"(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

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Kenneth La Torre
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Sun Oct 20, 2019 11:06 pm

oh wow, i read the manga and they have ssb goku fighting ssj3 cumber... they really have no set power scaling. and toppo in god mode is even with him as well.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dark_Tzitzimine » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:39 am

SS Broly is more than enough to deal with both Goku and Vegeta SSB, so I wouldn't get too hung up on power scaling.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by MisteryOne » Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:59 am

Dark_Tzitzimine wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:39 am
SS Broly is more than enough to deal with both Goku and Vegeta SSB, so I wouldn't get too hung up on power scaling.
I don't see what that has to do with Heroes tho? Not to mention that considering Ikari Broly is stronger than SSG, SS Broly being that strong actually makes sense.

If Gogeta is able to beat Hearts on his own with just Blue it will fuck up the entire powerscale by a long shot (excluding the anime which has been inconsistent for aa long while). But I honestly doubt it will happen in the arcade game.

Speaking about Hakaishin Toppo vs Cumber, what annoys me about that battle is that it means Evolution Vegeta was always strong enough to fight Cumber alone, yet he didn't do it cause...plot I guess. It's my only big complain about the manga version since it's a too obvious issue.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Steven Bloodriver » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:08 am

Majin Demigra wrote:
Sun Oct 20, 2019 2:07 pm
If Vegito Blue couldn't beat Cumber I don't see how Gogeta Blue will do any good against Godslayer Hearts
If Son Goku and Vegeta weren't such a pair of Betas for the vast majority of their lives, they would have been able to defeat the restrained version of Kanba by fighting the Evil Saiyan seriously from the start. As in having Son Goku using his Super Saiyan Blue: 20X Kaioken and Vegeta using his Beyond Super Saiyan Blue before they would team up during their very first encounter with Kanba, which would then culminate in the combination of Super Saiyan Blue: 20X Kaioken Son Goku and Beyond Super Saiyan Blue Vegeta unleashing a Double Dragon Fist on the Evil Saiyan before blasting away what was left of Kanba with a SSB: 20X Kaioken Kamehameha and a Gamma Burst Flash. While if Vegito wasn't following in the footsteps of his fusees, as in using an insane amount of power on foes much weaker than himself, would have made short work of an unrestrained Kanba. As Vegito merely going into Saiyan Beyond God would have been more than enough to defeat Kanba in the latter's base form and even Super Saiyan form respectively. While Vegito with a less than 20X Kaioken would be able to defeat Kanba in his Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3 forms with little effort, but Vegito would have to use 20X Kaioken or even turn into Super Vegito in order to deal with the Full Power Super Saiyan 3 and Golden Great Ape forms of Kanba.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:04 pm

MisteryOne wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:59 am
Dark_Tzitzimine wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:39 am
SS Broly is more than enough to deal with both Goku and Vegeta SSB, so I wouldn't get too hung up on power scaling.
I don't see what that has to do with Heroes tho? Not to mention that considering Ikari Broly is stronger than SSG, SS Broly being that strong actually makes sense.

If Gogeta is able to beat Hearts on his own with just Blue it will fuck up the entire powerscale by a long shot (excluding the anime which has been inconsistent for aa long while). But I honestly doubt it will happen in the arcade game.

Speaking about Hakaishin Toppo vs Cumber, what annoys me about that battle is that it means Evolution Vegeta was always strong enough to fight Cumber alone, yet he didn't do it cause...plot I guess. It's my only big complain about the manga version since it's a too obvious issue.
it would ruin anything because fusion in the game was never beat. only the anime ruined it. if gogeta beats hearts it will be ok by game standards, only the anime suffers from that.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by MisteryOne » Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:48 pm

Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:04 pm
MisteryOne wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:59 am
Dark_Tzitzimine wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:39 am
SS Broly is more than enough to deal with both Goku and Vegeta SSB, so I wouldn't get too hung up on power scaling.
I don't see what that has to do with Heroes tho? Not to mention that considering Ikari Broly is stronger than SSG, SS Broly being that strong actually makes sense.

If Gogeta is able to beat Hearts on his own with just Blue it will fuck up the entire powerscale by a long shot (excluding the anime which has been inconsistent for aa long while). But I honestly doubt it will happen in the arcade game.

Speaking about Hakaishin Toppo vs Cumber, what annoys me about that battle is that it means Evolution Vegeta was always strong enough to fight Cumber alone, yet he didn't do it cause...plot I guess. It's my only big complain about the manga version since it's a too obvious issue.
it would ruin anything because fusion in the game was never beat. only the anime ruined it. if gogeta beats hearts it will be ok by game standards, only the anime suffers from that.
That is not the issue, tho? The point is that vanilla Blue Gogeta can't be that strong, specially if you consider Hearts at the very least should get a similar power boost to the one Kamioren got, which was pretty insane. And before absorbing the Universal Seed, Super Hearts was strong enough to face Goku, Jiren and Hit (while Cumbe faced Cooler).

