"(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

[Gt91]

This is going to be amazing ... so many cool characters :0

[shadowfox87]

I didn't really doubt you. Anyway, got the issue. Summary below. As there aren't scans yet, it didn't seem reasonable to do a full translation. Alakazam^ will probably still handle that in a few days when scans arrive. And it seems like crt/taddlelegacy will still be doing full scanlations.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[spoiler]Super Dragon Ball Heroes: Universe Mission Chapter 3 - Chapters are untitled until the tankobon release, but the cover page reads "Power vs. Power! Evil vs. Evil!"

At the battlefield, Mai takes out a Hoi-Poi capsule and informs Trunks it has his weapon and fighting clothes. No need to thank her, she says, just hurry up and get changed. Oolong, toting Mai's shotgun, tells them to quit flirting so they can get out of there, pronto. Mai says they do have to hurry. "That guy" is already at his limits.

We cut to Coola, worn down in front of the Evil Saiyan, who has two hands made of his ki moving in for the kill. Trunks leaps in and saves Coola, but is still repelled by the Evil Saiyan's ki. Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Vegeta attack with kicks but are likewise bounced back without even landing the blow. Vegeta is happy that Trunks is alive but warns Trunks to get out of there; he's in the way.

Vegeta is glad to see Goku has returned to his consciousness, but he's already out of energy for Super Saiyan Blue, having downgraded to Super Saiyan God.

Something about the appearance of a Saiyan with red hair enrages the Evil Saiyan. He breaks out of his restraints.

He knocks Goku and Vegeta flying. Mai calls Goku's name and shocks Oolong, whom the comic notes comes from an era in which Goku's still a child. Cue joke about people sure growing up fast.

In his laboratory, Fu is shocked to see Cumber has broken out of his restraints on his own. "So you were hiding a frightful amount of latent power, Evil Saiyan. Or no... Cumber!" (This is actually the first time his name is revealed in the comic.)

Trunks and Goku tell Mai to run, but she can't just leave them. She remembers being given something by the Kaioshin. She asks Oolong to buy her some time, and proceeds to distract Cumber with her "Flash Grenade CC5."

Mai delivers something to Goku while ... Goku? ... runs away from Cumber, drawing his attention. Surprise! The second Goku was actually Oolong. Meanwhile, Mai's successfully given the Potara to Goku and Vegeta. Vegetto Blue leaps in and attacks. Mai reveals she also gave them each a Senzu, likewise entrusted to her by the Kaioshin. Oolong swears he's never doing anything like that again.

Fu knows about the Potara and is delighted by this turn of events. He's even glad he brought the "pig kid" along. That transformation ability sure is interesting. And here he thought he was so weak he'd be boring. (All of this is simultaneously broadcast through the Fu-bot, to Oolong's chagrin.) "Oh, that's right!" the Fu-bot announces. "Speaking of that, I gave Cumber one of the Dragon Balls too!" Mai and Oolong are incredulous over the fact that this means they'll have to steal one from him as well.

Coola watches Vegetto and Cumber's battle from the sidelines. Vegetto and Cumber go at each other with their ki-blade and ki-hand attacks, respectively. A voice behind Oolong says it might be best to leave this Dragon Ball for later, and Oolong agrees. He then turns around and sees the speaker: Ozotto.

Trunks gets ready for a fight, but Ozotto says there's no need. There's no point in futile battles. He promises to see them all again when they've calmed down and begins to slip away through a portal. Coola runs after, determined not to let him escape, and takes Trunks with him through the portal.

"The ability to move through space-time. That sure is handy." Fu is impressed.

That guy is definitely one of the prisoners he handed a Dragon Ball, but he's having trouble remembering his name. He pulls it up on his computer: Ozotto. Yep. Sure is an interesting guy.

Mai, distraught by Trunks' disappearance, says they have to look for him again, to Oolong's horror. Meanwhile, the battle between Vegetto and Cumber has heated up; Cumber has now gone Super Saiyan. Vegetto says its time for them to get serious. In that case, Cumber says, it's time to really mix things up. He shoots a ball of light into the sky. He'll show Vegetto what he's like when he's serious. His eyes begin to glow and his heart pounds.

Meanwhile, in "Area Kaosu," Coola and Trunks emerge from the portal. There's no sign of Ozotto around. Trunks ask Coola why they're going after him. "Why?" Coola asks. Because judging from his remarks earlier, that guy knows where the Dragon Balls are.

