"Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by In Brightest Day » Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:50 pm

If they were interested in making a large roster, I think the following characters would be good additions to the game:

Aka, Bergamo, Bojack, Bora (Upa assist), Botamo, Cabba, Champa, Chi-Chi, Dabura (Babidi assist), Dr. Gero (#19 assist), Dyspo, Frost, GT Pan, Jaco, King Chappa, Ledgic, Lord Slug, Magetta, Mercenary Tao (Tsuru Sen'nin assist), Nail, Nam, Olibu, Oob, Paikuhan, Pirina (Saonel assist), Raditz, Ribrianne, Sauza, Supreme Kai, Tarble, Teen Goten, Toppo, Yajirobe, Zangya, Zarbon
goku the krump dancer wrote:While I mostly wanna say no to Chi-Chi as well, considering that they added Videl of all people then I guess they could do some fun stuff with Chi-Chi as well, she’s the more aesthetically entertaining character between she and Videl anyway.

As far as anyone else it’s gonna be a hard no from me, I have no interest in Ranfan, Bacterian and Nam if mostly because they’re so minor I couldn’t imagine a fully fleshed out character for the game. Granted they could always get creative, which is fine but again they’re so minor, that it doesn’t matter. I can’t imagine an EVO crowd getting hype at a Manwolf gameplay trailer.
I would say diversity is always a good thing, and painting Nam, Chi-Chi, Grandpa Gohan, etc. with the same brush as Manwolf and Bacterian isn’t entirely accurate or fair.

The only real question is if they could develop a unique enough style and move-set for those characters to make it worthwhile.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kataphrut » Sun Sep 06, 2020 1:42 am

Meito wrote:
Fri Sep 04, 2020 6:31 am
Kataphrut wrote:
Mon Aug 31, 2020 8:50 am
Rage quitters about to be deleted:

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Maybe it would have been better to remove some BPs as a penalty. Many ragequitters have become such in order get higher ranks.
Anyway at least is something, thanks Hiroki!
I think the ban does include kicking people off the leaderboards. So long Hyde-Gackt.

Regarding the whole OG DB characters thing, I want to be a shit and say that of course Dragon Ball characters are in, because Dragon Ball is the whole thing. But I wouldn't be fooling anyone. For what it's worth, pretty much all of Yamcha's moves and most of Tien's are based on their "Dragon Ball" incarnations because they didn't have any fights worth drawing from in later arcs. I've said before that you need to have a lot of clout and moveset potential to make it into this game, and most of the ones that haven't gotten in yet aren't in it for a reason.

Adding Roshi has opened the door to other non-flying characters from that era, but let's be honest, Tao is probably the only worthwhile choice and he's already been deconfirmed as a "gag character". Never let it be said the "comedic prequel" thing is entirely a Western notion.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by goku the krump dancer » Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:13 am

In Brightest Day wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:50 pm
Snip
This is ArcS not Spike, they're not interested in 80 man Rosters with paper thin depth to them. Honestly in regards to the Roster as it stands now they actually have most of the heavy hitters anyone could realistically ask for when it comes to whats supposed to be a "Serious DB Fighting Game".

When it comes to a sequel or just adding more characters, I'd imagine we'd get The Supreme Kai of Time (since she's more involved in modern material, even if its only video game related) before we get Giran or Grandpa Gohan. Honestly i'm not interested in having them be playable either, they were all relevant for half a chapter at best and were largely forgotten about after word, there's no way they could come up with enough unique material to give them a solid moveset without diverging from who the character is all together and if that's the case why not just a make a brand new character exclusive to the game like Android 21.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by In Brightest Day » Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:56 pm

goku the krump dancer wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:13 am
snip
Fair enough.

They were able to make Videl into a fully fleshed-out playable character in the game so most of the people on my above list, bar one or two characters, should easily be put in the game by the same logic.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Mon Sep 07, 2020 12:29 pm

They could potentially bring back assist-only characters like in Extreme Butoden. It could be a good way of bringing in single gimmick fighters like Giran and non-combatants like Bulma and Kaio-sama who usually get ignored.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:59 am

goku the krump dancer wrote:
Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:13 am
This is ArcS not Spike, they're not interested in 80 man Rosters with paper thin depth to them. Honestly in regards to the Roster as it stands now they actually have most of the heavy hitters anyone could realistically ask for when it comes to whats supposed to be a "Serious DB Fighting Game".
Xenoverse is where the big roaster is, there's no need to have FighterZ be like that as well. In terms of future games or DLC, I think there's potential with Raditz and Dabura to be added.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by SSGSWarrior » Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:51 am

