, so in a best-case scenario I guess maybe you could say that it would be a really close match? So now we're already at our limit! But phew! Boo lost Gotenks' SSJ3 power so he should be back down to around 200.
But OH NO. While all of that was going on, beloved character Ultimate Mystic Gohan (with bang) showed up! Gohan was stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks (200), but weaker than Boo after absorbing Gotenks (400), so he would have to be somewhere between 200 and 400. Anyway, Boo went and absorbed that Gohan! Now the numbers look like THIS:
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): 100
Boo (Super): 200
Boo (Gotenks): 400
Boo (Gohan): 400-600
Boo (Pure): 400
As you can see, this is all pretty nonsensical! Even in a best-case scenario, assuming Boo's absorptions are merely additive instead of multiplicative, going with the lowest possible numbers for everyone involved, AND assuming Pure Boo is equal to SSJ3 Goku instead of being a good bit weaker, it still isn't possible for Pure Boo to be stronger than all the other Boos. At best, and this is really reaching (remember how much we lowballed?), he's tied for the strongest -- but for this to even approach making any kind of sense, you'd have to say that Boo (Gotenks), Boo (Gohan), Boo (Pure), and Goku (SSJ3) are all even with each other.
Or, you know, dump the SEG.
Let's put aside all of those other character statements and sources (some good, some specious) and as an experiment, just use the SEG multipliers. Okay, so "Super Saiyan" is supposed to be 50x Goku's normal battle power, "Super Saiyan 2" is supposed to be twice as strong as that, and "Super Saiyan 3" is supposed to be four times as strong as that, right? So if Goku's normally a "1", his other levels would look like this?
Goku (Base): 1
Goku (SSJ): 50
Goku (SSJ2): 100
Goku (SSJ3): 400
So for Kid/Pure Boo to be the strongest, that means you'd have to squeeze all of Boo's permutations between 100 and 400, right?
On this scale, the fat, childlike Majin Boo who first appeared would have to be at least 100, since he was pretty comfortably above Goku and Vegeta using SSJ2, but in order to give us as much room as possible, let's just lowball him and put him at 100. Goku thought he could obliterate Pure Boo with SSJ3's full power (400), but again, just to be generous, let's highball Pure Boo and say he's even with Goku's 400. So now Boo's levels (allowing maximum space for Pure Boo to be the strongest) should look like this:
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): ??
Boo (Super): ??
Boo (Gotenks): ??
Boo (Gohan): ??
Boo (Pure): 400
Let's try to fill those other Boos in! When the fat Boo split from the thin Boo, it was stated (by Piccolo or the narrator, who can remember which?) that the fat Boo stood no chance against the thin Boo. So really the thin Boo should be higher than 100, but again, in the interest of giving as much room as possible for Pure Boo to be the strongest, let's lowball him and say he's only 100. Provided that, at a minimum, "Super Boo" is the sum of the two Boos added together (to clarify, this isn't the only possibility; I know a lot of folks out there believe it to be a product of multiplication rather than addition, but this is just to give us a bare minimum), then he should be at 200, right? Let's plug those in!
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): 100
Boo (Super): 200
Boo (Gotenks): ??
Boo (Gohan): ??
Boo (Pure): 400
This form of Boo was said to be equal, if not a bit inferior to Gotenks as a SSJ3; but again, to make things simple, let's just say they are equal and Gotenks is also at 200. We're only at the half-way mark to Pure Boo, so there's still a lot of room for him to be the strongest. But uh-oh! It looks like Majin Boo went and absorbed some folks!
Again, operating under the assumption that the product of Boo's absorption is at a minimum equal to the sum of Boo and his victims, this would make Boo (Gotenks) a 400. Goku showed up to fight this Boo, so in a best-case scenario I guess maybe you could say that it would be a really close match? So now we're already at our limit! But phew! Boo lost Gotenks' SSJ3 power so he should be back down to around 200.