"So there's someone with a Dragon Ball here?" Trunks asks. If there wasn't, Coola conjectures, then he wouldn't have come here.

Trunks and Coola step over a hill and find the remains of Freeza's army, including King Cold! From a cloud of black smoke, Tullece, Kid Boo, Bojack and Slug emerge.[/spoiler]

By far my favorite chapter yet lol I really did enjoy the gag when oolong realized Goku in SSJGod was the same Goku he was on an adventure with just all grown up, vegito Blue kaioken vs Cumber Golden oozaru next chapter will be awesome! Also thank you for being one of the only people that had fate in me. Also here’s a pic for those nonbelievers lol ssj cumber vs vegito Blue https://imgur.com/gallery/3wMi9UL

Sorry I doubted you. I guess you have it on the day it's released and have some connection with the storeowner.

I really liked this chapter. I always placed this Oolong from the Pilaf Saga of Dragon Ball since he has the panties on top of his head. It's nice that they confirmed that by Oolong recognizing Goku's name. I loved his role as a gag character. The anime didn't even introduce him yet!

I also like Vegetto vs Cumber's fight. In the anime, Vegetto is already using SSB Kaioken and Cumber in his base is able to compete with it, which makes Cumber too strong. Here, Cumber is forced to go SSJ. Vegetto from that picture has a double aura, so it seems he uses Kaioken after Cumber uses SSJ. However, a Kaioken's max multiplier is only 20x while a SSJ is 50x. Then if Cumber goes Oozaru, that's a further 10x!

I have a feeling that Oolong is going to turn into scissors and help cut off Cumber's tail! There's no way to defeat Cumber otherwise OR Cumber may even turn into a SSJ4! Regardless, Cumber is way too powerful, more powerful than Jiren in his Oozaru state.

Also, yes, the fact that Cumber broke out of his straitjacket upon seeing Goku as a red-haired saiyan is very peculiar. Cumber is an ancient saiyan, confirmed from scans and also from the fact that he retains his pupils after turning into a SSJ unlike other Saiyans. If he recognizes a red-haired Saiyan, then it may be Yamoshi afterall. However, then that changes many things because it was implied that Yamoshi turned into an SSJ not a SSG. Saiyans from that long ago shouldn't be this powerful, so obviously Fu gave Cumber some major upgrades infusing him with Time Rift energy like he did in XV2.

[RichardKing2]

Correction: In a Super Dragon Ball heroes opening, Base Cumber is able to compete with SSB KK Vegito. We haven't seen the full fight in the anime and as a result, don't know if Cumber will turn SSJ against him or not other than knowing he uses KK at some point . And we don't know how the full fight will even play out in the anime . And need we forget that Dragon ball heroes openings are not consistent in terms of power levels(Goku going SSB to fight base frost)

[S3 Hendrix]

I didn't really doubt you. Anyway, got the issue. Summary below. As there aren't scans yet, it didn't seem reasonable to do a full translation. Alakazam^ will probably still handle that in a few days when scans arrive. And it seems like crt/taddlelegacy will still be doing full scanlations.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[spoiler]Super Dragon Ball Heroes: Universe Mission Chapter 3 - Chapters are untitled until the tankobon release, but the cover page reads "Power vs. Power! Evil vs. Evil!"

At the battlefield, Mai takes out a Hoi-Poi capsule and informs Trunks it has his weapon and fighting clothes. No need to thank her, she says, just hurry up and get changed. Oolong, toting Mai's shotgun, tells them to quit flirting so they can get out of there, pronto. Mai says they do have to hurry. "That guy" is already at his limits.

We cut to Coola, worn down in front of the Evil Saiyan, who has two hands made of his ki moving in for the kill. Trunks leaps in and saves Coola, but is still repelled by the Evil Saiyan's ki. Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Vegeta attack with kicks but are likewise bounced back without even landing the blow. Vegeta is happy that Trunks is alive but warns Trunks to get out of there; he's in the way.

Vegeta is glad to see Goku has returned to his consciousness, but he's already out of energy for Super Saiyan Blue, having downgraded to Super Saiyan God.

Something about the appearance of a Saiyan with red hair enrages the Evil Saiyan. He breaks out of his restraints.

