"Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Discussion of all things related to Dragon Ball video games (console and portable games, arcade versions, etc.) from the entire franchise's history.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Matches Malone » Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:59 am

Grimlock wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:21 pm
I'd like to take a look at it. I've been very curious about this supposed canon Dragon Ball supposedly has. All I see are merely opinions, but seeing something official might be interesting.
I don't think you need someone to explicitly say there's one to know it exists. Saying DB doesn't have a canon to follow is like saying it's like the Simpsons or tom and Jerry where anything goes and everything can be watched in any order. Although all stories are "official", not all of them are taken into account nowadays. For example, we've got a new rebooted Broly, which means his original movies aren't taken into account as stories that happened. Vegeta was taught fusion in Broly, meaning that Fusion reborn didn't take place within the canon. If cooler is also rebooted in Super, that'll make his 2 original movies irrelevant. Sure, everything is official, but not everything happened.

I don't see any canon arguments within other fan groups so I don't know why it's such an issue with DB's fans. I don't think it's an issue of there being one or not as much as fans just wanting what they like to count. If something doesn't count, that doesn't mean fans can't like it for what it is.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Scsigs » Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:17 am

Grimlock wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:04 am
You may want to rewatch Dragon Ball Super. Not that I do watch that terrible show, but I surprisingly remember it having a lot of filler content from Dragon Ball Z, from Gregory's appearance to that Ginyu/frog thing. The only work that didn't take any filler was Dragon Ball Online. But that's all besides the point, of course. I'm not questioning the validity of the original manga, I'm questioning all the other works besides it.
Ginyu Frog was a case of confirming Ginyu in the frog's body made it to Earth with everyone else when it exploded. People speculated on that, I'm very sure, & the writers chose to throw it in to make the arc different enough from the movie. However, the movie is clearly the canon version of that story, so...yeah...

Gregory is something I hate was included in Super's anime & I'll be the first to say he shouldn't be there. Nothing's technically saying he doesn't exist in the DB universe, but including him in the new material is stupid.

Also, that only really happens early on when the writers had to write the first 2 arcs to have filler in them to make them different from the movies. From the 3rd arc on, filler only gets surface references in Super's slice of life filler episodes & nothing else. The story just proceeds as if the filler from Z never existed. In fact, you can just watch Battle of Gods & Resurrection F, with the filler episodes inn between & after both respective arts thrown in if you want, then just go on to the U6 Arc in Super & you'd have a much better experienced since the first 2 arcs of Super aren't too different from the movies, but ARE extremely poorly-paced &, unfortunately, suffer from the bad work schedule the staff were under at the time, resulting in the animation being very poor at times.

DB Online was a short-lived MMO video game that had its own story & lore written by Toriyama himself, so I'm not surprised it didn't reference filler since it had its own narrative to go on. I'm not surprised there. It's like asking why Xenoverse didn't reference filler from Z, when its events are clearly tied to the manga's continuity as its source material.
The thing is, all other works have something about them that discredit them as stuff that take place in the main timeline of DB. The movies before Battle of Gods are either in alternate universes, or timelines, since most of them have active continuity errors that prevent them from being a part of the main timeline & the rest were made with the intention of not being in there as well, most of the filler was made just to eat up time & at least some of it is actively contradicted later on because Toriyama didn't write it, so he didn't keep track of it, & so on. It's just how this is working.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grimlock » Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:18 pm

