So how did the cell juniors survive?

[PFM18]

You mean that thing you do consistently every single month for every single chapter of the Super manga? That thing you do based on 3 or 4 out of context pages before the chapter is even translated and released with proper context?

It is fair criticism. Sure, I usually criticize it before the official translations are out, and it may seem to be out of context, ultimately the criticism still holds water after the official translations are out. If I were to misunderstand a scene, and criticize it based on my misunderstanding, I would correct myself and/or apologize for the unfair, inaccurate premature criticism. The problem is, this hasn't actually happened. What does happen, is that Toyotaro apologists come to his defense and come up with all kinds of ridiculous excuses and convoluted rationalizations of the events in the manga.

For example, when the manga shows:

SSJ2 Vegeta>SSJ Black>Base Black>SSJ3 Goku

Which, of course, is incredibly stupid. People claimed this was a result of Vegeta retaining his obscenely powerful SSJ2 form he used against Beerus when he hit Bulma. This is quite literally the definition of convoluted and is an example of Toyotaro apologists pretending like this actually makes sense. Irrationally defending him and coming up with explanations that are clearly not intended by him or implied in any way.

This garbage is largely all you ever have to contribute to discussions. Pantalones covered the subject perfectly, but you won't have any of it, You offered nothing of value to further the discussion at hand and only took the opportunity to once again attack the manga/Toyotaro. You don't come in looking for civil. rational discussion or getting to the truth of the matter, it's always just looking for a way to crap on the manga/Toyotaro and push your biases on to everyone.

I am not going to sit here and pretend like this is a gag chapter and that excuses the ridiculousness of this plot point. People make excuses like "oh well it doesn't matter it is a gag chapter." They come up with these excuses to dismiss these failures in storytelling and I am not going to sit here and stand for things like that. It is a contribution because I am simply voicing my opinion on the matter, that being that this is a blatant inconsistency and cannot be rationalized. You seem to be angry that I am criticizing Toyotaro's work, but I have every right to voice my concerns on how poor of a job he does. I don't see how you can really determine that I am not having a rational discussion, or getting to the truth. It is perfectly rational to explain my interpretation being that the truth is this is a blatant inconsistency. Plain and simple. Is it irrational for me to call it an inconsistency from my point of view? No, not at all. You may disagree, but it is simply my opinion and my interpretation that this is not consistent with what was established during the original source material.

I don't know what set you off, but this personal crusade of yours to shit on Toyotaro at every opportunity needs to stop. You constantly bring it up in every thread and discussion you're a part of regardless of whether or not it's relevant, on topic or if comparisons were even being made in the first place.

I don't see any policy against criticism. I don't really quite understand how what I am doing is something that is problematic to the discussion.

Like this comment below from the Broly Movie discussion thread that has absolutely nothing to do with the manga at all.

That comment was perfectly relevant to the discussion. The idea of bringing Cumber into the movie or to be used in the future, was brought up. Cumber as a character was being criticized for not having a character and I didn't see a problem with it. Cumber is a character who is part of a promotional anime for a game, and it is not meant to be taken seriously as a story. It is not necessarily fair to hold Cumber to a high standard as a character, when the story is not really meant to be taken seriously. It is just a story about crazy fights that promotes a game. So I don't see Cumber's lack of a character as a problem.

On the other hand, Toyotaro's work is meant to be taken seriously because it is an official continuation of Toriyama's story. So while Cumber being devoid of character is not a problem because of the low standard set by the storytelling in Heroes, Toyotaro's characters being devoid of character is a problem because it is an official work that is meant to be taken seriously. I was simply distinguishing between when a character should or shouldn't be held to a higher standard and it was perfectly relevant to the discussion. If you can't see the relevance to the discussion at hand, that is not my problem.

You often bring up the manga or Toyotaro completely unprovoked to make some snotty, passive aggressive backhanded remark. I've been around these forums since last year quietly watching things unfold and I can't help but pick up on your behavior. It regularly borders on infringing on the community guidelines - especially regarding civility with other users and remaining on topic. For your own sake, I'd cut back on the vendetta or you may wind up getting yourself banned. I'm no moderator and I won't pretend to be one, but I've seen other users get banned for less.

Your entire post has served to attack me and has contributed absolutely nothing to the discussion whatsoever so I don't think you really have a leg to stand on as far as citing the community guidelines. I am perfectly civil when discussing these things and there's no policy against criticism. As I already explained, in terms of remaining on topic, you don't seem to understand how these things are on topic. If anything, you should feel obliged to make a better effort to remain on topic.