He knocks Goku and Vegeta flying. Mai calls Goku's name and shocks Oolong, whom the comic notes comes from an era in which Goku's still a child. Cue joke about people sure growing up fast.

In his laboratory, Fu is shocked to see Cumber has broken out of his restraints on his own. "So you were hiding a frightful amount of latent power, Evil Saiyan. Or no... Cumber!" (This is actually the first time his name is revealed in the comic.)

Trunks and Goku tell Mai to run, but she can't just leave them. She remembers being given something by the Kaioshin. She asks Oolong to buy her some time, and proceeds to distract Cumber with her "Flash Grenade CC5."

Mai delivers something to Goku while ... Goku? ... runs away from Cumber, drawing his attention. Surprise! The second Goku was actually Oolong. Meanwhile, Mai's successfully given the Potara to Goku and Vegeta. Vegetto Blue leaps in and attacks. Mai reveals she also gave them each a Senzu, likewise entrusted to her by the Kaioshin. Oolong swears he's never doing anything like that again.

Fu knows about the Potara and is delighted by this turn of events. He's even glad he brought the "pig kid" along. That transformation ability sure is interesting. And here he thought he was so weak he'd be boring. (All of this is simultaneously broadcast through the Fu-bot, to Oolong's chagrin.) "Oh, that's right!" the Fu-bot announces. "Speaking of that, I gave Cumber one of the Dragon Balls too!" Mai and Oolong are incredulous over the fact that this means they'll have to steal one from him as well.

Coola watches Vegetto and Cumber's battle from the sidelines. Vegetto and Cumber go at each other with their ki-blade and ki-hand attacks, respectively. A voice behind Oolong says it might be best to leave this Dragon Ball for later, and Oolong agrees. He then turns around and sees the speaker: Ozotto.

Trunks gets ready for a fight, but Ozotto says there's no need. There's no point in futile battles. He promises to see them all again when they've calmed down and begins to slip away through a portal. Coola runs after, determined not to let him escape, and takes Trunks with him through the portal.

"The ability to move through space-time. That sure is handy." Fu is impressed.

That guy is definitely one of the prisoners he handed a Dragon Ball, but he's having trouble remembering his name. He pulls it up on his computer: Ozotto. Yep. Sure is an interesting guy.

Mai, distraught by Trunks' disappearance, says they have to look for him again, to Oolong's horror. Meanwhile, the battle between Vegetto and Cumber has heated up; Cumber has now gone Super Saiyan. Vegetto says its time for them to get serious. In that case, Cumber says, it's time to really mix things up. He shoots a ball of light into the sky. He'll show Vegetto what he's like when he's serious. His eyes begin to glow and his heart pounds.

Meanwhile, in "Area Kaosu," Coola and Trunks emerge from the portal. There's no sign of Ozotto around. Trunks ask Coola why they're going after him. "Why?" Coola asks. Because judging from his remarks earlier, that guy knows where the Dragon Balls are.

"So there's someone with a Dragon Ball here?" Trunks asks. If there wasn't, Coola conjectures, then he wouldn't have come here.

Trunks and Coola step over a hill and find the remains of Freeza's army, including King Cold! From a cloud of black smoke, Tullece, Kid Boo, Bojack and Slug emerge.[/spoiler]

By far my favorite chapter yet lol I really did enjoy the gag when oolong realized Goku in SSJGod was the same Goku he was on an adventure with just all grown up, vegito Blue kaioken vs Cumber Golden oozaru next chapter will be awesome! Also thank you for being one of the only people that had fate in me. Also here’s a pic for those nonbelievers lol ssj cumber vs vegito Blue https://imgur.com/gallery/3wMi9UL

Sorry I doubted you. I guess you have it on the day it's released and have some connection with the storeowner.

I really liked this chapter. I always placed this Oolong from the Pilaf Saga of Dragon Ball since he has the panties on top of his head. It's nice that they confirmed that by Oolong recognizing Goku's name. I loved his role as a gag character. The anime didn't even introduce him yet!

I also like Vegetto vs Cumber's fight. In the anime, Vegetto is already using SSB Kaioken and Cumber in his base is able to compete with it, which makes Cumber too strong. Here, Cumber is forced to go SSJ. Vegetto from that picture has a double aura, so it seems he uses Kaioken after Cumber uses SSJ. However, a Kaioken's max multiplier is only 20x while a SSJ is 50x. Then if Cumber goes Oozaru, that's a further 10x!

