Tales from the Daizenshuu

[Herms]

----Notice:This old thread is part of my series of guides. To avoid necro-posting, please post any comments you have in the sticky thread for my guides, rather than here. Thanks!----

While I was home during my Thanksgiving college break, I took the opportunity to look through my Daizenshuu for rare and interesting facts. I decided to do this because of the “What does ‘Daizenshuu’ meant to you?” thread and the various other discussions we’ve had about the Daizenshuu on these boards. The Daizenshuu are rare books and very few fans outside of Japan have them, so I want to do what I can to help make the information in them available to more people. That and there’s a few things in there that puzzle me and I want to see if someone else might be able to shed a little light on it for me.

(I don’t really know whether or not ‘Daizenshuu’ on its own should be capitalized, but I’m going to stop doing so from here on out because it’s annoying me)

Basically I’ve gone through them looking for anything that I think is interesting and that you probably wouldn’t know if you didn’t have them. I’ve generally left out things that, while only found in the daizenshuu, are already well known among fans, such as the battle powers from Daizenshuu 7. For this reason I’ve ignored the interviews with Toriyama entirely, since there are numerous translations of them available on the internet.

Obviously my findings are by no means complete, since there is an absurd amount of information in the daizenshuu and anything short of a full translation would leave something out. I’m also limited by the fact that I only have the hardcover daizenshuu, 1-7. If anyone who owns the softcover daizenshuu wants to contribute anything, feel free. Actually, anybody who has any of the daizenshuu and wants to contribute something from them is welcome to.

Are you ready? Then let’s begin!

Daizenshuu 1: Complete Illustrations
OK, so what information could I possibly find in a daizenshuu that’s just pictures, especially since I already said I was leaving out the Toriyama interview? Well, at the back of this daizenshuu, after the pictures but before the interview, is a sort of index of every image in the book. Under each image is a sentence or so describing the image, telling what it was drawn for, and giving other tidbits. None of this information is earth-shattering, but if you’re a fan of Toriyama’s artwork you might find some of it interesting.

For instance, for Piece 76, which is a group picture of the RR Army era cast all running happily, the notes say that the original picture was lost and they had to use the issue of Jump it in appeared as a source.



Pieces 41 and 42 show Goku holding an anime cell of himself and listening to a record playing, respectively (Piece 42 is the logo used for the Daizenshuu EX podcast). According to the notes, Toriyama drew these in response to receiving an anime cell and a record of the anime theme (presumable Makafushigi Adventure at this point) as a gift. You can see both of these pictures if you go to the Daizenshuu EX homepage; they're on the right sidebar.

The big thing I want to mention is something called the Catchphrase Grand Prix. It is noted several times throughout the image index notes that Toriyama drew some pieces for this. Apparently it was a contest which involved the various Jump manga artists drawing a picture based on a particular phrase, Exploding Dog-style. I think the idea was that readers would send in catchphrases, and the winner’s catchphrase would be the one that the mangaka drew a picture of. However, I’ve been unable to find much information on this so far.

Anyway, do you know the picture where Goku, Piccolo, and Gohan are all dressed up in ancient Chinese, Journey to the West style clothing? This is Piece 140, and according to the notes it was drawn by Toriyama for the Catchphrase Grand Prix. The catchphrase this piece was based on is “最っ勇気!!”. This translates out to “Maximum Courage!!” or something like that, but the joke is that the characters are read as ‘saiyyuki’, which is a pun on ‘saiyuuki’, the Japanese name for Journey to the West. So we get a picture of everyone dressed as Journey to the West characters and looking brave.


