Kanzenshuu

How exactly is SS Vegeta fighting base Broly that well?

Base Broly is stronger than SSG since Ikari is only a 10 times boost (Oozaru power) and he wasn't that far off of SSB Goku in the movie with it.

1. Ultimate Gohan ( Pre-ToP) vs SSJ3 Goku ( Pre-ToP) 2. Base Gotenks (Post-Rosat) vs SSJ2 Goku (Buu arc) 3. Fat Janemba vs Evil Buu 4. Piccolo (Android arc Pre-Kami) vs Yardrat SSJ1 Goku 1.- Goku powers down to base and one shots his son. 2.- Goku powers down to Super Saiyan and one shots him. 3.- ...

I think Piccolo is only considered strong at the Cell Games because people want him to be. He has 0 feats other than an off-screen fight that wasn't going his way. Vegeta and Trunks weren't doing so hot either. The Cell Juniors they were fighting weren't even damaged. That cover art that shows all ...

1. Ultimate Gohan ( Pre-ToP) vs SSJ3 Goku ( Pre-ToP) 2. Base Gotenks (Post-Rosat) vs SSJ2 Goku (Buu arc) 3. Fat Janemba vs Evil Buu 4. Piccolo (Android arc Pre-Kami) vs Yardrat SSJ1 Goku 1.- Goku powers down to base and one shots his son. 2.- Goku powers down to Super Saiyan and one shots him. 3.- ...

Black would get an ugly ass final transformation.

Can anyone translate this?

It's funny, when the Anime ended in 2018, I was in the (very large) camp that wanted Super to return, but now, after 6 years and 2 Manga-only arcs as well as one movie, I don't want Super to return at all. When I look at Episode 131, it is the perfect conclusion to "Mainstream" Super, and...

GreatSaiyaman123 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 4:24 pm

ZombieVito wrote: ↑Thu Jan 04, 2024 2:30 pm But we are shown base Gohan can't do that.

That he can’t wipe out the whole army? When?

When he needed Super Saiyan to beat Shisami, a member of Freeza's army.

The phrase “Gohan is the strongest” isn’t directly in it because it’s not a piece of dialogue, it’s a cue from Toriyama to the animators. Gohan gets the most screentime in the movie, and Freeza even highlights Gohan as someone who could wipe the entire army at once. But we are shown base Gohan can'...

The bits with Gohan in Resurrection F are all kinds of weird. Piccolo is somehow struggling against someone said to be Zarbon-level, and Gohan steps in to save him, but still has to go Super Saiyan to do it. Toriyama's script, meanwhile, doesn't say anything beyond just "Gohan is strongest&quo...

Kaioshin says he thinks Goku is stronger than himself when they meet, and pretty much says he can’t beat Babidi and co. without him. This is before Dabra even shows up. I don’t think Pui Pui has to be stronger than Kaioshin since Kaioshin didn’t even know who he was. Pui Pui is probably stronger, b...

I remembered Goku getting impressed when Shin says all Kaioshins could kill Freeza in one blow but even Vegeta gets a reaction?

Logic tells me that they wouldn't be impressed by this if they could do that easily, which tells me that Freeza is indeed stronger than them in base.

Thoughts?

GeekForFun wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2024 10:41 pm What's the evidence for Supreme Kai being weaker than the base saiyans?

Piccolo saying Shin was stronger than him.

You mean the Zenkai boosts the saiyans stopped having after the Namek saga? Where was this "Saiyan adaptation" for Future Gohan after getting his ass kicked by the androids for 10+ years? So #17 didn't notice when the entire human race was genocided instantly by Super Buu? No? I mean this...

How is it not? Cabba was a scrawny little adolescent who didn't even know what a Super Saiyan was. And yet he's stronger than Buuhan? When just regular Super Buu was already more powerful than Super Saiyan 3 Goku. A Super Buu who then absorbed the prodigy Ultimate Gohan and Piccolo on top that requ...

Kazuya Mishima wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 8:08 pm It's terrible writing for everyone from as little as Base Cabba upwards to be at least as strong as Buuhan.

But why?

I will never get this complaint.

Kazuya Mishima wrote: ↑Sat Dec 30, 2023 3:38 pm So it really was bad writing after all.

Huh?

Was it ever made clear where Base Goku's strength was meant to be in Super in the end of not? Are we still meant to believe that Base Cabba, Base Caulifla and basically anyone above that is still well above Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks or what? Yes? We literally see someone exactly as strong as base Vege...

I was about to say this. Even in the manga Jiren fought SSBE Vegeta who he himself said was a considerable change from SSB. There's just no way Jiren is close to SSB. Do you people always over-scrutinize "feats" while completely ignoring the narrative? Chapters 39 and 40 have entire spiel...

Nah, even in raw power in the manga Jiren was above Blue Evolved Vegeta, and equal to UI Goku even though he started out lower. It also depends on if Goku and Vegeta have seen Jiren since the ToP, maybe he got stronger again and they saw him? who knows. Toriyama's statements on Gohan were only base...