I have a feeling that Oolong is going to turn into scissors and help cut off Cumber's tail! There's no way to defeat Cumber otherwise OR Cumber may even turn into a SSJ4! Regardless, Cumber is way too powerful, more powerful than Jiren in his Oozaru state.

Also, yes, the fact that Cumber broke out of his straitjacket upon seeing Goku as a red-haired saiyan is very peculiar. Cumber is an ancient saiyan, confirmed from scans and also from the fact that he retains his pupils after turning into a SSJ unlike other Saiyans. If he recognizes a red-haired Saiyan, then it may be Yamoshi afterall. However, then that changes many things because it was implied that Yamoshi turned into an SSJ not a SSG. Saiyans from that long ago shouldn't be this powerful, so obviously Fu gave Cumber some major upgrades infusing him with Time Rift energy like he did in XV2.

Lol I actually have a few very close friends who live in japan I’ve even gone to japan once earlier this year to visit One of them, in that picture vegito isn’t in kaioken yet but on the next page he goes kaioken and when he does Cumber makes a false moon and starts to transform into golden oozaru, I have a feeling we’ll get ssj4 Cumber and maybe even learn that he is the creator of SSJ4 or something like that. Also this is Heroes so they could just straight use all we heard from BOG of how yamoshi is the OG ssj god and defeated the evil saiyan(and non of the new lore) but Cumber does fit into the lore of yamoshi perfectly even with what toriyama gave us, how yamoshi was forced into ssj by the evil saiyans and what does Cumber do in the manga and game? Forces Goku to go Super Saiyan Berserk(in the anime it’s different it just seems he makes Goku go crazy while in the game and manga it’s clear he completely makes Goku switch forms)

[Cipher]

I didn't initially interpret from the drawing that Vegetto was using Kaioken, and he never announces he's using it, but his aura is a bit different once we return to the fight and see Cumber as a Super Saiyan, so it's certainly possible that was the intent.

Also, summary on the previous page was edited a bit after the version quoted at the top of this page. Not for content; just for wording.

[AnimeNation101]

I didn't really doubt you. Anyway, got the issue. Summary below. As there aren't scans yet, it didn't seem reasonable to do a full translation. Alakazam^ will probably still handle that in a few days when scans arrive. And it seems like crt/taddlelegacy will still be doing full scanlations.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[spoiler]Super Dragon Ball Heroes: Universe Mission Chapter 3 - Chapters are untitled until the tankobon release, but the cover page reads "Power vs. Power! Evil vs. Evil!"

At the battlefield, Mai takes out a Hoi-Poi capsule and informs Trunks it has his weapon and fighting clothes. No need to thank her, she says, just hurry up and get changed. Oolong, toting Mai's shotgun, tells them to quit flirting so they can get out of there, pronto. Mai says they do have to hurry. "That guy" is already at his limits.

We cut to Coola, worn down in front of the Evil Saiyan, who has two hands made of his ki moving in for the kill. Trunks leaps in and saves Coola, but is still repelled by the Evil Saiyan's ki. Super Saiyan Blue Goku and Vegeta attack with kicks but are likewise bounced back without even landing the blow. Vegeta is happy that Trunks is alive but warns Trunks to get out of there; he's in the way.

Vegeta is glad to see Goku has returned to his consciousness, but he's already out of energy for Super Saiyan Blue, having downgraded to Super Saiyan God.

Something about the appearance of a Saiyan with red hair enrages the Evil Saiyan. He breaks out of his restraints.

He knocks Goku and Vegeta flying. Mai calls Goku's name and shocks Oolong, whom the comic notes comes from an era in which Goku's still a child. Cue joke about people sure growing up fast.

In his laboratory, Fu is shocked to see Cumber has broken out of his restraints on his own. "So you were hiding a frightful amount of latent power, Evil Saiyan. Or no... Cumber!" (This is actually the first time his name is revealed in the comic.)

Trunks and Goku tell Mai to run, but she can't just leave them. She remembers being given something by the Kaioshin. She asks Oolong to buy her some time, and proceeds to distract Cumber with her "Flash Grenade CC5."