The next Catchphrase Grand Prix picture is Piece 190, which shows Trunks and everyone wearing Saiyan armor, with Trunk’s time machine in the back ground. The catchphrase this time was “Mirai wa…tourai.”, or ‘The future…is arriving’. Therefore, we get Trunks and his time machine. (It would seem that the catchphrases often involve wordplay)


The last piece of these pieces I noticed, though there probably were others, was Piece 262. This is a Buu era picture of the cast, with Gohan in the middle looking weirdly happy. The notes say that this was the last picture Toriyama drew for the Catchphrase Grand Prix, though it fails to say what the catchphrase actually was. (I should also note that Vegeta is oddly wearing his Cell era clothing in this picture)


Piece 100, a cover page which shows Goku and Gohan riding on a short-legged dinosaur through heavy jungle, is notable because at the top instead of ‘Dragon Ball’ it says ‘Dagon Ball’. The notes for this image describe this as ‘charming’. This was corrected in the kanzenban release and (I think) the Viz graphic novel edition, making the original incorrect version something of a rarity. (‘Dagon Ball’ sounds like a crossover between Dragon Ball and the works of H.P. Lovecraft, which would be either amazingly awesome or really, really dumb)


On the subject of altered images, there’s Piece 192, which is the infamous ‘Everyone flipping off Cell’ image. Of course, Viz edited out all the middle fingers, making the original something you won’t see in America, though you can find it outside of the daizenshuu. I just want to note that in fact everyone isn’t flipping Cell off, just Kuririn, Tenshinhan, Yamcha, and Trunks. For some reason I find it amusing that none of the androids are flipping him off, since it seems like they have the most reason to do so.

There's a piece that shows #16, #17, and #18, with a giant image of Goku's face in the background (unfortunately I can't tell from my awful handwriting what number this piece is). The notes say that Toriyama put Goku in there because this was the part of the story when he was still unconcious from his heart virus, and he wanted to include him in the title page since he wouldn't be in the story. Something like that, anyway (damn handwriting).


Daizenshuu 1 includes the complete spine image illustration (that picture that is spread over the spines of the tankoubon volumes). If you have the tankoubon volumes or the Viz graphic novels, you might have noticed that this image is never actually completed! Volume 42’s spine image (DBZ vol.26 for Viz) shows SSJ Goku’s legs with his feet partially cut off. Daizenshuu 1 includes that missing snippit of Goku’s feet, labeling it as ‘unused’.


So that’s it for Daizenshuu 1. Jiminy Mosachrist, I wrote this much already and I’m only done with the first daizenshuu?! I’ll have to continue this later.

Edit: Images added, courtesy of Saiyan, who is awesome.

[KillerCory]

Cool information. I should be getting Daizenshuu #1 in the mail very soon.

[aegoku]

That was incredibly helpful and informative. Thanks for taking the time to post all that great information.

[Herms]

Daizenshuu 2: Story Guide
There’s a lot of stuff in this daizenshuu. A large part of it is dedicated to simply summarizing the events of each volume, from the start of the series to the end. There’s also a lot of stuff that organizes information in interesting or useful ways, such as giving little ‘personal histories’ that show the various ages, forms, and whatnot that each character goes through in the course of the series. There’s also the ‘human drama’ section, which is more or less summaries of the character arcs of different characters. For instance, Piccolo’s entry here shows show he evolves from a villain to ‘Unchy Piccolo’, to steal a phrase from the podcast. While it’s all very neat and useful, it’s still stuff you could get from studying the series in-depth, so I won’t dwell on it too much.

First I’d like to mention the pre-Dragon Ball works that Toriyama did that went on to influence Dragon Ball, which is covered on p.46 of Daizenshuu 2. I’m pretty sure this was explained in one of the old Ask Daizenshuu EX questions or some such place, but I think its interesting enough to repeat. Basically, before Dragon Ball Toriyama made a manga called Dragon Boy, which starred a boy with dragon wings who had to escort a princess to her home country. Like Goku, he didn’t know the difference between men and women, so there are parts that are very reminiscent of early Dragon Ball stuff. He also encountered shape-shifting ‘youkai’, Japanese spirit/monster things (Oolong was referred to as a ‘youkai’ when he first appeared).

There’s also Tonpuu’s Big Adventure (tonpuu no daibouken), which features capsules! Except these ones have to be boiled, so they aren’t nearly as useful as the ones in Dragon Ball. They were called ‘iro-iro capsules’ (‘iro-iro’ means ‘various’).