But OH NO. While all of that was going on, beloved character Ultimate Mystic Gohan (with bang) showed up! Gohan was stronger than SSJ3 Gotenks (200), but weaker than Boo after absorbing Gotenks (400), so he would have to be somewhere between 200 and 400. Anyway, Boo went and absorbed that Gohan! Now the numbers look like THIS:
Boo (Fat): 100
Boo (Thin): 100
Boo (Super): 200
Boo (Gotenks): 400
Boo (Gohan): 400-600
Boo (Pure): 400
As you can see, this is all pretty nonsensical! Even in a best-case scenario, assuming Boo's absorptions are merely additive instead of multiplicative, going with the lowest possible numbers for everyone involved, AND assuming Pure Boo is equal to SSJ3 Goku instead of being a good bit weaker, it still isn't possible for Pure Boo to be stronger than all the other Boos. At best, and this is really reaching (remember how much we lowballed?), he's tied for the strongest -- but for this to even approach making any kind of sense, you'd have to say that Boo (Gotenks), Boo (Gohan), Boo (Pure), and Goku (SSJ3) are all even with each other.
Or, you know, dump the SEG.
For yer health!
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TheUltimateNinja
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
This is where you're mistaken. It's stated that Fat Buu's power was divided between the Good and Evil Buus.Dragon Ball Daisuki wrote: Let's try to fill those other Boos in! When the fat Boo split from the thin Boo, it was stated (by Piccolo or the narrator, who can remember which?) that the fat Boo stood no chance against the thin Boo. So really the thin Boo should be higher than 100, but again, in the interest of giving as much room as possible for Pure Boo to be the strongest, let's lowball him and say he's only 100. Provided that, at a minimum, "Super Boo" is the sum of the two Boos added together (to clarify, this isn't the only possibility; I know a lot of folks out there believe it to be a product of multiplication rather than addition, but this is just to give us a bare minimum), then he should be at 200, right? Let's plug those in!
So given that, you could lowball Super Buu to 100, equal to Fat Buu. Then there's no problems fitting Buuhan below SSJ3 Goku.
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Dragon Ball Daisuki
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Maybe? But then again, wasn't it heavily implied that Boo's power was greatly suppressed by the Dai Kaioshin? In other words, the power that was split up was the total amount of power that should have been at his disposal (but that he doesn't have full access to as long as Dai Kaioshin is the dominant personality).
Looking at it from another angle, whatever his power was after the split, the fat Boo fought Pure Boo afterwards and did a bit better than Vegeta (SSJ2), right? Or at the very least, did as well as him? Vegeta's supposed to be equal with Goku at this point, isn't he?
Then both Vegeta (SSJ2) and Boo (Fat/Good) should be 100, and we slide back into the same power scale. Boo (Thin/Evil) then has to be at least 100, making Super Boo at least 200 and all the rest 400 or more.
Looking at it from another angle, whatever his power was after the split, the fat Boo fought Pure Boo afterwards and did a bit better than Vegeta (SSJ2), right? Or at the very least, did as well as him? Vegeta's supposed to be equal with Goku at this point, isn't he?
Then both Vegeta (SSJ2) and Boo (Fat/Good) should be 100, and we slide back into the same power scale. Boo (Thin/Evil) then has to be at least 100, making Super Boo at least 200 and all the rest 400 or more.
For yer health!
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supersaiyangodgogeta
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Where does the Legend of Manga guidebook label Pure Boo as weaker than Super Boo?
There isn't really a need for a long drawn out debate on this. Goku states that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo. Multiple guides state that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo verbatim. Toriyama states that he made Boo the strongest in his Final Form.
It doesn't matter if people don't think it makes sense. And the whole Super Boo>Goku debacle honestly isn't relevant as that has nothing to do with Pure Boo being the strongest. It's just some wierd deflection.
There isn't really a need for a long drawn out debate on this. Goku states that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo. Multiple guides state that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo verbatim. Toriyama states that he made Boo the strongest in his Final Form.
It doesn't matter if people don't think it makes sense. And the whole Super Boo>Goku debacle honestly isn't relevant as that has nothing to do with Pure Boo being the strongest. It's just some wierd deflection.
Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
It's possible that the power that was split up was the regular power of Boo and the power of his rage, which gave birth to the other Boo. It's like the Fat Boo going berserk and not being able to sustain that power. Still, there is nothing clear about how much Boo powers up when he absorbs someone. Mostly assume he just adds, but I think it's not that drastic.Dragon Ball Daisuki wrote:Maybe? But then again, wasn't it heavily implied that Boo's power was greatly suppressed by the Dai Kaioshin? In other words, the power that was split up was the total amount of power that should have been at his disposal (but that he doesn't have full access to as long as Dai Kaioshin is the dominant personality).