In Brightest Day wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:50 pm
If they were interested in making a large roster, I think the following characters would be good additions to the game:

Aka, Bergamo, Bojack, Bora (Upa assist), Botamo, Cabba, Champa, Chi-Chi, Dabura (Babidi assist), Dr. Gero (#19 assist), Dyspo, Frost, GT Pan, Jaco, King Chappa, Ledgic, Lord Slug, Magetta, Mercenary Tao (Tsuru Sen'nin assist), Nail, Nam, Olibu, Oob, Paikuhan, Pirina (Saonel assist), Raditz, Ribrianne, Sauza, Supreme Kai, Tarble, Teen Goten, Toppo, Yajirobe, Zangya, Zarbon
goku the krump dancer wrote:While I mostly wanna say no to Chi-Chi as well, considering that they added Videl of all people then I guess they could do some fun stuff with Chi-Chi as well, she’s the more aesthetically entertaining character between she and Videl anyway.

As far as anyone else it’s gonna be a hard no from me, I have no interest in Ranfan, Bacterian and Nam if mostly because they’re so minor I couldn’t imagine a fully fleshed out character for the game. Granted they could always get creative, which is fine but again they’re so minor, that it doesn’t matter. I can’t imagine an EVO crowd getting hype at a Manwolf gameplay trailer.
I would say diversity is always a good thing, and painting Nam, Chi-Chi, Grandpa Gohan, etc. with the same brush as Manwolf and Bacterian isn’t entirely accurate or fair.

The only real question is if they could develop a unique enough style and move-set for those characters to make it worthwhile.

I think basically everybody in the Tournament of Power could be added. But like you said, diversity gets harder as the roster gets bigger. Still, I think people would not mind the clones if they just think of those clone characters as alternate costumes

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cold Skin » Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:59 pm

^ Speaking of alternate costumes, this would be a welcome addition to have at least one per character, progressively included (they could start with just a bunch having that priviledge and then do it for more and more characters as time goes by).
With their graphics, it is time-consuming because it's not about just swapping models but checking and shading sprites one by one for every single movement, plus checking that punctual deformations are applied to the new shape and clothes overall.

But they could have a small 3D modeling team dedicated to it in their development staff, as it would really only involve to redraw sprites without having to invent and check a whole gameplay and without any modification to the hitboxes either.
It is no small task compared to most games for which you can just swap models, but it is not something as big as including a new character with a new gameplay either.

It's "only" about drawing alternate sprites, so you could have a team in charge of it on the side.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dbzfan94 » Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:56 pm

SSGSWarrior wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:51 am
In Brightest Day wrote:
Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:50 pm
If they were interested in making a large roster, I think the following characters would be good additions to the game:

Aka, Bergamo, Bojack, Bora (Upa assist), Botamo, Cabba, Champa, Chi-Chi, Dabura (Babidi assist), Dr. Gero (#19 assist), Dyspo, Frost, GT Pan, Jaco, King Chappa, Ledgic, Lord Slug, Magetta, Mercenary Tao (Tsuru Sen'nin assist), Nail, Nam, Olibu, Oob, Paikuhan, Pirina (Saonel assist), Raditz, Ribrianne, Sauza, Supreme Kai, Tarble, Teen Goten, Toppo, Yajirobe, Zangya, Zarbon
goku the krump dancer wrote:While I mostly wanna say no to Chi-Chi as well, considering that they added Videl of all people then I guess they could do some fun stuff with Chi-Chi as well, she’s the more aesthetically entertaining character between she and Videl anyway.

As far as anyone else it’s gonna be a hard no from me, I have no interest in Ranfan, Bacterian and Nam if mostly because they’re so minor I couldn’t imagine a fully fleshed out character for the game. Granted they could always get creative, which is fine but again they’re so minor, that it doesn’t matter. I can’t imagine an EVO crowd getting hype at a Manwolf gameplay trailer.
I would say diversity is always a good thing, and painting Nam, Chi-Chi, Grandpa Gohan, etc. with the same brush as Manwolf and Bacterian isn’t entirely accurate or fair.

The only real question is if they could develop a unique enough style and move-set for those characters to make it worthwhile.

