Search found 3644 matches

by Miracles
Mon Jul 10, 2023 3:33 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

That would be your reasoning. You're implying that throughout the duration of the fight, Goku was not operating at full power because he needs the strength to transform. According to the story, Goku's battle with Caulifa was primarily the reason why his energy was growing stronger which is differen...
by Miracles
Mon Jul 10, 2023 2:32 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

So according to your reasoning, Base Goku cannot be at full power while simultaneously not having enough stamina to transform? That's according to the story. Especially when in episode 112 where Goku told Vegeta he was stringing opponents along until he got his "strength back" while panti...
by Miracles
Mon Jul 10, 2023 12:43 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

This means that there is a certain level of stamina required to transform. That isn't indicative of Goku's power in his respective transformations. When we are told that Goku and Caulifa's energy was rising, we aren't told that it was a result of Goku regaining his stamina. That was noted to be a s...
by Miracles
Sun Jul 09, 2023 6:59 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

I'm asking for direct statements that are directly related to Goku's fight with Caulifa. The only moment where Goku's stamina recovery was explicitly mentioned was upon reaching a higher transformation. Episode 113 Caulifa asks Goku: "Aren't you gonna transform too?" Base mode Goku says: ...
by Miracles
Sun Jul 09, 2023 5:56 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

GreatSaiyaman123 is strictly talking about the anime. There's no denying that Gogeta Blue is significantly stronger than Vegetto Blue in the anime. Broly is already stronger than Jiren by a wide margin and Jiren supposedly surpassed Merged Zamasu significantly by Episode 109. Merged Zamasu was rath...
by Miracles
Sat Jul 08, 2023 7:10 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

GreatSaiyaman123 is strictly talking about the anime. There's no denying that Gogeta Blue is significantly stronger than Vegetto Blue in the anime. Broly is already stronger than Jiren by a wide margin and Jiren supposedly surpassed Merged Zamasu significantly by Episode 109. Merged Zamasu was rath...
by Miracles
Fri Jul 07, 2023 5:41 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

If Goku and Vegeta haven’t changed in the ToP, and in turn haven’t changed since the Future Trunks Saga, then how come Gogeta stomps someone comparable to Beerus while Vegetto gets his hands full with Zamasu? They train in between arcs. For example Goku was strong enough to handle Blue Kaioken X20 ...
by Miracles
Fri Jul 07, 2023 6:00 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

The narration repeatedly suggests that Goku's lack of stamina precluded him from using higher forms and that would be the reason why Goku was never operating at full power. That doesn't guarantee that Goku lacked power in his respective forms. Stamina and energy aren't the same. Energy is a term us...
by Miracles
Thu Jul 06, 2023 6:25 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

He didn't have enough energy to access his stronger transformations but that doesn't mean the highest level he could enter at that point was not at full power. Goku's strength gains are literally lumped with Caulifa's and Kefla's. What is often forgotten is that Caulifa was also worn down by the ti...
by Miracles
Thu Jul 06, 2023 3:59 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

It wouldn't matter. If stamina correlated to power, there's no conceivable way Goku would have matched Kefla in power. Aside from that, the only thing that is emphasized is Goku lacking stamina, not power. His lack of stamina was the reason why he lost. Not because he couldn't put out his full powe...
by Miracles
Wed Jul 05, 2023 7:29 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Not necessarily. Even when Goku fights on par with Kefla, the narrative acknowledges that Goku's stamina was far lower than Kefla's. Stamina and strength are treated as two separate things. Yes because Goku still wasn't at full power. It wouldn't matter. If stamina correlated to power, there's no c...
by Miracles
Wed Jul 05, 2023 12:51 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

The narration in that episode definitely has energy, stamina and strength the same. Not necessarily. Even when Goku fights on par with Kefla, the narrative acknowledges that Goku's stamina was far lower than Kefla's. Stamina and strength are treated as two separate things. Yes because Goku still wa...
by Miracles
Wed Jul 05, 2023 12:26 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

The narration in that episode definitely has energy, stamina and strength the same.
by Miracles
Tue Jul 04, 2023 6:49 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Goku was lumped with Caulifa when Caulifa was stated to be growing stronger. The same should logically apply to Goku. Otherwise, you kind of dug yourself a hole if you're trying to reconcile Goku's first performance against Kale with his rematch against her. That was under the context of Caulifa al...
by Miracles
Tue Jul 04, 2023 6:27 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

But wasn't Goku just recovering his strength against Caulifa and Kale instead of growing stronger? Goku was lumped with Caulifa when Caulifa was stated to be growing stronger. The same should logically apply to Goku. Otherwise, you kind of dug yourself a hole if you're trying to reconcile Goku's fi...
by Miracles
Tue Jul 04, 2023 7:16 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

But wasn't Goku just recovering his strength against Caulifa and Kale instead of growing stronger?
by Miracles
Mon Jul 03, 2023 10:54 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Please excuse the double post. All I know is taking the story at face value, Goku avoided going Blue as much as possible during the TOP, not to drain energy. Now if Blue is not his strongest form and can hold back in it, why would he need to strategically put out it's power?
by Miracles
Mon Jul 03, 2023 6:21 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

SSJG was transformed back into in BoG when Goku punched Beerus's Ball. Goku could have used it against Kale if he wanted to hold back. Especially when Blue was stated to use up tons of stamina transforming into it. Only in the movie. In the anime Goku punched it in base and for years we thought it ...
by Miracles
Mon Jul 03, 2023 3:15 am
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Goku had SSJ3 and Red to use against Kale. May I ask what do you mean that SSJG wasn't back on the table yet? [ SSJ3 is useless. Goku didn’t use it against Jiren either. It’s not revealed that Goku can still go SSJG until a few episodes later, so it’s unknown if writers knew Goku could use SSJG her...
by Miracles
Sun Jul 02, 2023 10:33 pm
Forum: Dragon Ball Super
Topic: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread
Replies: 39836
Views: 3837916

Re: Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

Berserk Kale was said to be formidable by Toppo who is Blue level in the anime. Yet has SSJ2 Goku, who is fatigued, actually trade with her more powerful controlled state. This is with the help of Caulifa by the way too. This is just bad writing by TOEI.