Looking at it from another angle, whatever his power was after the split, the fat Boo fought Pure Boo afterwards and did a bit better than Vegeta (SSJ2), right? Or at the very least, did as well as him? Vegeta's supposed to be equal with Goku at this point, isn't he?
Then both Vegeta (SSJ2) and Boo (Fat/Good) should be 100, and we slide back into the same power scale. Boo (Thin/Evil) then has to be at least 100, making Super Boo at least 200 and all the rest 400 or more.
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ZeroNeonix
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Goku never said that Kid Buu was the strongest. During his transformation, he asks, "Is it me, or is his power rising?" Or something to that affect. That was an animeism, made up for the show to create tension. But then they immediately contradict that when Goku thinks he's strong enough to finish Buu himself, without fusion. And considering how Kid Buu didn't completely destroy Super Saiyan 3 Goku, where Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) was so obviously out of his league, the conclusion is pretty obvious. Kid Buu is more "dangerous," as the manga puts it, but that is only because of his complete lack of rationality. He's insane enough to destroy a planet while still standing on it. He's a loose canon. In contrast, Super Buu was stronger, but he had more intelligence and restraint.supersaiyangodgogeta wrote:Where does the Legend of Manga guidebook label Pure Boo as weaker than Super Boo?
There isn't really a need for a long drawn out debate on this. Goku states that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo. Multiple guides state that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo verbatim. Toriyama states that he made Boo the strongest in his Final Form.
It doesn't matter if people don't think it makes sense. And the whole Super Boo>Goku debacle honestly isn't relevant as that has nothing to do with Pure Boo being the strongest. It's just some wierd deflection.
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supersaiyangodgogeta
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
So in other words Goku said that Pure Boo is the strongest. Along with the multiple guides stating it verbatim along with Toriyama saying that he made Boo the strongest in his final form. Ok then.ZeroNeonix wrote:Goku never said that Kid Buu was the strongest. During his transformation, he asks, "Is it me, or is his power rising?" Or something to that affect. That was an animeism, made up for the show to create tension. But then they immediately contradict that when Goku thinks he's strong enough to finish Buu himself, without fusion. And considering how Kid Buu didn't completely destroy Super Saiyan 3 Goku, where Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) was so obviously out of his league, the conclusion is pretty obvious. Kid Buu is more "dangerous," as the manga puts it, but that is only because of his complete lack of rationality. He's insane enough to destroy a planet while still standing on it. He's a loose canon. In contrast, Super Buu was stronger, but he had more intelligence and restraint.supersaiyangodgogeta wrote:Where does the Legend of Manga guidebook label Pure Boo as weaker than Super Boo?
There isn't really a need for a long drawn out debate on this. Goku states that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo. Multiple guides state that Pure Boo is the strongest Boo verbatim. Toriyama states that he made Boo the strongest in his Final Form.
It doesn't matter if people don't think it makes sense. And the whole Super Boo>Goku debacle honestly isn't relevant as that has nothing to do with Pure Boo being the strongest. It's just some wierd deflection.
You didn't list a contradiction. The statements are very straight forward. A contradiction would be Goku stating that Pure Boo is the strongest, then going on to say that he isn't. But that never happened. Direct statements take precedence over hamster wheel rationalizations or what someone thinks is "obvious".
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ZeroNeonix
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Guides makes stuff up a lot. Give me a Toriyama quote.supersaiyangodgogeta wrote:So in other words Goku said that Pure Boo is the strongest. Along with the multiple guides stating it verbatim along with Toriyama saying that he made Boo the strongest in his final form. Ok then.
You didn't list a contradiction. The statements are very straight forward. A contradiction would be Goku stating that Pure Boo is the strongest, then going on to say that he isn't. But that never happened. Direct statements take precedence over hamster wheel rationalizations or what someone thinks is "obvious".
And yes, that is an obvious contradiction. Goku felt the power of Super Buu and said, "Nope! I don't stand a chance against him! I better fuse with my son. Nope! Now my son is absorbed. I'm screwed."
Then when Goku felt the power of Kid Buu, he was like, "Fusion isn't necessary here. We can totally beat him." And during their fight, the two were pretty evenly matched powerwise, only Goku's power was draining fast while Buu was just regenerating any damage made against him.