Now consider that Jiren fought Meged Zamasu, SS3 Full Power Cumber and normal Hearts just by himself. That alone means Super Hearts is way stonger than his normal self. (Also worth nothing that Zamasu in the game was strong enough to face Hakaishin Toppo and Dyspo).

Blue Vegetto didn't lose against Cumber, but he didn't win either as Cumber himself pointed out. Fuu interrumped that battle. And that was only SS1 Cumber. UI Goku fought SS3 Cumber which would imply that UI> Blue Fusion as well, unless now we need to take in mind some type of overcomplicated Blue Dance>UI> Blue Potara thing...

Gogeta just can't win alone considering how insanely powerful Godslayer Hearts should be. Again, not with normal Blue at the very least. If he uses another form, it would not be an issue.

To sum it up: it isn't just a minor inconsistence, it would go against almost all of the previous battles regarding Hearts and Goku themselves.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Wilderness » Tue Oct 22, 2019 7:10 pm

I don’t really know how many times I’ll have to repeat myself in this thread... but any logic regarding x being more powerful than y needs to be thrown out of the window.

One person can be stronger than another for no reason other than they just can. Trust me, if they want a vanilla Garlic Jr. to be stronger than Broly one day, they’ll just do it with no explanation.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grimlock » Tue Oct 22, 2019 8:10 pm

That is correct and not just here, in the whole franchise. We can't really discuss who's stronger than who. The characters are going to be as strong as the writers demand them to be.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kenneth La Torre » Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:52 pm

MisteryOne wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:48 pm
Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:04 pm
MisteryOne wrote:
Mon Oct 21, 2019 3:59 am

I don't see what that has to do with Heroes tho? Not to mention that considering Ikari Broly is stronger than SSG, SS Broly being that strong actually makes sense.

If Gogeta is able to beat Hearts on his own with just Blue it will fuck up the entire powerscale by a long shot (excluding the anime which has been inconsistent for aa long while). But I honestly doubt it will happen in the arcade game.

Speaking about Hakaishin Toppo vs Cumber, what annoys me about that battle is that it means Evolution Vegeta was always strong enough to fight Cumber alone, yet he didn't do it cause...plot I guess. It's my only big complain about the manga version since it's a too obvious issue.
it would ruin anything because fusion in the game was never beat. only the anime ruined it. if gogeta beats hearts it will be ok by game standards, only the anime suffers from that.
That is not the issue, tho? The point is that vanilla Blue Gogeta can't be that strong, specially if you consider Hearts at the very least should get a similar power boost to the one Kamioren got, which was pretty insane. And before absorbing the Universal Seed, Super Hearts was strong enough to face Goku, Jiren and Hit (while Cumbe faced Cooler).

Now consider that Jiren fought Meged Zamasu, SS3 Full Power Cumber and normal Hearts just by himself. That alone means Super Hearts is way stonger than his normal self. (Also worth nothing that Zamasu in the game was strong enough to face Hakaishin Toppo and Dyspo).

Blue Vegetto didn't lose against Cumber, but he didn't win either as Cumber himself pointed out. Fuu interrumped that battle. And that was only SS1 Cumber. UI Goku fought SS3 Cumber which would imply that UI> Blue Fusion as well, unless now we need to take in mind some type of overcomplicated Blue Dance>UI> Blue Potara thing...

Gogeta just can't win alone considering how insanely powerful Godslayer Hearts should be. Again, not with normal Blue at the very least. If he uses another form, it would not be an issue.

To sum it up: it isn't just a minor inconsistence, it would go against almost all of the previous battles regarding Hearts and Goku themselves.
you are putting logic into power scalinvg when there is none. UI has never been Objectively beyond fusion, its just that that is how it was made for a certain mission. look at ssj4 xeno vegito, fighting ssj3 cumber despite ssj4 xeno goku losing to ssb goku.

like the comments above, there is no set in stone power scaling. it will always change

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by S3 Hendrix » Wed Oct 23, 2019 12:49 am

Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 10:52 pm
MisteryOne wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:48 pm
Kenneth La Torre wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:04 pm

it would ruin anything because fusion in the game was never beat. only the anime ruined it. if gogeta beats hearts it will be ok by game standards, only the anime suffers from that.
That is not the issue, tho? The point is that vanilla Blue Gogeta can't be that strong, specially if you consider Hearts at the very least should get a similar power boost to the one Kamioren got, which was pretty insane. And before absorbing the Universal Seed, Super Hearts was strong enough to face Goku, Jiren and Hit (while Cumbe faced Cooler).