Next, some form names. On p.112, in Goku’s personal history entry, it refers to the form of Super Saiyan that Goku and Gohan show off before and during the Cell Games as ‘Super Saiyan Full-Power ’ also called 'Full-Power Super Saiyan' (超サイヤ人フルパワー, they use the English phrase ‘full-power’ here). There are a couple of misconceptions about this phrase I want to clear up. First, even though this form is most known for Goku and Gohan going around relaxing in it, it is used in fighting. Goku’s entry counts him as being a Super Saiyan Full-Power when he fights Cell, and notes that his aura is different then it was as a regular Super Saiyan. This ties into the second misconception, that Super Saiyan Full-Power only refers to the aura-less state we see Goku and Gohan in.

The last thing I have to say about this is more of an argument than a tidbit, but I know that a lot of people have seen the phrase ‘Super Saiyan Full-Power ’ as being contradicted by the existence of Super Saiyan 2 and 3. However, the daizenshuu were published after the end of the series, and it would be bizarre of them to coin a phrase that they would have known wasn’t true. Instead, I think the phrase is simply meant to refer to the fact that Super Saiyan Full-Power shows the full power of the first level of Super Saiyan.



Next we have ‘Saikyou no Senshi’ (最強の戦士), the term used in Gohan’s personal history entry (p.114-117) to refer to what is more commonly known as Ultimate Gohan. This phrase means ‘The Strongest Warrior’, and is taken from the old Kaioshin’s dialogue when describing his whole awaking-hidden-power power and the effect it will have on Gohan (interesting, this exact phrase first turns up way back during the Saiyan arc, when Piccolo says that he will make Gohan into the strongest warrior). Daizenshuu 7’s pullout poster with all the characters calls this same form of Gohan ‘Super Son Gohan’ (超孫悟飯, with the kanji 超 being read as ‘suupa’, same as with how Super Saiyan is written in Japanese). Despite the hopes and dreams of various Phenomenol-type fans, all this entry says in terms of strength is that in this form of Gohan surpasses Gotenks.


Vegeta’s personal history entry (p.124-125) lists ‘Hakai-Ouji Vegeta’ (破壊王子ベジータ) for what is generally called ‘Majin Vegeta’. This term means ‘Destructive Prince Vegeta’.


Daizenshuu 2’s battle list (p.242 onwards, I think) contains every battle in the entire manga. It counts the first bout as Goku versus the fish, so you know they’re not leaving anything out. From Goku versus the fish to Goku versus Uub, the daizenshuu lists 187 battles.

The Shenlong Times insert for this daizenshuu includes some stuff on Toriyama’s three editors during his Dragon Ball years. The first one is Torishima Kazuhiko, who was Toriyama’s editor from the start of Dragon Ball (and even before that, when he was working on Dr. Slump) up until the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai. The insert says that Torishimi was the model for Piccolo Daimaou. Dr. Slump fans might know that Torishima was also the basis for Senbei’s nemesis Dr. Mashirito (‘Torishima’ with the syllables reversed). This makes him just about the most evil human being in history.

A close second is Toriyama’s 2nd editor: Kondou Yuu, who the insert says was the model for Freeza! Kondou was editor from the Saiyan story arc until the first appearance of Cell in his complete form. Toriyama’s last editor for Dragon Ball was Takeda Fuyuto, who served from the first appearance of Cell in his complete form until the end of the series. The insert says that Takeda was the model for Fat Buu.



Here's a scan of the first page of Daizenshuu 2's Shenlong Times insert (again, all scans are thanks to the extremely generous Saiyan). This shows Toriyama with his three editors. Unfortunately, I don't know for sure who's who. Saiyan has more scans of the Shenlong Times in his post below.

Backing back up to Gohan’s personal history entry, I’d like to follow up on the issue of Gohan and SSJ2. Apparently people have claimed that the daizenshuu says Gohan never goes SSJ2 after he shows off the form to Kibito. Now, I failed to find anything that says this, either in his personal history entry here, or in his Daizenshuu 7 bio, or anywhere else I looked. I might have not looked in the right place, though. Either way, we all know that Gohan’s Buu arc SSJ2 form was weaker than the Cell Games version. The standard reason, given in the series after all, is that he failed to train. However, I noticed that Gohan’s personal history entry also notes that him not being angry was also a factor.