The implications are obvious, whether you choose to ignore them or not. Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) > Ultimate Gohan > Super Buu (before absorbing Gotenks) > Kid Buu = Super Saiyan 3 Goku > Fat Buu
Also, I noticed you ignored the animeism I pointed out. The anime adds stuff that isn't canon. Always has.
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supersaiyangodgogeta
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
This isn't a rebuttal. The guides are official material created to supplement and clarify details of the story and it's never stated that they "make things up".ZeroNeonix wrote:Guides makes stuff up a lot. Give me a Toriyama quote.supersaiyangodgogeta wrote:So in other words Goku said that Pure Boo is the strongest. Along with the multiple guides stating it verbatim along with Toriyama saying that he made Boo the strongest in his final form. Ok then.
You didn't list a contradiction. The statements are very straight forward. A contradiction would be Goku stating that Pure Boo is the strongest, then going on to say that he isn't. But that never happened. Direct statements take precedence over hamster wheel rationalizations or what someone thinks is "obvious".
And yes, that is an obvious contradiction. Goku felt the power of Super Buu and said, "Nope! I don't stand a chance against him! I better fuse with my son. Nope! Now my son is absorbed. I'm screwed."
Then when Goku felt the power of Kid Buu, he was like, "Fusion isn't necessary here. We can totally beat him." And during their fight, the two were pretty evenly matched powerwise, only Goku's power was draining fast while Buu was just regenerating any damage made against him.
The implications are obvious, whether you choose to ignore them or not. Super Buu (Gohan Absorbed) > Ultimate Gohan > Super Buu (before absorbing Gotenks) > Kid Buu = Super Saiyan 3 Goku > Fat Buu
Also, I noticed you ignored the animeism I pointed out. The anime adds stuff that isn't canon. Always has.
And no, Goku and Pure Boo weren't evenly matched. Goku stated that he couldn't keep up with Pure Boo even at Super Saiyan 3, then later on states that Pure Boo was far stronger than he imagined, so much so that Goku said that he would've destroyed him as Vegito if he knew that Boo would've been so strong. At no point during that fight was Boo at any risk of losing to Goku.
Again, Pure Boo is stated to be the strongest. What you think was implied doesn't have any relevance.
Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Boohan is the strongest in the manga while Kid Boo is the strongest for the anime. The former has Goku terrified of the concept of facing Super Boo without fusion but he's fine with taking on Kid.
The anime has the narrator and I believe Goku himself quite frequently refer to Kid as the most powerful.
The anime has the narrator and I believe Goku himself quite frequently refer to Kid as the most powerful.
When someone tells you, "Don't present your opinion as fact," what they're actually saying is, "Don't present your opinion with any conviction. Because I don't like your opinion, and I want to be able to dismiss it as easily as possible." Don't fall for it.
How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):
How the Black Arc Should End (by Lightbing!):
Spoiler:
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House of Balloons
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
<Massive unnecessary quote removed>
You either show me proof that the Spirit Bomb that defeated a serious Kid Buu> Super Vegito who is> Buuhan who is> Base Vegito. Or concede.
You either show me proof that the Spirit Bomb that defeated a serious Kid Buu> Super Vegito who is> Buuhan who is> Base Vegito. Or concede.
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Polyphase Avatron
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Not really.
Cool stuff that I upload here because Youtube will copyright claim it: https://vimeo.com/user60967147
Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
If we are going to go by the hypothetical scale of having Base Goku as a 1, then It follows that:
GokuBase: 1
Goku SSJ: 50
Goku SSJ2: 100
Goku SSJ3: 400
Then, since Goku estimated that Gotenks could beat Fat Buu and told Buu he would have somebody stronger coming, referring to Gotenks, then we can estimate:
SSJ Gotenks ~ SSJ3 Goku.
So it follows that on the aforementioned scale:
SSJ Gotenks: 400
SSJ2 Gotenks: 800
SSJ3 Gotenks: 3200
and then Super Buu and SSJ3 Gotenks were about equal to each other so Super Buu would probably also be around 3200 and then Ultimate Gohan is significantly stronger than both of them and Super Buu absorbs him so it would get really ugly to try to make Kid Buu look stronger than Buuhan imo.(I'd have him around 7500 on this scale)
GokuBase: 1
Goku SSJ: 50
Goku SSJ2: 100
Goku SSJ3: 400
Then, since Goku estimated that Gotenks could beat Fat Buu and told Buu he would have somebody stronger coming, referring to Gotenks, then we can estimate:
SSJ Gotenks ~ SSJ3 Goku.