Mai delivers something to Goku while ... Goku? ... runs away from Cumber, drawing his attention. Surprise! The second Goku was actually Oolong. Meanwhile, Mai's successfully given the Potara to Goku and Vegeta. Vegetto Blue leaps in and attacks. Mai reveals she also gave them each a Senzu, likewise entrusted to her by the Kaioshin. Oolong swears he's never doing anything like that again.

Fu knows about the Potara and is delighted by this turn of events. He's even glad he brought the "pig kid" along. That transformation ability sure is interesting. And here he thought he was so weak he'd be boring. (All of this is simultaneously broadcast through the Fu-bot, to Oolong's chagrin.) "Oh, that's right!" the Fu-bot announces. "Speaking of that, I gave Cumber one of the Dragon Balls too!" Mai and Oolong are incredulous over the fact that this means they'll have to steal one from him as well.

Coola watches Vegetto and Cumber's battle from the sidelines. Vegetto and Cumber go at each other with their ki-blade and ki-hand attacks, respectively. A voice behind Oolong says it might be best to leave this Dragon Ball for later, and Oolong agrees. He then turns around and sees the speaker: Ozotto.

Trunks gets ready for a fight, but Ozotto says there's no need. There's no point in futile battles. He promises to see them all again when they've calmed down and begins to slip away through a portal. Coola runs after, determined not to let him escape, and takes Trunks with him through the portal.

"The ability to move through space-time. That sure is handy." Fu is impressed.

That guy is definitely one of the prisoners he handed a Dragon Ball, but he's having trouble remembering his name. He pulls it up on his computer: Ozotto. Yep. Sure is an interesting guy.

Mai, distraught by Trunks' disappearance, says they have to look for him again, to Oolong's horror. Meanwhile, the battle between Vegetto and Cumber has heated up; Cumber has now gone Super Saiyan. Vegetto says its time for them to get serious. In that case, Cumber says, it's time to really mix things up. He shoots a ball of light into the sky. He'll show Vegetto what he's like when he's serious. His eyes begin to glow and his heart pounds.

Meanwhile, in "Area Kaosu," Coola and Trunks emerge from the portal. There's no sign of Ozotto around. Trunks ask Coola why they're going after him. "Why?" Coola asks. Because judging from his remarks earlier, that guy knows where the Dragon Balls are.

"So there's someone with a Dragon Ball here?" Trunks asks. If there wasn't, Coola conjectures, then he wouldn't have come here.

Trunks and Coola step over a hill and find the remains of Freeza's army, including King Cold! From a cloud of black smoke, Tullece, Kid Boo, Bojack and Slug emerge.[/spoiler]

By far my favorite chapter yet lol I really did enjoy the gag when oolong realized Goku in SSJGod was the same Goku he was on an adventure with just all grown up, vegito Blue kaioken vs Cumber Golden oozaru next chapter will be awesome! Also thank you for being one of the only people that had fate in me. Also here’s a pic for those nonbelievers lol ssj cumber vs vegito Blue https://imgur.com/gallery/3wMi9UL

See? Nothing to lose. In fact, you’ve gained my trust. I dont know if that really means anything but you got it

[AnimeNation101]

By far my favorite chapter yet lol I really did enjoy the gag when oolong realized Goku in SSJGod was the same Goku he was on an adventure with just all grown up, vegito Blue kaioken vs Cumber Golden oozaru next chapter will be awesome! Also thank you for being one of the only people that had fate in me. Also here’s a pic for those nonbelievers lol ssj cumber vs vegito Blue https://imgur.com/gallery/3wMi9UL

Sorry I doubted you. I guess you have it on the day it's released and have some connection with the storeowner.

I really liked this chapter. I always placed this Oolong from the Pilaf Saga of Dragon Ball since he has the panties on top of his head. It's nice that they confirmed that by Oolong recognizing Goku's name. I loved his role as a gag character. The anime didn't even introduce him yet!

I also like Vegetto vs Cumber's fight. In the anime, Vegetto is already using SSB Kaioken and Cumber in his base is able to compete with it, which makes Cumber too strong. Here, Cumber is forced to go SSJ. Vegetto from that picture has a double aura, so it seems he uses Kaioken after Cumber uses SSJ. However, a Kaioken's max multiplier is only 20x while a SSJ is 50x. Then if Cumber goes Oozaru, that's a further 10x!

I have a feeling that Oolong is going to turn into scissors and help cut off Cumber's tail! There's no way to defeat Cumber otherwise OR Cumber may even turn into a SSJ4! Regardless, Cumber is way too powerful, more powerful than Jiren in his Oozaru state.