That's it for 2. Next is 3, the Animation Guide part 1. I actually don't have too much on that one.

edit: Saiyan's scans added, changed 'Full Power Super Saiyan' to 'Super Saiyan Full-Power

[testing223]

Love to see some scans of what you speak of!

[Kikoha Hater]

Wow Herms, that was very informative.

[Chuquita]

The fact that Toriyama's editors were models for the villains in db/dbz is hilarious.

I almost imagine these guys to look like "human" versions of the villains in real life. XD

[Ash]

The fact that Toriyama's editors were models for the villains in db/dbz is hilarious.

It's not the first time Toriyama had done it: in Dr. Slump the evil Dr. Mashirito is based on his editor Torishima.

[FindKenshi]

I thank you very much for doing this, sir. It's everything I expected. I know it's too late to ask you now, but I'm really hoping you got some interesting tidbits about Freeza. I'd like to hear them all. I'm somewhat of a Freeza fanatic. Anyway, it's hillariously awesome that the major villains were based on his editors.

[Herms]

Love to see some scans of what you speak of!

Yeah, I would have loved to make some, but unfortunately I don't have a scanner at my home. It would have made explaning some things a lot easier to have pictures.

I thank you very much for doing this, sir. It's everything I expected. I know it's too late to ask you now, but I'm really hoping you got some interesting tidbits about Freeza. I'd like to hear them all. I'm somewhat of a Freeza fanatic. Anyway, it's hillariously awesome that the major villains were based on his editors.

I do have a few that relate to Freeza and his organization, mostly from Daizenshuu 4 and a few from 7. I'll probably be doing both of those last however, so you might have to wait a bit. But I think I already had the thing about how Freeza is based on Toriyama's second editor, so that's something.

[Kikoha Hater]

I was hoping if you could answer a few attack question since the Ultimate DBZ Information Site lacks vital info on some of the attacks that was listed. I’ve been wondering if this “Isa o Hasahusa Tobatsu” was the whirlwind breath that Freeza used on those three namekian warriors. What is this “Kamino Bashi Waza” that Cashyu uses, I can only assume it was where he lets his hair grow to strangle Gohan technique and if Double Attack refer to that combined Ki attack they Sail and Tado used on Gohan. Is Janemba’s Nindouriki the attack where he fires off all those beams, and what is this “Setsu Toku”, Chou Keekai, and Finish Flash. Does the really Daizenshuu shed any light on these questions? I would very much appreciate it .

[Saiyan]

I can make some scans for you if you want. I have the first 7 Daizenshuu. If you want you can PM me some pages you want me to scan in, and I'll try to get started on the first two this weekend.

[Toriyama Boss]

I'd be happy to translate those scans when posted.

[Saiyan]

Alrighty. Here are some scans. I tried to clean up the sides as much as possible. Some of em have sides that are just a tad blurry, and the Piece #100 one was a two page spread, and I really wasn't in the mood to break my Daizenshuu binding .

Daizenshuu #1




Daizenshuu #2


Daizenshuu #2 Shenlong Times



Daizenshuu #3


Daizenshuu #5

[Herms]

Daizenshuu 5: TV Animation Part 2

OK, so obviously I’m skipping around a little. I want to save the more information heavy daizenshuu for last, so I’ll be doing 3, 5, and 6 first and 4 and 7 for last. And since I don’t have anything interesting for 3, here we are at Daizenshuu 5.

The first thing from the animation guide I want to talk about is something that doesn’t even involve the anime itself. Instead, it’s a series of so-called ‘Outside Stories’ based on the Dragon Ball Z anime that were published by Shueisha. These are featured in one of Daizenshuu 5’s ‘Variety of DB’ articles, on pp.156-157. Apparently, they were a series of original manga-like stories that served as special features in several different Dragon Ball books.