I think basically everybody in the Tournament of Power could be added. But like you said, diversity gets harder as the roster gets bigger. Still, I think people would not mind the clones if they just think of those clone characters as alternate costumes
About 70% of he ToP fighters barely did more than a single attack, if that. No way they're gonna put 80 DLC characters

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:59 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:56 pm

About 70% of he ToP fighters barely did more than a single attack, if that. No way they're gonna put 80 DLC characters
I for one can't wait to play as Kettle with his one Hellzone Grenade rip-off attack, and nothing else.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dbzfan94 » Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:20 pm

LoganForkHands73 wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 6:59 pm
Dbzfan94 wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:56 pm

About 70% of he ToP fighters barely did more than a single attack, if that. No way they're gonna put 80 DLC characters
I for one can't wait to play as Kettle with his one Hellzone Grenade rip-off attack, and nothing else.
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Either I'm crazy or that dude's head is photoshopped onto Jiren's body. (Seriously so many characters in that arc are so forgettable I dont even know who's actually a character and who's an edit/OC :lol:

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:32 pm

Dbzfan94 wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 7:20 pm

Either I'm crazy or that dude's head is photoshopped onto Jiren's body. (Seriously so many characters in that arc are so forgettable I dont even know who's actually a character and who's an edit/OC :lol:
Oh, he's real. :wink: Maybe he's the legendary El Hermano...

Yeah, even as a fan of that arc there sure are a lot of forgettable, shittily designed fodder characters. To be fair, I think it's mainly down to creative burnout as it would be hard for anyone to come up with nearly a hundred unique characters (including the gods) and 90% of them had to be designed by Toei because Toriyama only provided like eight of them.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kataphrut » Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:50 pm

Cold Skin wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:59 pm
^ Speaking of alternate costumes, this would be a welcome addition to have at least one per character, progressively included (they could start with just a bunch having that priviledge and then do it for more and more characters as time goes by).
With their graphics, it is time-consuming because it's not about just swapping models but checking and shading sprites one by one for every single movement, plus checking that punctual deformations are applied to the new shape and clothes overall.

But they could have a small 3D modeling team dedicated to it in their development staff, as it would really only involve to redraw sprites without having to invent and check a whole gameplay and without any modification to the hitboxes either.
It is no small task compared to most games for which you can just swap models, but it is not something as big as including a new character with a new gameplay either.

It's "only" about drawing alternate sprites, so you could have a team in charge of it on the side.
I don't know about you, but the last thing I want to see is effort being wasted on paid cosmetics. The game industry has enough of that as it is.

Adding new characters that expand the competitive roster is a better use of time and resources, in my opinion. I've seen so many people say "when are they gonna add x costume or y form as a skin?" and I'm like "why is that so important?"

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Neo-Makaiōshin » Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:52 am

Roshi gameplay: https://youtu.be/zmi_RVHB3lw

Coming September 18th.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cold Skin » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:37 am

Kataphrut wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:50 pm
Cold Skin wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:59 pm
^ Speaking of alternate costumes, this would be a welcome addition to have at least one per character, progressively included (they could start with just a bunch having that priviledge and then do it for more and more characters as time goes by).
With their graphics, it is time-consuming because it's not about just swapping models but checking and shading sprites one by one for every single movement, plus checking that punctual deformations are applied to the new shape and clothes overall.

But they could have a small 3D modeling team dedicated to it in their development staff, as it would really only involve to redraw sprites without having to invent and check a whole gameplay and without any modification to the hitboxes either.
It is no small task compared to most games for which you can just swap models, but it is not something as big as including a new character with a new gameplay either.

It's "only" about drawing alternate sprites, so you could have a team in charge of it on the side.
I don't know about you, but the last thing I want to see is effort being wasted on paid cosmetics. The game industry has enough of that as it is.

Adding new characters that expand the competitive roster is a better use of time and resources, in my opinion. I've seen so many people say "when are they gonna add x costume or y form as a skin?" and I'm like "why is that so important?"
It's important for the same reason that people would like new stages: because things get visually boring when it's the same characters in the same places for the 250th time. It's a fighting game, once you've done the story mode there's no extra mission to go for, you spend hours and hours fighting over and over again through endless matches that all look the same.

Having 12 different colors (a little more than that now) is nice, but it doesn't change the fact that facing "classic costume" Goku is routine, and that facing "Whis training" Goku or "City clothes waiting for the Cell Game" Goku would break the visual routine after hours of the same and would refresh things and renew the interest in seeing the various sprites and animations at work during hours of gameplay.

Even fighting games like Tekken 2 at the time of the first Playstation understood that characters need at least one visual variation available for the sake of variety, and not just a color change but a full costume change.
Today, games like Mortal Kombat understand that visual variation can even go as far as being able to choose between a bunch of different intros and different win poses (although I think they make you spend game money to unlock them).

