is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

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is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by p-hyvo » Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:52 am

i didint get this well and I'm not sure, because if ccl Goku = dbs Goku that would change a lot every power level discussion, and that will be a hell of enormous change for me

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:05 am

What's "CCL"? And yes, the non-Xeno Goku comes from Dragon Ball Super, but why creating a thread just for the question? You could have asked that here or here.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by dbgtFO » Tue Jun 05, 2018 3:34 am

Grimlock wrote:What's "CCL"? And yes, the non-Xeno Goku comes from Dragon Ball Super, but why creating a thread just for the question? You could have asked that here or here.
It can only mean "Capsule Corp Logo".

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by mute_proxy » Tue Jun 05, 2018 4:42 am

In a separate game only canon sense, he is. He's the one with SSBlue, and Xeno Goku is the one with SS4

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by ankokudaishogun » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:23 pm

unless otherwise stated or shown, while Goku:CC might not be Goku:Super, he has to be taken to absolutely identical for all intents and purposes to post-ToP Goku:Super

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:27 pm

dbgtFO wrote:[It can only mean "Capsule Corp Logo".
Just call him Goku, since there's no specification and it is the Goku we know.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by shadowfox87 » Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:39 pm

It's Goku after ToP. There's no change for me power scaling wise at all. It's consistent with everything I already wrote.

The source of the confusion stemmed from the assumption that Xeno Goku had god ki. However, that assumption is based from a 3DS game called Ultimate Mission X. At no point in the DBH arcade game or in other missions, has this ever been stated. Furthermore, SSJ4 > SSJ and SSB = SSJ+god ki. Hence, if you add god ki to both sides of the equation, SSJ4+god ki > SSJ+god ki --> SSJ4+god ki > SSB. This isn't the case however, since we find that SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku. By logic, this Xeno Goku doesn't have god ki.
DBS Manga vs Anime Differences: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=42062
Timelines Explanation: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=42105
Log Power Scaling: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=40610
Science of Ultra Instinct: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=40707

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:36 pm

shadowfox87 wrote:It's Goku after ToP. There's no change for me power scaling wise at all. It's consistent with everything I already wrote.

The source of the confusion stemmed from the assumption that Xeno Goku had god ki. However, that assumption is based from a 3DS game called Ultimate Mission X. At no point in the DBH arcade game or in other missions, has this ever been stated. Furthermore, SSJ4 > SSJ and SSB = SSJ+god ki. Hence, if you add god ki to both sides of the equation, SSJ4+god ki > SSJ+god ki --> SSJ4+god ki > SSB. This isn't the case however, since we find that SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku. By logic, this Xeno Goku doesn't have god ki.
Maybe not God Ki specifically, but certainly god empowerment if the events of Battle of Gods (which DID happen for Xeno Goku, as well) are anything to go by.

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by TobyS » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:53 am

PerhapsTheOtherOne wrote:
shadowfox87 wrote:It's Goku after ToP. There's no change for me power scaling wise at all. It's consistent with everything I already wrote.

The source of the confusion stemmed from the assumption that Xeno Goku had god ki. However, that assumption is based from a 3DS game called Ultimate Mission X. At no point in the DBH arcade game or in other missions, has this ever been stated. Furthermore, SSJ4 > SSJ and SSB = SSJ+god ki. Hence, if you add god ki to both sides of the equation, SSJ4+god ki > SSJ+god ki --> SSJ4+god ki > SSB. This isn't the case however, since we find that SSB Goku > SSJ4 Xeno Goku. By logic, this Xeno Goku doesn't have god ki.
Maybe not God Ki specifically, but certainly god empowerment if the events of Battle of Gods (which DID happen for Xeno Goku, as well) are anything to go by.
How do we know bog happened to this ssj4 Goku?
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by mute_proxy » Wed Jun 06, 2018 4:56 am

TobyS wrote:How do we know bog happened to this ssj4 Goku?
Probably the current DBHeroes manga

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by TobyS » Wed Jun 06, 2018 5:24 am

mute_proxy wrote:
TobyS wrote:How do we know bog happened to this ssj4 Goku?
Probably the current DBHeroes manga
It's so weird how hard to find a English scan of that outside the first 4 chapters, keep getting the shitty earlier in about kids playing a video game...
Yamcha almost certainly did not cheat on Bulma:
He was afraid of Women, Bulma was the flirty one.
Yamcha wanted to get married (it was his gonna be his wish)
He suggested they settle down in the Trunks saga.
Alternate future Trunks is not a reliable source.
Toriyama wanted new SSJ Kids and not make new characters.