The first one appeared in Weekly Shounen Jump Special Edition: Dragon Ball Z Anime Special, and was called “ピッコロ大魔王の名に賭けて” (‘Risking the name of Piccolo Daimaou’, or something like that). It focused on Piccolo, starting from his birth from Piccolo Daimaou’s egg and going up until his tutoring of Gohan and the arrival of Vegeta and Nappa. The story was by Koyama Takao, who did series composition and screenplays for the anime. The illustrations where by Maeda Minoru, who worked on the anime as a chief animator, animation director, and character designer.




The second one appeared in Dragon Ball Z Anime Special II, and was called “誇り高き!! サイヤの王子ベジータ” (‘High Pride!! The Saiya Prince Vegeta’). It focused on Vegeta, from his childhood on Planet Vegeta until his revival by Namek's Dragon Balls. It was again written by Koyama Takao and illustrated by Maeda Minoru.



The final one was included in the Anime Comics version of the Bardock special, and was called “孤独の未来戦士!! トランクス” (‘Lonely Future Warrior!! Trunks’). It told Trunk’s story, covering much of the same material as the Trunks special. However, it went further than the Trunks special did and included Trunks' journey into the past, his first meeting with his father, and his fight against Cell in the present. This one was written by Matsui Miya, who was scenario supervisor for the anime; the illustrations were again by Maeda Minoru.

I'll do the rest of Daizenshuu 5 later.

Alrighty. Here are some scans. I tried to clean up the sides as much as possible. Some of em have sides that are just a tad blurry, and the Piece #100 one was a two page spread, and I really wasn't in the mood to break my Daizenshuu binding .

Thank you! I'm going to go back and incorperate these in my original post, if that's OK.

edit: Scandalous!
edit: corrected my mistake on exactly what material Piccolo's story covers, and finally added the team who created Trunks' story. Also changed original wording which suggested that the Ouside Stories were unconnected with the anime; the were in fact based directly on the anime and not the manga
edit: corrected what material is covered by Vegeta and Trunks' stories

[Toriyama Boss]

Cool Guys!
@Herms: If you want to post scans of the characters profiles from the Daizenshuu 7 I will be happy to translate ALL of them! Matter of fact just post as much scans as you can and I will translate all of it.

Thank you!

[Herms]

Daizenshuu 5: TV Animation Part 2
Continued

OK, so it’s later.

On p.68 there is a feature on Toriyama’s involvement in the anime. An extremely similar feature, possible even an identical one, was apparently included in the recent anime guide Son Gokuu Densetsu, and is the basis for the “Akira Toriyama had nothing to do with filler” entry in Daizenshuu EX’s rumor guide. The feature shows the character designs Toriyama made for anime-only characters such as Paikuhan and the Dai-Kaiou. It also includes ideas and sketches that he gave the anime staff to embellish and make into filler. For instance, Yamcha playing on a baseball team was Toriyama’s idea. He also suggested that there be a giant snake on the Serpent Road, which formed the basis for the Princess Snake episode. However, he only gave basic ideas, and DID NOT WRITE FILLER.

*ahem*

He also provided the anime staff with specially colored images for characters who hadn’t appeared in color chapters yet, so they would know what colors to use. For instance, the daizenshuu shows a color copy of Chapter 362’s cover page, which shows Cell in his egg, larva, and imperfect forms. This cover page was originally black and white, but Toriyama colored in a copy and sent it to the anime staff so that they would know what Cell’s proper colors were. The daizenshuu notes that this would make it the first color picture of Cell ever. You still can’t see Toriyama’s colored version outside of the daizenshuu (and maybe Son Gokuu Densetsu).

More ideas that Toriyama supplied the anime staff with (this is still from p.68): The Tsufuru are only ½ as tall as the Saiyans, due to their planet’s high gravity and the fact that they aren’t as strong as the Saiyans. Saibaiman are made from Saiyan biotechnology. Scouters are Tsufuru technology.


On p.105 it has a feature on how some specific things from the manga were adapted for the anime, such as Freeza’s final transformation, Goku’s SSJ3 transformation, and Fusion. It notes the voice of the fused character was made by having the voice actors for both characters talk into the microphone in unison. You probably already figured that out from just watching the show, but for whatever reason it treats this as a big secret, which I found amusing. The interesting thing is that Toriyama came up with the idea of providing the fused characters’ voices this way.