emperior wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:41 am
The wall supposedly talks about the manga because it has some stuff which is manga-exclusive, like the God of Destruction exhibition match, Zamasu multiplying and Trunks being on par with SS3 Goku in his SS2 form.
But I agree the phrasing is a bit ambiguous so as not to say that only the manga version of Super is canonical.
The problem is that there can be no ambiguity. So I'll ask again, which version are we supposed to take canonical? And if it is Toyotaro's version, why wouldn't I be able to pick the movies instead? Isn't Toriyama's works the ones we should be considering? Where's the "just what the authors did and nothing else matters" thought here? Or is there a level of hypocrisy/contradiction when it comes to Dragon Ball Super and its many continuities? If we are to take just Toriyama's story, then I think it should be very clear which continuity we should be taking as canonical when it comes to Battle of Gods and Resurrection F, yet we still have debates over it, people preferring the movies, manga or the anime. If there is an official canon, why is this still such thing?
emperior wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:41 am
Either way we have plenty of interviews of Toriyama with Toyotaro in the collected volumes of the manga, while we have none of Toriyama with the anime staff. And Toriyama praised Toyotaro’s depiction of the story.
The fact Super’s manga is the same format as the original manga from Toriyama should make it the logical sequel to it, as it’s not like people reading the manga and then switching to the anime would keep the same experience.
And Toriyama supervising and correcting it would give it some more legitimacy - for example he sketched out rough boards for the U6 tournament gag, and of course he kept Toyotaro’s version of the ring so logically that would mean the egyptian-like ring is the true setting of the tournament.
Conversely, we have Toyotaro depicting kid Vegeta with bangs and him failing to mention Tarble and that Namekuseijin book in its manga. The latter being something we would come to learn it is seemingly from Toriyama. Curiously, it does appear in Toei's version. So should we really take these supervising and correcting that seriously as any hint of canonicity? What else Toyotaro may have failed to mention that comes from Toriyama?

Anyway, none of those things actually mean the manga version is the one to be taken as canonical once it is possible to tell or continue a story through different media and/or methods.
emperior wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:41 am
About DB online, I consider it because Toriyama was heavily involved with it and modern material, being written by Toriyama, borrows stuff from that game - such as Tenshinan having a Dojo, Mr Satan making movies or, more importantly, the design of the Yardratians seen recently in the manga.
The game is completely dead and it wasn’t even directly mentioned when they talked about the designs of the Yardratians, but considering how Toriyama has a track record of being strangely consistent with things he mentioned in past interviews and stuff that then appears in his story, so for example I think if in his head Goku’s death happens in a final fight with Vegeta then that thing is canonical until it’s contradicted in the story.

For me, ultimately, Dragon Ball is the work of one man (even if he of course had and still has editors and such) and only Toriyama can mess with its story.
An official canon would make everyone to think like that. But as I said, a lot of people don't take Dragon Ball Online as canonical work, which means, at the very least, if there is a canon, it is so loose and vague that we could hardly say there is canon at all, as people can take or ignore certain works. If we are to take just Toriyama's story, then we are to take all Toriyama's story (except those intentionally not to be part of something, like Neko Majin. As there is official statement saying it is meant to be a parody), not arbritrarily selecting this one or that one. That would be "headcanon".
Matches Malone wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:59 am
I don't think you need someone to explicitly say there's one to know it exists. Saying DB doesn't have a canon to follow is like saying it's like the Simpsons or tom and Jerry where anything goes and everything can be watched in any order. Although all stories are "official", not all of them are taken into account nowadays. For example, we've got a new rebooted Broly, which means his original movies aren't taken into account as stories that happened. Vegeta was taught fusion in Broly, meaning that Fusion reborn didn't take place within the canon. If cooler is also rebooted in Super, that'll make his 2 original movies irrelevant. Sure, everything is official, but not everything happened.
Classical example of confusing continuity and canonicity, and they couldn't be any more different.

No. To say Dragon Ball doesn't have a canon does not equal to saying it works like like Tom and Jerry and etc. A continuity is the flow of time and events in a certain order. Tom and Jerry doesn't have a continuity, its episodes aren't connected with each other.

Dragon Ball have (a lot of) continuity. One goes from Dragon Ball Minus up until Dragon Ball Online, for example. The canon would dictate which other works are acknowledged into it. Because this is what canon concerns about. Not the original work, but all the other works within the franchise. And it surely has nothing to do with continuity.

But isn't that simple because, like I said, Dragon Ball does offer the "alternate dimension" concept, which outright throws the canonicity concept through the window, because this method allows the possibility of characters from different dimension to meet each other. And here comes the tricky part: just because those characters met each other, doesn't mean the events (from the characters of the other dimension) will be acknowledged too. If Turles had appeared in Future Trunks saga using Goku Black's rift, that wouldn't mean Movie 3 suddenly happened in the Dragon Ball Super continuity, so where would be the canon now?

The usually regarded as the "main Spider-Man" is Peter Parker, that doesn't mean Miles Morales is not canonical/doesn't exist. The latter does exist in another Universe and they can meet each other, but that doesn't mean whatever happens/happened in the Miles Morales' universe is canonical/happened to/in Peter Parker's universe.