Now consider that Jiren fought Meged Zamasu, SS3 Full Power Cumber and normal Hearts just by himself. That alone means Super Hearts is way stonger than his normal self. (Also worth nothing that Zamasu in the game was strong enough to face Hakaishin Toppo and Dyspo).

Blue Vegetto didn't lose against Cumber, but he didn't win either as Cumber himself pointed out. Fuu interrumped that battle. And that was only SS1 Cumber. UI Goku fought SS3 Cumber which would imply that UI> Blue Fusion as well, unless now we need to take in mind some type of overcomplicated Blue Dance>UI> Blue Potara thing...

Gogeta just can't win alone considering how insanely powerful Godslayer Hearts should be. Again, not with normal Blue at the very least. If he uses another form, it would not be an issue.

To sum it up: it isn't just a minor inconsistence, it would go against almost all of the previous battles regarding Hearts and Goku themselves.
you are putting logic into power scalinvg when there is none. UI has never been Objectively beyond fusion, its just that that is how it was made for a certain mission. look at ssj4 xeno vegito, fighting ssj3 cumber despite ssj4 xeno goku losing to ssb goku.

like the comments above, there is no set in stone power scaling. it will always change
In the arcade story Goku Xeno ssj4 And Vegeta xeno ssj4 are equal to Cumber ssj, so it makes sense for Vegito xeno ssj4 to defeat Cumber. The arcade power scaling is actually pretty good compared to the manga, anime, and animated trailers continuities. Also think about this, Goku Xeno literally only says Goku ssjB was one step above himself(Goku Xeno) so that’s very vague and literally could mean Goku blue is only slightly stronger than Goku Xeno ssj4(or this could simply mean Vegeta xeno ssj4 is stronger than Goku Xeno ssj4.)

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Noitsnothim » Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:49 am

I'm doubting that the Universal Conflict Arc will be the last 'Dragon Ball Super' esque Saga we'll get in Heroes' what do you think is next after GodSlayer Hearts ? (Cause that's the end all be all type villain for Dragon Ball IMO) If Cumber & Lagss survive do you think they'll team up and join forces with Fu? Will (DBS) Broly and friends be brought into the mix? Perhaps the reason as to why Majin Ozotto has been absent from this storyline and only appearing as cameos is cause they're saving him for something big? wouldn't mind him being the next major villain

if they continue these types of stories there's only 3 fan service type things I'd like to see:
1. Broly God (From The Universal Studios tour) Which I assume is Koyama's Broly (from the movies and Dark Demon Realm I think!)
2. SS4 Cumber
3. CC & Xeno Fusion team up (CC Vegito blue & Xeno SS4 Gogeta or CC Gogeta Blue & Xeno SS4 Vegito)

Sorry I'm all over the place but I'd like to hear your guys' thoughts and ideas for what you'd like to see happen next after the Universal Conflict Arc

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grand Marshal 1 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:05 am

Noitsnothim wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:49 am
I'm doubting that the Universal Conflict Arc will be the last 'Dragon Ball Super' esque Saga we'll get in Heroes' what do you think is next after GodSlayer Hearts ? (Cause that's the end all be all type villain for Dragon Ball IMO) If Cumber & Lagss survive do you think they'll team up and join forces with Fu? Will (DBS) Broly and friends be brought into the mix? Perhaps the reason as to why Majin Ozotto has been absent from this storyline and only appearing as cameos is cause they're saving him for something big? wouldn't mind him being the next major villain

if they continue these types of stories there's only 3 fan service type things I'd like to see:
1. Broly God (From The Universal Studios tour) Which I assume is Koyama's Broly (from the movies and Dark Demon Realm I think!)
2. SS4 Cumber
3. CC & Xeno Fusion team up (CC Vegito blue & Xeno SS4 Gogeta or CC Gogeta Blue & Xeno SS4 Vegito)

Sorry I'm all over the place but I'd like to hear your guys' thoughts and ideas for what you'd like to see happen next after the Universal Conflict Arc
I also believe that this won't be the end of it. Fu is still there, but I doubt that we will get anything related to the Demon Realm.

Perhaps he has accumulated enough energy from all these fights to finally make his move. Using Cumber and Lagss could be one way of doing that. Perhaps approaching the manga more with Ozotto.

Him being a villain that escaped the Prison Planet unknown to everyone else, perhaps even Fu could make sense for a 3-party battle. Fu would dispose of Cooler if he used Cumber tho, so he might as well forget the Saiyan. But Lagss definitely got 0 screentime in most media. Like she will play an important role later. And Ozotto in the mix makes sense.

As far as entirely original ideas go, I don't have anything in mind that doesn't sound like fanfic lol. Maybe a hint to Moro the Galactic Patrol and Sealas? Not sure how that would play out in this timeline tho.