Also, yes, the fact that Cumber broke out of his straitjacket upon seeing Goku as a red-haired saiyan is very peculiar. Cumber is an ancient saiyan, confirmed from scans and also from the fact that he retains his pupils after turning into a SSJ unlike other Saiyans. If he recognizes a red-haired Saiyan, then it may be Yamoshi afterall. However, then that changes many things because it was implied that Yamoshi turned into an SSJ not a SSG. Saiyans from that long ago shouldn't be this powerful, so obviously Fu gave Cumber some major upgrades infusing him with Time Rift energy like he did in XV2.

Lol I actually have a few very close friends who live in japan I’ve even gone to japan once earlier this year to visit One of them, in that picture vegito isn’t in kaioken yet but on the next page he goes kaioken and when he does Cumber makes a false moon and starts to transform into golden oozaru, I have a feeling we’ll get ssj4 Cumber and maybe even learn that he is the creator of SSJ4 or something like that. Also this is Heroes so they could just straight use all we heard from BOG of how yamoshi is the OG ssj god and defeated the evil saiyan(and non of the new lore) but Cumber does fit into the lore of yamoshi perfectly even with what toriyama gave us, how yamoshi was forced into ssj by the evil saiyans and what does Cumber do in the manga and game? Forces Goku to go Super Saiyan Berserk(in the anime it’s different it just seems he makes Goku go crazy while in the game and manga it’s clear he completely makes Goku switch forms)

I'm kinda skeptical about that. Heroes goes crazy but are they really crazy enough to insert their characters into uncharted lore territory that has a possibility of being covered in a main series leading to huge contradictions for Heroes?

[shadowfox87]

Lol I actually have a few very close friends who live in japan I’ve even gone to japan once earlier this year to visit One of them, in that picture vegito isn’t in kaioken yet but on the next page he goes kaioken and when he does Cumber makes a false moon and starts to transform into golden oozaru, I have a feeling we’ll get ssj4 Cumber and maybe even learn that he is the creator of SSJ4 or something like that. Also this is Heroes so they could just straight use all we heard from BOG of how yamoshi is the OG ssj god and defeated the evil saiyan(and non of the new lore) but Cumber does fit into the lore of yamoshi perfectly even with what toriyama gave us, how yamoshi was forced into ssj by the evil saiyans and what does Cumber do in the manga and game? Forces Goku to go Super Saiyan Berserk(in the anime it’s different it just seems he makes Goku go crazy while in the game and manga it’s clear he completely makes Goku switch forms)

It just seems odd. SSJ is a 50x boost and Kaioken is up to 20x max. So if Base Cumber was fighting on par with SSB Vegetto and then was forced to go SSJ. Then in response, Vegetto uses Kaioken which in turn, causes Cumber to go Golden Oozaru, is kind of overkill. Also, if Cumber was the creatr of the SSJ4, he wouldn't have needed to go Golden Oozaru as an intermediate stage and would be able to transform into it directly. If Cumber is an ancient saiyan that lived on Sadala and fought Yamoshi, it would make much more sense that he never had the Super Saiyan transformation before. There can only be 1 original Super Saiyan and so far, we only know that Yamoshi turned into a Super Saiyan on Sadala as per Toriyama's words. Yamoshi had 5 pure-hearted Saiyan friends, so maybe he just accidentally discovered the SSG ritual after his friends gave him some energy. Though it's weird for him to be the original SSJ AND the original SSG. There's no way that Cumber was this strong on Sadala. Rather, that he is this strong now because Fu experimented on him and infused him with Time Rift energy. For if a mortal existed in Universe 7 1000 years ago when Sadala existed that exceeded the power of Beerus, he would've known about it or Whis would've told him as it would catch his interest.

So the question I have is - between the fight of Base Cumber vs SSB Vegetto, is it an even battle or is SSB Vegetto dominating or holding back? If he is holding back, then it would make sense for Cumber to turn SSJ, but for Cumber to turn Oozaru it would imply that SSJ Cumber < SSB Kaioken x20 Vegetto.

[AnimeNation101]

Is the chapter out-out yet, or are people just getting advance copies?

If it's past street date, I can go look for one this weekend.