So you see, once a franchise have the "alternate dimension" concept, it completely tears apart all sense of canonicity. It may not have happened in the "main one" but it still there as a legit event. And this is the case with the movies of Dragon Ball. Once Toriyama said they happened in a different dimension, the events seen in the movies became as legit as the one you call "main events". They didn't happen in the manga, but somewhere out there they are real, not what-if.
Scsigs wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:17 am
The movies before Battle of Gods are either in alternate universes, or timelines, since most of them have active continuity errors that prevent them from being a part of the main timeline & the rest were made with the intention of not being in there as well
But there would be absolutely no reason to try to place the movies in the "main timeline" as Toriyama himself said they didn't happened it. What Daizenshuu 6 did was just to give a bit of context when it says "this movie takes place right here because this and that", but it is not trying to say that that movie happened in the "main timeline". It is just to situate the viewers into the context of the movie and nothing else.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by emperior » Sun Feb 23, 2020 4:03 pm

Grimlock wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 3:18 pm
I just wanted to say that, yes Battle of Gods and Resurrection F are both canonical to the Super’s manga in my opinion.
There the BoG arc is 80% new stuff such as Goku farming, Champa collecting the Super DBs etcetera and 20% sort of a rushed recap of the movie. But yeah regarding the canonicity of Super, Battle of Gods is the trickiest one because it’s been told in 3 slightly different ways, but RoF is canon to the manga as Broly is therefore parts of BoG should be too.

As for you “alternate dimension” argument, what you are saying is basically the same thing as saying “this isn’t canonical”. Stories not written by the author, which he himself says are part of “alternate dimensions” is the same as saying those events are not canonical. It’s just Toriyama’s way of saying it, the same as he said Battle of Gods was written as if it were the next chapter of his manga instead of saying “this is canonical”.
Surely the movies, GT, Heroes etcetera exist and are there to be enjoyed by fans but, ultimately, they will never affect the main continuity because Toriyama doesn’t acknowledge their in-universe existence. Broly’s “canonization” is proof of that.
I really don’t think there’s any need to discuss this furthermore.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by VegettoEX » Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:39 pm

Please remember that this is a thread for discussing the video game Dragon Ball Z: Son Gohan Kakarot, not canoncity of various parts of the franchise. Thank you!
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Grimlock » Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:57 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 5:39 pm
Please remember that this is a thread for discussing the video game Dragon Ball Z: Son Gohan Kakarot, not canoncity of various parts of the franchise. Thank you!
Hey, may you please pin this thread? I should've taken this conversation there already, so sorry. It would be a lot easier if that thread gets pinned up. Since the last post was last year, shouldn't be a problem to dig it up, right?
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:05 pm

Quick question:
after defeating all the red villanous enemies around the map... do they re-spawn eventually? I've been taking my time with them because I don't want to have an empty map with no enemies, aside of the weak metalbots, saibaimen, etc.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:10 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:05 pm
Quick question:
after defeating all the red villanous enemies around the map... do they re-spawn eventually? I've been taking my time with them because I don't want to have an empty map with no enemies, aside of the weak metalbots, saibaimen, etc.
If it's your first time beating them, then it will all lead to the secret boss you have to beat. After you beat him, they'll all re-spawn across the maps, even stronger than they were before.

As for what happens when you beat them all again after that? Not sure, I haven't done that yet myself. It might re-spawn a second go-around with the secret boss, and they'll again re-spawn after that, basically in a cycle? Or you might just beat them all again and King Kai might remark 'the world is saved!' or something. I could see it going either way.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dbzfan94 » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:10 pm

Koitsukai wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:05 pm
Quick question:
after defeating all the red villanous enemies around the map... do they re-spawn eventually? I've been taking my time with them because I don't want to have an empty map with no enemies, aside of the weak metalbots, saibaimen, etc.
From what I heard, yes, they come back.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:51 pm

Thanks to both of you, I'll go at it then.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Sora Saiyan » Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:57 pm

Gyt Kaliba wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:10 pm
Koitsukai wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:05 pm
Quick question:
after defeating all the red villanous enemies around the map... do they re-spawn eventually? I've been taking my time with them because I don't want to have an empty map with no enemies, aside of the weak metalbots, saibaimen, etc.
If it's your first time beating them, then it will all lead to the secret boss you have to beat. After you beat him, they'll all re-spawn across the maps, even stronger than they were before.