Broly seems like a fountain of fanservice so not sure how they would use him. Z Broly going Legendary Super Saiyan God would be the most epic thing to see. Again, not sure how to place him in all this since Super Broly is a thing and Xeno Broly is different.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Noah » Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:33 pm

This probably was been asked before, but did we ever got Super Saiyan Nappa on it?
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Lord Beerus » Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:43 pm

Grimlock wrote:
Tue Oct 22, 2019 8:10 pm
That is correct and not just here, in the whole franchise. We can't really discuss who's stronger than who. The characters are going to be as strong as the writers demand them to be.
No. That is not the case for the entire franchise. The original story (Toriyama's manga) makes it VERY clear who is stronger than who, even taking into the capacity of what we see the characters do in combat despite how ridiculously strong they are. It's only external material such as the guidebooks, video games, films and TV anime, that have made shit confusing for some people. That isn't to say that bending or twisting the power scale is an inherently bad thing. You just need to make sure that it isn't the crux of the story. Or you risk killing any kind of drama or establishing some kind of tension.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grimlock » Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:54 pm

Yeah, right. I'll acknowledge the original manga made sense. It was possible to discuss power level in it. But these days it's just impossible. No wonder I gave up after Movie 15/Muten Roshi defeating Freeza soldiers and I don't even appear in threads whose power level is the theme. Anyway.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Steven Bloodriver » Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:17 pm

Noah wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:33 pm
This probably was been asked before, but did we ever got Super Saiyan Nappa on it?
As far as I know, Super Saiyan Nappa only appears in Dragon Ball Xenoverse Two.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DNA » Wed Oct 23, 2019 2:46 pm

Noah wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 1:33 pm
This probably was been asked before, but did we ever got Super Saiyan Nappa on it?
As Steven Bloodriver said, Super Saiyan Nappa is exclusive to Xenoverse 2. However, Heroes has Super Saiyan 3 Nappa. That's the only transformation for Nappa.
Unlike Raditz who has Ozaru and Super Saiyan 3.
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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dragotaker » Wed Oct 23, 2019 8:34 pm

Grand Marshal 1 wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:05 am
Noitsnothim wrote:
Wed Oct 23, 2019 3:49 am
I'm doubting that the Universal Conflict Arc will be the last 'Dragon Ball Super' esque Saga we'll get in Heroes' what do you think is next after GodSlayer Hearts ? (Cause that's the end all be all type villain for Dragon Ball IMO) If Cumber & Lagss survive do you think they'll team up and join forces with Fu? Will (DBS) Broly and friends be brought into the mix? Perhaps the reason as to why Majin Ozotto has been absent from this storyline and only appearing as cameos is cause they're saving him for something big? wouldn't mind him being the next major villain

if they continue these types of stories there's only 3 fan service type things I'd like to see:
1. Broly God (From The Universal Studios tour) Which I assume is Koyama's Broly (from the movies and Dark Demon Realm I think!)
2. SS4 Cumber
3. CC & Xeno Fusion team up (CC Vegito blue & Xeno SS4 Gogeta or CC Gogeta Blue & Xeno SS4 Vegito)

Sorry I'm all over the place but I'd like to hear your guys' thoughts and ideas for what you'd like to see happen next after the Universal Conflict Arc
I also believe that this won't be the end of it. Fu is still there, but I doubt that we will get anything related to the Demon Realm.

Perhaps he has accumulated enough energy from all these fights to finally make his move. Using Cumber and Lagss could be one way of doing that. Perhaps approaching the manga more with Ozotto.

Him being a villain that escaped the Prison Planet unknown to everyone else, perhaps even Fu could make sense for a 3-party battle. Fu would dispose of Cooler if he used Cumber tho, so he might as well forget the Saiyan. But Lagss definitely got 0 screentime in most media. Like she will play an important role later. And Ozotto in the mix makes sense.

As far as entirely original ideas go, I don't have anything in mind that doesn't sound like fanfic lol. Maybe a hint to Moro the Galactic Patrol and Sealas? Not sure how that would play out in this timeline tho.

Broly seems like a fountain of fanservice so not sure how they would use him. Z Broly going Legendary Super Saiyan God would be the most epic thing to see. Again, not sure how to place him in all this since Super Broly is a thing and Xeno Broly is different.
Didn't that happen already??? that 3D japan exclusive movie where Goku fuses with a member of the audience, if anything the thing we are missing about it are cards on the arcade and now the Switch game IIRC.

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Re: "(Super) Dragon Ball Heroes" Official Discussion Thread

Post by DNA » Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:03 am

Indeed, Broli God is already in the game, unfortunately he is one of the few characters that doesn't have a card, making him unplayable.
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