We're not talking about sacrificing new characters for new costumes. Of course the priority must go to new characters with new gameplay. But it's about adding new costumes on top of that, thanks to a small dedicated team that's just about creating a new model and drawing the shading and deformations on this new model to match the currently existing one.

Having the choice between two well-known variations would be a welcome and likely feasible addition, and we would even be lenient with characters like Freezer, Cell, Gotenks, Jiren or the small Boo having no variation since there is logically no costume change for them.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:55 am

Neo-Makaiōshin wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:52 am
Roshi gameplay: https://youtu.be/zmi_RVHB3lw

Coming September 18th.
Jeez, Roshi is tall here. Looks like he's going to struggle without a conventional super-dash, ngl, but he looks good!

Also, adding to the point about alternate costumes, for most characters, I'm not too fussed. However, Tenshinhan definitely needs his Cell arc green sash, or maybe just a plain shirtless skin -- it would take a lot of work but his current costume, while cool, is nowhere near as iconic.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kataphrut » Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:31 pm

Cold Skin wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:37 am
Kataphrut wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:50 pm
Cold Skin wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:59 pm
^ Speaking of alternate costumes, this would be a welcome addition to have at least one per character, progressively included (they could start with just a bunch having that priviledge and then do it for more and more characters as time goes by).
With their graphics, it is time-consuming because it's not about just swapping models but checking and shading sprites one by one for every single movement, plus checking that punctual deformations are applied to the new shape and clothes overall.

But they could have a small 3D modeling team dedicated to it in their development staff, as it would really only involve to redraw sprites without having to invent and check a whole gameplay and without any modification to the hitboxes either.
It is no small task compared to most games for which you can just swap models, but it is not something as big as including a new character with a new gameplay either.

It's "only" about drawing alternate sprites, so you could have a team in charge of it on the side.
I don't know about you, but the last thing I want to see is effort being wasted on paid cosmetics. The game industry has enough of that as it is.

Adding new characters that expand the competitive roster is a better use of time and resources, in my opinion. I've seen so many people say "when are they gonna add x costume or y form as a skin?" and I'm like "why is that so important?"
It's important for the same reason that people would like new stages: because things get visually boring when it's the same characters in the same places for the 250th time. It's a fighting game, once you've done the story mode there's no extra mission to go for, you spend hours and hours fighting over and over again through endless matches that all look the same.

Having 12 different colors (a little more than that now) is nice, but it doesn't change the fact that facing "classic costume" Goku is routine, and that facing "Whis training" Goku or "City clothes waiting for the Cell Game" Goku would break the visual routine after hours of the same and would refresh things and renew the interest in seeing the various sprites and animations at work during hours of gameplay.

Even fighting games like Tekken 2 at the time of the first Playstation understood that characters need at least one visual variation available for the sake of variety, and not just a color change but a full costume change.
Today, games like Mortal Kombat understand that visual variation can even go as far as being able to choose between a bunch of different intros and different win poses (although I think they make you spend game money to unlock them).

We're not talking about sacrificing new characters for new costumes. Of course the priority must go to new characters with new gameplay. But it's about adding new costumes on top of that, thanks to a small dedicated team that's just about creating a new model and drawing the shading and deformations on this new model to match the currently existing one.

Having the choice between two well-known variations would be a welcome and likely feasible addition, and we would even be lenient with characters like Freezer, Cell, Gotenks, Jiren or the small Boo having no variation since there is logically no costume change for them.
ArcSys is already devoting most of their resources toward Guilty Gear, and hopefully getting rollback netcode sorted out for all their future games. The team still working on FighterZ is already pretty small and the majority of the effort would be being spent on characters. Devoting extra effort into cosmetics simply isn’t worth it.

Also, I don’t know where you’re getting the idea that the game is boring without them. For me it’s absolutely not. What keeps the game interesting to me is rising up through the ranks, fighting better players, getting better with my own team, and every now and then dealing with the shakeup of a new character or balance patch added to the mix.

Adding costumes wouldn’t make any difference- if anything it would make it worse because it would create more things to deal with in my mind- “who’s that? Oh it’s Krillin in a cop outfit. He doesn’t look like Krillin as I’ve come to expect but I have to remember he still plays like him.” Character design and readable silhouettes are more important than people realise in competitive games, and costumes can actually distract from them.

Roshi Is looking cool. I think we’re getting a stream on Sunday, we’ll get to see him in the hands of pros. Leaving aside the utility of the leap, that lightning attack looks really strong. Also, his light autocombo with the afterimages looked sweet as!