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOBK-2256661

Release date is Aug. 3 according to CD Japan. I'm not sure how people are getting it earlier. It is Aug. 3rd already in Japan though. I guess connections with storeowner or living in Japan is the only way. Only the preview images have been leaked on the official shonenjump website, nothing beyond that.

I get the chapters the day they come out, the chapter ends with vegito Blue going kaioken while Cumber goes oozaru, cooler and trunks meet Ozotto, cooler doesn’t like Ozotto but knows he’s a guy with a dragon ball we see hatchiyack’s smoke start forming near cooler and turles, slug, bojack, Majin buu And Cell. The scans that I have aren’t the clearest so some of the kanji is really hard to read. Again this would be something dumb to lie about and I said it JUST HINTS he could possible be the saiyan yamoshi fought the main hint is the red hair triggering him(but i did post the Page where Fu talks about him on my Twitter)

You may have gotten some stuff wrong though. According to this cover of the manga, Hatchiyak or any signs of him don’t show up at all. Just some back smoke and then Turles and co. appear from it. Also, Fuu doesn’t hint at anything about Cumber. He only talks about how strong he is.

[S3 Hendrix]

http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/NEOBK-2256661

Release date is Aug. 3 according to CD Japan. I'm not sure how people are getting it earlier. It is Aug. 3rd already in Japan though. I guess connections with storeowner or living in Japan is the only way. Only the preview images have been leaked on the official shonenjump website, nothing beyond that.

I get the chapters the day they come out, the chapter ends with vegito Blue going kaioken while Cumber goes oozaru, cooler and trunks meet Ozotto, cooler doesn’t like Ozotto but knows he’s a guy with a dragon ball we see hatchiyack’s smoke start forming near cooler and turles, slug, bojack, Majin buu And Cell. The scans that I have aren’t the clearest so some of the kanji is really hard to read. Again this would be something dumb to lie about and I said it JUST HINTS he could possible be the saiyan yamoshi fought the main hint is the red hair triggering him(but i did post the Page where Fu talks about him on my Twitter)

You may have gotten some stuff wrong though. According to this cover of the manga, Hatchiyak or any signs of him don’t show up at all. Just some back smoke and then Turles and co. appear from it. Also, Fuu doesn’t hint at anything about Cumber. He only talks about how strong he is.

The red hair is mainly what I was talking about to hint Cumber fought yamoshi, the smoke is the smoke that creates ghost warriors again I said hachiyack’s smoke, bojack is dead in the manga and more to prove the one we see at the end is a ghost warrior. Also I meant to say bojack, Cell, turles, slug and buu emerge/form from the smoke. I promise you this is the destrongas that hachiyack ueses

[S3 Hendrix]

Lol I actually have a few very close friends who live in japan I’ve even gone to japan once earlier this year to visit One of them, in that picture vegito isn’t in kaioken yet but on the next page he goes kaioken and when he does Cumber makes a false moon and starts to transform into golden oozaru, I have a feeling we’ll get ssj4 Cumber and maybe even learn that he is the creator of SSJ4 or something like that. Also this is Heroes so they could just straight use all we heard from BOG of how yamoshi is the OG ssj god and defeated the evil saiyan(and non of the new lore) but Cumber does fit into the lore of yamoshi perfectly even with what toriyama gave us, how yamoshi was forced into ssj by the evil saiyans and what does Cumber do in the manga and game? Forces Goku to go Super Saiyan Berserk(in the anime it’s different it just seems he makes Goku go crazy while in the game and manga it’s clear he completely makes Goku switch forms)

It just seems odd. SSJ is a 50x boost and Kaioken is up to 20x max. So if Base Cumber was fighting on par with SSB Vegetto and then was forced to go SSJ. Then in response, Vegetto uses Kaioken which in turn, causes Cumber to go Golden Oozaru, is kind of overkill. Also, if Cumber was the creatr of the SSJ4, he wouldn't have needed to go Golden Oozaru as an intermediate stage and would be able to transform into it directly. If Cumber is an ancient saiyan that lived on Sadala and fought Yamoshi, it would make much more sense that he never had the Super Saiyan transformation before. There can only be 1 original Super Saiyan and so far, we only know that Yamoshi turned into a Super Saiyan on Sadala as per Toriyama's words. Yamoshi had 5 pure-hearted Saiyan friends, so maybe he just accidentally discovered the SSG ritual after his friends gave him some energy. Though it's weird for him to be the original SSJ AND the original SSG. There's no way that Cumber was this strong on Sadala. Rather, that he is this strong now because Fu experimented on him and infused him with Time Rift energy. For if a mortal existed in Universe 7 1000 years ago when Sadala existed that exceeded the power of Beerus, he would've known about it or Whis would've told him as it would catch his interest.