So it follows that on the aforementioned scale:
SSJ Gotenks: 400
SSJ2 Gotenks: 800
SSJ3 Gotenks: 3200
and then Super Buu and SSJ3 Gotenks were about equal to each other so Super Buu would probably also be around 3200 and then Ultimate Gohan is significantly stronger than both of them and Super Buu absorbs him so it would get really ugly to try to make Kid Buu look stronger than Buuhan imo.(I'd have him around 7500 on this scale)
Spoiler:
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supersaiyangodgogeta
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Gotenks is stated to be weaker than Vegeta prior to going into the ROSAT.
And I'm wondering how people try to reconcile Buff Boo being stronger than Super Boo despite South Kai being weaker than Pure Boo when they claim that Boo's absorptions are addition, have Gotenks hundreds of times stronger than Goku and have Pure Boo equal to Goku.
And I'm wondering how people try to reconcile Buff Boo being stronger than Super Boo despite South Kai being weaker than Pure Boo when they claim that Boo's absorptions are addition, have Gotenks hundreds of times stronger than Goku and have Pure Boo equal to Goku.
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ZeroNeonix
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
Even in the anime, Super Buu is clearly the strongest. I literally just watched the episode of Kai where Super Buu absorbs Gohan. While he has Gotenks in him, neither Goku or Gohan are a match for him. Goku plans to merge with his son, because he knows he's overmatched. After Gotenks' fusion ends, however, Goku changes his mind and says that Gohan could take him on all on his own. This establishes that Gohan is, in fact, stronger than Goku himself at that point. After Super Buu absorbs Gohan, Goku knows he's in trouble. He's desperate enough to even consider fusing with Hercule. It makes absolutely ZERO sense that Kid Buu would be the strongest when everything points to Super Buu with Gohan absorbed being the most powerful.ekrolo2 wrote:Boohan is the strongest in the manga while Kid Boo is the strongest for the anime. The former has Goku terrified of the concept of facing Super Boo without fusion but he's fine with taking on Kid.
The anime has the narrator and I believe Goku himself quite frequently refer to Kid as the most powerful.
If Kid Buu were really that strong, Goku wouldn't have even been able to fight back, but we see that he does. The only reason Goku couldn't defeat Buu is because of the massive drain Super Saiyan 3 has on his energy. That's exactly how the anime frames their struggle, when Vegeta steps in to give Goku a chance to recharge. All we have in the anime pointing to Kid Buu's superiority is one line from Goku implying that Kid Buu felt like he increased in power, but like many things the anime adds, it makes absolutely no sense with the rest of the story.
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GreatSaiyaman123
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
It's not really impossible Goku got stronger out of the blue for the Pure Boo fight. Pretty sure Toei did that on Super a few times, so nothing much wrong with this hapening on Z.ZeroNeonix wrote:Even in the anime, Super Buu is clearly the strongest
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ZeroNeonix
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Re: Would it make more sense if Kid Buu was the strongest Buu?
By such an extreme amount? Now I know that Toriyama doesn't really keep track of power levels or anything like that. It's why Trunks was able to fight Super Saiyan Rosé Goku Black. It was just convenient for the plot. But there are several signs that Kid Buu was originally intended to be weaker than Super Buu.GreatSaiyaman123 wrote:It's not really impossible Goku got stronger out of the blue for the Pure Boo fight. Pretty sure Toei did that on Super a few times, so nothing much wrong with this hapening on Z.ZeroNeonix wrote:Even in the anime, Super Buu is clearly the strongest
Goku to Vegeta when against Super Buu: "How do you want this to end, Vegeta? If we don't merge, our planet and everything we care about is gone forever! Do you want our friends and families to die in vain?"
Goku against Kid Buu: "Nah, we don't need 'em (Potara ear rings). Besides, he's not merged with anyone any more, so it wouldn't be right."
That's quite a change of attitude, if Buu's power really did increase after returning to his original form. Now, if Kid Buu was weaker, and Goku thought he had a chance on his own, that change in attitude would be totally in character.