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by LoganForkHands73 » Thu Sep 10, 2020 12:11 pm

Kataphrut wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 9:31 pm
Cold Skin wrote:
Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:37 am
Kataphrut wrote:
Tue Sep 08, 2020 10:50 pm


I don't know about you, but the last thing I want to see is effort being wasted on paid cosmetics. The game industry has enough of that as it is.

Adding new characters that expand the competitive roster is a better use of time and resources, in my opinion. I've seen so many people say "when are they gonna add x costume or y form as a skin?" and I'm like "why is that so important?"
It's important for the same reason that people would like new stages: because things get visually boring when it's the same characters in the same places for the 250th time. It's a fighting game, once you've done the story mode there's no extra mission to go for, you spend hours and hours fighting over and over again through endless matches that all look the same.

Having 12 different colors (a little more than that now) is nice, but it doesn't change the fact that facing "classic costume" Goku is routine, and that facing "Whis training" Goku or "City clothes waiting for the Cell Game" Goku would break the visual routine after hours of the same and would refresh things and renew the interest in seeing the various sprites and animations at work during hours of gameplay.

Even fighting games like Tekken 2 at the time of the first Playstation understood that characters need at least one visual variation available for the sake of variety, and not just a color change but a full costume change.
Today, games like Mortal Kombat understand that visual variation can even go as far as being able to choose between a bunch of different intros and different win poses (although I think they make you spend game money to unlock them).

We're not talking about sacrificing new characters for new costumes. Of course the priority must go to new characters with new gameplay. But it's about adding new costumes on top of that, thanks to a small dedicated team that's just about creating a new model and drawing the shading and deformations on this new model to match the currently existing one.

Having the choice between two well-known variations would be a welcome and likely feasible addition, and we would even be lenient with characters like Freezer, Cell, Gotenks, Jiren or the small Boo having no variation since there is logically no costume change for them.
ArcSys is already devoting most of their resources toward Guilty Gear, and hopefully getting rollback netcode sorted out for all their future games. The team still working on FighterZ is already pretty small and the majority of the effort would be being spent on characters. Devoting extra effort into cosmetics simply isn’t worth it.

Also, I don’t know where you’re getting the idea that the game is boring without them. For me it’s absolutely not. What keeps the game interesting to me is rising up through the ranks, fighting better players, getting better with my own team, and every now and then dealing with the shakeup of a new character or balance patch added to the mix.

Adding costumes wouldn’t make any difference- if anything it would make it worse because it would create more things to deal with in my mind- “who’s that? Oh it’s Krillin in a cop outfit. He doesn’t look like Krillin as I’ve come to expect but I have to remember he still plays like him.” Character design and readable silhouettes are more important than people realise in competitive games, and costumes can actually distract from them.

Roshi Is looking cool. I think we’re getting a stream on Sunday, we’ll get to see him in the hands of pros. Leaving aside the utility of the leap, that lightning attack looks really strong. Also, his light autocombo with the afterimages looked sweet as!
Some modern fighting games are far too fixated on cosmetics, so in a sense I'm glad that FighterZ doesn't overindulge in it. Tekken 7 is one of my favourite games of all time, but the custom cosmetics can be actively disruptive in gameplay (there's options to give Jack full-body 40k Space Marine armour that totally obscures his character model) and many of them simply look completely atrocious. There's nothing more winceworthy than playing online and coming across a Miguel stripped down to his boxers with pink fairy wings on his back, a frog on his crotch and a bear mask. Even ignoring customisable stuff, Street Fighter V has gone completely off-the-rails with promoting thousands of alternate costumes, much to the annoyance of most players.

All that said, a handful wouldn't hurt but maybe at this point it's best left for a sequel. As I said, I'd like the option to get Tenshinhan to ditch the Chinese gown and give him the green trousers at least. Meanwhile, #18's Android arc gear is outdated af -- I'd like to play as her in her post-BoG casual clothes or her pink tracksuit for example. Or at the very least, allow her to ditch the Red Ribbon jacket so it looks more like her Buu arc outfit.
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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Neo-Makaiōshin » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:25 pm

A bit more footage of Roshi. His Mafuba super seems to force character switch if it doesn't kill.

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Re: "Dragon Ball FighterZ" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cold Skin » Thu Sep 10, 2020 1:31 pm

^ It's what I thought I saw with some footage played by a girl for a show or something.
It could have a tactical importance to have this extra way to discard an opponent for a little while.

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