On p.106 they show some of the height charts that the animators used to keep track of the heights of the different characters. According to this, Gotenks is actually about a head taller than Goten or Trunks. Weird.


And that’s all I have for Daizenshuu 5. I’ll do 3 next, which will take all of ten seconds to do, with the amount of notes I have on it.

edit: Scan scan, kokoro hikarete 'ku...

[Herms]

Cool Guys!
@Herms: If you want to post scans of the characters profiles from the Daizenshuu 7 I will be happy to translate ALL of them! Matter of fact just post as much scans as you can and I will translate all of it.

Thank you!

That'd be nice. I still do owe you a scan of the 'kiri' entry in Daizenshuu 7...

Well, this isn't a scan, but could you tell me exactly what "ピッコロ大魔王の名に賭けて" means? I don't think I quite get what ' 賭けて' is supposed to mean here. What does it mean to risk/gamble a name? Is it a colloquial expression that I'm not familiar with? I'd be great if you could explain this for me.

[Chibi Mystic Gohan]

Daizenshuu 5: TV Animation Part 2
Continued

OK, so it’s later.

On p.68 there is a feature on Toriyama’s involvement in the anime. An extremely similar feature, possible even an identical one, was apparently included in the recent anime guide Son Gokuu Densetsu, and is the basis for the “Akira Toriyama had nothing to do with filler” entry in Daizenshuu EX’s rumor guide. The feature shows the character designs Toriyama made for anime-only characters such as Paikuhan and the Dai-Kaiou. It also includes ideas and sketches that he gave the anime staff to embellish and make into filler. For instance, Yamcha playing on a baseball team was Toriyama’s idea. He also suggested that there be a giant snake on the Serpent Road, which formed the basis for the Princess Snake episode. However, he only gave basic ideas, and DID NOT WRITE FILLER.

*ahem*

He also provided the anime staff with specially colored images for characters who hadn’t appeared in color chapters yet, so they would know what colors to use. For instance, the daizenshuu shows a color copy of Chapter 362’s cover page, which shows Cell in his egg, larva, and imperfect forms. This cover page was originally black and white, but Toriyama colored in a copy and sent it to the anime staff so that they would know what Cell’s proper colors were. The daizenshuu notes that this would make it the first color picture of Cell ever. You still can’t see Toriyama’s colored version outside of the daizenshuu (and maybe Son Gokuu Densetsu).

More ideas that Toriyama supplied the anime staff with (this is still from p.68): The Tsufuru are only ½ as tall as the Saiyans, due to their planet’s high gravity and the fact that they aren’t as strong as the Saiyans. Saibaiman are made from Saiyan biotechnology. Scouters are Tsufuru technology.

On p.105 it has a feature on how some specific things from the manga were adapted for the anime, such as Freeza’s final transformation, Goku’s SSJ3 transformation, and Fusion. It notes the voice of the fused character was made by having the voice actors for both characters talk into the microphone in unison. You probably already figured that out from just watching the show, but for whatever reason it treats this as a big secret, which I found amusing. The interesting thing is that Toriyama came up with the idea of providing the fused characters’ voices this way.

On p.106 they show some of the height charts that the animators used to keep track of the heights of the different characters. According to this, Gotenks is actually about a head taller than Goten or Trunks. Weird.

And that’s all I have for Daizenshuu 5. I’ll do 3 next, which will take all of ten seconds to do, with the amount of notes I have on it.

It would be neat to see some scans on the character designs and ideas Toriyama provided for the TV series. Could you provide some?

[Toriyama Boss]

[That'd be nice. I still do owe you a scan of the 'kiri' entry in Daizenshuu 7...

Well, this isn't a scan, but could you tell me exactly what "ピッコロ大魔王の名に賭けて" means? I don't think I quite get what ' 賭けて' is supposed to mean here. What does it mean to risk/gamble a name?.

It means, "I'm betting in the name of The Demon Lord Piccolo."