So the question I have is - between the fight of Base Cumber vs SSB Vegetto, is it an even battle or is SSB Vegetto dominating or holding back? If he is holding back, then it would make sense for Cumber to turn SSJ, but for Cumber to turn Oozaru it would imply that SSJ Cumber < SSB Kaioken x20 Vegetto.

In my opinion it’s a pretty even fight, then Cumber goes ssj and once he goes ssj vegito says “I’ll go Kaioken!” Then Cumber shoots his fake moon into the air

[shadowfox87]

In my opinion it’s a pretty even fight, then Cumber goes ssj and once he goes ssj vegito says “I’ll go Kaioken!” Then Cumber shoots his fake moon into the air

My point exactly, if it is an even fight, then Base Cumber = SSB Vegetto. If Cumber goes SSJ, then his strength is 50x and if Vegetto uses Kaioken, it's only up to 20x. Therefore, Cumber shouldn't need to go Oozaru at all. It's overkill. The only rationalization to this is Base Cumber is < SSB Vegetto and that SSJ Cumber < SSB + Kaioken x20 Vegetto

[Cipher]

It is Kaio-Ken. Sorry. They did this weird thing where they wrote Kaio-Ken out in kanji and wrote "serious" next to it in furigana. I completely missed that on first pass.

As we know Hachihyack shows up in this story and the inclusion of the black smoke is an odd detail, it's also highly likely the four characters at the end of the chapter are Ghost Warriors, even if there's nothing to explicitly confirm it this issue.

[shadowfox87]

I can see the double aura, so it is Kaio-Ken but that is only AFTER Cumber goes SSJ. It's nice that Yoshitaka Nagayama was able to draw in the double aura. It looks nice. It was thought that CSSB in Toyotaro's manga was simply because it was too difficult to draw double auras, but it seems it can be done afterall.

[S3 Hendrix]

It is Kaio-Ken. Sorry. They did this weird thing where they wrote Kaio-Ken out in kanji and wrote "serious" next to it in furigana. I completely missed that on first pass.

As we know Hachihyack shows up in this story and the inclusion of the black smoke is an odd detail, it's also highly likely the four characters at the end of the chapter are Ghost Warriors, even if there's nothing to explicitly confirm it this issue.

One thing to help confirm it’s the destrongas and that they are ghost warriors is the fact the cooler has already killed Bojack but yet he shows up from the smoke.

[alakazam^]

One thing to help confirm it’s the destrongas and that they are ghost warriors is the fact the cooler has already killed Bojack but yet he shows up from the smoke.

We also know from the arcade's story mode that the whole King Cold section has to do with Hacchihyakku's smoke.

[S3 Hendrix]

One thing to help confirm it’s the destrongas and that they are ghost warriors is the fact the cooler has already killed Bojack but yet he shows up from the smoke.

We also know from the arcade's story mode that the whole King Cold section has to do with Hacchihyakku's smoke.

Yep yep, I was gonna throw that in there but I assumed most people already knew

[Bebi Hatchiyack]

In my opinion it’s a pretty even fight, then Cumber goes ssj and once he goes ssj vegito says “I’ll go Kaioken!” Then Cumber shoots his fake moon into the air

My point exactly, if it is an even fight, then Base Cumber = SSB Vegetto. If Cumber goes SSJ, then his strength is 50x and if Vegetto uses Kaioken, it's only up to 20x. Therefore, Cumber shouldn't need to go Oozaru at all. It's overkill. The only rationalization to this is Base Cumber is < SSB Vegetto and that SSJ Cumber < SSB + Kaioken x20 Vegetto

I frankly gave up with the power scalling I think it's no use at this point and IMO the power scalling doesn't allow you to play with the story as you want.

[emperior]

SSB Kaio-Ken in manga form? Nice! Is it the first time it ever appeared in the Heroes manga?
Are there any pictures of it?

[mahakaishin1991]

I'm wondering if the 'evil saiyan' name now is meant to associate Kanba with the 'evil saiyans' yamoshi fought...