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by shadowfox87 » Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:49 am

mute_proxy wrote:
TobyS wrote:How do we know bog happened to this ssj4 Goku?
Probably the current DBHeroes manga
I have all chapters of the sdbh manga up to Chapter 6 translated. No indication that BoG happened to Xeno Goku. Again this stems from Ultimate Mission X. Chronoa summoned the strongest warrior from Trunks memories - Xeno Goku. This happens in Chapter 1 of SDBH. This Trunks is post-Cell Saga. He has killed the Androids and Imperfect Cell. Gohan should be the strongest warrior technically in his memories but because growing up, Future Bulma always told Trunks about Goku, he looks up to Goku as the strongest warrior. Chronoa then summoned a Future version of Goku from a GT timeline. Later on, even Xeno Vegeta joins the team and he's irritated that his own son thinks Goku is stronger than he is. However, the Vegeta from the Cell saga wasn't exactly the best role model for Trunks.
DBS Manga vs Anime Differences: viewtopic.php?f=25&t=42062
Timelines Explanation: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=42105
Log Power Scaling: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=40610
Science of Ultra Instinct: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=40707

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Wed Jun 06, 2018 9:50 am

TobyS wrote:How do we know bog happened to this ssj4 Goku?
Anyone who read the Dark Demon Realm Mission, Universe Mission and Ultimate Charisma Mission mangas knows that Movie 14 did not happen to Xeno Goku. In the arcade game, there is also no mention, or even implying that Movie 14 happened to Xeno Goku.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by mute_proxy » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:14 am

Grimlock wrote:
Anyone who read the Dark Demon Realm Mission, Universe Mission and Ultimate Charisma Mission mangas knows that Movie 14 did not happen to Xeno Goku. In the arcade game, there is also no mention, or even implying that Movie 14 happened to Xeno Goku.

And what about the 3DS game?

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:19 am

The 3DS game is a whole different thing, more like set in an alternate dimension. The game has its own events and rules that do not apply to the main version of Heroes (which is the arcade), exactly how Dragon Ball Super manga is not to be seen in a same continuity as the Dragon Ball Super anime. They are similar, but not to be treated/seen as the same thing.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by mute_proxy » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:25 am

Grimlock wrote:The 3DS game is a whole different thing, more like set in an alternate dimension. The game has its own events and rules that do not apply to the main version of Heroes (which is the arcade), exactly how Dragon Ball Super manga is not to be seen in a same continuity as the Dragon Ball Super anime. They are similar, but not to be treated/seen as the same thing.
That's like treating the Z movies as a separate thing from the Z series, which in Heroes' case, they aren't. It's still part of the same. Just because some things/events don't align, doesn't mean it's another thing completely. In other words, both Xeno Goku's CAN have the same backstory, even if they might not be the same beings.

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:34 am

mute_proxy wrote:That's like treating the Z movies as a separate thing from the Z series.
And this is exactly what you should do. The movies take place in another dimension, apart/separated from the "main" one.
mute_proxy wrote:It's still part of the same. Just because some things don't align, doesn't mean nothing does.
No, they are not. Otherwise you'd have to explain how and why in the hell would Kaioshin of Time create different/multiple Time Patrols, why would Chamel first appear in SDBH3 (arcade version) if he appears earlier in one of the GDM missions (3DS version), and none of the characters (from the arcade) knew Chamel prior to SDBH3. You would have to explain a lot of stuff and would have to fit everything that blatantly contradict each other.

In the Ultimate Charisma Mission manga, Xeno Goku clearly says he doesn't know about God Ki. How do you fit this information with his claim that he once transformed into Super Saiyan God in 3DS game? Why didn't Xeno Goku make any comment upon seeing Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan if he had Super Saiyan God/God ki in the arcade?
mute_proxy wrote:In other words, both Xeno Goku's CAN have the same backstory, even if they might not be the same beings.
Yes, up until Majin Buu saga. Then 3DS Xeno Goku experienced Movie 14, but the "main"/arcade/manga Xeno Goku did not.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by mute_proxy » Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:01 am

Grimlock wrote:
Yes, up until Majin Buu saga. Then 3DS Xeno Goku experienced Movie 14, but the "main"/arcade/manga Xeno Goku did not.
And why not? Is there something contradicting it?

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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by Grimlock » Wed Jun 06, 2018 11:04 am

Yes. Read my post entirely.
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Re: is ccl goku in the upcoming dbh anime goku from dbs?

Post by PerhapsTheOtherOne » Wed Jun 06, 2018 6:30 pm

Huh..... coulda sworn that Geekdom101 said that Xeno Goku did go through Battle of Gods in his video covering the character.

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