As for what happens when you beat them all again after that? Not sure, I haven't done that yet myself. It might re-spawn a second go-around with the secret boss, and they'll again re-spawn after that, basically in a cycle? Or you might just beat them all again and King Kai might remark 'the world is saved!' or something. I could see it going either way.
Once you beat them a second time they just respawn again at the same level. This time the final fight is against Gotenks and Vegetto, and they're level 200. It's really disappointing that there's not a single reward since the villainous enemies this time are super high levels.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Wed Feb 26, 2020 2:13 pm

Sora Saiyan wrote:
Wed Feb 26, 2020 1:57 pm
Once you beat them a second time they just respawn again at the same level. This time the final fight is against Gotenks and Vegetto, and they're level 200. It's really disappointing that there's not a single reward since the villainous enemies this time are super high levels.
Huh, so I guess their only real purpose after you defeat Mira is probably to be one of the best things to grind against for EXP? Especially since you don't really need to be anywhere near the level they are to stand a chance of beating them, compared to how important relatively close levels were prior to hitting Lv. 100.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by samuraix123 » Thu Feb 27, 2020 4:37 pm

Man...I wanted to upload game clips that I made onto Youtube but I guess Toei wont let me. I can't even send screenshots of anything to my friends. :thumbdown:
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by VegettoEX » Thu Feb 27, 2020 5:12 pm

You can still take them, it’s just that you just can’t immediately use the built-in console functionality to share. I’ve been copying and saving them to a USB stick afterward; you can do anything you want with them at that point.

It’s bizarre and dumb and backward and inconvenient, but at least it ain’t Atlus level 😂.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by samuraix123 » Fri Feb 28, 2020 6:00 pm

Sorry but I posted this Dragonballfighterz thread but it was meant for this thread. I have depression and sometimes my mind gets cloudy and I made a mistake.
I don't know about you guys, but doing those side missions with training is tough with Vegeta lol Nappa keeps using that exploding move were he says NOW DIE!!! Over and over and Raditz keeps firing those purple nurples at me lol i'm 34 with Vegeta and the recommended level to do it is 35 lol Good lord! I gotta use my health items a lot. Lol but....I'm enjoying it. It wouldn't be a dragonball game without a little annoying parts lol
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Koitsukai » Wed Mar 04, 2020 11:36 pm

There's an update, I don't know what it will update.

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Cold Skin » Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:25 pm

^ Not much apparently. It's all about the stability, not new content.

"Fixed crashing issues.
Addressed framerate drop and freezing issues.
Addressed stuttering/lag issues.
Performance and stability improvements added.
Other minor under the hood improvements."

At least, the Time Machine is coming in March though. But when I check my "Story" menu, the only blue quests that appear are apparently the ones I've completed, which makes sense since the menu is called "Completed stories".
There's no way to actually know if I missed any side quest and which time period I should go back to...
There's only a "completed stories" menu and a "Kame training instructions" menu in the "Story" section. There's no "to be done" menu...

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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Kanassa » Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:47 pm

Cold Skin wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 12:25 pm
^ Not much apparently. It's all about the stability, not new content.

"Fixed crashing issues.
Addressed framerate drop and freezing issues.
Addressed stuttering/lag issues.
Performance and stability improvements added.
Other minor under the hood improvements."

At least, the Time Machine is coming in March though. But when I check my "Story" menu, the only blue quests that appear are apparently the ones I've completed, which makes sense since the menu is called "Completed stories".
There's no way to actually know if I missed any side quest and which time period I should go back to...
There's only a "completed stories" menu and a "Kame training instructions" menu in the "Story" section. There's no "to be done" menu...
Considering the 'To be done' stories only seem to appear and disappear depending on when they're available, I assume they'll pop up when the time machine is available.
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Scsigs » Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:13 am

Kanassa wrote:
Sun Mar 08, 2020 11:47 pm
Considering the 'To be done' stories only seem to appear and disappear depending on when they're available, I assume they'll pop up when the time machine is available.
They'd better. I already know I've missed several sidequests based on what I've seen in TFS' playthrough so far.
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Re: "Dragon Ball Z: Kakarot" Official Discussion Thread

Post by Dbzfan94 » Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:55 am

As far as I know, I'm only missing one. It still shows up in my mission log despite not being able to do it.

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